Posted: 12/11/2008 7:02:45 AM EDT
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We are looking at getting a comm system set up for some of our group, and I am looking for some input on hardware.
We are considering these radios: Kenwood Protalk We are looking for cross town communication for emergencies and in the hills Thanks WDS |
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How big is the town you need to cross? Are you in an urban area, or small town in a rural area, or ? Do you already have a licensed frequency or how did you come to select that model of radio? If not, what radio service are you anticipating using? Sorry for the lack of data.... Small town rural I guess, 'Cross town' would be about 5 miles max, non line of sight due to a hill or two. Pretty much everything is small town in this state. the tallest building in town is 6 stories. Tallest in the whole state is 12 stories but that is at the college (dorms).... Was considering MURS frequency's but we are open to other options as well. We want to be able to communicate legally before SHTF and don't really care about the rules after TSHF. Thanks WDS |
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We are looking at getting a comm system set up for some of our group, and I am looking for some input on hardware. We are looking for cross town communication for emergencies and in the hills standard horizon HX370S. about $110 as part of a kit that includes the battery, AC charger, DC charger, charging base, and a 6xAA battery holder. http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=10&f=22&t=604477&page=2#10323383 http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=10&f=22&t=617634 http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=10&f=22&t=617901 http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=10&f=22&t=618176 http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=10&f=22&t=614541 ps: http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=10&f=22&t=604477&page=1 ar-jedi |
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The above seems to be a good choice and is economical if you're looking for handhelds, and MURS is a good choice in your environment for a handheld only communications system, it's no-license so no hassles and probably little chance of interference.
5 miles is going to stretch beyond the capabilities of handhelds to communicate reliably though, unless you're connected to good mobile antennas. Depending on your budget and how much effort you want to put into all this, getting a GMRS license and good quality LMR/commercial radios (not bubble pack radios) might give you a little edge with the handhelds, plus you can use base station or mobile radios up to 50 watts which in combination with good antennas will get you a lot more range and reliability. You could even put up a GMRS repeater to provide a larger handheld-to-handheld coverage area. You would need a GMRS license ($80 IIRC). One thought about "post SHTF" legality... I always recommend that you get comms that you can use anytime, because you need to have experience with how things work prior to relying on them during an emergency. |
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Always a hard question about maintaining 2-way capability in the absense of utility power. The answers are usually expensive and technical. WT's can be turned on at specifiec intervals to make radio checks across town or patrols, but keeping a repeater on the air 24/7 during said TSHF is quite another thing. In Wyoming, a solar array large enough to keep the batteries charged and the repeater powered up might be possible to clandestinely mount atop a large building's roof. You would need to keep it hidden from scroungers during times of unrest.
It is possible that a couple of 2 watt VHF radios using base station beam antennas might make the 5 mile trip. The only way to see is to find some hams willing to do a test on 2 meters before you make the radio purchase. GMRS repeaters are nice. In most areas, putting one on a 150 foot tower will get you 8 to 10 mile coverage to handheld radios. The mobiles will go further than that. You will need someone with radio technical ability to maintain things unless you have plenty of money. RS |
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We have vhf all over up here. We bought a icom m72 with 6/3/1 watts of power. It has reached over 20 miles if you have high ground. Very well made and sumersible. Your planning on turning your nose up at the FCC if the SHTF? Not trying to start anything, I have thought of this before as well. VHF is a good radio freq but is only legal out on the water and from the dock. In a SHTF I think FCC reg is the least of our problems. |
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We have vhf all over up here. We bought a icom m72 with 6/3/1 watts of power. It has reached over 20 miles if you have high ground. Very well made and sumersible. yay, a $10K fine. http://www.fcc.gov/eb/FieldNotices/2003/DOC-258874A1.html Before the
