Posted: 1/22/2009 2:41:48 AM EDT
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I'm in the works for planning an emergency fire starter. I've been sooo cold, my fingers don't work well enough to use matches or butane lighter. I need something that doesnt need fine motor skills to use.
I'm thinking of a large pill bottle to hold some fire paste in; this is essentially jelled alcohol, thinner than Sterno, more like toothpaste. Add to this a flint, glued to the outside of the bottle, and a steel to strike it with. In the worst case (i.e., imminent hypothermia), this would enable the user to crush the bottle, releasing the jelled alcohol, and then use the flint/steel to start the alcohol on fire. How cold can the jelled alcohol be before it no longer emits flammable vapors? |
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I'm in the works for planning an emergency fire starter. I've been sooo cold, my fingers don't work well enough to use matches or butane lighter. I need something that doesnt need fine motor skills to use. I'm thinking of a large pill bottle to hold some fire paste in; this is essentially jelled alcohol, thinner than Sterno, more like toothpaste. Add to this a flint, glued to the outside of the bottle, and a steel to strike it with. In the worst case (i.e., imminent hypothermia), this would enable the user to crush the bottle, releasing the jelled alcohol, and then use the flint/steel to start the alcohol on fire. How cold can the jelled alcohol be before it no longer emits flammable vapors? Purel hand sanitizer. I tested it about a year ago when it was -4 outside and it worked fine. It took two flashes of sparks but lit up after that. I use the small $.50 bottles you can drag the lid across the ground if you hands cannot manipulate. Just keep the flint dry they can be problematic when they are wet. I would think also if the flint is covered in jelled alcohol. |
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2 small vials.
One with potassium permangenate, the other with glycerol ( glycerine or anti-freeze). Instant fire. Make them small glass vials and even if you cannot remove the top, you simply break them with a rock, one on top of the other, in your tinder bundle. This can also be done one-handed, in case you are also injured. If using glass vials, make sure they cannot break accidently or you'll have a flaming pack. |
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Have you tried a BlastMatch? It's made to work using one hand. I gave one to my brother who was born with one hand and he started a fire on the first try using Vasoline coated cotton balls, a paper towel, toilet paper. It throws some spark to say the least.
Do a search of "Blastmatch" on Youtube if you want to see how it works. |
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Have you tried a BlastMatch? It's made to work using one hand. I gave one to my brother who was born with one hand and he started a fire on the first try using Vasoline coated cotton balls, a paper towel, toilet paper. It throws some spark to say the least. Do a search of "Blastmatch" on Youtube if you want to see how it works. Comparison between BlastMatch, Fire Steel and LMF fire lighter |
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I personally don't care for the BlastMatch since it has moving parts and the striker piece isn't secured very well.
During abbreviated survival training (I teach Hunter Education for Texas Parks & Wildife) they don't last more than 7 or 8 fire starting sessions, then the striker pops out of it's flap under your thumb. Gerber did replace a couple of them at no charge but I finally gave up on it. YMMV. Plus it is expensive & heavy. Nothing that I've tried will strike hotter or with more sparks though. Even the little magnesium fire starter from Coleman, etc (now made in China) has a fair striker (flint) and now comes with a hacksaw blade for sparking (cheap, too). The problem here is you need your fingers to be in working condition. You might think about a Bic with no safety-illegal in California (just like strike-anywhere kitchen matches) but if you can see your fingers you can usually manipulate a safety-free Bic. |
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A few years ago I bought a bunch of those little NRA "Survival Kits" that included a BlastMatch, signal mirror, tinder cubes etc. The BlastMatch units were awesome while they worked, but I tend to be a little heavy-handed, and they didn't hold up.
