Posted: 10/5/2007 4:08:13 AM EDT
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Has the AR-15 platform become the most versatile weapon in the preparedness arsenal? When one thinks of the AR-15, they would only think of the 5.56mm/.223 caliber, but with new modifications, the AR platform is as versatile as any weapon on the planet. With changing the upper receiver, one can easily switch from anything from .22 LR to .50 Beowulf. Most preparedness minded individuals agree to needing several calibers in their inventory for a variety of needs, from short term SHTF to TEOTWAWKI situations, can the AR-15 fill the gaps (except for a shotgun and pistol requirement) in almost every situation? Let’s take a look. I’m focusing directly on calibers which do not need any modifications to the lower receiver. .22 LR for plinking, training and small game. These are available commercially and fit the need for a small game rifle, whether you have a shorty 16 inch carbine or a full length 24 inch barrel varmint. The .22 conversion will fit the bill. I can’t speak to accuracy out of these, but for hunting small game, I wouldn’t figure it would be too much beyond the range of the .22. Mid range caliber rounds: 5.56mm/.223, 6.8 SPC, 7.62x39mm The first and last are mainstays of the survivalist’s arsenal, with the 6.8 being the relative newcomer. The 5.56 being well suited for most applications (except hunting larger game) and the last two filling the void there. The 7.62x39mm and 6.8 SPC are valid rounds for most North American game. With the 6.8 SPC being a newcomer, the ammo is still expensive, but reloading components are available and with more factories pumping out ARs in 6.8, the price on ammo is coming down. Other calibers that can be used/modified for the weapons platform: .17 Remington, .204 Ruger, .222 Remington, .6mm X 45, 6mm PPC, .30 Carbine, 6.5 Grendel, .223 WSM and .243 WSSM on a standard lower receiver. There are others available as well. Pistol Caliber Conversions: Several Different calibers for pistol conversion, for both home protection and/or younger members not ready for a full size caliber yet. 9x19mm, .40 S&W, 10mm, .45 ACP. Pistol caliber conversions offer a nice bridge between pistols and full size rifles. Large caliber Conversions: .450 Bushmaster, .458 SOCOM and .50 Beowulf. For large and dangerous game. These calibers pack pretty much the same punch as a .45-70 Government and are effective. Down side to these calibers? They are pretty expensive right now. So why would I want to have one firearm in many calibers? Several reasons… Familiarity with one system of operation. Ergonomics (the AR is debatably the most ergonomic rifle on the planet) The modular nature of the AR platform to include scopes, hand guards, flash suppressors/muzzle brakes, etc, etc, etc. Switch from small caliber to large caliber in less than a minute Different applications means different rounds, same weapon with different upper Imagine a BOB with a 16 inch upper for .22 LR and your main weapon being a 6.8 SPC. You would not need to have two weapons, hence cutting down on the weight in your bag. About the only thing missing is the 7.62 NATO and higher. Some manufacturers are making modular weapons that take anything from .22 LR to .30-06 to .338 in an AR style weapon. However, these are more complicated and require more work for changing calibers. So ideally, could one set up the following weapons vault? AR-15 lower, whatever manufacturer you want, whatever stock you want, whatever handgrip you want, trigger, etc. One 20 inch upper with .22 LR conversion kit for small game One 16 inch upper in 5.56mm for security/varmint applications One 18 inch upper in 6.8 SPC for hunting/security applications One 18 inch upper in .450 Bushmaster for security/large game hunting One 16 inch upper in .45 ACP for security applications I think someone could have this and be pretty well set with possibly needing a bolt gun in the .30 caliber range (.308, .300 Mag, .30-06, etc) if they so desired. |
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My take on this whole argument is as follows. The AR platform is modular, Ease of Maintenance, Ease of Repair, Readily available replacement parts that can be stocked up on. One COULD stock Multiple Calibers and Multiple uppers etc. Mass Quantities of Mags are available cheap. Also light and easy to teach family members to use and maintain. Seems like a good choice, the best? Maybe not but a good Choice. |
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The AR is an outstanding platform. That said, if you can't do it with a 5.56 carbine, you probably shouldn't be trying to do it with an AR. I for one can't see the viability (from a survival standpoint) of stocking multiple uppers and the obligatory multiple magazines to go with each one. |