Federal Communications Commission Washington, D.C. 20554 In the Matter of ) File Number EB-04-TP-560 ) Jeremy R. Riels ) NAL/Acct. No.200532700008 Cross City, Florida ) ) FRN 0013442918 ) NOTICE OF APPARENT LIABILITY FOR FORFEITURE Released: May 9, 2005 By the District Director, Tampa Office, South Central Region, Enforcement Bureau: I. INTRODUCTION 1. In this Notice of Apparent Liability for Forfeiture (``NAL''), we find Jeremy R. Riels, apparently liable for a forfeiture in the amount of ten thousand dollars ($10,000) for willful violation of Section 301 of the Communications Act of 1934, as amended (``Act'').1 Specifically, we find Mr. Riels apparently liable for operating a transmitter on 156.875 MHz (VHF marine channel 77) without a license. II. BACKGROUND 2. In response to a complaint filed by the United States Coast Guard (``USCG''), the Tampa Office of the Enforcement Bureau (``Tampa Office'') initiated an investigation into the unauthorized use of marine VHF frequencies in and around the USCG receive site in Dixie County, Florida. On December 8, 2004, agents from the Tampa Office monitored a signal on 156.875 MHz (VHF marine channel 77) and heard a conversation between hunters about the location of their hunting dogs in the forest. The agents used radio direction finding techniques to determine that the source of the signal on 156.875 MHz was coming from a 1997 brown Silverado Chevrolet pickup truck in Dixie County, Florida. The agents observed a radio transmitter installed in the vehicle. Mr. Riels, the driver and only occupant of the vehicle, was questioned and admitted to operation of the radio transceiver installed in his vehicle. He stated that he used this radio, as opposed to a CB radio, which could be used legally, because the CB band had too much interference. A search of Commission records provided no authorization for Mr. Riels to operate on this frequency. ar-jedi |
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Vhf are used everywhere up here even by aircarriers. They are in just about every home and fishcamp. They make a very good safety item. Quoted:
VHF is a good radio freq but is only legal out on the water and from the dock. you guys should both straighten out your terminology before carrying on. VHF is *not* a radio type. VHF defines a range of frequencies from about 30MHZ to about 300MHz. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Very_high_frequency practically every radio signal you have ever heard has arrived within the VHF range –– including FM broadcast radio, public safety radio, weather radio, and so on. you are using the term VHF interchangeably with VHF Marine Radio. VHF Marine radio exists between 156 and 172MHz. from the link above... Marine VHF radio is installed on all large ships and most motorized small craft. It is used for a wide variety of purposes, including summoning rescue services and communicating with harbours and marinas, and operates in the VHF frequency range, between 156 to 174 MHz.
which continues... Marine VHF radio is sometimes illegally operated inland. Since enforcement is often the job of the local coast guard, enforcement away from the water is sometimes difficult.
Marine VHF radio is not the same as MURS, 2m amateur (ham) radio, and other radio types that operate in the VHF range. there are specific purposes for each of these radio types, as defined and enforced by the FCC. operation of a VHF Marine Radio on land is unlawful; an example of disobeying this is illustrated in the link and quoted text i posted above. legal VHF radio types include both licensed (e.g. amateur) and unlicensed (e.g. MURS). again, VHF does not equal VHF Mairine radio. it is unlawful to use VHF Marine radios on land. you should understand that using VHF Marine radios on land opens you up to the possibility of FCC enforcement actions, which usually end with hefty fines. ar-jedi |
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Vhf are used everywhere up here even by aircarriers. They are in just about every home and fishcamp. They make a very good safety item. Quoted:
VHF is a good radio freq but is only legal out on the water and from the dock. you guys should both straighten out your terminology before carrying on. VHF is *not* a radio type. VHF defines a range of frequencies from about 30MHZ to about 300MHz. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Very_high_frequency practically every radio signal you have ever heard has arrived within the VHF range –– including FM broadcast radio, public safety radio, weather radio, and so on. you are using the term VHF interchangeably with VHF Marine Radio. VHF Marine radio exists between 156 and 172MHz. from the link above... Marine VHF radio is installed on all large ships and most motorized small craft. It is used for a wide variety of purposes, including summoning rescue services and communicating with harbours and marinas, and operates in the VHF frequency range, between 156 to 174 MHz.
which continues... Marine VHF radio is sometimes illegally operated inland. Since enforcement is often the job of the local coast guard, enforcement away from the water is sometimes difficult.
