Posted: 12/24/2014 7:54:26 PM EDT
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Ok gents i grew up shooting bolt action rifles and now I want to get one I can reach out and touch things with.
Intended ranges of 500-1000 yards in 308 (maybe 300 win mag). I don't need to drop a lot of coin on it but would like a decent rifle and optic. I know Remington 700's can be had for a good price. What would you guys recommend? |
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Quoted:
I know you said you don't need to drop a lot of coin, but if you could be a little more specific on your budget for the rifle and optic it would help people make better suggestions for you. Around $1500 would be ideal for the rifle and optic. Once i reacquire my long range shooting ability i'll be willing to spend some more money. I just want something to get me back in the game. |
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Please help us out!
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_16_17/626_Which________should_I_buy____Please_Read_.html M Richardson |
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Quoted:
Please help us out! http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_16_17/626_Which________should_I_buy____Please_Read_.html M Richardson Thanks...i'm not going to answer every single one of the points you made in your threads but let me try to give you some basics: I'm looking for a 1000 yard rifle to primarily shoot paper/steel (I am thinking a 308 would be ideal). I would like a bolt action with a simple stock set up for the time being but potentially have it be something I could upgrade later. I do not want this to be a bench gun as there is the possibility that I will use this for hunting at some point also. I would prefer a threaded barrel for use of a brake although this is not strictly necessary. Recoil is not a factor. As far as triggers go in my price range I am not sure I can get something match grade. Again I used to shoot long range with bolt guns but it has been a long time. I am completely new to long range optics in this country so this is where I will probably need the most help. If it helps at all I learned to use scopes using the MIL system (despite my education being screwed up and them trying to teach me metric and standard units). As for the magazine I am not fussed about detachable or internal box either one is fine with me. Clearly detachable is always nice but it is not a primary concern. As for barrel length I agree with you about wanting the longest and heaviest profile possible however this does need to be a rifle I can sling and carry distances if necessary. Price range around $1000-$1500 including optic I was looking at this savage: Savage |
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Link doesn't go to a specific model. |
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Quoted: Model: 11/111 Hog Hunter 308 Sorry annoying savage website. 20" barrel? 1000yd? 308? If you want a gun for going "long", go with something made to go long. Not saying a 20" 308 wont do it, they're just better ways to do it. I would say 26" MIN. Barrel length = velocity. If I were looking for a stock savage to shoot long in 308, something like this would be on my short list. http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/model/12BENCHREST |
For an optic in your price range I would highly suggest an SWFA super sniper scope with mil turrets. Either a fixed 10X or 12X would work for your purpose and cost around $300. They also hold their value so if you decide to upgrade later you can get your money back out of them. I have both a 10X and a 12X and they both track perfectly and from other reviews they can handle a lot of abuse although I haven't felt the need to abuse mine to find out The glass is good enough and I feel you have to spend two to three times as much money to get a scope that is better over all than the super sniper.
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I agree with you about the barrel length but I do need something that's relatively portable too. The reason why I was put off of bench rest models is my buddy has a custom remington 700 that is so damn bulky and heavy that it's useless. The area I shoot in is an old quarry with several places to set up and shoot but some of which I will have to walk or climb to, length and weight are a concern but I don't think adding an extra six inches to the barrel would be too long. Thanks for the advice.
Also lefty, thanks for the scope recommendation will be sure to check that out. |
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If you're a hand loader I'd recommend a .260 Remington (6.5-08) or a 308. As you're in Virginia you may find a few places to shoot that will let you reach out a full 1,000 yards with safe backstopping -- otherwise you find yourself limited to private or public rifle ranges.
While a Savage starts out reasonably priced for the capability a Remington 700 will give you much wider choice and variety in the long run when considering after-market accessories. If you don't have an "Elmer" (what HAM radio guys call a mentor with experience to walk you through the hoops) you can spend a lot of coin for not a whole lot of return. A Remington 700 Varmint rifle in 308 in an H-S Precision stock is a decent starting point. Start with at least a 24-inch barrel. You can always go shorter as you gain experience. Difficult to try gluing on a couple inches of barrel once you discover you'd like the bullet to go a little faster or farther. You can get a very good SWFA Super Sniper or Vortex that can take you a long way. |
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For out of the box accuracy I would go with a Savage. To some degree it is always a gamble, but I think Savage has a better design to cope with loose machining and assembly tolerances. The Remington makes a better donor action if you plan to spend an additional $700 to get it blueprinted with a new barrel.