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Here is a fine example of why multi caliber: All of my group has a weapon in 7.62x39, whether they are sks's, or ak's. We also have other guns, but we all agreed to have at least 1 viable common caliber. Since some of the group cannot afford an AR, then it was decided to go the less expensive 7.62x39 route. Now, my wife doesn't care for the kick of the AK's, and doesn't like the SKS either. I am finishing up a build for her in .223, that she really enjoys to shoot. I will be getting a 7.62x39 conversion for her AR, that way she is on the same common caliber as the rest of us, should that need ever arise. Another exapmle ( although only theoretical) would be to do an AR in your handgun caliber ( 9mm or .45) and be able to use multiple platforms with the same bullet. With all of this said and done, I really dont think the AR platform is of much use, once you get rid of all the zombie hordes that will invade for your stuff at the begginning. Personnally, a 12 guage shotgun with a variety of loads, and a .22 rifle with plenty of ammo is the best bet, if you cant afford to drop a lot of money on your arsenal, or you are in a situation that owning an AR ( or any other "evil" rifle) is not workable. 12 and 22 are both very PC correct. |
Well, on your second point I will point out there is the AR-10! On your 3rd point, I disagree 100% The advantage of the AR-15 is the easy that it can be worked on and I think that if a person can not afford to have multiple spare AR-15s, that they would be wise to have a spare upper and a spare lower parts kit just in case SHTF and they need to replace something for one reason or another. For me, I do everything in 2's or more for key weapons (I can afford to...) I have two AR-10s (AR-10T, CAR-10) I have two FALS (Imbel Rifle, DSA Para) I have two Rem 700s in 308 (PSS and BDL Sporter) I have two Glock 17s I have two Ruger 10/22s I have two Rem 870s I have MORE then two AR-15s I have WAY MORE then two AKs The advantage... if one gun goes down, I still have a second (or more) that will fill the same basic role OR I can scavange it for parts to keep using the system I want or need most. I was slow to adopt the "ONE is NONE, TWO is ONE" principle, but I buy one or two guns a year and now I really am where I want to be. |
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I don't have the dosh to get into a handful of rifles, so I'm settling for a handful of AR lowers before the '08 election. Afterwards as funds allow for different ammo and reloading gear I may get into some of the larger 6.x caliber rounds. I would like to get into an M1[4|A], but from a preparedness standpoint I think the money is better spent on food stuffs and backing up the gear I have now. So yeah, go AR! :-) -WhyTanFox |
| The lower can be a relatively inexpensive part of the whole system If your BO plan is to carry one lower with multiple uppers, your BI plan should include a couple of extra complete lowers. $90 for the lower, $60 for the parts kit, and a used stock off the EE will turn 1 into 2 which in the SF equals 1. Also, no one has a .45ACP adapter for a standard AR lower, the upper will fit, but it will be a single shot. CNC Gunsmithing is making a .45 AR lower that will accept grease gun mags, but it's a dedicated lower due to the magwell mods. Oly Arms makes a .45 lower that uses Glock mags, and again it's dedicated. As far as the pistol caliber conversions, the only one that uses a standard AR lower(with a mag block) is the Colt 9mm carbines, they also use a modified mag that's not cheap. As far as 7.62x39, it won't feed well out of standard AR mags. The only calibers that are really worth getting uppers for if you plan on switching out are .22LR, .223, and any of the larger calibers designed to function and feed from standard AR mags(6.8, .450BM, .458SOCOM, etc.). Otherwise just stock rifles with uppers mated to dedicated lowers, and go with AR's for the similarity in manual of arms, and repair/assembly/spare lower parts. The main reason Colt came out with the 9mm Sub-gun was for these reasons. |
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Of course the problem with stocking multiple uppers instead of complete rifles is what happens when your lower takes a crap? Either you lose it, break it, damage it, or need it somewhere else, doing something else. Now you have a bunch of uppers that are effectively worthless. It's a good strategy, but you should have lowers for at least the most useful of the upper configs. |
