Posted: 10/30/2012 7:01:23 PM EDT
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I've got a Roth IRA. To my understanding I can take out everything that I have deposited summing all of the years of deposit, without penalty. Anything that is over my deposited amount that is withdrawn will be penalized for windrawing.
So, If I've put in 5K for 10 years and the IRA, through gains and dividends is worth 75K, I can sell 50K worth of stock and then withdraw that amount without penalty? Am I understanding it correctly? I've been good at picking stocks and never thought I'd withdraw before retirement, hence my naivety. I simply don;t trust stocks with the amoun t of debt/inflation we have in the US, but that's for another thread... Thanks in advance. |
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I've got a Roth IRA. To my understanding I can take out everything that I have deposited summing all of the years of deposit, without penalty. Anything that is over my deposited amount that is withdrawn will be penalized for windrawing. So, If I've put in 5K for 10 years and the IRA, through gains and dividends is worth 75K, I can sell 50K worth of stock and then withdraw that amount without penalty? Am I understanding it correctly? I've been good at picking stocks and never thought I'd withdraw before retirement, hence my naivety. I simply don;t trust stocks with the amoun t of debt/inflation we have in the US, but that's for another thread... Thanks in advance. That is my understanding as well––you can withdraw all of your deposits––this is called your "Basis" without penalty or taxes since these contributions were made after tax. |
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I've been good at picking stocks and never thought I'd withdraw before retirement, hence my naivety. I simply don;t trust stocks with the amoun t of debt/inflation we have in the US, but that's for another thread... If you're worried about debt/inflation, you should love stocks. What do you think is going to happen to Coca Cola's earnings when inflation drives the price of a 20 oz coke up to $5.00? Stocks appreciate when inflation occurs because businesses factor that into their pricing and earnings goals. McDonald's is not going to be selling $1.00 cheeseburgers 10 years from now. |
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A Roth IRA is supposed to be kept for 20+ years to help you at after you retire. Emptying it out to buy gold is a dumb move in my opinion but it's your money I think I have more of a problem than most with the Fed's mentality to print any amount of money as necessary without check. And, I don;t think inflation is at the level proclaimed... |
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I think I have more of a problem than most with the Fed's mentality to print any amount of money as necessary without check. And, I don;t think inflation is at the level proclaimed... Then you need to invest accordingly, rather than pull your money out of your IRA and put it into PMs that are selling close to all-time highs. What difference does it make to McDonald's what the US national debt is when they have over 30,000 restaurants spread across the entire world? How is the Fed printing money going to affect Exxon, which hundreds of subsidiaries across the world bringing in over $400 billion in annual revenue? And even if the Fed prints money, and inflation skyrockets, that doesn't affect corporate profits. Companies raise their prices to adjust for inflation. That's why a Ford car costs more today than it did in 1960. It's why you can't buy a 16 oz coke for a nickel today. If you're worried about the fed printing money, then you need to focus on adjusting your Roth IRA to compensate for that. Drawing the money out and investing it into something that has skyrocketed in price over the decade is not smart. |
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I think I have more of a problem than most with the Fed's mentality to print any amount of money as necessary without check. And, I don;t think inflation is at the level proclaimed... Then you need to invest accordingly, rather than pull your money out of your IRA and put it into PMs that are selling close to all-time highs. What difference does it make to McDonald's what the US national debt is when they have over 30,000 restaurants spread across the entire world? How is the Fed printing money going to affect Exxon, which hundreds of subsidiaries across the world bringing in over $400 billion in annual revenue? And even if the Fed prints money, and inflation skyrockets, that doesn't affect corporate profits. Companies raise their prices to adjust for inflation. That's why a Ford car costs more today than it did in 1960. It's why you can't buy a 16 oz coke for a nickel today. If you're worried about the fed printing money, then you need to focus on adjusting your Roth IRA to compensate for that. Drawing the money out and investing it into something that has skyrocketed in price over the decade is not smart. I guess I'm taking it one step further. Even if these corps are profitable, the standard currency used as the medium for their profits will fail as a viable currency. I don;t care if McDonald's is double the profitability of last year, the dollar is going to be worthless. PM's are at rare highs, but nit unprecedented. What is unprecedented is our level of debt. Also, the 3.0% inflation rate is about 250% lower than what we are actually at, the world's currency seems to move as the US moves, and Fed printing money simply dilutes and will topple the system. Not sure how this is not transparent. |
