Posted: 5/7/2015 9:13:20 AM EDT
So I just received my reloading items I ordered. I used my Hornady OAL gauge and my bullet comparator and my throat seems to be really shallow. I'm getting 2.679 for overall length and 2.105 with the comparator. I shot a bunch of factory loads and some had cratored primers and when I cleared live rounds they had marks on them from being jammed into the lands. The gun was built by dan doweling, I plan on calling him today. I bought the gun 3rd party with 20 rds down the pipe. It shoots well with factory ammo, see page ten of the MOA all day thread. I'm just curious if anyone with a custom rig would understand why the chamber would be cut so shallow? It's just odd to me as I would have to load my OAL to 2.659 to be .020 off the lands seems like it would be a little stumpy. Any insight or help would be appreciated.
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Some folks give prescriptions to their gunsmiths to cut chambers to specifically supplied dummy rounds.
Is it possible the folks you bought this from forgot to inform you that the rig was designed around a specific bullet at a specific seating depth? I would ask them as well as the builder if you can. |
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Some folks give prescriptions to their gunsmiths to cut chambers to specifically supplied dummy rounds. Is it possible the folks you bought this from forgot to inform you that the rig was designed around a specific bullet at a specific seating depth? I would ask them as well as the builder if you can. Yeah I asked before buying but was given a generic answer, "it will shoot 168's or 175's with no issue". There was no info on specifics. I'm going to call the smith in CO later and see if he has a record or if he remembers |
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Yeah I asked before buying but was given a generic answer, "it will shoot 168's or 175's with no issue". There was no info on specifics. I'm going to call the smith in CO later and see if he has a record or if he remembers Quoted:
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Some folks give prescriptions to their gunsmiths to cut chambers to specifically supplied dummy rounds. Is it possible the folks you bought this from forgot to inform you that the rig was designed around a specific bullet at a specific seating depth? I would ask them as well as the builder if you can. Yeah I asked before buying but was given a generic answer, "it will shoot 168's or 175's with no issue". There was no info on specifics. I'm going to call the smith in CO later and see if he has a record or if he remembers |
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That response sort of gives you the answer, right? Quoted:
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Some folks give prescriptions to their gunsmiths to cut chambers to specifically supplied dummy rounds. Is it possible the folks you bought this from forgot to inform you that the rig was designed around a specific bullet at a specific seating depth? I would ask them as well as the builder if you can. Yeah I asked before buying but was given a generic answer, "it will shoot 168's or 175's with no issue". There was no info on specifics. I'm going to call the smith in CO later and see if he has a record or if he remembers If you're a trusting individual I guess that response would suffice, but when I check the throat at a 147 FMJ surplus round is jamming the lands I have to pull my WTF card. I called old man doweling and he can't remember what he reamed it for. |
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If you're a trusting individual I guess that response would suffice, but when I check the throat at a 147 FMJ surplus round is jamming the lands I have to pull my WTF card. I called old man doweling and he can't remember what he reamed it for. Quoted:
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Some folks give prescriptions to their gunsmiths to cut chambers to specifically supplied dummy rounds. Is it possible the folks you bought this from forgot to inform you that the rig was designed around a specific bullet at a specific seating depth? I would ask them as well as the builder if you can. Yeah I asked before buying but was given a generic answer, "it will shoot 168's or 175's with no issue". There was no info on specifics. I'm going to call the smith in CO later and see if he has a record or if he remembers If you're a trusting individual I guess that response would suffice, but when I check the throat at a 147 FMJ surplus round is jamming the lands I have to pull my WTF card. I called old man doweling and he can't remember what he reamed it for. Once again, I guess I should have been more direct. His response would have warned me he suspects bullets other than those mentioned are either unknown, questionable, or likely problematic. IE, he knew something about the rifle he was not revealing. Now, his response over the telephone doesn't give confidence in his record keeping :) If the rifle was made for a client or for spec a month ago or a decade ago, one is likely to remember or should record such things. Seems a maker has a responsibility to remember and PASS ON that kind of info. IME issues like this are often accompanied by "a really good price" lol. |
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Once again, I guess I should have been more direct. His response would have warned me he suspects bullets other than those mentioned are either unknown, questionable, or likely problematic. IE, he knew something about the rifle he was not revealing. Now, his response over the telephone doesn't give confidence in his record keeping :) If the rifle was made for a client or for spec a month ago or a decade ago, one is likely to remember or should record such things. Seems a maker has a responsibility to remember and PASS ON that kind of info. IME issues like this are often accompanied by "a really good price" lol. Quoted:
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Some folks give prescriptions to their gunsmiths to cut chambers to specifically supplied dummy rounds. Is it possible the folks you bought this from forgot to inform you that the rig was designed around a specific bullet at a specific seating depth? I would ask them as well as the builder if you can. Yeah I asked before buying but was given a generic answer, "it will shoot 168's or 175's with no issue". There was no info on specifics. I'm going to call the smith in CO later and see if he has a record or if he remembers If you're a trusting individual I guess that response would suffice, but when I check the throat at a 147 FMJ surplus round is jamming the lands I have to pull my WTF card. I called old man doweling and he can't remember what he reamed it for. Once again, I guess I should have been more direct. His response would have warned me he suspects bullets other than those mentioned are either unknown, questionable, or likely problematic. IE, he knew something about the rifle he was not revealing. Now, his response over the telephone doesn't give confidence in his record keeping :) If the rifle was made for a client or for spec a month ago or a decade ago, one is likely to remember or should record such things. Seems a maker has a responsibility to remember and PASS ON that kind of info. IME issues like this are often accompanied by "a really good price" lol. Yeah I got it for a steal  it is a shooter though, I just don't know how to proceed with reloading for it. I don't know if jamming the lands @ .010 will yield lower pressure than .10 I might just mock up some BH 175 loads and test them out. It just kinda blows that my plans are kinda blown now for this rifle. I guess I'll nug it out and hopefully all will be well.