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The very thing I like about the AR is also what makes me crazy. They are so easy to maintain and modify that some folks just go hog wild. I'm a Keep It Simple Stupid kind of guy when it comes to working guns. My duty guns are a bone-stock 1911 Colt, a pump shotgun, and a J-frame S&W. When you start hanging doo dads and goodies on them, you increase the complexity and spare parts logistical challenges. Simplicity is the beauty of an AR. I just can't see mixing things up with parts and calibers that really don't give that much more of and edge. I guess my A1 upper with a 16 inch barrel and a collapsible stock and an Israeli style sling just isn't as sexy as some but it's reliable and hard to get out of whack. I don't want to even have to think about what upper I've got and whether this set of optics is optimum for that round. I just want a gun that hits dead on with a zero at 25 meters. I want one zero, one ammo type, one mag type. If my AR isn't up to the job at hand, then I'm probably in way over my head. J. |
This has never happened to me I have plenty or Lowers though. Not rocket science. I have NEVER Broken an AR Lower or an M-16 Lower. I have never LOST an AR lower.... Anyway I have a 22 conversion kit Two different 9mm uppers an Oly and a CMMG with the CMMG I use promags and have not had a problem. the mags are not expensive at all. the Oly uses STEN mags and they are cheap, I modify them myself just milling a small slot for the stock Mag Catch. Multiple 5.56 Uppers and Such.  I built these for a customer a while back.  I am not saying that all I have are AR Types, I have two AK types, one SKS, Mauser Bolt Guns, 300 Wm, 308 in the Form of an M1A, Soon a FAL, and a bunch of other weapons. But the most versatile weapons platform if you can have only one is the AR. I am not saying that I only stock or keep AR types but I do have a few of them. |
I'm also guessing you've never been in a true SHTF situation with one either though. I'm not saying it's likely, but we are talking about dealing with worst case scenarios. At best you lose flexibility, at worst you lose the use of the uppers entirely. Having back ups just makes good sense, especially when lowers are so inexpensive. |
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The problem with multiple calibers is you need an entire new upper - and at that point for a few hundred more dollars you can buy a lower, and then you have two rifles. This is the M.O. of black rifle disease, but it kind of defeats the discussion at hand of a "versatile" rifle. To me it is not versatile if you pick up another gun. Sure there are advantages with same manual of arms and the like, but its not quite what I think. I think the MRP style uppers and the MGI AR's are really where the AR platform shines. A 22 bolt is easy enough conversion, but when you want big game, you are going to need a new barrel and bolt. When/if such things like a quick change 458 socom or 50 beo barrels become available for these platforms, then it becomes much easier to have ONE rifle with a 556 barrel, a 22 bolt and a big bore barrel and bolt that would cover all needs. |
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I think so, in light of those new uppers that allow you to change the magazine well. If it'll preform well and be strong, I think that'd be the ideal, as you can use normal AK magazines. I wouldn't want to carry the stuff to switch calibers on my back for a bug out, though. |
I think we agree.  On point #2, I was referring to the AR15. On point #3, I wasn't saying I'm opposed to having additional uppers. What I do think is a bit silly is having 5.56 NATO, 6.5 Grendel, 6.8 SPC, 7.62x39, 9mm, 10mm, and .45 ACP uppers, as well as a suitable load out of magazines and ammo for each. |
You don't need to change magwells if you stick to 5.56mm, 22LR and 450 socom or 50 beo. Just the barrel and bolts. You would need: 1 extra barrel 2 extra bolts That isn't a lot of extra stuff to have around, hell you could hump it if need be. |
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I don't think it's realistic to think you can carry an AR and have extra uppers in the event that you need big bore power like .458 SOCOM or .450 Bushmaster. If you actually needed the power for something, would you just stop, open your bag, find the upper/mags, put the 5.56 upper/mags in your bag.... It would be better to have something like a shotgun with slugs and ghost ring sights. It would be ideal if you just had someone with you that was carrying a shotgun or big bore AR/rifle so you wouldn't have to chose. Anyway, .22Lr, .223, slugs, .270, these are all rounds that can be found almost anywhere. You're not going to find resupply of 6.8 or any of those big bore cartriges. That's just my opinion. I wouldn't want to be messing with my rifle when I should be aiming it. |