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I guess I'm taking it one step further. Even if these corps are profitable, the standard currency used as the medium for their profits will fail as a viable currency. I don;t care if McDonald's is double the profitability of last year, the dollar is going to be worthless. PM's are at rare highs, but nit unprecedented. What is unprecedented is our level of debt. Also, the 3.0% inflation rate is about 250% lower than what we are actually at, the world's currency seems to move as the US moves, and Fed printing money simply dilutes and will topple the system. Not sure how this is not transparent. Nothing personal, but how old are you? You don't seem to understand the disconnect between the value of the USD and companies that accept it in their regular course of business. The USD is just a point of reference to what something costs. It doesn't matter if it inflates 1000% or 1%. It's just the unit of measure that we use to compare companies, stocks, products, wages, etc. The dollar is our measuring stick. It doesn't determine how much profit anyone makes or what dividend is paid out by a major company. Do you think McDonald's is accepting USD in their Japanese restaurants. They're not, at least not on a major scale. They accept Yen in Japan, Euros in Britain, etc. If the dollar collapses, they'll start accepting whatever currency replaces it, and their financial statements will be changed to use a new unit of measure. If you pull up a McDonald's stock report in Japan, the numbers are going to be in Yen and it's going to be printed in Japanese. Profits go beyond the value of the USD, and the collapse of a currency is not going to change that. Your concern is basically akin to saying that you don't want to invest in a US company because you don't have faith in English continuing as a language, and a US company can't survive if they don't speak English. There is a complete disconnect between the two factors. Betting against the US stock market means you are betting against the ability of a private business to do what private businesses have done for thousands of years. People will buy/sell/barter/trade goods no matter what happens to the government and the local currency. Unless you expect our imminent collapse to completely change the way society interacts and barters with each other to exchange goods and services, then it would be completely foolish to bet against the stock market over the long term. |
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I guess I'm taking it one step further. Even if these corps are profitable, the standard currency used as the medium for their profits will fail as a viable currency. I don;t care if McDonald's is double the profitability of last year, the dollar is going to be worthless. PM's are at rare highs, but nit unprecedented. What is unprecedented is our level of debt. Also, the 3.0% inflation rate is about 250% lower than what we are actually at, the world's currency seems to move as the US moves, and Fed printing money simply dilutes and will topple the system. Not sure how this is not transparent. Nothing personal, but how old are you? You don't seem to understand the disconnect between the value of the USD and companies that accept it in their regular course of business. The USD is just a point of reference to what something costs. It doesn't matter if it inflates 1000% or 1%. It's just the unit of measure that we use to compare companies, stocks, products, wages, etc. The dollar is our measuring stick. It doesn't determine how much profit anyone makes or what dividend is paid out by a major company. Do you think McDonald's is accepting USD in their Japanese restaurants. They're not, at least not on a major scale. They accept Yen in Japan, Euros in Britain, etc. If the dollar collapses, they'll start accepting whatever currency replaces it, and their financial statements will be changed to use a new unit of measure. If you pull up a McDonald's stock report in Japan, the numbers are going to be in Yen and it's going to be printed in Japanese. Profits go beyond the value of the USD, and the collapse of a currency is not going to change that. Your concern is basically akin to saying that you don't want to invest in a US company because you don't have faith in English continuing as a language, and a US company can't survive if they don't speak English. There is a complete disconnect between the two factors. Betting against the US stock market means you are betting against the ability of a private business to do what private businesses have done for thousands of years. People will buy/sell/barter/trade goods