Posted: 6/26/2012 12:46:14 AM EDT
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A little backstory:
Almost three years ago I was pushing 569 lbs. A combination of a crappy diet and not eating regularly. I was diagnosed as diabetic, high blood pressure, terrible cholesterol. I changed my diet and lifestyle habits and was getting nowhere, and fell into depression. Doctor suggested Gastric Lap Band - which I ended up doing. The Lap Band turned out to be a terrible decision, and I had nothing but trouble with it. Hospitalized twice for malnutrition, abdominal pain, and they could never seem to get it "set up" quite right and I would have trouble even drinking water unless I was standing up. I had to eat my tiny meals while standing and walking around the living room. I only lost a little bit of weight, and my insurance (which PAID for the surgery) refused to pay for the regular "fills" and visits required, causing me to rack up a ton of medical debt. I ended up having a nurse at my place of work (after consulting why my physician and discussing the issue for several weeks with her) drain most of the fluid from my band. I began a normal diet, high in protein and cut out sugars and a lot of (but not all) carbs. I felt WAY better, and actually began losing weight - the key for me was REMEMBERING to eat. One of the things that caused me to get big and stay big was that I do not get hungry, and would often go without eating for most of a day, and then have a huge meal whenever I remembered (often after midnight, working graveyard shifts). I was actually eating MORE and losing weight than when I was big. I lost just over 200 lbs in just under two years. My doctor declared that I was no longer diabetic, my blood pressure was still borderline, but my cholesterol was now at a healthy level. A couple months ago I was at 357 lbs, and I began to read about and study Paleo/Primal. One of the hardest things for me diet-wise is that my S/O is picky and is the type of person that can burn cereal (a-la Homer Simpson) just by making a bowl of it. With me working 7 days and 65-80 hours a week, I had to stock frozen pizzas and other assorted easy and quick junk so S/O could have something to eat while I was at work. We talked it over and S/O agreed to go along on Paelo with me. We have changed our lifestyle as far as eating goes, and just two moths later I am down to 325, blood pressure, sugar, and cholesterol have all come down to acceptable levels. I feel GREAT, have a ton of energy, and don't tire out nearly as much as I used to. Now, I want to start going to the gym. I get a TON of cardio at work as is, including plenty of running - my job gets very physical often. The gym near us is pretty basic, but it is affordable - the problem is that I need to have a set workout routine or else I go in there and just kind of wander around doing whatever. I cannot afford a personal trainer at this time but it is something that I would like to look into in the near future. With that in mind, I want to bulk up muscle-wise while burning fat (mostly belly and chest area, where the fat is really hanging on). I kind of have to work on everything, but don't really have any idea where to start, or how to build a routine, how often, etc. I still have at least 100 lbs to lose. Any help with this is most appreciated. Sorry for the wall of text. 
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The starting strength book is a great resource regardless of your program. Check out the starting strength FAQ listed above the tacked threads. Practical Programming is a good book for modifying starting strength when adding 5 pounds every time fails to work anymore, and good at gaining a better understanding of training.
I can't help but think that since you used to move around at nearly 600 pounds that after a month or two of squats and deadlifts you could be squatting and deadlifting far more than most people could as beginners. Congradulations on the life change, keep the momentum moving foward! |
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Now I am as much an iron devotee as anyone here, but is starting strength really the right recommendation in this case? Sounds like he's still seriously overweight, and to me that means he needs to unfuck his diet, do lots of cardio and generally being more active. Just becoming flexible enough to do a decent squat may prove to be a challenge. Some resistance training to maintain what muscle you have while you're still cutting weight is good, but save the serious weight training until that fat is under control. Note that I am not a doctor, nutritionist. personal trainer nor did not stay at a Holiday Inn express last night... |
| He has lost 200 pounds in two years and describes his job as very physically active. So it sounds like his diet is going well. You are right, he might not be flexible enough to perform a good squat. That is the downfall of asking for and giving advice over the internet. Hopefully the book, if he decides to buy it and read it would give him the ability to self ascess and self teach. If his diet is good (it sounds like it is) and he is moving around a ton at work I really don't see why serious weight training should be delayed. His blood pressure is within acceptable standards so I don't feel is is at any high risk of a coranary event from heavy compound exercises. |
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Quoted:
Now I am as much an iron devotee as anyone here, but is starting strength really the right recommendation in this case? Sounds like he's still seriously overweight, and to me that means he needs to unfuck his diet, do lots of cardio and generally being more active. Just becoming flexible enough to do a decent squat may prove to be a challenge. Some resistance training to maintain what muscle you have while you're still cutting weight is good, but save the serious weight training until that fat is under control. Note that I am not a doctor, nutritionist. personal trainer nor did not stay at a Holiday Inn express last night... Starting Strength is almost always the answer. 
If it's not the answer, it's part of the answer in addition to cardio and diet. Squat, deadlift, bench and overhead press. |
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Quoted:
The starting strength book is a great resource regardless of your program. Check out the starting strength FAQ listed above the tacked threads. Practical Programming is a good book for modifying starting strength when adding 5 pounds every time fails to work anymore, and good at gaining a better understanding of training. I can't help but think that since you used to move around at nearly 600 pounds that after a month or two of squats and deadlifts you could be squatting and deadlifting far more than most people could as beginners. Congradulations on the life change, keep the momentum moving foward! http://www.mcmaster.com Part # 90108A046 They are ~.625lbs each and allow 1.25lbs increases. Slow progress is still progress. |
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Thanks for all the replies. I am going to be reading the Starting Strength sticky thing when I am off work tomorrow.
