Posted: 11/28/2009 7:27:50 PM EDT
| Two full days including moving my ammo supply to another location. It gave me a great insight as to bugging out if need be and what I would need to do so. |
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I have nothing but fear and loathing for the idea of a BO. At present I do not even have a good BOV. At least one that could carry even a fraction of my supplies. A good BOV is very high on my lists of must haves in the coming year. Until then, my BOG consists of my BOB, my SHTF weapons, and a case each of food and ammo. That's about all I can fit in the trunk of my Nissan. My main plan is to BIP and then move to my BOL when things settle a little.
Strong work and smart thinking on experimenting with your BO preps. When I have my BOV I will have to do the same. I am currently working on pre-positioning stock, so I will have less to move. 
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Quoted:
I have nothing but fear and loathing for the idea of a BO. At present I do not even have a good BOV. At least one that could carry even a fraction of my supplies. A good BOV is very high on my lists of must haves in the coming year. Until then, my BOG consists of my BOB, my SHTF weapons, and a case each of food and ammo. That's about all I can fit in the trunk of my Nissan... I had a little Nissan sportscar as my prime mover about this time last year... a litle rain and a Diesel spill fixed that. After hauling camping equipment in it a couple times it became obvious it wasn't what I really needed/wanted. I lucked into a Unimog for not too much money... kept an eye on Craigslist and got an M105A2 trailer (1.5 ton capacity -built to go behind a Deuce-and-a-half) in new shape for $400. Now I've got the capacity to haul some of what I'd like to keep if things get bad -for about the same money as what I would have made in payments in that same period of time with the blingy sportscar. Yeah, most chicks dig the 'Mog less ...now to find a new chick to fit the new view. 
It's all about focus, patience, and a little timing doesn't hurt... As with everything I guess! |
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Love the Unimog, how can you not love a truck that comes with it's own back up hand crank (at least the older ones) to start it with? And if you drop all the canvas, it will fit in many a domestic garage (great OPSEC). They are very cool, and a damn good BOV.
I have been looking at the "bobbed" Duce's being sold on 100dollarman.com for $7,500. They are pretty awesome as well. The chopped down Duce looks like an American Unimog. It is also a multi-fuel diesel which adds to it's appeal. Not to mention parts should be fairly easy to come by. The problem is that they are out in Cali which restricts my ability to inspect them, and shipping is a bitch. I also think that I may be able to do a better job of building the truck to suit my needs/whims. For instance, I would like to mount two spare tires between the cab and the bed. But seeing 100dollarman's bobbed Duce's has definitely fueled my interest. Until I saw his site, the Unimog was #1 on my list, despite possible parts issues. Right now I am looking around at a few surplus dealers and pricing trucks, trailers, and any other parts I would need to do my own conversion. I envy you your Mog. 
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Consider this about bugging out and bugging in. Even under the best of circumstances, a BO will be difficult. Imagine this. You have a family that's all on board, knows the plan, and will start loading the BOV as soon as you give the word, no questions asked. All of your family members happen to be home at the time, so no running around to school and work to pick them up. All the necessary preps are both mylar sealed, and in plastic containers, and of course they're redundent in mulp\tiple containers, so that if one were lost, it wouldn't be all your batteries for instance. Your BOV is a late model diesel crew cab pick up or excursion, but not so new as to be unable to run biodiesel, fuel oil, etc. It's 4x4, and you'll be towing a trailer, or better yet your boat loaded like a trailer which should help if you have to abandon the roads and go to the waterways. Of course you've planned to possibly use your boat, and you've made arrangements with people to pick you up futher along your water way route if necessary and continue taking your family to your secure BOL. Your communication is all via HAM radio, which is outfitted in all of your vehicles, and in use by your friends near your BOL. Speaking of your BOL, it's completely privately owned, and payed off, with neighbors of a like mind, and very little access except for the one private dirt road in and out. There is ample game, timber, ponds, streams and an aquafir on the property. You have already propositioned farm equipment, other vehicles, weapons, ammo,money/precious metals, food, medical supplies, and the like. There is a full shop, and of course a genset to run anything that you might need. Your BOL is located on very high ground, and is not near any other metro areas, or on the escape routes of any major metro areas, Rawles's golden horde.
Sounds like your BO should be as easy as you can make it as a middle class family, right. Sure if you were rich, you could have a helicopter standing by, and have fully redundant supplies at your BOL, so you wouldn't need to pack anything, but the abouve situation is pretty good. It could be, but it could be a disaster as well. Imagine a vehicle problem(breakdown, blowout, fuel problem, accident, etc), an illness in the family, closed or flooded roadways, lack of communication with your help, or you successfully make it to your BOL, and it too was affected by what you're bugging out from, or it's burnt down, been taken over, etc. So, you've decided that BI is your best option. You select your home site where it's out of the way, but you can still make a living, you can produce your own food and energy, and your supplies are stocked for decades. A tornado, a flood, a forest fire, an outbreak of disease, an agricultural blight, or even a Biblical plague of locusts could force a BO from your secure location. Even under either of these ideal set of circumstances, a BO or BI can be hard, or impossible. You must be flexible, and realize that not every SHTF will be a Mad Max scenario. A railroad accident with leaking chlorine gas will require a BO, but won't require weapons, food for a year, or lots of ammo. A disaster is just that, something that you may prepare for, but will never be truly ready for every case. Adapt and overcome. |
 Way to state the obvious. The best way to adapt and overcome is to have as many plans and options available to you before the problem lands at your doorstep. Even a localized BO to avoid a toxic plume from a train wreck can be a major problem if you have never given any thought to a rapid BO. Where as if you have BO plans and equipment for any kind of SHTF situation, you can always ratchet it down for the small scale crisis.