no matter what happens to the government and the local currency. Unless you expect our imminent collapse to completely change the way society interacts and barters with each other to exchange goods and services, then it would be completely foolish to bet against the stock market over the long term. You honestly believe that, if the dollar collapses, it will have no adverse affects on the Yen or Euro; the US economy goes in to crisis and the rest of the world keeps humming along just fine? I'm amazed at your disassociation... I'm betting, in an unprecedented time in our country, the dollar will collapse causing a panic across the globe. Metals are not the answer but make for an easier transition to food and brass as your best bets. Age is not an issue, it's empiricism with reality that matters... |
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You honestly believe that, if the dollar collapses, it will have no adverse affects on the Yen or Euro; the US economy goes in to crisis and the rest of the world keeps humming along just fine? I'm amazed at your disassociation... I'm betting, in an unprecedented time in our country, the dollar will collapse causing a panic across the globe. Metals are not the answer but make for an easier transition to food and brass as your best bets. Age is not an issue, it's empiricism with reality that matters... Currencies have collapsed all throughout history. It doesn't change the nature of businesses and how companies operate. If everyone starts using rocks as currency tomorrow, McDonald's will start accepting rocks for cheeseburgers. And as long as they accept more rocks than they spend to make their food, they will be profitable. If you own McDonald's, you will accumulate more rocks over time as they keep operating. To think that global companies are going to fail simply due to a currency crisis is foolish. For that to happen, the entire concept of how our society interacts will have to change. We would no longer be doing business with each other for that to happen. No more bartering, no more trading, no more buying and selling of any good or service. Our entire society would have to collapse and every person fend for themselves without engaging in economic transactions with each other. That's just not going to happen, no matter how badly you think the USD is going to fail, or how much debt our government has. It goes against the very nature of humans. If you want to be stubborn, it's your money. Withdraw it and spend it on whatever hunk of metal you think is going to benefit you down the road. But I can almost guarantee you that you'll end up regretting the decision, and you'll be giving up a significant chunk of retirement income to survive a collapse that's not going to play out the way you think it will. |
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Currencies have collapsed all throughout history. It doesn't change the nature of businesses and how companies operate. If everyone starts using rocks as currency tomorrow, McDonald's will start accepting rocks for cheeseburgers. And as long as they accept more rocks than they spend to make their food, they will be profitable. If you own McDonald's, you will accumulate more rocks over time as they keep operating.
To think that global companies are going to fail simply due to a currency crisis is foolish. For that to happen, the entire concept of how our society interacts will have to change. We would no longer be doing business with each other for that to happen. No more bartering, no more trading, no more buying and selling of any good or service. Our entire society would have to collapse and every person fend for themselves without engaging in economic transactions with each other. That's just not going to happen, no matter how badly you think the USD is going to fail, or how much debt our government has. It goes against the very nature of humans. If you want to be stubborn, it's your money. Withdraw it and spend it on whatever hunk of metal you think is going to benefit you down the road. But I can almost guarantee you that you'll end up regretting the decision, and you'll be giving up a significant chunk of retirement income to survive a collapse that's not going to play out the way you think it will.[/quote] –––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– Silver and Gold are a bit different than rocks so not sure why the flippant analogy. If our dollar collapses, you think that you'll be fine because you've diversified your assets into international companies? You'll be good to survive the rioting and craziness; I don't think it's a sit-on-the-porch-sipping-whisky while the Japanese are crushing Quarter Pounders and your retirement fund climbs 600%. To think the dollar is so segregated from our global economy is also foolish. Would Greece be doing "as well" without the help of of the EU? Look how bad it is anyway. and Greece is not America... |
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I am a stacker and think it is important to diversify into metals but I also tend to agree with GraysonP in that I am not pulling my money out of my retirement accounts.
