Posted: 3/1/2009 12:20:59 PM EDT
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Many of us have generators for SHTF situations, but do any of you have solar panels? Generators are great, but they are a hassle because you have to stock fuel, and worry about engine failure, so I started wondering about solar panels. I don't really know anything about them, but I hear they are getting more efficient, and the price is coming down. Could someone give me an idea of what type of solar panel to power the essentials such as a lamp or two, and the fan to the wood furnace. Also a general price would be good too.
Thanks, Tyler |
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Sure, 4x 80 watt solar panels on our trailer charging 2 golf cart batteries via an Outback MMPT charge controller, will on a good day, run a small PC and some 15 watt flourescent lighting about 10 hours a day.
Or figure how much your fan and light draw in watts. The system I described is good for about 700 to 1000 watt hours per day depending on sunlight, time of year, condx of batteries, etc. It's a good system for modest needs. |
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solar electrical power is about the most expensive option you can go with to make electricity. it is also one of the simplest. it has a lot of attraction because of the potential longevity of the panels, and the perceived low maintenance aspect.
it takes a lot more panels than you might think to get anything remotely approaching a useful amount of electricity unless you find a way to drastically reduce how much electricity you typically use. Think a reduction on the order of 95%. an RV can use a propane for cooking, heating, and refrigeration, even lighting, so for an RV, it can make some sense as opposed to a loud generator. |
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Unless you are in the sun belt, its hard to the capture a great deal of energy from the sun in order to run all lighting and home appliances. This is why many people combine solar and wind energy solutions together in order to maximize their generation of "green" power.
I hope to be able to build a new home within 2-3 years. We're planning on using solar and wind energy, along with structurally insulated foam panels for the walls. |
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I built my system exactly one year ago today....
1100 watt system with battery and grid tie. My electric bill went from around $275.00/ month avg to around $35.00 avg. Total cost was 10k but I did install my self and saved big $$$ I figure it will pay for itself in 3 year. I have had monthly electric bills as low as 2 bucks. There is 30% tax credit from Feds. |
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I built my system exactly one year ago today.... 1100 watt system with battery and grid tie. My electric bill went from around $275.00/ month avg to around $35.00 avg. Total cost was 10k but I did install my self and saved big $$$ I figure it will pay for itself in 3 year. I have had monthly electric bills as low as 2 bucks. There is 30% tax credit from Feds. What is your Kw hour price? That seems like a pretty small system to have such large savings. You can't hardly run a coffee pot on 1100 watts. |
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I built my system exactly one year ago today.... 1100 watt system with battery and grid tie. My electric bill went from around $275.00/ month avg to around $35.00 avg. Total cost was 10k but I did install my self and saved big $$$ I figure it will pay for itself in 3 year. I have had monthly electric bills as low as 2 bucks. There is 30% tax credit from Feds. Would you mind providing some specifics on your system, like, what components, where you got them and how much $$? |
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These guys have some pre-built kits with all the required parts to give you ideas.
http://www.partsonsale.com/ |
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I built my system exactly one year ago today.... 1100 watt system with battery and grid tie. My electric bill went from around $275.00/ month avg to around $35.00 avg. Total cost was 10k but I did install my self and saved big $$$ I figure it will pay for itself in 3 year. I have had monthly electric bills as low as 2 bucks. There is 30% tax credit from Feds. The numbers really don't add up. Most places electricity is about 10 cents a kw-hr. To go from $275 a month to $35 means you went from 2750 kw-hrs to 350 per month, implying you are making about 2400 kw-hrs per month of electrcity from your system. An 1100 watt system will average 4 or 5 kw-hrs per day, maybe 8 if you are in a real sunny place and have fancy tracking type mounts. That would imply you are probably only generating less than 200 kw-hrs a month. |
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I built my system exactly one year ago today.... 1100 watt system with battery and grid tie. My electric bill went from around $275.00/ month avg to around $35.00 avg. Total cost was 10k but I did install my self and saved big $$$ I figure it will pay for itself in 3 year. I have had monthly electric bills as low as 2 bucks. There is 30% tax credit from Feds. The numbers really don't add up. Most places electricity is about 10 cents a kw-hr. To go from $275 a month to $35 means you went from 2750 kw-hrs to 350 per month, implying you are making about 2400 kw-hrs per month of electrcity from your system. An 1100 watt system will average 4 or 5 kw-hrs per day, maybe 8 if you are in a real sunny place and have fancy tracking type mounts. That would imply you are probably only generating less than 200 kw-hrs a month. I posted pics of my whole set up here last year...and I cant find it now  ....but to add and to answer your questions.....our electric company had a 30 % increase in rates t the same time I built my system. Also I conserve my power when possible ie....the coffee pot runs on the gas stove...the lights are all cfl now...the freezers are all on timers...and I have a bio diesel generator for backup power so I use genny tocharge batteries when itscloudy. And I sell back to the grid on sunny days.