Marine VHF radio is not the same as MURS, 2m amateur (ham) radio, and other radio types that operate in the VHF range. there are specific purposes for each of these radio types, as defined and enforced by the FCC. operation of a VHF Marine Radio on land is unlawful; an example of disobeying this is illustrated in the link and quoted text i posted above. legal VHF radio types include both licensed (e.g. amateur) and unlicensed (e.g. MURS). again, VHF does not equal VHF Mairine radio. it is unlawful to use VHF Marine radios on land. you should understand that using VHF Marine radios on land opens you up to the possibility of FCC enforcement actions, which usually end with hefty fines. ar-jedi I am not sure I should dare add onto ar-jedi's post, but... pay attention to whats in red if you happen to be transmitting inland somewhere on a band that is used for something else (fire, police, etc) and you screw someone up, they will come and find you. They have in the past, and they will in the future. |
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You REALLY NEED to do a frequency study in your area and find out what City, County, fire and Mutual Aid are using in your area and stay far away from Frequencies. DO NOT program non type rated radios for the GMRS, FRS frequencies though it can Physically BE done you can bleed over into LE, Fire or EMS bands. Particularly using non approved radios. If you inadvertantly jam those folks someone WILL come to find you!
DO NOT use Marine VHF, In remote areas the Forest service, Rangers, State police and other government entities use HF, Low VHF, VHF and Hi VHF a lot. |
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Vhf are used everywhere up here even by aircarriers. They are in just about every home and fishcamp. They make a very good safety item. Quoted:
VHF is a good radio freq but is only legal out on the water and from the dock. you guys should both straighten out your terminology before carrying on. VHF is *not* a radio type. VHF defines a range of frequencies from about 30MHZ to about 300MHz. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Very_high_frequency practically every radio signal you have ever heard has arrived within the VHF range –– including FM broadcast radio, public safety radio, weather radio, and so on. you are using the term VHF interchangeably with VHF Marine Radio. VHF Marine radio exists between 156 and 172MHz. from the link above... Marine VHF radio is installed on all large ships and most motorized small craft. It is used for a wide variety of purposes, including summoning rescue services and communicating with harbours and marinas, and operates in the VHF frequency range, between 156 to 174 MHz.
which continues... Marine VHF radio is sometimes illegally operated inland. Since enforcement is often the job of the local coast guard, enforcement away from the water is sometimes difficult.
Marine VHF radio is not the same as MURS, 2m amateur (ham) radio, and other radio types that operate in the VHF range. there are specific purposes for each of these radio types, as defined and enforced by the FCC. operation of a VHF Marine Radio on land is unlawful; an example of disobeying this is illustrated in the link and quoted text i posted above. legal VHF radio types include both licensed (e.g. amateur) and unlicensed (e.g. MURS). again, VHF does not equal VHF Mairine radio. it is unlawful to use VHF Marine radios on land. you should understand that using VHF Marine radios on land opens you up to the possibility of FCC enforcement actions, which usually end with hefty fines. ar-jedi I am not sure I should dare add onto ar-jedi's post, but... pay attention to whats in red if you happen to be transmitting inland somewhere on a band that is used for something else (fire, police, etc) and you screw someone up, they will come and find you. They have in the past, and they will in the future. LOL Yeah what is said in red is what I said in my post, I'm sorry I didn't use the word "Marine radio" I just presumed ya'll infered that when someone is talking about a two way handheld and VHF in the same sentence they mean "Marine" Ar-Jedi you wanna feel better about nailing me on a technicality? Fine. 
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LOL Yeah what is said in red is what I said in my post, I'm sorry I didn't use the word "Marine radio" I just presumed ya'll infered that when someone is talking about a two way handheld and VHF in the same sentence they mean "Marine" when i hear someone speaking of "a two way handheld and VHF", "Marine" is the third or fourth thing that comes to mind. public safety (police/fire/EMS) radio comes first, business/commerical band next, then 2m amateur, and finally Marine. oh, yeah, i'm not exactly in Kansas either. i can throw a quarter off my back deck and hit the Atlantic Ocean. everyone and their brother here has a VHF Marine radio on board their boat. it's still not the first thing that comes to mind when i hear "a two way handheld and VHF". Quoted:
Ar-Jedi you wanna feel better about nailing me on a technicality? Fine.
i'm not "nailing" anyone. the situation here is that more than a few ARFCOM'ers can't differentiate your use of "VHF" from anything else they may have experience with. no sense confusing folks. ar-jedi |