Flexibility is a minor issue, I am way more flexible than folks my size usually are - a byproduct of needing flexibility to do my job where I again get a ton of cardio/activity all day. |
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1. physical activity at work
there is a difference b/w doing work which involve physical activity and exercising for fitness/health. Two aren't necessarily the same. For example, let's say you walk around at work intermittently for accumulative total of 30 minutes a day, and also,get in and out of car/work station. That probably won't be as effective as walking non-stop at brisk pace(can talk but can't sing) for 30 minutes. Even if you are involved in something as physical as manual labor work 8 hours a day, I believe one hour of properly designed fitness workout can achieve more result than basic manual labor. 2. 569lb/357lb If you weigh 357lb and also used to weigh 569lb, it means your joints/back/etc. were stressed more than they were originally designed for, esp. since I assume the supporting structural muscles are not as developed as they should be. 3. recommended workout Because of your current weight and history, I wouldn't recommend plyometric, cross fit, standard weight training, running, etc. due to propensity for injury in your case, based on your current weight and history. Instead, I would recommend something like the following: - alternate regiment of walking, stationary cycling, and swimming/walking in water for at least 30 minutes. - resistance exercise: you'll probably get the most bang for buck by focusing on core/trunk and glute/thigh/leg - aquatic resistance program in pool is also good - core: regular plank, side plank, and bird dog(if you don't know what these are, google Stuart McGill, Canadian back specialist). These could be assisted or supported version until you develop the necessary strength. - glute/thigh/leg: static wall sit, squat(without weight), and lunges, again w/o weight - both pilates and yoga are good for stretching, although pilates is more core focused and emphasis in yoga varies tremendously, depending on type/drill/exercise...some parts of yoga are very much like gymnastics and some parts of it is actually very sedentary, while other parts approach skills/strength/flexibility of a circus acrobat(there are some school of thought which actually thinks that origin of Chinese martial arts lies in yoga brought over from India!) - keep in mind that there are at least 4 elements to fitness: cardio, muscle resistance/development, balance, and flexibility. To have balanced development, as well as balanced body, you need to develop all 4 aspects of general fitness. Not only that, regarding muscle/resistance development, there is slow push/grind aspect as well as explosive, ballistic aspect which requires different kinds of drills but before going there, I think losing weight and improving overall fitness should take precedence. - take it easy, don't try to do everything at once Check with your doctor/trainer first and only upon your doctor's permission/recommendation. 4. diet Diet is, at the very least, as important as exercise. I don't advocate high protein/low carb diet. Instead, I advocate varied diet with most of calories coming from complex carb with small portion from lean protein(varied source) supplemented with small portion of nuts, healthy oil like olive oil/fish oil, nonfat yogurt, etc. I advocate very large quantity of fresh vegetables and fruits on daily basis because they are very nutrient dense, while being low in calories(with few exception like avocado). You can easily buy very large bag of restaurant grade/size salad bags from Costco/Sam's Club/etc. for very little money and supplement it with steamed vegetables, brown rice/whole wheat bread/sweet potatoes/etc., along with small portion of meat/fish/beans/etc. You want the total volume of food consumed daily to be LARGE so that you will always feel satiated, not hungry, but you also want calorie deficit(more calorie is burned than consumed). 5.books I would recommend the following two books. The Ultimate Fit or Fat by Covert Bailey Which Comes First, Cardio or Weights?: Fitness Myths, Training Truths, and Other Surprising Discoveries from the Science of Exercise by Alex Hutchinson 6. videos You might find the following videos inspiring. Never, Ever Give Up. Arthur's Inspirational Transformation! extended cut version Ernestine Shepherd The 75-year-old bodybuilding grandma I'm sure you can do it! GOOD LUCK! Quoted:
A little backstory: Almost three years ago I was pushing 569 lbs. A combination of a crappy diet and not eating regularly. I was diagnosed as diabetic, high blood pressure, terrible cholesterol. I changed my diet and lifestyle habits and was getting nowhere, and fell into depression. Doctor suggested Gastric Lap Band - which I ended up doing. The Lap Band turned out to be a terrible decision, and I had nothing but trouble with it. Hospitalized twice for malnutrition, abdominal pain, and they could never seem to get it "set up" quite right and I would have trouble even drinking water unless I was standing up. I had to eat my tiny meals while standing and walking around the living room. I only lost a little bit of weight, and my insurance (which PAID for the surgery) refused to pay for the regular "fills" and visits required, causing me to rack up a ton of medical debt. I ended up having a nurse at my place of work (after consulting why my physician and discussing the issue for several weeks with her) drain most of the fluid from my band. I began a normal diet, high in protein and cut out sugars and a lot of (but not all) carbs. I felt WAY better, and actually began losing weight - the key for me was REMEMBERING to eat. One of the things that caused me to get big and stay big was that I do not get hungry, and would often go without eating for most of a day, and then have a huge meal whenever I remembered (often after midnight, working graveyard shifts). I was actually eating MORE and losing weight than when I was big. I lost just over 200 lbs in just under two years. My doctor declared that I was no longer diabetic, my blood pressure was still borderline, but my cholesterol was now at a healthy level. A couple months ago I was at 357 lbs, and I began to read about and study Paleo/Primal. One of the hardest things for me diet-wise is that my S/O is picky and is the type of person that can burn cereal (a-la Homer Simpson) just by making a bowl of it. With me working 7 days and 65-80 hours a week, I had to stock frozen pizzas and other assorted easy and quick junk so S/O could have something to eat while I was at work. We talked it over and S/O agreed to go along on Paelo with me. We have changed our lifestyle as far as eating goes, and just two moths later I am down to 325, blood pressure, sugar, and cholesterol have all come down to acceptable levels. I feel GREAT, have a ton of energy, and don't tire out nearly as much as I used to. Now, I want to start going to the gym. I get a TON of cardio at work as is, including plenty of running - my job gets very physical often. The gym near us is pretty basic, but it is affordable - the problem is that I need to have a set workout routine or else I go in there and just kind of wander around doing whatever. I cannot afford a personal trainer at this time but it is something that I would like to look into in the near future. With that in mind, I want to bulk up muscle-wise while burning fat (mostly belly and chest area, where the fat is really hanging on). I kind of have to work on everything, but don't really have any idea where to start, or how to build a routine, how often, etc. I still have at least 100 lbs to lose. Any help with this is most appreciated. Sorry for the wall of text. |
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no, it's inappropriate because when one's weight is >300lb and was at one point over 500lb, there are structural issues, such as overstressed joints/back/etc.