While they worked they were great-you could use them one handed while wearing gloves. Maybe I'm just a klutz when it comes to this stuff, but I managed to break 3 of them in normal, everyday use (campfires, BBQs etc). I'd hate like hell to have to depend on one if my survival depended on a warm fire. If you or your spouse/SO owns a double boiler, it's real easy to make your own waterproof strike anywhere matches. I bought a block of pure parafin wax for candlemaking at the local craft supply store. Melt the parafin in the double boiler, and then dip in some Diamond "Strike Anywhere" matches. I could do 12 matches at a time using a large acco-clip that I swiped from work. Some people dip the whole match into the parafin, but I prefer to dip them about halfway down the stick. My "ghetto" matches are every bit as waterproof and reliable as the expensive ones I used to buy. |
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If you or your spouse/SO owns a double boiler, it's real easy to make your own waterproof strike anywhere matches. I bought a block of pure parafin wax for candlemaking at the local craft supply store. Melt the parafin in the double boiler, and then dip in some Diamond "Strike Anywhere" matches. I could do 12 matches at a time using a large acco-clip that I swiped from work. Some people dip the whole match into the parafin, but I prefer to dip them about halfway down the stick. My "ghetto" matches are every bit as waterproof and reliable as the expensive ones I used to buy. I've done this and found that if I didnt coat the entire matchstick, that if submerged for even a small amout of time the uncoated portion of the stick would absorb the water and disperse it to the covered portion and the matchhead, rendering it useless. YMMV, but it's worth testing if these matches are important to you... -Slice |
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My favorite flint fire starter is the Blast Match. I've been using them for 5 years now, never broken any of the 3 I have, nor the three I've given as gifts. I do also pack a stadard magnesium fire starter in my pack in the event that it's really cold/wet and there is no dry tinder available. A guy can make a pretty substantial fire starting kit with just a magnesium fire starter bar, a 3" piece of hacksaw blade (for striking, so you don't dull your knife), and a pencil sharpener for getting dry wood shavings from sticks.
Other good tinders when using a magnesium fire starter are: Duct tape: peel a piece off, shave the magnesium chips on the sticky side and light. If you decide not to start the fire, just fold the tape over and use it later. Burns long and hot, plenty to get a fire going. Duct tape is a handy thing to have in a BOB.. Bicycle innertube: Cut 1" squares with fraying on one end and a hole in the center. The hole is so they can be put on the firestarter's lanyard, and the fraying is to make the rubber catch and burn more easily. Lay a rubber square down and shave a pile of magnesium on the frayed end. Strike the magnesium and the rubber will burn long and hot. Very tenacious flame in windy conditions. |
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Swedish Fire Steel takes no skill or dexterity. You get a shower of sparks. You could use it wearing mittens, if need be. You still need tinder, of course.
GL |
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With a fire steel you could hold down a knife with your foot, the knife angled up over a stone to give the back edge some height off the ground and then scrap the fire steel towards you across it with your mittened hand, I suppose. It'd be awkward but I'm sure it could be done. If you had an axe, I suppose you could hold steady the axe handle over your shoulder as you bend down with the fire steel and scrap it across the blade of the axe. That should work. Or stab the knife in the dirt and scrape the steel across it that way. Or hold the axe head or the knife between your booted feet and scrape.
GL |
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With a fire steel you could hold down a knife with your foot, the knife angled up over a stone to give the back edge some height off the ground and then scrap the fire steel towards you across it with your mittened hand, I suppose. It'd be awkward but I'm sure it could be done. If you had an axe, I suppose you could hold steady the axe handle over your shoulder as you bend down with the fire steel and scrap it across the blade of the axe. That should work. Or stab the knife in the dirt and scrape the steel across it that way. Or hold the axe head or the knife between your booted feet and scrape. GL Yep. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0bU0F0hKdI |
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Bundle of 000 fine steel wool + 9 volt battery=instant fire  Hmmm, nospoon... you've given me an idear... I'm going to try a plastic medicine bottle, about 1 1/4 inch diameter. At the bottom I'll put something to make good tinder, like sawdust/paraffin. Above that will be some cotton batting. This will be soaked with jellied alcohol. Mixed with that will be some steel wool. On the outside of the bottle, I'll tape a 9 volt battery. Touch the wool with the battery and the whole thing will go up pretty nicely. Or am I courting an incendiary device charge? |
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Bundle of 000 fine steel wool + 9 volt battery=instant fire Hmmm, nospoon... you've given me an idear... I'm going to try a plastic medicine bottle, about 1 1/4 inch diameter. At the bottom I'll put something to make good tinder, like sawdust/paraffin. Above that will be some cotton batting. This will be soaked with jellied alcohol. Mixed with that will be some steel wool. On the outside of the bottle, I'll tape a 9 volt battery. Touch the wool with the battery and the whole thing will go up pretty nicely. Or am I courting an incendiary device charge? If you try this make sure and post how it works, if you have to empty the bottle or if you can just burn the bottle as well, please. I am thinking it will really help if you can just burn the bottle if you are out in rain or high winds. |
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Bundle of 000 fine steel wool + 9 volt battery=instant fire Hmmm, nospoon... you've given me an idear... I'm going to try a plastic medicine bottle, about 1 1/4 inch diameter. At the bottom I'll put something to make good tinder, like sawdust/paraffin. Above that will be some cotton batting. This will be soaked with jellied alcohol. Mixed with that will be some steel wool. On the outside of the bottle, I'll tape a 9 volt battery. Touch the wool with the battery and the whole thing will go up pretty nicely. Or am I courting an incendiary device charge? how long do you think the jellied alcohol will last before evaporation will effect it i have some in the bottle in the barn but haven't used any in years .i guess i had better see if it is any good still |
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If you try this make sure and post how it works, if you have to empty the bottle or if you can just burn the bottle as well, please. I am thinking it will really help if you can just burn the bottle if you are out in rain or high winds.
