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Posted: 3/4/2010 10:49:25 AM EDT
Actually, 3

The lessons:
1. If you suspect a mechanical problem, fix it NOW! Don't think 'she'll be right' and drive it out of town on a lark

2. There are few situations more stressful than being unexpectedly stranded miles from home with a tired, hungry toddler and a tired, hungry, hormonal wife. There is no such thing as too much preparation for this.

3. There is no such substitute for practical mechanical experience. Do as much of your own maintenance as possible now in the good times to save you money. In the bad times it might save your life.

The story:
Been hearing a strange rattle in the BOV for a while. We took it to the mechanic to fix an unrelated problem, he heard the rattle and said that we should have that looked at, but that it probably wasn't much to worry  about, so we book it in for the following Tuesday.

Wife's birthday rolls on the Saturday and  I decide to go for a drive into the countryside to visit a winery for the day. We get there, have fun, visit a pretty local lake and start driving home. About 100km from home, the tacho dies and the charge light comes on. I pull over and have a look and don't see anything wrong. I call the auto club and wait for them to turn up. As its about 5pm, the rugrat is getting hungry. Feeling very proud of myself for packing supplies, I crack out the crackers and fruit cup and proceed to feed her. Or try to- she turns her nose up. By this time Mrs Lert is also getting tired and hungry, and very much over the hungry, whining 1 year old, and concerned about it getting dark. Much crankiness ensues, the auto club turn up eventually, pronounces a the water pump dead, tows the BOV to the depot in another town and we go home via taxi, train and lift from my sister, arriving after 9pm with the rugrat still awake and in total meltdown, with the wife not far behind.

A couple of days later I get a call from the depot saying that the new water pump, 2 belts and 2 bearings are going to set me back $750! I have no choice but to pay it, and take the 1.5 hrs train trip to the garage to pick it up. The mechanic then says that the alternator is on its way out, the the OEM part (he couldn't find an aftermarket part) from land rover will cost $1k. I said I'd take my chances, and drove home. 10km out of town and the alternator dies. Being a diesel , this is not an immediate emergency, however driving a car 100km from home, in the blinding rain in rush hour traffic with just the battery to run things is not fun.

The punchline:
I called around for a new alternator to fit myself, found an OEM one for $385 (yeah, I know, still expensive but the cheapest out there) and I could have gotten an after market water pump for $99 had I just done the job myself in the driveway.

Feel free to add any extra lessons
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 10:52:47 AM EDT
What kind of vehicle is this?
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 10:54:45 AM EDT
Quoted:
What kind of vehicle is this?


OP said it was a Taco.

Glad to see you were at least partially prepared. Pack some booze for the wife next time.
And good on you for not letting them rip you off and you getting the parts yourself.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 11:04:06 AM EDT
Quoted:
Quoted:
What kind of vehicle is this?


OP said it was a Taco.

Glad to see you were at least partially prepared. Pack some booze for the wife next time.
And good on you for not letting them rip you off and you getting the parts yourself.


Um no The tacho dies = the tachometer stopped functioning

OP said he needed an OEM alternator for a Land Rover
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 11:16:58 AM EDT
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
What kind of vehicle is this?


OP said it was a Taco.

Glad to see you were at least partially prepared. Pack some booze for the wife next time.
And good on you for not letting them rip you off and you getting the parts yourself.


Um no The tacho dies = the tachometer stopped functioning

OP said he needed an OEM alternator for a Land Rover


damn your superior reading abilities.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 11:20:36 AM EDT
Sorry, I should have mentioned it

It's a 1997 Landrover Discovery Series 1, with the 300tdi diesel engine. Its the last of the Discos where it doesn't matter if the electronics clap out.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 11:22:44 AM EDT
Lert, I think you did ok.  I understand how it can be with a baby and wife.  You got home that day and you were only tired.  A good sleep will buff that right out.

Realistically the items that might have abated the meltdown would have been food for the wife, and getting the baby to eat sooner.  

Don't kick yourself about the mechanicals, just try to keep the BOV in the best condition that you can.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 11:28:10 AM EDT
Quoted:
Quoted:
What kind of vehicle is this?


OP said it was a Taco.

Glad to see you were at least partially prepared. Pack some booze for the wife next time.
And good on you for not letting them rip you off and you getting the parts yourself.


<making furious notes> Get booze for wife </making furious notes>

Do we have to be stranded for that?