Any extra money I have above my retirement accounts I use for metal but I am not going to liquidate any tax advantaged holdings. Inflation is coming and the dollar is losing value but companies will go up with it. The goods and services they provide inflate as well. |
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I am a stacker and think it is important to diversify into metals but I also tend to agree with GraysonP in that I am not pulling my money out of my retirement accounts. Any extra money I have above my retirement accounts I use for metal but I am not going to liquidate any tax advantaged holdings. Inflation is coming and the dollar is losing value but companies will go up with it. The goods and services they provide inflate as well. I have a 20% year over year increase in my investment Roth IRA. I won;t be taking everything out, just what I've put in, principally. I fully anticipate the rest to be wiped with a market crash as the Feds continue our trend with hyperinflation coincided with the globe's dependence on a stable US economy... |
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I've got a Roth IRA. To my understanding I can take out everything that I have deposited summing all of the years of deposit, without penalty. Anything that is over my deposited amount that is withdrawn will be penalized for windrawing. So, If I've put in 5K for 10 years and the IRA, through gains and dividends is worth 75K, I can sell 50K worth of stock and then withdraw that amount without penalty? Am I understanding it correctly? I've been good at picking stocks and never thought I'd withdraw before retirement, hence my naivety. I simply don;t trust stocks with the amoun t of debt/inflation we have in the US, but that's for another thread... Thanks in advance. That is my understanding as well––you can withdraw all of your deposits––this is called your "Basis" without penalty or taxes since these contributions were made after tax. He will be penalized if the distribution is non-qualified due to age. |
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I've got a Roth IRA. To my understanding I can take out everything that I have deposited summing all of the years of deposit, without penalty. Anything that is over my deposited amount that is withdrawn will be penalized for windrawing. So, If I've put in 5K for 10 years and the IRA, through gains and dividends is worth 75K, I can sell 50K worth of stock and then withdraw that amount without penalty? Am I understanding it correctly? I've been good at picking stocks and never thought I'd withdraw before retirement, hence my naivety. I simply don;t trust stocks with the amoun t of debt/inflation we have in the US, but that's for another thread... Thanks in advance. That is my understanding as well––you can withdraw all of your deposits––this is called your "Basis" without penalty or taxes since these contributions were made after tax. He will be penalized if the distribution is non-qualified due to age. I'm reading I can pull 100% of my initial contributions any time I want, without penalty. Where did we suggest distributions? |
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I've got a Roth IRA. To my understanding I can take out everything that I have deposited summing all of the years of deposit, without penalty. Anything that is over my deposited amount that is withdrawn will be penalized for windrawing. So, If I've put in 5K for 10 years and the IRA, through gains and dividends is worth 75K, I can sell 50K worth of stock and then withdraw that amount without penalty? Am I understanding it correctly? I've been good at picking stocks and never thought I'd withdraw before retirement, hence my naivety. I simply don;t trust stocks with the amoun t of debt/inflation we have in the US, but that's for another thread... Thanks in advance. That is my understanding as well––you can withdraw all of your deposits––this is called your "Basis" without penalty or taxes since these contributions were made after tax. He will be penalized if the distribution is non-qualified due to age. I'm reading I can pull 100% of my initial contributions any time I want, without penalty. Where did we suggest distributions? A "distribution" is tax parlance for "pulling 100% of your initial contributions." And you cannot pull 100% of your initial contribution without penalty if you pull it before you reach 59 and 1/2 years of age. That is the general rule. First, five-year period must be established. Then, you must be 59 1/2 or disabled, or take an amount out for first-time homebuyer. See guidance below as per PPC/Quickfinder. Qualified distributions. A qualified distribution is income and penalty tax-free [IRC §408A(d)]. A distribution is qualified if made after a five-year holding period, which begins on the first day of the first year for which Roth IRA contributions were made, and one of the following applies: 1) The taxpayer is age 591/2 or older, 2) The distribution is due to death or disability or 3) The distribution is eligible for the first-time homebuyer exception to the 10% penalty tax on early distributions. Five-year holding period. The first Roth IRA contribution starts the five-year holding period. It is a once-in-a-lifetime satisfaction of the holding period rules for all of the taxpayer’s Roth IRAs. A subsequent contribution will not start a new holding period. If a taxpayer makes his first Roth IRA contribution any time between January 1, 2011 and April 17, 2012, for tax year 2011, the five-year holding period begins on January 1, 2011. The five-year holding period for the beneficiary of a Roth IRA includes the time held by the decedent. |