I'm thinking of using it either way... Maybe even put it in an easily-crushable container, for real emergencies. I mentioned that I'd been cold enough that my fingers would not respond. Fortunately I was with a group who taught me what to do (put hands in armpits to rewarrm them). But this is the kind of emergency I am considering–– being so far gone that one's faculties are impaired, and dexterity is seriously impaired. Be nice to be able to set something on fire in such an emergency, right? |
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road flare I agree. A 15 min road flare (easily found at Walmart) is awesome for starting fires (intended or not). If you live in a fire prone area, be careful that you don't set the surrounding area on fire; in fact, I would suggest that you actually 'fire up' a road flare in a controlled environment before you actually need it, just so you can see how powerful they are. Keep a bucket of water handy and even dip the flare into the water to see how well they stay lite when this happens. Sparco |
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road flare I agree. A 15 min road flare (easily found at Walmart) is awesome for starting fires (intended or not). If you live in a fire prone area, be careful that you don't set the surrounding area on fire; in fact, I would suggest that you actually 'fire up' a road flare in a controlled environment before you actually need it, just so you can see how powerful they are. Keep a bucket of water handy and even dip the flare into the water to see how well they stay lite when this happens. Sparco Oh, road flares are plenty powerful! They are also pertty smokey, which sort of limits their usability in, say, a tent. From my original post: Regarding using alcohol: How cold can the jelled alcohol be before it no longer emits flammable vapors? |
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2 small vials. One with potassium permangenate, the other with glycerol ( glycerine or anti-freeze). Instant fire. Make them small glass vials and even if you cannot remove the top, you simply break them with a rock, one on top of the other, in your tinder bundle. This can also be done one-handed, in case you are also injured. If using glass vials, make sure they cannot break accidently or you'll have a flaming pack. I've been experimenting with this for the last couple weeks. I bought a 1 lb bottle of PP at lowes and a bottle of glycerine from the first aid section of Wal Mart. Mix the two together in equal parts, and nothing. 10 minutes later, nothing. 15-20 minutes later and it starts to smolder and then ignites. Works a little faster but with antifreeze, though all I had on hand was the pre-diluted stuff so the flame was not as intense. All the video's I've seen, this is normally an instant reaction. So what am I doing wrong??? or is it just the sub freezing temps hindering the reaction?? |
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Since the KMnO4 is an oxidizer, it has a shelf life. Over time, it loses some of it's effectiveness. I noticed in Chem lab (many moons ago), the older the KMnO4 was, the slower the reaction. Eventually, it would not ignite at all. I do not have a time frame on this unfortunatly. Also, excess heat will also speed this loss of effectiveness, so keeping it in your car over the summer could possibly render it usless by the time you'd really need it, IMO.
Also, MCR, where in Lowes were you able to find the KMnO4? I've looked but didn't know what department it was in and no one knew what I was talking about when I asked for it.. lol |
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2 small vials. One with potassium permangenate, the other with glycerol ( glycerine or anti-freeze). Instant fire. Make them small glass vials and even if you cannot remove the top, you simply break them with a rock, one on top of the other, in your tinder bundle. This can also be done one-handed, in case you are also injured. If using glass vials, make sure they cannot break accidently or you'll have a flaming pack. I've been experimenting with this for the last couple weeks. I bought a 1 lb bottle of PP at lowes and a bottle of glycerine from the first aid section of Wal Mart. Mix the two together in equal parts, and nothing. 10 minutes later, nothing. 15-20 minutes later and it starts to smolder and then ignites. Works a little faster but with antifreeze, though all I had on hand was the pre-diluted stuff so the flame was not as intense. All the video's I've seen, this is normally an instant reaction. So what am I doing wrong??? or is it just the sub freezing temps hindering the reaction?? Yes, the speed to react spontaneously is highly dependent on temperature. Try warming the glycerine next to your body. |
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I know where the OP is coming from with the idea of being so cold your hands dont work.