So for the number crunchers that say it don't add up....it does add up! Can I run my electric clothes dryer on it ever day.....NO!!!!! Can I run air compressor in my shop 24/7.......NO!!!! Can I leave coffee pot on 24/7......NO!!! Can I run a/c in summer 24/7 .......NO!!!! Thats why I have biodiesel genny and I run that at least 4 hours per week to peek batteries when its cloudy, the air compressor when I need air, and forget about the a/c because then I would need a much bigger solar system. Am I typing this in the dark.....yes.... 
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I built my system exactly one year ago today.... 1100 watt system with battery and grid tie. My electric bill went from around $275.00/ month avg to around $35.00 avg. Total cost was 10k but I did install my self and saved big $$$ I figure it will pay for itself in 3 year. I have had monthly electric bills as low as 2 bucks. There is 30% tax credit from Feds. Would you mind providing some specifics on your system, like, what components, where you got them and how much $$? 8 X 130 watt kyocera panels xantrex 4024 hybrid inverter Kubota biodiesel genny (I owned this already so not in price) Xantrex genny auto start outback mx60 charge controller trojan t 106 batteries wired in series and parell for 6 x 24 batteries outback Dc and Ac breaker boxes lightnng arrestors and other misc equipment Pole mount on 8" x12' pole in the ground 6' with 20++ bags of concrete. I did the WHOLE install myself (electrician did grid tie part)if anyone wants help or wants to see the system....im me please. Mounted on Pole mount and I am the manual tracker 
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I built my system exactly one year ago today.... 1100 watt system with battery and grid tie. My electric bill went from around $275.00/ month avg to around $35.00 avg. Total cost was 10k but I did install my self and saved big $$$ I figure it will pay for itself in 3 year. I have had monthly electric bills as low as 2 bucks. There is 30% tax credit from Feds. pics? |
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I built my system exactly one year ago today.... 1100 watt system with battery and grid tie. My electric bill went from around $275.00/ month avg to around $35.00 avg. Total cost was 10k but I did install my self and saved big $$$ I figure it will pay for itself in 3 year. I have had monthly electric bills as low as 2 bucks. There is 30% tax credit from Feds. The numbers really don't add up. Most places electricity is about 10 cents a kw-hr. To go from $275 a month to $35 means you went from 2750 kw-hrs to 350 per month, implying you are making about 2400 kw-hrs per month of electrcity from your system. An 1100 watt system will average 4 or 5 kw-hrs per day, maybe 8 if you are in a real sunny place and have fancy tracking type mounts. That would imply you are probably only generating less than 200 kw-hrs a month. I posted pics of my whole set up here last year...and I cant find it now ....but to add and to answer your questions.....our electric company had a 30 % increase in rates t the same time I built my system. Also I conserve my power when possible ie....the coffee pot runs on the gas stove...the lights are all cfl now...the freezers are all on timers...and I have a bio diesel generator for backup power so I use genny tocharge batteries when itscloudy. And I sell back to the grid on sunny days.
So for the number crunchers that say it don't add up....it does add up! Can I run my electric clothes dryer on it ever day.....NO!!!!! Can I run air compressor in my shop 24/7.......NO!!!! Can I leave coffee pot on 24/7......NO!!! Can I run a/c in summer 24/7 .......NO!!!! Thats why I have biodiesel genny and I run that at least 4 hours per week to peek batteries when its cloudy, the air compressor when I need air, and forget about the a/c because then I would need a much bigger solar system. Am I typing this in the dark.....yes....