You have to go very slow and very gently and focus on diet, very controlled resistance and symmetric development focusing on cardio, strength, balance, and flexibility, not only on strength. Quoted:
Now I am as much an iron devotee as anyone here, but is starting strength really the right recommendation in this case? Sounds like he's still seriously overweight, and to me that means he needs to unfuck his diet, do lots of cardio and generally being more active. Just becoming flexible enough to do a decent squat may prove to be a challenge. Some resistance training to maintain what muscle you have while you're still cutting weight is good, but save the serious weight training until that fat is under control. Note that I am not a doctor, nutritionist. personal trainer nor did not stay at a Holiday Inn express last night... |
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Quoted: no, it's inappropriate because when one's weight is >300lb and was at one point over 500lb, there are structural issues, such as overstressed joints/back/etc. You have to go very slow and very gently and focus on diet, very controlled resistance and symmetric development focusing on cardio, strength, balance, and flexibility, not only on strength. Quoted: Now I am as much an iron devotee as anyone here, but is starting strength really the right recommendation in this case? Sounds like he's still seriously overweight, and to me that means he needs to unfuck his diet, do lots of cardio and generally being more active. Just becoming flexible enough to do a decent squat may prove to be a challenge. Some resistance training to maintain what muscle you have while you're still cutting weight is good, but save the serious weight training until that fat is under control. Note that I am not a doctor, nutritionist. personal trainer nor did not stay at a Holiday Inn express last night... You're right, but there's still a place for a beginning resistance program...might not want it to be the focus, but there's no reason not to squat, deadlift and press. |
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no, it's inappropriate because when one's weight is >300lb and was at one point over 500lb, there are structural issues, such as overstressed joints/back/etc. You have to go very slow and very gently and focus on diet, very controlled resistance and symmetric development focusing on cardio, strength, balance, and flexibility, not only on strength. Quoted:
Now I am as much an iron devotee as anyone here, but is starting strength really the right recommendation in this case? Sounds like he's still seriously overweight, and to me that means he needs to unfuck his diet, do lots of cardio and generally being more active. Just becoming flexible enough to do a decent squat may prove to be a challenge. Some resistance training to maintain what muscle you have while you're still cutting weight is good, but save the serious weight training until that fat is under control. Note that I am not a doctor, nutritionist. personal trainer nor did not stay at a Holiday Inn express last night... You're right, but there's still a place for a beginning resistance program...might not want it to be the focus, but there's no reason not to squat, deadlift and press. Like its been said here before....if you can get up off the shitter and bend down and tie your own shoes you can do squats and deads. |
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Like its been said here before....if you can get up off the shitter and bend down and tie your own shoes you can do squats and deads. so weighted squat/deadlift with a barbell is appropriate for someone who went from 500+lb to >300lb and have weak, overstressed joints, and underdeveloped supporting muscle in the back? Along with overstressed back? |
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You're right, but there's still a place for a beginning resistance program...might not want it to be the focus, but there's no reason not to squat, deadlift and press. For simple reason like just the weight of barbell might be too much, esp. considering overstressed joints, back, lack of adequately developed support core muscle, etc. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Like its been said here before....if you can get up off the shitter and bend down and tie your own shoes you can do squats and deads. so weighted squat/deadlift with a barbell is appropriate for someone who went from 500+lb to >300lb and have weak, overstressed joints, and underdeveloped supporting muscle in the back? Along with overstressed back? Yes it is- it may not be heavy, it may be 100#, 45# or with a 15# training bar but yes, it is appropriate. How do you think he'll build that underdeveloped muscle? |
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Quoted: Quoted: You're right, but there's still a place for a beginning resistance program...might not want it to be the focus, but there's no reason not to squat, deadlift and press. For simple reason like just the weight of barbell might be too much, esp. considering overstressed joints, back, lack of adequately developed support core muscle, etc. Yeah, it MIGHT be, which is why I'm not prescribing a weight here. |
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The guy was not bed ridden which meant he had enough strength to move his own body around. Now that he can still move his body around, even running, at 200 pounds less hints that he is more than strong enough to move is body through most basic human motions such as sitting down and standing up. If he can tolerate the ground reaction forces of running at 300 + pounds I can bet his body is structually sound enough to handle 45 pounds accross his back. My only concern would be can he squat safely and effectively? If he could sit back into a squat, keep his weight in his heals, not let his knees collapse inwards and maintain a proper spinal position with no weight he is either ready for weighted squats, or will be within a short amount of time. If not, loading an already poor movement is just foolish.
From the sound of it he is looking to improve his quality of life. I would certainley hate to see him decrease his quality of life in an attempt to improve it. Overall it is his choice to make and I wish him the best of luck. And I wonder why people starting out with diet and exercise end up overwhelmed at all the differing opinions!? 
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Exactly...
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The guy was not bed ridden which meant he had enough strength to move his own body around. Now that he can still move his body around, even running, at 200 pounds less hints that he is more than strong enough to move is body through most basic human motions such as sitting down and standing up. If he can tolerate the ground reaction forces of running at 300 + pounds I can bet his body is structually sound enough to handle 45 pounds accross his back. My only concern would be can he squat safely and effectively? If he could sit back into a squat, keep his weight in his heals, not let his knees collapse inwards and maintain a proper spinal position with no weight he is either ready for weighted squats, or will be within a short amount of time. If not, loading an already poor movement is just foolish. From the sound of it he is looking to improve his quality of life. I would certainley hate to see him decrease his quality of life in an attempt to improve it. Overall it is his choice to make and I wish him the best of luck. And I wonder why people starting out with diet and exercise end up overwhelmed at all the differing opinions!? Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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I think using microplates for compound exercises is an equipment solution to a programming problem. Why? Shouldn't linear progression be exhausted before moving to more advanced forms of programming? I just never understood the whole idea behind exhausting every bit of linear progression you can.This is realized by progress coming to a complete halt and with the popular starting strength advice of backing off the weights and ramping back up a few times it just seems like time spent spinning your wheels. Realisticly this would probably be a max of 2 months which isn't anything in what should be viewed as a multi-year process but if we can avoid that then lets avoid it. I am all for the KISS concept, but at the same time I cant justify spinning your wheels all in the name of KISS (keep it simple, stupid). |
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You're right, but there's still a place for a beginning resistance program...might not want it to be the focus, but there's no reason not to squat, deadlift and press. LMAO at some of the responses here (not yours RoG). The OP is hauling around 200lbs less than he was not that long ago - awesome job there - and people are worried about him putting a 45lb barbell across his shoulders? Other folks are recommending the use of micro-plates when the OP has not even started strength training.
To the OP - the starting strength recommendation is a good one. Start slowly; focus on form; and don't worry about how much weight you're moving. If you have specific concerns, talk to your doctor or a PT before you get started. |
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you don't start off with weight because the jump in increase in the weight is too much. 10% of 345lb is 34.5lb and barbell alone weighs more than that.