I took a little swim in a pond one time when it was in the single digits. That was fuggen cold. At that point matches, lighters, and fancy sparkers are going to be the death of you. Something that requires minimal effort and dextarity are the life saver. Of course, you have to have the tinder bundle ready to go as well as the logs for fuel. If you think starting a fire while violently shivering is hard, try swinging an axe 
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Myself, I'm sticking with the Blast Match. I had and earlier iteration (Strike Force) prior to receiving a Blast Match as part of the Christmas Exchange here a couple of years ago.
The NRA survival kit, and the Blast Match that it contained (well the Blast Match has been the most useful part), has worked flawlessly. Fire starting has too many variable to account for "all situations", best that you can do is account for as many as are reasonable. I also carry a container of lifeboat matches in my GHB, as well as several butane lighters, and a good old fashioned Zippo with a refuel kit. Zippo's can also be used to house fire starting solutions: Zippo to the Rescue Always have a backup for your backup 
c0 ____________________________ Failure to plan on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine. http://Tpass.org |
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2 small vials. One with potassium permangenate, the other with glycerol ( glycerine or anti-freeze). Instant fire. Make them small glass vials and even if you cannot remove the top, you simply break them with a rock, one on top of the other, in your tinder bundle. This can also be done one-handed, in case you are also injured. If using glass vials, make sure they cannot break accidently or you'll have a flaming pack. I've been experimenting with this for the last couple weeks. I bought a 1 lb bottle of PP at lowes and a bottle of glycerine from the first aid section of Wal Mart. Mix the two together in equal parts, and nothing. 10 minutes later, nothing. 15-20 minutes later and it starts to smolder and then ignites. Works a little faster but with antifreeze, though all I had on hand was the pre-diluted stuff so the flame was not as intense. All the video's I've seen, this is normally an instant reaction. So what am I doing wrong??? or is it just the sub freezing temps hindering the reaction?? Yes, the speed to react spontaneously is highly dependent on temperature. Try warming the glycerine next to your body. I don't believe that chemical reaction function under a certain temperature. A road flare fits your scenario best, as they were designed to be stupid and cold proof.. |
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Since the KMnO4 is an oxidizer, it has a shelf life. Over time, it loses some of it's effectiveness. I noticed in Chem lab (many moons ago), the older the KMnO4 was, the slower the reaction. Eventually, it would not ignite at all. I do not have a time frame on this unfortunatly. Also, excess heat will also speed this loss of effectiveness, so keeping it in your car over the summer could possibly render it usless by the time you'd really need it, IMO. Also, MCR, where in Lowes were you able to find the KMnO4? I've looked but didn't know what department it was in and no one knew what I was talking about when I asked for it.. lol I found the PP in the household water treatment section of the store, right next to the faucets, etc. It came in a white bottle with purple lettering on the label. Search the website and you'll see what I am talking about. It at least gives you an idea what type of packaging to look for. |
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Since the KMnO4 is an oxidizer, it has a shelf life. Over time, it loses some of it's effectiveness. I noticed in Chem lab (many moons ago), the older the KMnO4 was, the slower the reaction. Eventually, it would not ignite at all. I do not have a time frame on this unfortunatly. Also, excess heat will also speed this loss of effectiveness, so keeping it in your car over the summer could possibly render it usless by the time you'd really need it, IMO. Also, MCR, where in Lowes were you able to find the KMnO4? I've looked but didn't know what department it was in and no one knew what I was talking about when I asked for it.. lol I found the PP in the household water treatment section of the store, right next to the faucets, etc. It came in a white bottle with purple lettering on the label. Search the website and you'll see what I am talking about. It at least gives you an idea what type of packaging to look for. Ace Hardware also has it. |
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Well, I finally tried it out... it worked well. I combined a length of dryer lint with some Coughlan's Fire Paste, rolled some steel wool into the mix, and put it into a pill bottle. Removed the top, pulled the end of the steel wool out, and tried to light it with a 9v battery. No luck. So I lit the package with a butane lighter. It burned very well. In fact, it burned so well it started a 1x2 pine board on fire! I put a couple of the 1x2s together and got a self-sustaining fire going.
The significance of this is, as cougargnw pointed out, it can be very difficult getting enough small tinder together to light a fire. By having a hot, long-duration fire source, you can light some of the larger tinder. I tried to get a video of this effort, but my camera shut off 1/2 way through. I didn't have enough memory to record the entire event! I will do it again under 'real life' conditions. By the way, Coughlan's Fire Paste (aka Fire Ribbon) is great stuff! You could almost llght a battleship with this stuff! |