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I agree the ar15 is the most versatile, but why all the specialty calibers? Get an ar15 or two or three in 5.56, and an ar10 or two and be done with it. That said I am considering getting a 9mm for plinking cause I cant afford .223, so I will just shut up now. ETA: AFSOC after looking at those rifles you built now I want some colored furniture. |
And what weapon would not fall to this scenario? AK? What? You lose it well, you lost it, damage it and it is scrap... there is no weapon that this would not happen with so the argument is moot. Not even a viable issue. Yep those do look nice the customer needed them to match and wanted OD, One in the rack is one of his own carbines that I just rebuilt. The Rest are new. They are typically used in an Austere environment, in combat type situations. |
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Paveway, the reason I suggest that using the lower I mentioned is the fact that you can use common magazine and common rounds. .50 Beowulf isn't something you can find everywhere, hence I'm leery of relying on it for anything important. You can argue that you can stock up on these specialty calibers and not worry about resupplying at walmart or the local gun shop, but it's rather costly and if you loose it, well, you're screwed. It's much more plausable to find AK magazines and 762x39 than 6.8 or those special magazines you need to use 762x39 in regular ARs. |
Personally I have AR-15's and AR-10's and I call it good. I'm merely responding to the idea that One basic rifle can cover all needs as being a verstile platform. If you buy the necessary equip, the AR fits this bill.... |
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Picture yourself on either side of this scenario: With all the ARs, AKs, and SKS out there, when the SHTF, there will be plenty available for the taking. No matter how many of what you have, a single shot from a lone deer hunter with a hungry family could end you days as a former ARFcom member. Just as important, if not more so, is to have a lot more knowledge on how not to be on the receiving end than how to use all those rifles you've acquired. IMO a bolt action is as much offensive as an AR is defensive. You should have one of each in every caliber you have your ARs in. |
this is what some folks over look here in interweb land. Think of it this way. How many here or else where do you see " ill grab my AR becuase if i gotta make a hit out at XXXX yrds..." i want accuracy. Here's a lil hint, ever try hitting that target at xxxx yrds while under fire? Wanna try it...set up a target at that magical xxxyrds. Now you'll need some help. get off that bench rest,, and behind cover think that your actually beging shot at. Now here's where you help comes in,,he's gonna be shooting at you with an airsoft, and maybe better tossing other shit at you,everytime you move from behind that cover! i'll lay $$ down you wont hit that target every dam time. You porlly wont hit it at all if your buddy sits it up and doesnt let you see where its at 1st! whats this have to do with the "lone deer hunter"..... at 200yrds a guy in camo your not gonna see,plain and simple. unless your sitting there glassin the AO all damn day long. which you cant do! So that "bubba" with his 80yr old mosin 91/30 will say " damn i hungry as hell, that guys got a fire going, and a BIG pot of food on it,,hell look at that fancy rifle,, sure'd like that more than ole betsy here....." WHOOOmmmpPPPhhhhh.......... that fancy plate carrier you got rated to stop 762x54r or 7.92 , 06,270 or 300wsm(rum winmag etc)? i mean you do plan on wearing it 24/7 during shtf right, while you work, sleep,cook,shit,,hunt zombies with out fear???? so while crusty ole bolt guns or deer rifles may not be the answer to 0-35yrd room clearing sexy shooting, they do have their place in a shtf plan for some folks..... AR with 13 upper and 13 lowers? unless there are pre stocked at your BOL, your SOL,, and i know for a fact most here wont be able to hump the extra weight and parts associated with that on top of their normal gear IF they had to bug out from their dream home in downtown suburbia! pick a rifle you trust 100% , have the spare parts that "may" break, and go with it, but having 20 diff calibers and the need for 30 different parts( more to lose, more to break, more to stock) just to justify modulairty is senseless,,, \IMHO the $$ is better spent on one rifle set up you trust, and training for that rifle. |
I agree, but I am not the one advocating what basically amounts to a single rifle. |
very true. Like many before me has said. "The right tool for the right job." To me my AR is a defensive/offensive weapon. While you could use the AR for hunting(shot placement being key) it only fills the DEF/OFF in my arsenal. I have a shotgun, a .22lr and an 8mm for hunting. |