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Posted: 3/16/2002 3:04:31 AM EDT
My Father in law sent me this- God sent his son to die for you. Allah wants your son to die for him. Kinda says it all doesn't it?We had better get over this utopian view that we can all(christians&muslims) get along and realize this is a war not against terrorism per se but a war against a totally alien culture. A couple of nights ago on the news,they interviewed the mother of one of the raghead suicide bombers.She said she knew her son was doing this,that he was in heaven and she wished her other sons would do this and kill as many Jews as possible.What kind of mother WANTS her sons to die? I'm so fed up with this "Islam is about love and peace" crap.These people are frickin animals.For instance-- Scenerio 1.The Jews control Israel.Do they try to kill every Muslim?Of course they don't Scenerio 2.The palastineans control Israel.Would they try to kill every last Jew?It would be the Holocaust all over. OK,thats my rant.
Link Posted: 3/16/2002 5:45:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By GreyGhost: God sent his son to die for you. Allah wants your son to die for him. Kinda says it all doesn't it?
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Yep.
Scenerio 1.The Jews control Israel.Do they try to kill every Muslim?Of course they don't Scenerio 2.The palastineans control Israel.Would they try to kill every last Jew?It would be the Holocaust all over.
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The Palestinians aren't waiting until they control Israel to start killing every last Jew.
Link Posted: 3/16/2002 6:30:13 AM EDT
Originally Posted By GreyGhost: My Father in law sent me this- God sent his son to die for you. Allah wants your son to die for him. Kinda says it all doesn't it?We had better get over this utopian view that we can all(christians&muslims) get along and realize this is a war not against terrorism per se but a war against a totally alien culture. A couple of nights ago on the news,they interviewed the mother of one of the raghead suicide bombers.She said she knew her son was doing this,that he was in heaven and she wished her other sons would do this and kill as many Jews as possible.What kind of mother WANTS her sons to die? I'm so fed up with this "Islam is about love and peace" crap.These people are frickin animals.For instance-- Scenerio 1.The Jews control Israel.Do they try to kill every Muslim?Of course they don't Scenerio 2.The palastineans control Israel.Would they try to kill every last Jew?It would be the Holocaust all over. OK,thats my rant.
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Couldn't have said it better myself. Reason doesn't work with fanatics. We need to tell the Israelis to do what they have to and assist as needed.
Link Posted: 3/16/2002 7:58:36 AM EDT
Have we reached the point where the belief is that Christians, Jews, Muslims and Agnostics worship a different GOD ?
Link Posted: 3/16/2002 8:47:07 AM EDT
There's no difference between God, Allah or any other by a different name. The difference lies in people's level of ignorance perpetuated by trying to blame problems on different religious beliefs. It's a very convenient method of explantation by those in power and influence to keep you busy(debating) and out of their way(agenda) by convincing you to belief that religion is the problem.
Link Posted: 3/16/2002 10:44:17 AM EDT
Originally Posted By levi: There's no difference between God, Allah or any other by a different name. The difference lies in people's level of ignorance perpetuated by trying to blame problems on different religious beliefs. It's a very convenient method of explantation by those in power and influence to keep you busy(debating) and out of their way(agenda) by convincing you to belief that religion is the problem.
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Agree. With all.
Link Posted: 3/16/2002 3:00:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By levi: There's no difference between God, Allah or any other by a different name. The difference lies in people's level of ignorance perpetuated by trying to blame problems on different religious beliefs. It's a very convenient method of explantation by those in power and influence to keep you busy(debating) and out of their way(agenda) by convincing you to belief that religion is the problem. Last time I checked my Christian beliefs/teaching did not tell me to kill unbelievers so they could be my servants in heaven. Maybe God,Allah,The Great Spirit etc. are the same thing.Who knows?But these ragheads believe there is a difference and that's the reality of the situation. If the current problems in the Middle East aren't about religion please raise my "level of ignorance"
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Link Posted: 3/17/2002 6:33:01 AM EDT
Originally Posted By levi: There's no difference between God, Allah or any other by a different name. The difference lies in people's level of ignorance perpetuated by trying to blame problems on different religious beliefs. It's a very convenient method of explantation by those in power and influence to keep you busy(debating) and out of their way(agenda) by convincing you to belief that religion is the problem.