Some things to consider about the Hog Hunter: It is not their accustock, so the plastic stock will not be very sturdy The factory magazine isn't that great. You may want to research if the bolt release is the older style (on the side) as pictured. I find their new bottom bolt release to be annoying and it makes fitting a new stock difficult as well. 1000 yards with a 20" .308 is possible, but if that were the main concern, I would advise a longer barrel. It looks like a great start for what you want. You will probably get excellent results on target, and it will get even better if you drop the action into a chassis that accepts AICS pattern magazines. There is nothing wrong with staying in a Mil-Mil optic. I think that system will only get more popular in the future. |
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I chose a Remington 700 LTR in .308 as a compromise between barrel length (velocity for 800+ yds) and weight (for carrying around all day). It's been great so far, I put a Harris bipod on it and attached a SWFA 10x42 SS with Seekins Precision rings and 20moa base. It shot 3/4 moa 5-shot groups at 100yds from a bipod with 168gr FGMM, and I suspect much of that group size was due to shooter error (I'm an extremely novice rifle shooter). I hope to shrink those group sizes up with handloads and training.
So don't discount Remington just because you read some threads about their supposedly shoddy quality nowadays... maybe I just got lucky, but many other people also get very accurate 700s out of the box. Once I start regularly shooting over 800yds I may want to have a bit more velocity, but at that point I'll probably want a dedicated LR rifle in 6.5 Creedmore or something. I have a lot of practice/training to do before I can reliably shoot past 600yds anyway (I've never even shot past 300 yet), so I'm confident my LTR will serve me well for quite a while. One thing to consider: if you spend a little more for a rifle with a decent stock, you can sell it in the future if you want to offset the cost of upgrading your setup. If you buy a SPS or base model Savage, the stock has essentially no resale value. One more piece of advice that was given to me many times: don't cheap out on the scope rings/base and mount them using a decent torque wrench (also use the torque wrench to tighten the action screws to a consistent/appropriate torque). The extra $ you spend on good rings/base will save you even more $ on wasted ammo and time chasing an accuracy problem caused by a shifting scope. |
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A Howa M1500 Compact Varminter in .308. 20" 1:10 twist #6 profile heavy, Sako style extractor and the HACT trigger is awesome. - $500-http://www.legacysports.com/barreled-actions
A B&C Tactical Medalist for the Howa 1500 S/A - $250-http://www.stockysstocks.com/servlet/the-110/Bell-Carlson-tactical-2092/Detail A Vortex 6-24x50 Viper HS-T VMR-1 (MRAD) - $640-http://swfa.com/Vortex-6-24x50-Viper-HS-T-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P67737.aspx Good +20 MOA base and steel mid rings - $100 Total- $1490 + taxes. My Howa Compact Varminter in the factory Hogue stock ($550) with a Vortex Crossfire II 6-24x50($299) and Weaver +20 MOA base($30)/ Warne Steel Mids($60)...$950 total investment: http://i.imgur.com/OPvbivM.jpg Recent 7 shot group at 150 yds using factory Winchester Match 168's: http://i.imgur.com/TBlyppr.jpg I am new to precision shooting, so YMMV. |
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Here is my experience shooting LONG range. Don't do what I did.
Start with something you can actually shoot WELL.....like a .308 OR SMALLER caliber (.243 or maybe even a .223?) and practice the basics. Then practice them a whole lot more. Think-spend half as much on ammo as you did on your rifle/scope. Buy the very best rifles and scopes you can afford (Hint-ANYONE can shoot well out to around 800 yards with a $8,000.00 rifle/scope) I would often put rank beginners behind my rifles-tell them what to look at in the scope, line it up, relax, squeeze the trigger. Booom-----clang! It's out past 800-900 yards things get a bit tricky but this is where all your practice helps. Depending on your elevation and other external variables a .308 is "marginal" over 800 yards. But if you start off with too much gun-say .338 laupa for example -you might develop a bit of a flinch (ask me how I know). 
I settled on the 300wm......and lived in an area of the country with high enough elevation that 1400+ yard shooting was routine based on externals (temps usually). Past that and my bullets went below the 1000fps threshold for best accuracy. I spent a butt load of money, time, blood, sweat, and tears, learning all this the absolute hardest way you could-trial and error (before the interwebs). Use the information you have available here and elsewhere and have fun. |