So if you don't need to use weights in the beginning and also, shouldn't for safety reason, then weight training book is not going to be useful. He can safely move to weight when joints/supporting structural muscle/core muscle are more developed and also, when he has lost more weight. Also, weight training alone is not the sole road to strength/fitness. If you progress from knee pushup to full pushup to one arm pushup to handstand pushup and also progress to other calisthenics/body weight routine, you're going to be extremely strong from functional perspective. Not only that, if you swim and learn to swim with paddles for greater resistance, you're going to develop upper body strength as well as cardio. I don't know of too many weight lifters who can maintain a perfect 90 degree static wall sit for 30 minutes w/o breaking a sweat. Maybe you can but most folks who do weight training can't. Quoted:
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Like its been said here before....if you can get up off the shitter and bend down and tie your own shoes you can do squats and deads. so weighted squat/deadlift with a barbell is appropriate for someone who went from 500+lb to >300lb and have weak, overstressed joints, and underdeveloped supporting muscle in the back? Along with overstressed back? Yes it is- it may not be heavy, it may be 100#, 45# or with a 15# training bar but yes, it is appropriate. How do you think he'll build that underdeveloped muscle? |
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You're right, but there's still a place for a beginning resistance program...might not want it to be the focus, but there's no reason not to squat, deadlift and press. For simple reason like just the weight of barbell might be too much, esp. considering overstressed joints, back, lack of adequately developed support core muscle, etc. Yeah, it MIGHT be, which is why I'm not prescribing a weight here. If the guy is not going to use weight, he doesn't need a weight training book. |
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From the sound of it he is looking to improve his quality of life. I would certainley hate to see him decrease his quality of life in an attempt to improve it. Overall it is his choice to make and I wish him the best of luck. And I wonder why people starting out with diet and exercise end up overwhelmed at all the differing opinions!? so how does the following decrease the quality of his life? And how did this guy decrease the his quality of life in the following video? He certainly did not follow this forum's advice, that's for sure, to learn to walk again and lose 100+ lb! 297lb guy learns to walk again and lose 140lb! >>> Instead, I would recommend something like the following: - alternate regiment of walking, stationary cycling, and swimming/walking in water for at least 30 minutes. - resistance exercise: you'll probably get the most bang for buck by focusing on core/trunk and glute/thigh/leg - aquatic resistance program in pool is also good - core: regular plank, side plank, and bird dog(if you don't know what these are, google Stuart McGill, Canadian back specialist). These could be assisted or supported version until you develop the necessary strength. - glute/thigh/leg: static wall sit, squat(without weight), and lunges, again w/o weight - both pilates and yoga are good for stretching, although pilates is more core focused and emphasis in yoga varies tremendously, depending on type/drill/exercise...some parts of yoga are very much like gymnastics and some parts of it is actually very sedentary, while other parts approach skills/strength/flexibility of a circus acrobat(there are some school of thought which actually thinks that origin of Chinese martial arts lies in yoga brought over from India!) - keep in mind that there are at least 4 elements to fitness: cardio, muscle resistance/development, balance, and flexibility. To have balanced development, as well as balanced body, you need to develop all 4 aspects of general fitness. Not only that, regarding muscle/resistance development, there is slow push/grind aspect as well as explosive, ballistic aspect which requires different kinds of drills but before going there, I think losing weight and improving overall fitness should take precedence. - take it easy, don't try to do everything at once <<< |
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The guy was not bed ridden which meant he had enough strength to move his own body around. Now that he can still move his body around, even running, at 200 pounds less hints that he is more than strong enough to move is body through most basic human motions such as sitting down and standing up. If he can tolerate the ground reaction forces of running at 300 + pounds I can bet his body is structually sound enough to handle 45 pounds accross his back. My only concern would be can he squat safely and effectively? If he could sit back into a squat, keep his weight in his heals, not let his knees collapse inwards and maintain a proper spinal position with no weight he is either ready for weighted squats, or will be within a short amount of time. If not, loading an already poor movement is just foolish. Barbell alone weights 45lb. 10% of 345lb is 34.5lb. So starting off someone who is grossly overweight and WITH overstressed joints/back/support muscle with sudden weight increase of much more than 10% of his body weight is WISE? |
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Quoted: you don't start off with weight because the jump in increase in the weight is too much. 10% of 345lb is 34.5lb and barbell alone weighs more than that. So if you don't need to use weights in the beginning and also, shouldn't for safety reason, then weight training book is not going to be useful. He can safely move to weight when joints/supporting structural muscle/core muscle are more developed and also, when he has lost more weight. Also, weight training alone is not the sole road to strength/fitness. If you progress from knee push to full pushup to one arm push to handstand pushup and also progress to other calisthenics/body weight routine, you're going to be plenty strong. Not only that, if you swim and learn to swim with paddles for greater resistance, you're going to develop upper body strength as well as cardio. I don't know of too many weight lifters who can maintain a perfect 90 degree static wall sit for 30 minutes w/o breaking a sweat. Maybe you can but most folks who do weight training can't. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Like its been said here before....if you can get up off the shitter and bend down and tie your own shoes you can do squats and deads. so weighted squat/deadlift with a barbell is appropriate for someone who went from 500+lb to >300lb and have weak, overstressed joints, and underdeveloped supporting muscle in the back? Along with overstressed back? Yes it is- it may not be heavy, it may be 100#, 45# or with a 15# training bar but yes, it is appropriate. How do you think he'll build that underdeveloped muscle? He's already lost 200#, so a 45# bar isn't going to hurt him. And since you're laughably wrong about him not needing to do any weight training he would be wise to pick up that book. You're right, weight training isn't the sole way to get fitter, but it's one of the better, more efficient ways (depending on one's goals of course).
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I fail to see the relationship b/w losing 200lb and weight of the barbell being insignificant since 45lb barbell before weight is added is greater than 10% of the gentleman's current weight of 345lb.
So if someone loses 200lb in excess weight and is currently at 345lb, his joints/back/supporting muscle got stronger? How do you reason that? Quoted:
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You're right, but there's still a place for a beginning resistance program...might not want it to be the focus, but there's no reason not to squat, deadlift and press. LMAO at some of the responses here (not yours RoG). The OP is hauling around 200lbs less than he was not that long ago - awesome job there - and people are worried about him putting a 45lb barbell across his shoulders? Other folks are recommending the use of micro-plates when the OP has not even started strength training.
To the OP - the starting strength recommendation is a good one. Start slowly; focus on form; and don't worry about how much weight you're moving. If you have specific concerns, talk to your doctor or a PT before you get started. |
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Quoted: I fail to see the relationship b/w losing 200lb and weight of the barbell being insignificant since 45lb barbell before weight is added is greater than 10% of the gentleman's current weight of 345lb. So if someone loses 200lb in excess weight and is currently at 345lb, his joints/back/supporting muscle got stronger? How do you reason that? Quoted: Quoted: You're right, but there's still a place for a beginning resistance program...might not want it to be the focus, but there's no reason not to squat, deadlift and press. LMAO at some of the responses here (not yours RoG). The OP is hauling around 200lbs less than he was not that long ago - awesome job there - and people are worried about him putting a 45lb barbell across his shoulders? Other folks are recommending the use of micro-plates when the OP has not even started strength training.To the OP - the starting strength recommendation is a good one. Start slowly; focus on form; and don't worry about how much weight you're moving. If you have specific concerns, talk to your doctor or a PT before you get started. His body was supporting 200# pounds. Now he's supporting 200# FEWER pounds. It seems reasonable that he would be able to squat or deadlift 45#, and in reality he can probably do more than that- though I'd have to see him move to judge that. Where are you getting this ridiculous 10% of body weight number from? I don't know of ANYBODY who knows what they're talking about who thinks you should start at 10% of body weight. Hell, most UNTRAINED people can squat a lot more than that (flexibility issues aside).