Plan for the worst and hope for the best. Actually, plan for the worst and then have a back up plan if the first plan doesn't work (and then have a back up plan for the back up plan!). Yeah, that's the ticket! 
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Quoted:
Way to state the obvious. The best way to adapt and overcome is to have as many plans and options available to you before the problem lands at your doorstep. Even a localized BO to avoid a toxic plume from a train wreck can be a major problem if you have never given any thought to a rapid BO. Where as if you have BO plans and equipment for any kind of SHTF situation, you can always ratchet it down for the small scale crisis.
Plan for the worst and hope for the best. Actually, plan for the worst and then have a back up plan if the first plan doesn't work (and then have a back up plan for the back up plan!). Yeah, that's the ticket! Don't think it's that obvious, as the OP said he wouldn't want to BO, as TJ says, prep for the most likely scenario first, and most of those won't require a full scale, move your life BO. Stick around a while and you'll see that while this forum does deal with the mad max TEOTWAWKI planning, much of what is discussed is how to deal with the SHTF's that have and will most likely happen again. Read FerFal's blog and posts about what a nationwide SHTF/financial collapse looks like, and you'll see that all the sniper rifles, military type trucks, and such would prove useless, while a handgun, precious metals, body armor, and a fast fuel efficient vehicle with an alarm are invaluable. Consider this, a fire department is a paramilitary organization that is tasked, trained, and highly equipped to deal with a certain area of S hitting the F. Firemen do get killed on regular day in, day out runs, sometimes it's a MVA, sometimes it's a floor colapse, or a heart attack. While firemen are prepared for as many contigencies as possible, things still go wrong, the same as what could happen to the best laid BI or BO plans. Thinking that you'll be able to BI until things settle down to BO is nice for now, but it's not necessarily a reality. Thinking that you'll be able to BO from any situation in a UniMog when the roads are congested with all those sports cars, and minivans attempting the same thing is also a pipe dream, every vehicle has it's advantages and disadvantages. The OP stated that it'd be difficult to BO, and would require new planning based on it taking 2 days to move ammo, I'm trying to point out that the most likely SHTF scenario that one of us may have to BO from will most likely not involve any weapons, ammo, MRE's, serious offroading, MULTI-CAM, OR KIFARU.(except for maybe Protus, who never leaves home without his multicam Kifaru BOB) This being the case, a BO doesn't necessarily need to involve moving ammo crates, MRE's and the like. If your supplies are secured at home, a BO could involve nothing more than getting in the car and going to stay in a hotel or with family for a few days. Same goes for a BI, that most likely will mean just staying home, and having the resources to do so, you can call it Bugging In, but it's really just doing what people did for the winter in certain locales, as little as 75 years ago.(and some still do today) |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Way to state the obvious. The best way to adapt and overcome is to have as many plans and options available to you before the problem lands at your doorstep. Even a localized BO to avoid a toxic plume from a train wreck can be a major problem if you have never given any thought to a rapid BO. Where as if you have BO plans and equipment for any kind of SHTF situation, you can always ratchet it down for the small scale crisis.
