Posted: 3/16/2016 8:48:10 PM EDT
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I have a ptr 91 coming and im considering turning this into a precision type rifle, I know the factory triggers are not ideal but im planning to send it to Williams to get a set trigger job done to it.
anyone use one of these in this kind of role? |
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Quoted:
I don't think a PTR 91 would fulfill my definition of a precision rifle, but maybe your's will. I used to think this of my FAL's until I purchased true precision rifles. I was going to go with a similar post. I have both an HK-93 and 91: while they are OK, even with the best of ammo they are battle rifles, not precision rifles. |
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Here's a group from my DM Course shot with an SR25 at 1000yds on a large gong at North Springs, using the 178gr AMAX, next to my AR15 6.5 Grendel rapid fire group.
That rifle is superbly accurate. See the 3 rds at 12 o'clock covering half of the center black circle? These groups were shot at different times in the day, and I was just holding into the wind with a guesstimate of where I thought I needed to be, couldn't see my hits through the spotting scope. We could just barely see his when they appeared in the string. 
I would be surprised to see hits on the plate even with a PTR-91. |
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Quoted:
Here's a group from my DM Course shot with an SR25 at 1000yds on a large gong at North Springs, using the 178gr AMAX, next to my AR15 6.5 Grendel rapid fire group. That rifle is superbly accurate. See the 3 rds at 12 o'clock covering half of the center black circle? These groups were shot at different times in the day, and I was just holding into the wind with a guesstimate of where I thought I needed to be, couldn't see my hits through the spotting scope. We could just barely see his when they appeared in the string. http://i1085.photobucket.com/albums/j422/LRRPF52/3bf6ee00-ad92-4600-a7bb-e77b0832f99f_zpsfe8pbfh3.jpg I would be surprised to see hits on the plate even with a PTR-91. I don't know why you have to crap on everything that is not 6.5 Grendel. OP is talking about a PTR91 not an SR25 in 6.5 |
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I don't know why you have to crap on everything that is not 6.5 Grendel. OP is talking about a PTR91 not an SR25 in 6.5 Quoted:
Quoted:
Here's a group from my DM Course shot with an SR25 at 1000yds on a large gong at North Springs, using the 178gr AMAX, next to my AR15 6.5 Grendel rapid fire group. That rifle is superbly accurate. See the 3 rds at 12 o'clock covering half of the center black circle? These groups were shot at different times in the day, and I was just holding into the wind with a guesstimate of where I thought I needed to be, couldn't see my hits through the spotting scope. We could just barely see his when they appeared in the string. http://i1085.photobucket.com/albums/j422/LRRPF52/3bf6ee00-ad92-4600-a7bb-e77b0832f99f_zpsfe8pbfh3.jpg I would be surprised to see hits on the plate even with a PTR-91. I don't know why you have to crap on everything that is not 6.5 Grendel. OP is talking about a PTR91 not an SR25 in 6.5 I think he is simply pointing out the AR platform, large frame or small, is a better option... |
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would you not look at these the same way the mil looks at a sr25 or any other ar10 marksmans rifle? I was responding to this. It's very hard for me to think of a PTR-91 as a precision rifle, since they are not known for accuracy and being optics friendly. A delayed rolling locker system is pretty brutal on optics with 7.62 NATO driving the bolt carrier group back, with very heavy action spring weight slamming it back into battery. |
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I bought an HK91 back in the 80's and accuracy was rather poor. I had it topped with a Leupold 12x target scope in a factory HK mount and it was lucky to shoot 2 MOA at 100 yards.....and that was with 110gr hand loads. Bullets over 110gr went into 3 inch+ patterns. The thing sucked.
Maybe the PTR's are better than the original HK's......it wouldn't take much to improve on them. Tony |
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The 91 will shoot 3inch groups at best,They can do better than that frequently- maybe 3MOA with regular 147-150gr FMJ's, but quality bullets help a lot and ruin every single case ejected.Port buffer alleviates the brass damage, nearly 100% It will destroy cheap scopes andso stop using cheap scopes. They suck anyway you will be rezeroing after every range trip unless it has a welded on fail rail. I have two SG1 scope mounts on two different rifles, and swap the scopes between the rifles. Both hold zero as well as my Larue SPRE on my AR I'm not claiming that a G3 type can keep up with a precision AR10 platform. I've had both and the AR10 is the winner in precision. The G3 type can be brought within minimum practical accuracy boundaries. It's not cheap, but doesn't automatically require rebarreling. The G3 isn't a benchrest level shooter, but the AR10 isn't an AK reliable shooter either. It's give and take. |
| I gota good deal on an hk91 a long time ago (first 308) and wanted to make it a "precision" rifle. upgraded the trigger, put a nicer buffer on it, decent scope. ect. That thing was a BLAST to shoot, but precision was not its thing. On top of the fact it just destroys the cases for reloading. I ended up selling it, still regret it, to fund my semi auto 308 that will shoot moa all day long and with hand loads (and me doing more of my part) i get 1/2 moa. so i have been there, and unless it says PSG, u wont have an "accurate" hk91 style rifle. |
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The G3 isn't a benchrest level shooter, but the AR10 isn't an AK reliable shooter either. It's give and take. Quoted:
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The 91 will shoot 3inch groups at best,They can do better than that frequently- maybe 3MOA with regular 147-150gr FMJ's, but quality bullets help a lot and ruin every single case ejected.Port buffer alleviates the brass damage, nearly 100% It will destroy cheap scopes andso stop using cheap scopes. They suck anyway you will be rezeroing after every range trip unless it has a welded on fail rail. I have two SG1 scope mounts on two different rifles, and swap the scopes between the rifles. Both hold zero as well as my Larue SPRE on my AR The G3 isn't a benchrest level shooter, but the AR10 isn't an AK reliable shooter either. It's give and take. I'm calling bullshit on that statement. It assumes that large-framed AR's have inherent reliability issues which couldn't be further from the truth. There is no "give and take" with regards to the AR's that are precision rifles, they are precise and function fine. This banal assumption that AK's are somehow the gold standard of reliability is really silly at this point. Let's move on. |
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Another two items that you should consider to assist in controlling the recoil in addition to the trigger work your discussing would be to update the stock pad and buffer both parts can be purchased from RTG and will greatly help in reducing the recoil to a gently rearward push that will facilitate getting back on target quicker and remove trigger jerk and/or body flinching due to the heavy recoil driving the rifle hard into the body.
http://www.robertrtg.com/store/pc/HK-HEAVY-BUFFER-U-S-PCS-181p1957.htm http://www.robertrtg.com/store/pc/HK21-RUBBER-BUTTPAD-25p1863.htm These additional items should help get your closer to your DMR ( Designated Marksmen Rifle). |
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Given that there are some pretty decent precision rifles based on the 91 platform, they obviously can be made to shoot fairly well.
I've got an MSG90 and SG1 that do a decent job. I also have an Mk11mod0 that does a bit better accuracy wise, but leaves something to be desired with regard to reliability (chokes once in a while) . That being said, starting with a bare bones 91, fix the trigger first and use quality scope mounting components (ie. a real claw mount or a quality p-rail), and add a port buffer if you plan on reloading. Basically look at HK did with the SG-1 first, and then what they did with the PSG-1 and MSG-90 for clues as to what parts of the system need "upgrading" to be accurate. My SG-1 is a 1.5moa gun with handloads FWIW. |