Posted: 4/19/2010 12:41:30 PM EDT
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So I bought a house where the previous owner had a ton of ground cover (vines). Well weeds sprouted up and they didn't bother to pull them out and they have wreaked havoc (in a stretch of yard they actually grew up the hedges and ripped the hedges down :( and need to be replaced). My wife and I have decided to get rid of the ground cover and weeds and put in sod and a raised garden. Well I used a tiller when I was younger but had a question regarding it before I go rent one. The ground cover pulled out easily and left no trace. But the weeds that came up I noticed (also vine like) had these roots that went into the ground much like a tree root but only about the thickness of a finger. While pulling I realized how bad it was. Underneath the soil there is a maze of these roots and are now actually going underneath the grass and these vines started to pop up out of the lawn (I ripped those I saw out). I really don't want to have to pull all these by hand as the area is somewhat large. So my question is this: Will a tiller cut through those roots easily (being about the thickness of my finger...sorry no pic of my finger lol)? Also can I get by with a front tine? When I was younger I had used only a rear tine before and was always under the impression that a rear tine is more effective. I was under the assumption a tiller would be the best way to go but just want to make sure before I shell out the cash to rent one.
Thanks! |
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I wouldn't bet on it. Hard to tell without knowing how densely spaced the roots are, how tough they are, etc. but it sounds like even in the best case scenario you'd be pushing the limits of what a tiller can do. A rental would likely have pretty dull tines, and they tend to wrap vines/roots around the shaft and clog up the works pretty easily. And I'm guessing a front tine would beat you to death trying to till something like that. But if you've got no other option, it'd probably be worth a try - digging 'em all by hand sounds like a pretty miserable chore.
Is there room to get a small tractor in there? Seems like your best bet might be to hire someone to come in with some real equipment and do it up right. |
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If the roots are woody and tree like I think you better go with the rear tine tiller. I'm not sure how many square feet you need to till though.
A tractor mounted tiller would make quick work of a 1/2 acre or so. I have a 5 hp front tine that struggles with tree roots that get in my garden. I would not want to try a yard full of roots. |
| I would say it's probably around 1,200 sq ft or so? They are also somewhat dense in most of the area unfortunately. I really don't want to be trying to do this by hand. On the other side I don't want to rent a tiller that isn't going to get the job down and basically waste $100 for nothing. As for the roots. They all aren't as thick as my finger. Those are just the largest ones for the most part. Would say the largest run about the thickness of my thumb and the smallest to just about the thickness of my pinky, maybe a little smaller. |
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Quoted:
If the roots are woody and tree like I think you better go with the rear tine tiller. I'm not sure how many square feet you need to till though. A tractor mounted tiller would make quick work of a 1/2 acre or so. I have a 5 hp front tine that struggles with tree roots that get in my garden. I would not want to try a yard full of roots. Also one problem is there are two quite large trees situated there as well. Trying to figure out the cheapest and easiest solution. Maybe I will take pictures when I get home to show what I am dealing with. Or I'll get the wife to take them and send them to my at my office to upload them. |
| I'll probably get slapped down for heresy, but you might also toss around the idea of doing nothing. Well, not exactly nothing, but mow the whole mess as short as you can possibly get it, and put down a nice even layer of good grass seed. Continued mowing will keep the weeds knocked back, and the grass will eventually take over. I've turned fields full of fescue, grapevines, goldenrod, multiflora rose and other nasties into a pretty decent lawn that way. |
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A front tine would beat you to death, and I suspect you'd have a hard time getting through the roots....even with the rear tine that will likely be a problem.
Unless you're planning on putting in a garden, I'd follow the suggestion to mow it short and put some good grass seed(maybe even sod) on it. |
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Call me crazy on this suggestion. Why not spray a herbicide on everything you want gone. Wait a week if the vines come back spray one more time wait another week and sod/seed area you want grass. Board up area for raised garden add peat and other goodies till that area.
ETA:spellcheck |
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Quoted:
Call me crazy on this suggestion. Why not spray a herbicide on everything you want gone. Wait a week if the vines come back spray one more time wait another week and sod/seed area you want grass. Board up area for raised garden add peat and other goodies till that area. ETA:spellcheck Done that a few times but for this particular weed if you don't get the root up then it comes right back. It is like a root that like I said can be the thickness of my finger and is like a vine underground. Every couple feet or so it sprouts this little plant that come up above the service and if it is allowed to grow it basically turns into a vine. In the case of the previous owner who let if grow unchecked it grew right up through the hedges and ripped them down. If I spray chemicals it seems to just kill the little plant/vine that comes from the root. A week later more start popping up. And I notice it has no issue forcing itself up through grass which is another reason I wwant to get rid of it before placing sod. The are where I am putting my garden doesn't have much of the them and I have seemed to pull most of them. The other areas is another story |
This is a gap where the vine literally ripped the hedges down. Where all dirt and leaves are is where the ground cover and weeds were.
Here is a tree nearby and you see where the vines/roots were going up the tree along with some other vines. That tree is completely free of all vines and weeds now :) 
Now this pick is in a very small area where the roots started to creep underneath my law and sprout the vines up thru the grass. Sorry it's blurry but was taken with a phone I ripped the roots out and that is the pile in the pic 
Sorry don't have any before pics :) |
| I'd pull what I could, then I'd mow it as low as possible and spray it several times with a herbicide as it comes back. If you could get a hold of a commercial grade herbicide, I'd use it. Rinse and Repeat. I think if you do this you'd be good by the end of summer. Not what you would want to hear, but would probably be the way it would turn out. OR, you could cover the area with black plastic, and after some time, it would be dead. |
| Looks like some sort of creeper vine. I would try and till it (probably gonna be a PITA) then spray it with some 2-4-D (Round-up, Prosecuter,etc). Wait about a week the go back and try to till again. I think what you need to do is get a fair amount of those roots exposed then poison it right away. Just a thought, good luck. |
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Quoted:
Looks like some sort of creeper vine. I would try and till it (probably gonna be a PITA) then spray it with some 2-4-D (Round-up, Prosecuter,etc). Wait about a week the go back and try to till again. I think what you need to do is get a fair amount of those roots exposed then poison it right away. Just a thought, good luck. IIRC, 2-4D is a defoliant. Round up, on the other hand, is a poison and actually kills the plant. Google says I'm thinking about something else. I always have my uncle do the spraying here since he's already got stuff mixed and spraying fencerows or whatnot...but he said he added a little diesel or dishwashing detergent to help it "stick" to the plant a little better. Whatever it is he does, it works. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Looks like some sort of creeper vine. I would try and till it (probably gonna be a PITA) then spray it with some 2-4-D (Round-up, Prosecuter,etc). Wait about a week the go back and try to till again. I think what you need to do is get a fair amount of those roots exposed then poison it right away. Just a thought, good luck. IIRC, 2-4D is a defoliant. Round up, on the other hand, is a poison and actually kills the plant. Google says I'm thinking about something else. I always have my uncle do the spraying here since he's already got stuff mixed and spraying fencerows or whatnot...but he said he added a little diesel or dishwashing detergent to help it "stick" to the plant a little better. Whatever it is he does, it works. The diesel is good in areas like parking lots and driveways but the OP wants to replant, a little dish wash hand soap would be a good "sticker for his app. Forgot to mention it, good point about a sticking agent. ETA adding about a shot of palm-olive or similar counter top dish soap to round-up type chemicals (1/2 a shot per gal. post mix) will definitely enhance the effectiveness |