But only now is it adding up. In your first post you implied that you bought an 1100 watt system and cut your power bill $250.00 a month while still living the same way you did before. No mention of the genny and no mention of the reduced consumption. I came up with about the same numbers as ilbob did when I ran them I just didn't call BS yet until you came back with some clarification about your system......that did not add up at the time. To achieve what you posted with your first post it would take about a $50-60,000 PV system and battery bank and even then that would be pushing it. It was just a little misleading for someone who has no knowledge of PV systems and their efficiency ratings(or lack thereof). I would hate for someone to read that and go drop $10,000 on a system like yours thinking their power bill would magically become 1/8 of what it previously was while still maintaining their lifestyle. |
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I built my system exactly one year ago today.... 1100 watt system with battery and grid tie. My electric bill went from around $275.00/ month avg to around $35.00 avg. Total cost was 10k but I did install my self and saved big $$$ I figure it will pay for itself in 3 year. I have had monthly electric bills as low as 2 bucks. There is 30% tax credit from Feds. The numbers really don't add up. Most places electricity is about 10 cents a kw-hr. To go from $275 a month to $35 means you went from 2750 kw-hrs to 350 per month, implying you are making about 2400 kw-hrs per month of electrcity from your system. An 1100 watt system will average 4 or 5 kw-hrs per day, maybe 8 if you are in a real sunny place and have fancy tracking type mounts. That would imply you are probably only generating less than 200 kw-hrs a month. I posted pics of my whole set up here last year...and I cant find it now ....but to add and to answer your questions.....our electric company had a 30 % increase in rates t the same time I built my system. Also I conserve my power when possible ie....the coffee pot runs on the gas stove...the lights are all cfl now...the freezers are all on timers...and I have a bio diesel generator for backup power so I use genny tocharge batteries when itscloudy. And I sell back to the grid on sunny days.
So for the number crunchers that say it don't add up....it does add up! Can I run my electric clothes dryer on it ever day.....NO!!!!! Can I run air compressor in my shop 24/7.......NO!!!! Can I leave coffee pot on 24/7......NO!!! Can I run a/c in summer 24/7 .......NO!!!! Thats why I have biodiesel genny and I run that at least 4 hours per week to peek batteries when its cloudy, the air compressor when I need air, and forget about the a/c because then I would need a much bigger solar system. Am I typing this in the dark.....yes....
You need to differentiate between saving energy and the solar generated energy. Most of the energy savings reduced the bill, moreso than the solar panels. 1.1kw might generate 5-7kwh/da... At $0.10, you can do the math. Everyone I know who has solar (typically 10kw installations) does not do it for an economic reason, even with the tax rebates. Still not an effective ROI from a strictly finance sense. |
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It seems that some are still hung up on the money aspects of going solar!
What most dont realize is that if your going to try to run your house ineffiecintly and try to match you kwh/ month to that ussage it will be cost prohibitive to build a solar array. But if your willing to try to conserve, run eneregy effient appliances, etc...then solar is possible. I took a course on solar at the local University and 50% of the course was learning how to conserve and REDUCE energy usage or how to decrease electric bill. I have learned how to conserve...maybe you ought to try it. |
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It seems that some are still hung up on the money aspects of going solar! What most dont realize is that if your going to try to run your house ineffiecintly and try to match you kwh/ month to that ussage it will be cost prohibitive to build a solar array. But if your willing to try to conserve, run eneregy effient appliances, etc...then solar is possible. I took a course on solar at the local University and 50% of the course was learning how to conserve and REDUCE energy usage or how to decrease electric bill. I have learned how to conserve...maybe you ought to try it. I am looking at my feb bill. 196 kwh. My yearly kwh usage is 2582. about a quarter of the national avg. Would you be willing to share your notes, name of text book etc on conservation using electricity efficently? Not a top ten list of best practices but perhaps a top 100  .
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| I like "www.builditsolar.com" and a healthy dose of "get 'er done". Cfl bulbs, power strips on anything with a stand by load, swapped my AC bath fan 80 CFM (73w) for a 120 cfm DC computer fan (7w), I have not disconnected the clock on the stove 1w/hr....yet. ECM blower motor on a 10 SEER forced air furnice with airconditioning. Fisher Paykel washer. No production (solar, generator) the math still does not make sense to me. If I feel rich I might do this: chest fridge conversion or this DC fridge. What ideas have worked for you? |
| Thank you all for your help, especially Paul. I really liked that web page and it gave me a better idea of what I might need/want and the prices. With that being said, what does the board think the best system on that site would be to run a deepfreeze and a lamp or two if there was no grid power in a SHTF situation? |