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His body was supporting 200# pounds. Now he's supporting 200# FEWER pounds. It seems reasonable that he would be able to squat or deadlift 45#, and in reality he can probably do more than that- though I'd have to see him move to judge that. Where are you getting this ridiculous 10% of body weight number from? I don't know of ANYBODY who knows what they're talking about who thinks you should start at 10% of body weight. Hell, most UNTRAINED people can squat a lot more than that (flexibility issues aside). when people are grossly overweight, like 300lb and above, you start off with very light exercise, like wall sit. The reason is that something as simple as knee or ankle twist can be much more debilitating due to 2 reason: 1. much heavier body weight 2. weaker structure Previously carrying 200lb of fat doesn't mean that person's core and supporting muscle structure such as quad is stronger. Most folks I know who has lost large amount of body weight in short time usually haven't gotten stronger but weaker. |
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Quoted: Quoted: His body was supporting 200# pounds. Now he's supporting 200# FEWER pounds. It seems reasonable that he would be able to squat or deadlift 45#, and in reality he can probably do more than that- though I'd have to see him move to judge that. Where are you getting this ridiculous 10% of body weight number from? I don't know of ANYBODY who knows what they're talking about who thinks you should start at 10% of body weight. Hell, most UNTRAINED people can squat a lot more than that (flexibility issues aside). when people are grossly overweight, like 300lb and above, you start off with very light exercise, like wall sit. The reason is that something as simple as knee or ankle twist can be much more debilitating due to 2 reason: 1. much heavier body weight 2. weaker structure Previously carrying 200lb of fat doesn't mean that person's core and supporting muscle structure such as quad is stronger. Most folks I know who has lost large amount of body weight in short time usually haven't gotten stronger but weaker. Wall sits are ok, but aren't going to do shit for improving his ROM or his strength throughout his ROM. And if you don't think a 45# squat is very light, then I don't know what to tell you. - just to clarify, I'm not saying 45# is the magic number- maybe he can only do a 15# training bar, or there is the possibility that he may have to do air squats, we just don't know. You're advise to stay away from weight training is just flat out wrong though.
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here is what I recommended. I fail to see why weighting training book and weight training via squat/press/deadlift is safer/better for someone who weighs 345lb and just lost 200lb? Also, where I did I fail to recommend ROM? Last time I checked, both pilates/yoga included plenty of stretching routines/workout.
>>> Instead, I would recommend something like the following: - alternate regiment of walking, stationary cycling, and swimming/walking in water for at least 30 minutes. - resistance exercise: you'll probably get the most bang for buck by focusing on core/trunk and glute/thigh/leg - aquatic resistance program in pool is also good - core: regular plank, side plank, and bird dog(if you don't know what these are, google Stuart McGill, Canadian back specialist). These could be assisted or supported version until you develop the necessary strength. - glute/thigh/leg: static wall sit, squat(without weight), and lunges, again w/o weight - both pilates and yoga are good for stretching, although pilates is more core focused and emphasis in yoga varies tremendously, depending on type/drill/exercise...some parts of yoga are very much like gymnastics and some parts of it is actually very sedentary, while other parts approach skills/strength/flexibility of a circus acrobat(there are some school of thought which actually thinks that origin of Chinese martial arts lies in yoga brought over from India!) - keep in mind that there are at least 4 elements to fitness: cardio, muscle resistance/development, balance, and flexibility. To have balanced development, as well as balanced body, you need to develop all 4 aspects of general fitness. Not only that, regarding muscle/resistance development, there is slow push/grind aspect as well as explosive, ballistic aspect which requires different kinds of drills but before going there, I think losing weight and improving overall fitness should take precedence. - take it easy, don't try to do everything at once <<< Quoted:
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His body was supporting 200# pounds. Now he's supporting 200# FEWER pounds. It seems reasonable that he would be able to squat or deadlift 45#, and in reality he can probably do more than that- though I'd have to see him move to judge that. Where are you getting this ridiculous 10% of body weight number from? I don't know of ANYBODY who knows what they're talking about who thinks you should start at 10% of body weight. Hell, most UNTRAINED people can squat a lot more than that (flexibility issues aside). when people are grossly overweight, like 300lb and above, you start off with very light exercise, like wall sit. The reason is that something as simple as knee or ankle twist can be much more debilitating due to 2 reason: 1. much heavier body weight 2. weaker structure Previously carrying 200lb of fat doesn't mean that person's core and supporting muscle structure such as quad is stronger. Most folks I know who has lost large amount of body weight in short time usually haven't gotten stronger but weaker. Wall sits are ok, but aren't going to do shit for improving his ROM or his strength throughout his ROM. And if you don't think a 45# squat is very light, then I don't know what to tell you. - just to clarify, I'm not saying 45# is the magic number- maybe he can only do a 15# training bar, or there is the possibility that he may have to do air squats, we just don't know. You're advise to stay away from weight training is just flat out wrong though. |
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Quoted: here is what I recommended. I fail to see why weighting training book and weight training via squat/press/deadlift is safer/better for someone who weighs 345lb and just lost 200lb? Also, where I failed to recommend ROM? >>> Instead, I would recommend something like the following: - alternate regiment of walking, stationary cycling, and swimming/walking in water for at least 30 minutes. - resistance exercise: you'll probably get the most bang for buck by focusing on core/trunk and glute/thigh/leg - aquatic resistance program in pool is also good - core: regular plank, side plank, and bird dog(if you don't know what these are, google Stuart McGill, Canadian back specialist). These could be assisted or supported version until you develop the necessary strength. - glute/thigh/leg: static wall sit, squat(without weight), and lunges, again w/o weight - both pilates and yoga are good for stretching, although pilates is more core focused and emphasis in yoga varies tremendously, depending on type/drill/exercise...some parts of yoga are very much like gymnastics and some parts of it is actually very sedentary, while other parts approach skills/strength/flexibility of a circus acrobat(there are some school of thought which actually thinks that origin of Chinese martial arts lies in yoga brought over from India!) - keep in mind that there are at least 4 elements to fitness: cardio, muscle resistance/development, balance, and flexibility. To have balanced development, as well as balanced body, you need to develop all 4 aspects of general fitness. Not only that, regarding muscle/resistance development, there is slow push/grind aspect as well as explosive, ballistic aspect which requires different kinds of drills but before going there, I think losing weight and improving overall fitness should take precedence. - take it easy, don't try to do everything at once <<< Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: His body was supporting 200# pounds. Now he's supporting 200# FEWER pounds. It seems reasonable that he would be able to squat or deadlift 45#, and in reality he can probably do more than that- though I'd have to see him move to judge that. Where are you getting this ridiculous 10% of body weight number from? I don't know of ANYBODY who knows what they're talking about who thinks you should start at 10% of body weight. Hell, most UNTRAINED people can squat a lot more than that (flexibility issues aside). when people are grossly overweight, like 300lb and above, you start off with very light exercise, like wall sit. The reason is that something as simple as knee or ankle twist can be much more debilitating due to 2 reason: 1. much heavier body weight 2. weaker structure Previously carrying 200lb of fat doesn't mean that person's core and supporting muscle structure such as quad is stronger. Most folks I know who has lost large amount of body weight in short time usually haven't gotten stronger but weaker. Wall sits are ok, but aren't going to do shit for improving his ROM or his strength throughout his ROM. And if you don't think a 45# squat is very light, then I don't know what to tell you. - just to clarify, I'm not saying 45# is the magic number- maybe he can only do a 15# training bar, or there is the possibility that he may have to do air squats, we just don't know. You're advise to stay away from weight training is just flat out wrong though. Because those movements are things all people should be able to do. Get yourself off the toilet, pick something off the ground and lift it overhead. ROM = range of motion. Wall sits don't have it, squats do.