I was shocked by the cost the small town mechanic was charging. He seemed like a nice enough guy, but was up to his eyeballs with work and had no experience sourcing Land Rover parts from anyone but Land Rover (always a terrible mistake). Not too many Land Rovers around there it seems. Lots of Holdens and Toyotas though. I'm actually wondering if there was anything wrong with the water pump. The alternator sits underneath it, and was making a terrible racket just before it died so that could have been the problem all along. He did say it was shot when he took it out...
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 11:34:30 AM EDT
Quoted:
Lert, I think you did ok.  I understand how it can be with a baby and wife.  You got home that day and you were only tired.  A good sleep will buff that right out.

Realistically the items that might have abated the meltdown would have been food for the wife, and getting the baby to eat sooner.  

Don't kick yourself about the mechanicals, just try to keep the BOV in the best condition that you can.


Thanks. The wife ate alot of the crackers, but it wasn't enough. I'm putting together a proper car kit as soon as I get the alternator replaced and food will be a major component.

The thing that I didn't mention was that the Chilean earthquake happened while we were stuck on the side of the road, and we didn't hear the tsunami warning until the next morning, just before it was due to hit us. Fortunately, it only turned out to be a 6 inch wave, but had it turned out to be the real thing (and were right in the firing line) we might have been in trouble.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 11:35:36 AM EDT
Doubletap
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 12:07:51 PM EDT
Charge light indicates voltage problem.  Alternator.  Car dies while driving its an alternator problem, car won't start it's a battery (possibly also an alternator failing to charge said battery)


I'm willing to bet there wasn't a thing wrong with the waterpump.


When water pumps go bad, they are either leaking, or the engine is overheating.  If that belt is turning so it the water pump.


Belts are a maintnenace item, there is no such thing as a one-use belt, so it must have already been cracking pretty bad, or he doesn't know how to work on cars and had to cut it off with the added bonus of getting to bill you more and replace them.  They should be changed at regular intervals and inspected every time you change the oil.



Being a car guy, a lot of maintenance and repair stuff I take for granted after building several cars from the ground up.  

The easiest way to learn is by doing it and learning as you go.  


Car kit should be very comprehensive with tools-  metric and standard wrenches and sockets, pliers, vice grips, screw drivers, hammers, some wire, wire nuts, wire strippers, wheel spinner, spare bottle jack in addition to the trucks scissors jack, pretty much an entry level tool kit.  I also carry an oil filter, fuel filter (doubly important for a diesel), a spare wiper blade, oil, fix a flat for last ditch effort or if I manage to get two flats, (remember to check your spares inflation regularly), tire patch kit, zip ties, duct tape, road flares, etc.

In my BoB which stays in the truck, I have 3 MRE's, some freeze dried mountain house from the camping store, breakfast/protein bars, etc. And water.  The water gets rotated out monthly in the summer and the MRE's after 2 months.  Rotation is important with the high temperatures cars get.






Link Posted: 3/4/2010 12:45:26 PM EDT
Quoted:
Charge light indicates voltage problem.  Alternator.  Car dies while driving its an alternator problem, car won't start it's a battery (possibly also an alternator failing to charge said battery)


I'm willing to bet there wasn't a thing wrong with the waterpump.


When water pumps go bad, they are either leaking, or the engine is overheating.  If that belt is turning so it the water pump.


Belts are a maintnenace item, there is no such thing as a one-use belt, so it must have already been cracking pretty bad, or he doesn't know how to work on cars and had to cut it off with the added bonus of getting to bill you more and replace them.  They should be changed at regular intervals and inspected every time you change the oil.



Being a car guy, a lot of maintenance and repair stuff I take for granted after building several cars from the ground up.  

The easiest way to learn is by doing it and learning as you go.  









The series 1 discos had a problem in that by the time your temp gauge registers that you're over heating, you've already slagged down your pistons. You can fix this by fitting a $50 after market EGT sensor, which I intend to do ASAP, but given that the water pump was 6 years old, and knowing about the temp gauge problem, and that I wasn't in a position to 2nd guess the mechanic (100 + km away sitting at my desk at work) I didn't see that I had many options. That said, the pump wasn't leaking, and the temp gauge was completely normal, so I tend to agree with you.

The belt was going to be replaced a couple of days later at the next service as it was getting on, so I'm not so worried about that.