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I've got a Roth IRA. To my understanding I can take out everything that I have deposited summing all of the years of deposit, without penalty. Anything that is over my deposited amount that is withdrawn will be penalized for windrawing. So, If I've put in 5K for 10 years and the IRA, through gains and dividends is worth 75K, I can sell 50K worth of stock and then withdraw that amount without penalty? Am I understanding it correctly? I've been good at picking stocks and never thought I'd withdraw before retirement, hence my naivety. I simply don;t trust stocks with the amoun t of debt/inflation we have in the US, but that's for another thread... Thanks in advance. That is my understanding as well––you can withdraw all of your deposits––this is called your "Basis" without penalty or taxes since these contributions were made after tax. He will be penalized if the distribution is non-qualified due to age. I'm reading I can pull 100% of my initial contributions any time I want, without penalty. Where did we suggest distributions? A "distribution" is tax parlance for "pulling 100% of your initial contributions." And you cannot pull 100% of your initial contribution without penalty if you pull it before you reach 59 and 1/2 years of age. That is the general rule. First, five-year period must be established. Then, you must be 59 1/2 or disabled, or take an amount out for first-time homebuyer. See guidance below as per PPC/Quickfinder. Qualified distributions. A qualified distribution is income and penalty tax-free [IRC §408A(d)]. A distribution is qualified if made after a five-year holding period, which begins on the first day of the first year for which Roth IRA contributions were made, and one of the following applies: 1) The taxpayer is age 591/2 or older, 2) The distribution is due to death or disability or 3) The distribution is eligible for the first-time homebuyer exception to the 10% penalty tax on early distributions. Five-year holding period. The first Roth IRA contribution starts the five-year holding period. It is a once-in-a-lifetime satisfaction of the holding period rules for all of the taxpayer’s Roth IRAs. A subsequent contribution will not start a new holding period. If a taxpayer makes his first Roth IRA contribution any time between January 1, 2011 and April 17, 2012, for tax year 2011, the five-year holding period begins on January 1, 2011. The five-year holding period for the beneficiary of a Roth IRA includes the time held by the decedent. Wrong. You can take out your contributions at any time without tax or penalty. http://www.mymoneyblog.com/can-i-really-withdraw-my-roth-ira-contributions-at-any-time-without-tax-or-penalty.html |
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I've got a Roth IRA. To my understanding I can take out everything that I have deposited summing all of the years of deposit, without penalty. Anything that is over my deposited amount that is withdrawn will be penalized for windrawing. So, If I've put in 5K for 10 years and the IRA, through gains and dividends is worth 75K, I can sell 50K worth of stock and then withdraw that amount without penalty? Am I understanding it correctly? I've been good at picking stocks and never thought I'd withdraw before retirement, hence my naivety. I simply don;t trust stocks with the amoun t of debt/inflation we have in the US, but that's for another thread... Thanks in advance. That is my understanding as well––you can withdraw all of your deposits––this is called your "Basis" without penalty or taxes since these contributions were made after tax. He will be penalized if the distribution is non-qualified due to age. I'm reading I can pull 100% of my initial contributions any time I want, without penalty. Where did we suggest distributions? A "distribution" is tax parlance for "pulling 100% of your initial contributions." And you cannot pull 100% of your initial contribution without penalty if you pull it before you reach 59 and 1/2 years of age. That is the general rule. First, five-year period must be established. Then, you must be 59 1/2 or disabled, or take an amount out for first-time homebuyer. See guidance below as per PPC/Quickfinder. Qualified distributions. A qualified distribution is income and penalty tax-free [IRC §408A(d)]. A distribution is qualified if made after a five-year holding period, which begins on the first day of the first year