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Pantheism is the religious equivalent of moral relativism. What did God mean when he said "I am the Lord thy God, you shall have [b]no other gods[/b] before me"? Wasn't that implying that the "other" gods like Ra, Zeus, Buddah, Allah, Vishna, Gia or whatever were NOT to be worshipped? I don't know about any of those gods but I do know they are not the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob and they are not the Father of Jesus Christ. How do I know? Because the Bible does not mention these "other" gods as being the equivalent to "God". Oh, yeah... I know, the Bible is just a book of stories written by men to oppress the sheeple and tells us NOTHING about the nature of God. [rolleyes]
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 6:40:50 AM EDT
The problem is not God, by whatever name you call Him. The problem is some of the humans who claim to speak for Him. Choose your spokesmen carefully!
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:03:45 AM EDT
Breaking: Christian Church Attacked in Pakistan: [url]http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGAU2WLRWYC.html[/url] This church is located close to the diplomatic compound, and I suspect you will be hearing more about who died or was injured here.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:04:38 AM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Macallan:
Originally Posted By levi: There's no difference between God, Allah or any other by a different name. The difference lies in people's level of ignorance perpetuated by trying to blame problems on different religious beliefs. It's a very convenient method of explantation by those in power and influence to keep you busy(debating) and out of their way(agenda) by convincing you to belief that religion is the problem.
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Pantheism is the religious equivalent of moral relativism. What did God mean when he said "I am the Lord thy God, you shall have [b]no other gods[/b] before me"? Wasn't that implying that the "other" gods like Ra, Zeus, Buddah, Allah, Vishna, Gia or whatever were NOT to be worshipped? I don't know about any of those gods but I do know they are not the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob and they are not the Father of Jesus Christ. How do I know? Because the Bible does not mention these "other" gods as being the equivalent to "God". Oh, yeah... I know, the Bible is just a book of stories written by men to oppress the sheeple and tells us NOTHING about the nature of God. [rolleyes]
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As I'm sure most know I'm no expert in these matters of religion. However, I've long lived with the impression that Christian, Jew, Muslim all worshiped the same God. Is my assumption not correct ?? (Not a flame but a real question.)
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:15:50 AM EDT
Sub man, Jesus tells us that he will be your salvation or a stumbling block. Now I have spoke with Muslims, Buddist, and Hindus and they all admit that Jesus exist but that he was a good man and not the son of God. Now Jesus told us that all would know of him but that all would not follow him.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:27:15 AM EDT
What did God mean when he said "I am the Lord thy God, you shall have no other gods before me"? Wasn't that implying that the "other" gods like Ra, Zeus, Buddah, Allah, Vishna, Gia or whatever were NOT to be worshipped?
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No, at least not logically. If God meant "Thou shalt have no other gods, period", then why didn't he say that? The qualifying phrase "before me" implies that it's OK to have other gods on the side, provided that Yahweh is the sole possessor of the number one spot.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:29:23 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ar10er: Sub man, Jesus tells us that he will be your salvation or a stumbling block. Now I have spoke with Muslims, Buddist, and Hindus and they all admit that Jesus exist but that he was a good man and not the son of God. Now Jesus told us that all would know of him but that all would not follow him.
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ar10er, my question was meant to be very narrow and only limited to GOD.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:34:04 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By ar10er: Sub man, Jesus tells us that he will be your salvation or a stumbling block. Now I have spoke with Muslims, Buddist, and Hindus and they all admit that Jesus exist but that he was a good man and not the son of God. Now Jesus told us that all would know of him but that all would not follow him.
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ar10er, my question was meant to be very narrow and only limited to GOD.
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That is the difference between their God and mine. Jesus the Holy Spirit and God are the Holy trinity! One and the same.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:35:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/17/2002 7:36:17 AM EDT by 5subslr5]
Originally Posted By Renamed: The qualifying phrase "before me" implies that it's OK to have other gods on the side, provided that Yahweh is the sole possessor of the number one spot.
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That's the way I read it too. This interpretation would also leave room for worship of 'Jesus' by Christians, the 'Prophet' by Muslims, etc. Vastly important to their respective religions but 'not' before GOD. I ask again do not Christians, Jews and Muslims worship the same GOD; the 'one' GOD ??