I've done basic servicing stuff on my cars before, but nothing major. The alternator will be the first major part I've changed out myself, but looking at the workshop manual its just 2 bolts, 2 belts and 2 leads, so it doesn't look too taxing. Under the terms of the warranty on the vehicle we need to have it serviced in a garage, but stuff like this I want to do myself, both to save money and to learn. I'd actually like to build the disco up into a proper BOV/expedition vehicle myself. It'll be a good project.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 1:20:52 PM EDT
You could have probably replaced  a 14 dollar pair of  BEARINGS in the alternator two weeks ago, when the  "funny rattling noise" was first apparent.
In your own driveway.
Sorry.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 1:21:34 PM EDT
Lert, make friends with a good mechanic.  If you must have the BOV repaired at a garage under the terms of the warranty, then have the BOV serviced that way.  I would not want you to break a contract.  If you are able to take care of some things yourself so that they are never broken in an unscheduled way then you are your own warranty.

The alternator should not be difficult.  As you said; 2 bolts, 2 wires, and 2 belts.  Consider also the battery and battery cables (leads in ozspeak?), are these items getting old too?  If so this would be a good time to take care of them while you have the bonnet open.

If you like fixing things you will find that autos are not taxing to work on––they can be dirty though, got soap?
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 1:38:20 PM EDT
When your altenator goes out wack it with a hammer.  A stoner taught me this and I was like but had nothing to lose when mine went out so I did it.  It lasted another year, next time my headlites started to dim I did it again.  I got 3 additional years out of that altenator.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 8:00:46 PM EDT
Quoted:
You could have probably replaced  a 14 dollar pair of  BEARINGS in the alternator two weeks ago, when the  "funny rattling noise" was first apparent.
In your own driveway.
Sorry.


you're most probably right. When I get the new one in there I'll pull the dead one apart and check it out. I'll fix it up, then I'll have a spare. Two is one and all that.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 8:08:32 PM EDT
Quoted:
Lert, make friends with a good mechanic.  If you must have the BOV repaired at a garage under the terms of the warranty, then have the BOV serviced that way.  I would not want you to break a contract.  If you are able to take care of some things yourself so that they are never broken in an unscheduled way then you are your own warranty.

The alternator should not be difficult.  As you said; 2 bolts, 2 wires, and 2 belts.  Consider also the battery and battery cables (leads in ozspeak?), are these items getting old too?  If so this would be a good time to take care of them while you have the bonnet open.

If you like fixing things you will find that autos are not taxing to work on––they can be dirty though, got soap?


Fortunately it only needs to be serviced at a mechanics, and I get free labour on that for a year. Its a 3 year warranty. the warranty company doesn't need to know about other repairs.
The battery is 2 weeks old, but through leads look original, so replacing them is probably a good idea.

I don't mind the dirt and I want to know how to do my own mechanical work. As Heinlan said, 'specialization is for insects'.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 8:52:16 PM EDT
Sounds good

You sound as though this is your first kid.  Donne3, Ops, TomJefferson, Protus, Forrest, Frozenny, CJan_NH, rusteerooster, tayous1, and I have kids.  Though we don't get into parenting advise much i would like to touch on how your kid ate.  I going to take it on faith that you put good food before your child and that you are attentive to any possible allergy issues.

Step 1––Do not allow your child to throw food on the floor as part of her rejection behavior.
Step 2––Do allow her to say no and do not argue with her (Hint you have a long term plan dad and you are teaching your child to be a decisive problem solver)
Step 3––When she says no respond with "ok honey stay here and be good company at the table, you can have a bite if you are hungry)
Step 4––Eat your own dinner in peace
Step 5––Watch the baby's food transform from yuk to yum in about 90 seconds

YMMV, but mine aint starved yet

Post apocalyptic kiddie carriage in spring camo print


Bike trailer and JR4


JR1 towing JR4––he thinks he's turbocharged she hollering "too fast"


JR1 and JR3––My spring project is to get her off training wheels


JR2


The 22-400 BOV



Welcome to the SF  

If you wish to post a pic of the Disco that'd be cool
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 9:55:25 PM EDT
Quoted:
Sounds good

You sound as though this is your first kid.  Donne3, Ops, TomJefferson, Protus, Forrest, Frozenny, CJan_NH, rusteerooster, tayous1, and I have kids.  Though we don't get into parenting advise much i would like to touch on how your kid ate.  I going to take it on faith that you put good food before your child and that you are attentive to any possible allergy issues.