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I just don't know how to proceed with reloading for it. A) you will need a set of chamber gauges, and use them to determine chamber length B) once you know chamber length to within 0.001, then and only then does it make sent to measure the position of the leade and lands. C) once you know both of these, you will likely WANT to have the chamber cut to at least SAMMI minimums just so off the shelf ammo is non-dangerous. D) Otherwise, you are loading for a wildcat and you are on your own. E) given the chamber is not in SAMMI spec, you must start even lower than the minimums in the reloading book F) you must walk up slowly in charge weight watching pressure signs G) you should expect pressure signs from 2.5gr lower than maximum safe loads in the "book" H) You will have to measure case web expansion with a 4-digit micrometer and shoulder position prior to sizing any shot brass I) you must reload under the assumption that the gun actually is out to get you and proceed as if you eyesight is in peril--it is. All in all, it might be easier, all considered, to have the chamber set to SAMMI minimums (like PALMA 95). |
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A) you will need a set of chamber gauges, and use them to determine chamber length B) once you know chamber length to within 0.001, then and only then does it make sent to measure the position of the leade and lands. C) once you know both of these, you will likely WANT to have the chamber cut to at least SAMMI minimums just so off the shelf ammo is non-dangerous. D) Otherwise, you are loading for a wildcat and you are on your own. E) given the chamber is not in SAMMI spec, you must start even lower than the minimums in the reloading book F) you must walk up slowly in charge weight watching pressure signs G) you should expect pressure signs from 2.5gr lower than maximum safe loads in the "book" H) You will have to measure case web expansion with a 4-digit micrometer and shoulder position prior to sizing any shot brass I) you must reload under the assumption that the gun actually is out to get you and proceed as if you eyesight is in peril--it is. All in all, it might be easier, all considered, to have the chamber set to SAMMI minimums (like PALMA 95). Quoted:
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I just don't know how to proceed with reloading for it. A) you will need a set of chamber gauges, and use them to determine chamber length B) once you know chamber length to within 0.001, then and only then does it make sent to measure the position of the leade and lands. C) once you know both of these, you will likely WANT to have the chamber cut to at least SAMMI minimums just so off the shelf ammo is non-dangerous. D) Otherwise, you are loading for a wildcat and you are on your own. E) given the chamber is not in SAMMI spec, you must start even lower than the minimums in the reloading book F) you must walk up slowly in charge weight watching pressure signs G) you should expect pressure signs from 2.5gr lower than maximum safe loads in the "book" H) You will have to measure case web expansion with a 4-digit micrometer and shoulder position prior to sizing any shot brass I) you must reload under the assumption that the gun actually is out to get you and proceed as if you eyesight is in peril--it is. All in all, it might be easier, all considered, to have the chamber set to SAMMI minimums (like PALMA 95). That's what I was looking for, Thank You! |
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You can do as listed above or pay to run the reamer a bit deeper.
ETA unless you have a high pressure bolt, you will likely see pressure signs regardless of seating depth. Pressure issues are common with the higher pressured .308-based cartridges in the gas guns. |
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You can do as listed above or pay to run the reamer a bit deeper. ETA unless you have a high pressure bolt, you will likely see pressure signs regardless of seating depth. Pressure issues are common with the higher pressured .308-based cartridges in the gas guns. I contacted the seller and they said if I pay for shipping both ways they will fix it and have it back in a week. Sounds good to me |
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Some folks give prescriptions to their gunsmiths to cut chambers to specifically supplied dummy rounds. Is it possible the folks you bought this from forgot to inform you that the rig was designed around a specific bullet at a specific seating depth? I would ask them as well as the builder if you can. This,most custom smiths that I've talked to even supply custom dies to that rifles chamber. |
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Quoted: Is it a matter of headspace or just throat depth? Could it possibly be that someone was stingy about barrel life and wanted something that could go a long way before being "shot out"? If it was headspace, it would be rather difficult to cam over. My dad's '06 was cut for Sierra 2155s at mag length, so about minimum spec. It had 13,000 rounds through it and 3" of erosion before we switched to cast loads to spare what little life it has left. It could probably still shoot about MOA off the bench, but I'm not gonna bother. My Mauser has a Palma 95 chamber that seats SMKs at ~2.825". I may rethroat it since I'm not gonna use it for XTC, and don't feel like burning several thousand rounds so I can get to use heavies effectively. If/when I do, it probably still has a solid 5,000 rounds of MOA life left. ETA: Throat depth isn't the only factor in a barrel's precise life. Leade angle and smoothness play a part. |