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Because those movements are things all people should be able to do. Get yourself off the toilet, pick something off the ground and lift it overhead. ROM = range of motion. Wall sits don't have it, squats do. [/div] check the list again. How many weight training folks can hold a perfect plank for 15 minutes? Do you even know what a plank is? Or hold a static squat with thigh parallel to ground for 5 minutes w/o leg shaking? >>> Instead, I would recommend something like the following: - alternate regiment of walking, stationary cycling, and swimming/walking in water for at least 30 minutes. - resistance exercise: you'll probably get the most bang for buck by focusing on core/trunk and glute/thigh/leg - aquatic resistance program in pool is also good - core: regular plank, side plank, and bird dog(if you don't know what these are, google Stuart McGill, Canadian back specialist). These could be assisted or supported version until you develop the necessary strength. - glute/thigh/leg: static wall sit, squat(without weight), and lunges, again w/o weight - both pilates and yoga are good for stretching, although pilates is more core focused and emphasis in yoga varies tremendously, depending on type/drill/exercise...some parts of yoga are very much like gymnastics and some parts of it is actually very sedentary, while other parts approach skills/strength/flexibility of a circus acrobat(there are some school of thought which actually thinks that origin of Chinese martial arts lies in yoga brought over from India!) - keep in mind that there are at least 4 elements to fitness: cardio, muscle resistance/development, balance, and flexibility. To have balanced development, as well as balanced body, you need to develop all 4 aspects of general fitness. Not only that, regarding muscle/resistance development, there is slow push/grind aspect as well as explosive, ballistic aspect which requires different kinds of drills but before going there, I think losing weight and improving overall fitness should take precedence. - take it easy, don't try to do everything at once <<< |
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Because those movements are things all people should be able to do. Get yourself off the toilet, pick something off the ground and lift it overhead. ROM = range of motion. Wall sits don't have it, squats do. [/div] so ROM is not included in the following like yoga/pilates or air squats(no weight)? LOL, would be nice if you actually understood/read what you are criticizing, LOL! theinvisibleheart wrote>>> >>> Instead, I would recommend something like the following: - alternate regiment of walking, stationary cycling, and swimming/walking in water for at least 30 minutes. - resistance exercise: you'll probably get the most bang for buck by focusing on core/trunk and glute/thigh/leg - aquatic resistance program in pool is also good - core: regular plank, side plank, and bird dog(if you don't know what these are, google Stuart McGill, Canadian back specialist). These could be assisted or supported version until you develop the necessary strength. - glute/thigh/leg: static wall sit, squat(without weight), and lunges, again w/o weight - both pilates and yoga are good for stretching, although pilates is more core focused and emphasis in yoga varies tremendously, depending on type/drill/exercise...some parts of yoga are very much like gymnastics and some parts of it is actually very sedentary, while other parts approach skills/strength/flexibility of a circus acrobat(there are some school of thought which actually thinks that origin of Chinese martial arts lies in yoga brought over from India!) - keep in mind that there are at least 4 elements to fitness: cardio, muscle resistance/development, balance, and flexibility. To have balanced development, as well as balanced body, you need to develop all 4 aspects of general fitness. Not only that, regarding muscle/resistance development, there is slow push/grind aspect as well as explosive, ballistic aspect which requires different kinds of drills but before going there, I think losing weight and improving overall fitness should take precedence. - take it easy, don't try to do everything at once <<< <<< |
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Not only that, if you swim and learn to swim with paddles for greater resistance, you're going to develop upper body strength as well as cardio. Swimming with paddles will not improve strength. If you think that is the case, you don't understand what strength is. Quoted:
I don't know of too many weight lifters who can maintain a perfect 90 degree static wall sit for 30 minutes w/o breaking a sweat. Maybe you can but most folks who do weight training can't. And the point of maintaining a wall sit for 30 minutes is what? Prep for SERE school? Quoted:
so weighted squat/deadlift with a barbell is appropriate for someone who went from 500+lb to >300lb and have weak, overstressed joints, and underdeveloped supporting muscle in the back? Pretty tough to argue that someone who has weighed more than 500 pounds and has been highly mobile (according to the person) has muscles that are underdeveloped for supporting 350 pounds. Those muscles HAVE been supporting 500+ pounds and have supported high activity levels at current weight. Quoted:
Along with overstressed back? I missed it. Where did the OP say that he was experiencing back pain? |
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Quoted: Quoted: Because those movements are things all people should be able to do. Get yourself off the toilet, pick something off the ground and lift it overhead. ROM = range of motion. Wall sits don't have it, squats do. check the list again. How many weight training folks can hold a perfect plank for 15 minutes? Do you even know what a plank is? Or hold a static squat with thigh parallel to ground for 5 minutes w/o leg shaking? >>> Instead, I would recommend something like the following: - alternate regiment of walking, stationary cycling, and swimming/walking in water for at least 30 minutes. - resistance exercise: you'll probably get the most bang for buck by focusing on core/trunk and glute/thigh/leg - aquatic resistance program in pool is also good - core: regular plank, side plank, and bird dog(if you don't know what these are, google Stuart McGill, Canadian back specialist). These could be assisted or supported version until you develop the necessary strength. - glute/thigh/leg: static wall sit, squat(without weight), and lunges, again w/o weight - both pilates and yoga are good for stretching, although pilates is more core focused and emphasis in yoga varies tremendously, depending on type/drill/exercise...some parts of yoga are very much like gymnastics and some parts of it is actually very sedentary, while other parts approach skills/strength/flexibility of a circus acrobat(there are some school of thought which actually thinks that origin of Chinese martial arts lies in yoga brought over from India!) - keep in mind that there are at least 4 elements to fitness: cardio, muscle resistance/development, balance, and flexibility. To have balanced development, as well as balanced body, you need to develop all 4 aspects of general fitness. Not only that, regarding muscle/resistance development, there is slow push/grind aspect as well as explosive, ballistic aspect which requires different kinds of drills but before going there, I think losing weight and improving overall fitness should take precedence. - take it easy, don't try to do everything at once <<< [/div] No I don't know what a plank is. Perhaps you mean planche? In that case, yes I know what it is, but fail to see how the OP holding it for 15 min would help him reach his goals. How many weight training folks can do it? I don't know. How many planche folks can squat 2x their body weight?[/div] |