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:42:32 AM EDT
Part of what the Koran says about Jesus (a.k.a. "Isa"): [4.171] O followers of the Book! do not exceed the limits in your religion, and do not speak (lies) against Allah, but (speak) the truth; the Messiah, Isa son of Marium is only an apostle of Allah and His Word which He communicated to Marium and a spirit from Him; believe therefore in Allah and His apostles, and say not, Three. Desist, it is better for you; Allah is only one God; far be It from His glory that He should have a son, whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth is His, and Allah is sufficient for a Protector. [61.6] And when Isa son of Marium said: O children of Israel! surely I am the apostle of Allah to you, verifying that which is before me of the Taurat and giving the good news of an Apostle who will come after me, his name being Ahmad, but when he came to them with clear arguments they said: This is clear magic.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:48:47 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ar10er: That is the difference between their God and mine. Jesus the Holy Spirit and God are the Holy trinity! One and the same.
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I understand 'your' distinction.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 8:25:55 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By ar10er: That is the difference between their God and mine. Jesus the Holy Spirit and God are the Holy trinity! One and the same.
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I understand 'your' distinction.
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5s5, It is almost impossible to answer your question in clear and un-emotional way. From my studying the bible and my desire to know God, I would say that the God and Allah are NOT the same based on their character. I pose that it is quite unimportant what others believe. What is most important as far as our relationship with and understanding of God is understanding who Jesus was. It has already been pointed out that Muslim and Hindu believe that Jesus existed. Please read this: book: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0310209307/qid=1016384823/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_67_1/104-1677878-5947906 A secular (non-religious) journalist uses his talents in research to take a "scientific" look at Jesus. Best regards, --Marty
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 8:33:58 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 5subslr5: As I'm sure most know I'm no expert in these matters of religion. However, I've long lived with the impression that Christian, Jew, Muslim all worshiped the same God. Is my assumption not correct ?? (Not a flame but a real question.)
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Your assumption is incorrect. The God of the Jews is the God of the Christians. The Muslims made up a new one who is very different.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 11:12:35 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Renamed: No, at least not logically. If God meant "Thou shalt have no other gods, period", then why didn't he say that? The qualifying phrase "before me" implies that it's OK to have other gods on the side, provided that Yahweh is the sole possessor of the number one spot.
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No man can serve two masters. If your "other" god is purely for entertainment, then it's not much of a "god". If you are getting some (any) life-changing guidance from Vishna, Buddha or Mother Earth, then you are violating the 1st Commandment. The Bible is replete with verses that decry the worship or following of (in any form) the many pagan gods. Jesus says many false prophets will come in my name and we should reject them. He'd probably also have us reject the many false versions of the one true God.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 11:18:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/17/2002 6:39:54 PM EDT by 5subslr5]
I've got to admit surprise at some answers. While I may not agree, the answers to my question were clear and succinct.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 11:23:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/17/2002 11:24:43 AM EDT by LotBoy]
Originally Posted By Norm_G:
Originally Posted By 5subslr5: As I'm sure most know I'm no expert in these matters of religion. However, I've long lived with the impression that Christian, Jew, Muslim all worshiped the same God. Is my assumption not correct ?? (Not a flame but a real question.)
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Your assumption is incorrect. The God of the Jews is the God of the Christians. The Muslims made up a new one who is very different.
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I thought Islam was an offshoot of Judaism.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 6:33:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/17/2002 6:38:25 PM EDT by meshuggah]
Originally Posted By Renamed: The qualifying phrase "before me" implies that it's OK to have other gods on the side, provided that Yahweh is the sole possessor of the number one spot.
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Please, allow your wife/GF to use the same logic in your relationship - from what I can tell so far, this Imbrog|io dude is in dire need of humping.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 6:56:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By meshuggah:
Originally Posted By Renamed: The qualifying phrase "before me" implies that it's OK to have other gods on the side, provided that Yahweh is the sole possessor of the number one spot.
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Please, allow your wife/GF to use the same logic in your relationship - from what I can tell so far, this Imbrog|io dude is in dire need of humping.
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Hey, I'm not the one who gave Moses the stone tablets. [;)] I was just exlaining a logical implication of the way the commandment is worded. If you want to debate whether or not God really means what he says, there are others here at AR15.com ready to jump into that fray. [0:)]
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:03:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Macallan:
Originally Posted By levi: There's no difference between God, Allah or any other by a different name. The difference lies in people's level of ignorance perpetuated by trying to blame problems on different religious beliefs. It's a very convenient method of explantation by those in power and influence to keep you busy(debating) and out of their way(agenda) by convincing you to belief that religion is the problem.