Plan for the worst and hope for the best. Actually, plan for the worst and then have a back up plan if the first plan doesn't work (and then have a back up plan for the back up plan!). Yeah, that's the ticket! Don't think it's that obvious, as the OP said he wouldn't want to BO, as TJ says, prep for the most likely scenario first, and most of those won't require a full scale, move your life BO. Stick around a while and you'll see that while this forum does deal with the mad max TEOTWAWKI planning, much of what is discussed is how to deal with the SHTF's that have and will most likely happen again. Read FerFal's blog and posts about what a nationwide SHTF/financial collapse looks like, and you'll see that all the sniper rifles, military type trucks, and such would prove useless, while a handgun, precious metals, body armor, and a fast fuel efficient vehicle with an alarm are invaluable. Consider this, a fire department is a paramilitary organization that is tasked, trained, and highly equipped to deal with a certain area of S hitting the F. Firemen do get killed on regular day in, day out runs, sometimes it's a MVA, sometimes it's a floor colapse, or a heart attack. While firemen are prepared for as many contigencies as possible, things still go wrong, the same as what could happen to the best laid BI or BO plans. Thinking that you'll be able to BI until things settle down to BO is nice for now, but it's not necessarily a reality. Thinking that you'll be able to BO from any situation in a UniMog when the roads are congested with all those sports cars, and minivans attempting the same thing is also a pipe dream, every vehicle has it's advantages and disadvantages. The OP stated that it'd be difficult to BO, and would require new planning based on it taking 2 days to move ammo, I'm trying to point out that the most likely SHTF scenario that one of us may have to BO from will most likely not involve any weapons, ammo, MRE's, serious offroading, MULTI-CAM, OR KIFARU.(except for maybe Protus, who never leaves home without his multicam Kifaru BOB) This being the case, a BO doesn't necessarily need to involve moving ammo crates, MRE's and the like. If your supplies are secured at home, a BO could involve nothing more than getting in the car and going to stay in a hotel or with family for a few days. Same goes for a BI, that most likely will mean just staying home, and having the resources to do so, you can call it Bugging In, but it's really just doing what people did for the winter in certain locales, as little as 75 years ago.(and some still do today) Not looking for a pissing contest, but your previous post was a gross overstatement of the obvious (or at least it appeared so to me). It all boiled down to three basic points: 1. The most likely SHTF scenario will be local and smaller in scope (obviously) and can be handled with a credit card and a full tank of gas (not always an option). 2. The best laid plans can fall apart due to environment, weather, and other people's actions (another pretty obvious point), so...3. You need to adapt and overcome whatever comes your way (again, pretty obvious). Am I missing something here? My point is that preparedness is meant to cover all (or as many as you can) types of SHTF situations. Basics like copies of your birth certificate, passport, discharge papers, deeds, insurance and other key documents in a packet ready to grab and go. Food, water, shelter, and heat if weather or infrastructure failure compremise outside supply (I had to go six weeks without running water or power after Hugo, my preps made it possible). Well laid plans and supplies will make a big difference in how one weathers even the smallest bumps in the road. And yes, a good BOL is part of a complete plan. Don't believe it, just ask some of the Katrina survivors who are still living in BOL's, though in a majority of the cases they were not planned. While it is a little off subject, on more than one occasion you downplayed or even negated the role of firearms in self defense. While many of the smaller or local SHTF situations will not require the presence of firearms, they should have a place in everybody's prep and BO lists. Don't agree? Lets look at a small list: Hugo, where looters and gawkers were running rampant, The LA riots where shop keepers were left on their own to defend their property, Katrina where the looting began before the rain had even stopped. When the going gets rough, the dirtbags come out in force. Needed or not, I will be packing when the SHTF. As far as bugging out and BOV's, again, just part of the planning. Nothing wrong with a Mog for a BOV. It is 4WD, has good range, and can maintain road speeds. If the sheeple are clogging the roads with their little sports cars, the Mog is perfectly at home going cross country or cross the median. But I think the trailer might be a handicap. Nobody wants to bug out, I don't want to either. The PO wrote that he discovered it took two days to move all his stuff. In a worst case SHTF situation, I doubt coming back for seconds would be an option. The PO noted that he will have to re-check, re-pack, and re-organize after his little dry run. That is what preparedness is all about, make a plan, test it out, and then adjust as needed. You are right about one thing, you can't plan for everything, and things can go wrong (which is why we train). But the more in depth your preps and planning are, the less likely you will be caught flat footed. I don't remember who said it, but one of my favorite quotes is "I've always been lucky, and have found that the harder I work, the luckier I get". Prepping is work, it just happens to be kind of fun too (and it involves really neat toys such as tools, guns, and yes, even Unimogs!). |
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Quoted:
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I have nothing but fear and loathing for the idea of a BO. At present I do not even have a good BOV. At least one that could carry even a fraction of my supplies. A good BOV is very high on my lists of must haves in the coming year. Until then, my BOG consists of my BOB, my SHTF weapons, and a case each of food and ammo. That's about all I can fit in the trunk of my Nissan... I had a little Nissan sportscar as my prime mover about this time last year... a litle rain and a Diesel spill fixed that. After hauling camping equipment in it a couple times it became obvious it wasn't what I really needed/wanted. I lucked into a Unimog for not too much money... kept an eye on Craigslist and got an M105A2 trailer (1.5 ton capacity -built to go behind a Deuce-and-a-half) in new shape for $400. Now I've got the capacity to haul some of what I'd like to keep if things get bad -for about the same money as what I would have made in payments in that same period of time with the blingy sportscar. Yeah, most chicks dig the 'Mog less ...now to find a new chick to fit the new view.
It's all about focus, patience, and a little timing doesn't hurt... As with everything I guess! What Mog do you have? I have been looking and would rather have that than a duece but they are so hard to find. |
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What Mog do you have? I have been looking and would rather have that than a duece but they are so hard to find. [/quote] I have been looking at Mogs, but they are hard to find and can be pricey. A good alternative is the "Bobbed Duce", check out .http://www.100dollarman.com and you will see what I mean. It is a cut down Duce, looks like a pick up on steroids. The price is not bad, and parts should be a lot easier to come by than for the MOG. But Mogs are pretty hot, and there is no debating their track record. Until I saw the Bobbed Duce, the Mog was number one on my list. Still wouldn't turn one down if I came across a good deal on one. If you are willing to go through the trouble of importing one, check out http://www.ljacksonandco.com. They have Mogs and they aren't all beat to hell. They also have a lot of experience in the import/export aspect of the process.
Edit: having trouble posting the direct link, but the address is correct if you google it. |