for which Roth IRA contributions were made, and one of the following applies: 1) The taxpayer is age 591/2 or older, 2) The distribution is due to death or disability or 3) The distribution is eligible for the first-time homebuyer exception to the 10% penalty tax on early distributions. Five-year holding period. The first Roth IRA contribution starts the five-year holding period. It is a once-in-a-lifetime satisfaction of the holding period rules for all of the taxpayer’s Roth IRAs. A subsequent contribution will not start a new holding period. If a taxpayer makes his first Roth IRA contribution any time between January 1, 2011 and April 17, 2012, for tax year 2011, the five-year holding period begins on January 1, 2011. The five-year holding period for the beneficiary of a Roth IRA includes the time held by the decedent. Wrong. You can take out your contributions at any time without tax or penalty. http://www.mymoneyblog.com/can-i-really-withdraw-my-roth-ira-contributions-at-any-time-without-tax-or-penalty.html As stated, anything you put in you can take out. Just don’t touch your returns. Also, say on May 1 of every year you contribute a lump sum of $5,000 to max out your Roth. For the rest of that year you may borrow from that $5,000 as long as you return what you borrowed within 60 days. If you don’t replace it within 60 days then you’re out of luck and cannot make up for that “loan" |
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I've got a Roth IRA. To my understanding I can take out everything that I have deposited summing all of the years of deposit, without penalty. Anything that is over my deposited amount that is withdrawn will be penalized for windrawing. So, If I've put in 5K for 10 years and the IRA, through gains and dividends is worth 75K, I can sell 50K worth of stock and then withdraw that amount without penalty? Am I understanding it correctly? I've been good at picking stocks and never thought I'd withdraw before retirement, hence my naivety. I simply don;t trust stocks with the amoun t of debt/inflation we have in the US, but that's for another thread... Thanks in advance. That is my understanding as well––you can withdraw all of your deposits––this is called your "Basis" without penalty or taxes since these contributions were made after tax. He will be penalized if the distribution is non-qualified due to age. I'm reading I can pull 100% of my initial contributions any time I want, without penalty. Where did we suggest distributions? A "distribution" is tax parlance for "pulling 100% of your initial contributions." And you cannot pull 100% of your initial contribution without penalty if you pull it before you reach 59 and 1/2 years of age. That is the general rule. First, five-year period must be established. Then, you must be 59 1/2 or disabled, or take an amount out for first-time homebuyer. See guidance below as per PPC/Quickfinder. Qualified distributions. A qualified distribution is income and penalty tax-free [IRC §408A(d)]. A distribution is qualified if made after a five-year holding period, which begins on the first day of the first year for which Roth IRA contributions were made, and one of the following applies: 1) The taxpayer is age 591/2 or older, 2) The distribution is due to death or disability or 3) The distribution is eligible for the first-time homebuyer exception to the 10% penalty tax on early distributions. Five-year holding period. The first Roth IRA contribution starts the five-year holding period. It is a once-in-a-lifetime satisfaction of the holding period rules for all of the taxpayer’s Roth IRAs. A subsequent contribution will not start a new holding period. If a taxpayer makes his first Roth IRA contribution any time between January 1, 2011 and April 17, 2012, for tax year 2011, the five-year holding period begins on January 1, 2011. The five-year holding period for the beneficiary of a Roth IRA includes the time held by the decedent. Wrong. You can take out your contributions at any time without tax or penalty. http://www.mymoneyblog.com/can-i-really-withdraw-my-roth-ira-contributions-at-any-time-without-tax-or-penalty.html You know, you're correct. I got in a hurry. Further reading in the PPC guidance indicates that only the earnings portion is subject to the penalty. If the amounts were only comprised of Roth contributions (no rolllover conversions) the rules are clear that all contributions (basis) come out first and are not subject to penalty. (even if you have several Roth accounts, they are aggregated for the purpose of returning basis). I was reading a grid in the QF (tax guidance that costs a good bit) and that grid indicates that Roth IRA distributions are subject to penalty across the board. With that said, the text elsewhere goes on to say that Roth contributions can be distributed without penalty as long as it is solely return of basis. I should contact Thomson Reuters and point out the error in their grid. ETA: 
Notice in the "penalties" section that the QF fails to distinguish between basis and earnings. NUTZ. |