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Pantheism is the religious equivalent of moral relativism. What did God mean when he said "I am the Lord thy God, you shall have [b]no other gods[/b] before me"? Wasn't that implying that the "other" gods like Ra, Zeus, Buddah, Allah, Vishna, Gia or whatever were NOT to be worshipped? I don't know about any of those gods but I do know they are not the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob and they are not the Father of Jesus Christ. How do I know? Because the Bible does not mention these "other" gods as being the equivalent to "God". Oh, yeah... I know, the Bible is just a book of stories written by men to oppress the sheeple and tells us NOTHING about the nature of God. [rolleyes]
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Muslims worship the God of Abraham. They belive in Jesus , Moses and all the other guys. You guys spend way to much time sitting around in your trailer home looking for someone to hate.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:04:27 PM EDT
No man can serve two masters.
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Then I must work for the IRS. [%|]
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:19:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/17/2002 7:21:35 PM EDT by jtw2]
"Muslims worship the God of Abraham. They belive in Jesus , Moses and all the other guys. You guys spend way to much time sitting around in your trailer home looking for someone to hate. " John, you are missing the key point. They don't believe in Jesus the Christ. The believe in Jesus the prophet. Don't forget that even Satan believes in God.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:22:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By BigJohnStacey: You guys spend way to much time sitting around in your trailer home looking for someone to hate.
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BigJohn, is a "trailer home" an absolute necessity for proper hating or may other types of housing also be adequate ?? [:D]
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:30:28 PM EDT
It doesn't matter who/what you believe in, it's what you do with that belief. Unfortunately there are a few of people out there who believe they need to kill all Americans. I think we need to put an end to that belief.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:41:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/17/2002 8:01:25 PM EDT by The_Macallan]
Originally Posted By BigJohnStacey:
Originally Posted By The_Macallan: Pantheism is the religious equivalent of moral relativism. What did God mean when he said "I am the Lord thy God, you shall have no other gods before me"? Wasn't that implying that the "other" gods like Ra, Zeus, Buddah, Allah, Vishna, Gia or whatever were NOT to be worshipped? I don't know about any of those gods but I do know they are not the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob and they are not the Father of Jesus Christ. How do I know? Because the Bible does not mention these "other" gods as being the equivalent to "God".
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Muslims worship the God of Abraham. They belive in Jesus , Moses and all the other guys. You guys spend way to much time sitting around in your trailer home looking for someone to hate.
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Bzzzt... Wrongo [b]BigJohnStacey[/b]! Muslims do not believe in "the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob". Don't pick and choose what I was saying to try to refute me - your puny little retort will fall on its face big fat face. Muslims follow the lineage of Ishmael, bastard son of Abraham. From that point, they share no further history. Sure, they believe Jesus existed in the same way I believe that Siddhartha (aka Buddha) existed. Only as a wise man with charisma. They do NOT believe Jesus was who He claimed to be - the Son of God, Messiah, Lamb of God, the risen Savior of all humanity. They do NOT believe in a single word of the New Testament as it pertains to Jesus being the Son of God. Thinking that Moslems believe in Jesus, Moses and "all those other guys" (do you mean King David, Solomon, Peter and Paul?) illustrates your ignorance of the three major religions and their history. I guess now you're learning that your puddle-deep middle school education wears thin very fast when you enter the real world, huh? As far as sitting around hating, I think the Moslem terrorist problems of the last 30years, the PLO, Sudanese slave trade, Iran, Iraq, Libya, Kosovo, Yom Kippur War, Lockerbie, 9-ll and all the other terrorist attacks over the decades against JEWS and CHRISTIANS by MoslemMaggots around the world speaks loudly for settling the argument of who hates whom. Nice try [b]BigBoyGirl[/b], now go back to coloring pretty pictures and this time try to stay [i]inside[/i] the lines.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:42:29 PM EDT
None of this is about religion. There is a culture of world domination over there. The arab world hides it behind religion, but they basically believe they should not only rule that entier region, but the entire world. Religion is used as something to breainwash the peasant population into doing their bidding. Have you noticed that nothing the arab world ever does is defensive? They don't attempt to defend their territory, they always attack others. If the rest of the world had any balls, they'd roll over the whole middle east, and start nation building like Japan after WW2. The countries there stress too much on offensive military capabilities, because that is all they care about. This will be their downfall, since you can't defend your own land with NBC weapons and terrorist attacks.
Link Posted: 3/17/2002 7:55:49 PM EDT
My God could kick your allah's ass.
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