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Quoted: Quoted: Because those movements are things all people should be able to do. Get yourself off the toilet, pick something off the ground and lift it overhead. ROM = range of motion. Wall sits don't have it, squats do. so ROM is not included in the following like yoga/pilates or air squats(no weight)? LOL, would be nice if you actually understood/read what you are criticizing, LOL! theinvisibleheart wrote>>> >>> Instead, I would recommend something like the following: - alternate regiment of walking, stationary cycling, and swimming/walking in water for at least 30 minutes. - resistance exercise: you'll probably get the most bang for buck by focusing on core/trunk and glute/thigh/leg - aquatic resistance program in pool is also good - core: regular plank, side plank, and bird dog(if you don't know what these are, google Stuart McGill, Canadian back specialist). These could be assisted or supported version until you develop the necessary strength. - glute/thigh/leg: static wall sit, squat(without weight), and lunges, again w/o weight - both pilates and yoga are good for stretching, although pilates is more core focused and emphasis in yoga varies tremendously, depending on type/drill/exercise...some parts of yoga are very much like gymnastics and some parts of it is actually very sedentary, while other parts approach skills/strength/flexibility of a circus acrobat(there are some school of thought which actually thinks that origin of Chinese martial arts lies in yoga brought over from India!) - keep in mind that there are at least 4 elements to fitness: cardio, muscle resistance/development, balance, and flexibility. To have balanced development, as well as balanced body, you need to develop all 4 aspects of general fitness. Not only that, regarding muscle/resistance development, there is slow push/grind aspect as well as explosive, ballistic aspect which requires different kinds of drills but before going there, I think losing weight and improving overall fitness should take precedence. - take it easy, don't try to do everything at once <<< <<< [/div] I was obviously talking about the wall sits which you were hung up on yesterday. And yes, I'm familiar with Pilates- I should be since there's 2 reformers sitting in my garage for my wife who's opening her own studio...I should also know a few things about it since I'm in the process of getting a mat certification. |
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Swimming with paddles will not improve strength. If you think that is the case, you don't understand what strength is. And the point of maintaining a wall sit for 30 minutes is what? Prep for SERE school? Pretty tough to argue that someone who has weighed more than 500 pounds and has been highly mobile (according to the person) has muscles that are underdeveloped for supporting 350 pounds. Those muscles HAVE been supporting 500+ pounds and have supported high activity levels at current weight. I missed it. Where did the OP say that he was experiencing back pain? Paddles are used to improve strength/technique/speed for swimming but they also help burn more calories. It will help with creating a greater daily calorie deficit that will help the OP lose more weight. Wall sit is a basic rehab for joints/knees. It's also a very good exercise for developing your quads. Form matters more than time. Most people can't do one minute of perfect wall sit correctly. I only said 30 minutes because some folks got the impression that regimen was too easy. You can make it as hard or as easy as one wishes. If one minute of perfect wall sit didn't do anything, then one can progress to 5 minutes, 10 minutes, etc. There are different kinds of strength/strength training. General fitness isn't same as strength training. People who are overweight/obese/grossly overweight are predisposed/tend to have higher frequency of joint/back problem. For example, carrying extra 10lb of body weight translates to knee/hip feeling 3X as much force. Obesity/extra weight is a contributing factor to back problem. Even if the OP doesn't have any joint/back problem, odds are that he is predisposed to it due to tremendous amount of extra weight that he is carrying. Six in 10 Obese Adults Have Joint Pain Six in 10 Obese Adults Have Joint Pain AHRQ News and Numbers Release date: March 20, 2012 Fifty-eight percent of obese and nearly 69 percent of extremely obese adults age 20 or older reported suffering from joint pain in 2009, according to the latest News and Numbers from the Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality (AHRQ). The Federal agency found that among obese adults, nearly 42 percent reported having a heart condition, 42 percent said they had elevated cholesterol and 15 percent said they suffered from diabetes. The Association Between Obesity and Low Back Pain The Association Between Obesity and Low Back Pain: A Meta-Analysis Rahman Shiri*, Jaro Karppinen, Päivi Leino-Arjas, Svetlana Solovieva and Eira Viikari-Juntura *Correspondence to Dr. Rahman Shiri, Centre of Expertise for Health and Work Ability, Finnish Institute of Occupational Health, Topeliuksenkatu 41 a A, FIN-00250 Helsinki, Finland (e-mail: [email protected]). overweight and obesity increase the risk of low back pain. Overweight and obesity have the strongest association with seeking care for low back pain and chronic low back pain. |
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TIH: What research backs your recommendations as to your recommendations being the most ideal for the OP? What credentials and experience do you have that support your recommendations? I'm truly interested in how/why you give them. Thank you- Being overweight/obese increases the risk for joint/hip problem and back problem. Static wall sit/air squat are basic knee exercise. Ditto for plank/side plank except its for core. |
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first. Correlation is not causation. Maybe the Low back pain (LBP) CAUSED the people to be obese... eh?... Second. Stationary bike is actually better rehab than wall-sits (which are useless aside from mental fortitude and lactic acid tolerance). But you wouldn't know that because you have... Third... No credentials or clinical experience to determine this. If the OP has knee or back problems, Even walking would NOT be on my recommendation list. Swimming and stationary biking would be my recommendation due to the lack of impact. Squats (body weight, with a 45lb bar, or w/e he can muscularly handle etc) would be fine for anyone barring any major neurological complication/instability. "Low back pain" is not a contraindication, but any Spondy or instability would be. The fact that you state "he was overweight, therefore he has beat up his body and shouldnt handle weights" shows that you know nothing about severe weight loss/obesity and exercise. My credentials?–– professional Fighter/boxer professional Coach/trainer specializing in Knee rehab and Lumbar recovery. MS in Neurophys. Medical degree Clinical neurologist associated with further research. |
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No I don't know what a plank is. Perhaps you mean planche? In that case, yes I know what it is, but fail to see how the OP holding it for 15 min would help him reach his goals. How many weight training folks can do it? I don't know. How many planche folks can squat 2x their body weight?[/div] [/div] Planche and plank are 2 different thing. I wouldn't recommend planche for somebody who is overweight for the simple reason it's hard on your wrist, esp. if one is more than 300lb. Plank is a basic exercise for developing healthy core. There are so many articles about healthy core that it's not funny. It helps with everyday activity, lifting/twisting/standing, healthy back, sports, housework, gardening, balance/stability, good posture, etc. The real-world benefits of strengthening your core |
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first. Correlation is not causation. Maybe the Low back pain (LBP) CAUSED the people to be obese... eh?... Second. Stationary bike is actually better rehab than wall-sits (which are useless aside from mental fortitude and lactic acid tolerance). But you wouldn't know that because you have... Third... No credentials or clinical experience to determine this. Funny, I thought I recommended stationary cycling in the original recommendation, LOL! Quoted:
Instead, I would recommend something like the following: - alternate regiment of walking, stationary cycling, and swimming/walking in water for at least 30 minutes. - resistance exercise: you'll probably get the most bang for buck by focusing on core/trunk and glute/thigh/leg - aquatic resistance program in pool is also good - core: regular plank, side plank, and bird dog(if you don't know what these are, google Stuart McGill, Canadian back specialist). These could be assisted or supported version until you develop the necessary strength. - glute/thigh/leg: static wall sit, squat(without weight), and lunges, again w/o weight - both pilates and yoga are good for stretching, although pilates is more core focused and emphasis in yoga varies tremendously, depending on type/drill/exercise...some parts of yoga are very much like gymnastics and some parts of it is actually very sedentary, while other parts approach skills/strength/flexibility of a circus acrobat(there are some school of thought which actually thinks that origin of Chinese martial arts lies in yoga brought over from India!) - keep in mind that there are at least 4 elements to fitness: cardio, muscle resistance/development, balance, and flexibility. To have balanced development, as well as balanced body, you need to develop all 4 aspects of general fitness. Not only that, regarding muscle/resistance development, there is slow push/grind aspect as well as explosive, ballistic aspect which requires different kinds of drills but before going there, I think losing weight and improving overall fitness should take precedence. - take it easy, don't try to do everything at once |
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professional Fighter/boxer professional Coach/trainer specializing in Knee rehab and Lumbar recovery. MS in Neurophys. Medical degree Clinical neurologist associated with further research. BTW, are you the same guy who told this guy that he can never walk again and should give up, LOL? This is a joke, BTW, LOL. |
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first. Correlation is not causation. Maybe the Low back pain (LBP) CAUSED the people to be obese... eh?... Obviously, if you are injured, mobility/exercise level decrease and caloric intake tend to >> caloric expenditure so the tendency is for one to gain weight, LOL, but clinical data, like WAY MORE THAN ONE, found out that back problem increase with weight gain, both in US and outside of US. Basically, the weight of evidence is higher for overweight/obesity causing back problem rather than back problem being the causative factor. Following is an article that is going to be published in Spine, the official journal of the North American Spine Society. Body Mass Index as a Risk Factor for Developing Chronic Low Back Pain Spine (Phila Pa 1976). 2012 Jun 20. Body Mass Index as a Risk Factor for Developing Chronic Low Back Pain: A Follow-up in the Nord-Trøndelag Health Study. Heuch I, Heuch I, Hagen K, Zwart JA. High values of BMI may predispose to chronic LBP 11 years later, both in individuals with and without LBP. The association between BMI and LBP is not explained by an effect of LBP on later change in BMI. |
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Quoted: Quoted: No I don't know what a plank is. Perhaps you mean planche? In that case, yes I know what it is, but fail to see how the OP holding it for 15 min would help him reach his goals. How many weight training folks can do it? I don't know. How many planche folks can squat 2x their body weight?[/div] [/div] Planche and plank are 2 different thing. I wouldn't recommend planche for somebody who is overweight for the simple reason it's hard on your wrist, esp. if one is more than 300lb. Plank is a basic exercise for developing healthy core. There are so many articles about healthy core that it's not funny. It helps with everyday activity, lifting/twisting/standing, healthy back, sports, housework, gardening, balance/stability, good posture, etc. The real-world benefits of strengthening your core https://encrypted-tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSgWDHo2SIhaLQbfIAE-7eTLOkAlMoDwoHbVBNACPMYbb8hAUMb I'm not saying it's a bad exercise but it's stupid to focus on it. It's ONE STATIC movement that is good for core, but won't help him reach his goals. You know what else is great for the core? Lifting. |
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If the OP has knee or back problems, Even walking would NOT be on my recommendation list. Swimming and stationary biking would be my recommendation due to the lack of impact. Squats (body weight, with a 45lb bar, or w/e he can muscularly handle etc) would be fine for anyone barring any major neurological complication/instability. "Low back pain" is not a contraindication, but any Spondy or instability would be. The fact that you state "he was overweight, therefore he has beat up his body and shouldnt handle weights" shows that you know nothing about severe weight loss/obesity and exercise. There was a study done in Europe(wasn't translated into English) which showed that psychotherapy combined with different kinds of activities was just as effective as low back surgery. Interestingly enough, the study also found out that light aerobics yielded higher payout than rehab/physical therapy most probably due to confidence factor. The point is that light impact/aerobics can help folks with back problem. In US(in English), there was a meta-analytic study which found out that for medium/long term result, there was very little difference b/w folks who opted for back surgery vs. intense rehab. If walking on land is a problem, then one can alternate b/w stationary cycling and walking in water, as well as swimming. However, being predisposed to injury doesn't mean one has an injury but for basic prudence, one should be careful. Also, walking is a very fundamental activity. Almost every folk who've aged successfully, while showing minimal signs of physical deterioration and cognitive loss, seem to walk for 15-30 minutes a day, regularly. |
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I'm not saying it's a bad exercise but it's stupid to focus on it. It's ONE STATIC movement that is good for core, but won't help him reach his goals. You know what else is great for the core? Lifting. So I focused on ONE EXERCISE in the following? I must have difficulty counting. Quoted:
Instead, I would recommend something like the following: - alternate regiment of walking, stationary cycling, and swimming/walking in water for at least 30 minutes. - resistance exercise: you'll probably get the most bang for buck by focusing on core/trunk and glute/thigh/leg - aquatic resistance program in pool is also good - core: regular plank, side plank, and bird dog(if you don't know what these are, google Stuart McGill, Canadian back specialist). These could be assisted or supported version until you develop the necessary strength. - glute/thigh/leg: static wall sit, squat(without weight), and lunges, again w/o weight - both pilates and yoga are good for stretching, although pilates is more core focused and emphasis in yoga varies tremendously, depending on type/drill/exercise...some parts of yoga are very much like gymnastics and some parts of it is actually very sedentary, while other parts approach skills/strength/flexibility of a circus acrobat(there are some school of thought which actually thinks that origin of Chinese martial arts lies in yoga brought over from India!) - keep in mind that there are at least 4 elements to fitness: cardio, muscle resistance/development, balance, and flexibility. To have balanced development, as well as balanced body, you need to develop all 4 aspects of general fitness. Not only that, regarding muscle/resistance development, there is slow push/grind aspect as well as explosive, ballistic aspect which requires different kinds of drills but before going there, I think losing weight and improving overall fitness should take precedence. - take it easy, don't try to do everything at once |