Step 1––Do not allow your child to throw food on the floor as part of her rejection behavior.
Step 2––Do allow her to say no and do not argue with her (Hint you have a long term plan dad and you are teaching your child to be a decisive problem solver)
Step 3––When she says no respond with "ok honey stay here and be good company at the table, you can have a bite if you are hungry)
Step 4––Eat your own dinner in peace
Step 5––Watch the baby's food transform from yuk to yum in about 90 seconds

YMMV, but mine aint starved yet

Post apocalyptic kiddie carriage in spring camo print
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u142/PA22-400/CIMG0924jokers.jpg

Bike trailer and JR4
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u142/PA22-400/CIMG0880.jpg

JR1 towing JR4––he thinks he's turbocharged she hollering "too fast"
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u142/PA22-400/CIMG0846.jpg

JR1 and JR3––My spring project is to get her off training wheels
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u142/PA22-400/CIMG0878.jpg

JR2
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u142/PA22-400/CIMG0853.jpg

The 22-400 BOV
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u142/PA22-400/CIMG1225.jpg


Welcome to the SF  

If you wish to post a pic of the Disco that'd be cool


That's sound advice. Yep, she's our first, and an adventurous, head-strong, decisive one at that. The food is always good (she's never eaten junk food) and there's no allergies as yet. She did start throwing food on the ground at about 9 months, but a short course of smacks on the hand cured her of that. Now she either puts the food in a neat pile to one side of her plate, or hands it back when its finger food. (she can't say 'no' yet) If she doesn't want it, we don't force the issue. We might try different food at a later point, but generally she gets what she's given, and generally she eats it. I put the eating issues in this instance down to her fatigue and our stress, not to mention the unusual setting.

You have a fine-looking family there, and I'm always on the lookout for good advice. I'll post pics when I get home.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 9:58:40 PM EDT
for $750 sounds like a pretty decent price for something like that here in the states depending on the vehicle.  

Generally you're losing your ass paying for labor, and more importantly diagnostics.

If you're doing your own maintenance, you'll not only be saving money on labor but you'll also learn your way around your vehicle.  You'll notice a leaking radiator hose before it completely ruptures, a corroded ground cable, etc. etc.  That way even if you can't fix it yourself, you'll save the $100 diagnostic fee because you'll know the exact problem when you pull in
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 10:04:34 PM EDT
Seriously, you have a fucking land rover as a bov?

SErisouly?

THe BIGGEST Piece of shit reliability wise on the fucking planet.  Ever heard the joke: Why don't the Brits make computers? 'Cause they haven't found a way to make them leak oil yet.


Really, i don't think there is a worse suv out there for reliabilty that anyone who can afford a land rover, let alone fixing one couldn't buy.

Get a better car man, your family is worth it.

TXL


that's the fucking lesson
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 10:24:23 PM EDT
Great

PA story time

When our oldest girl was beginning the "terrible twos" we would tell her that she was two and tired, and to relax and take a nap.  So a few months of this pattern go by.....  Then one day we were at the largest grocery store in town, and she got tired.  So I'm carrying the infant in the bassinet and holding the 2yo by the hand....  the 2yo yells in crying voice at 110 decibels "I'm two and I'm tired"....  half the people in the store watched us walk out––me laughing her crying.  She took a nap in the BOV.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 10:30:19 PM EDT
Quoted:
Seriously, you have a fucking land rover as a bov?

SErisouly?

THe BIGGEST Piece of shit reliability wise on the fucking planet.  Ever heard the joke: Why don't the Brits make computers? 'Cause they haven't found a way to make them leak oil yet.


Really, i don't think there is a worse suv out there for reliabilty that anyone who can afford a land rover, let alone fixing one couldn't buy.

Get a better car man, your family is worth it.

TXL


that's the fucking lesson


TXL, the OP is in Australia, but you already noticed that.  I bet a Suburban like mine would be as difficult to maintain there as the Disco is here.  Now if Lert were to get a Hilux Surf(UK name) / 4Runner(US name) we'd probably cheer him on.


Link Posted: 3/4/2010 10:35:08 PM EDT
Quoted:
Seriously, you have a fucking land rover as a bov?

SErisouly?

THe BIGGEST Piece of shit reliability wise on the fucking planet.  Ever heard the joke: Why don't the Brits make computers? 'Cause they haven't found a way to make them leak oil yet.


Really, i don't think there is a worse suv out there for reliabilty that anyone who can afford a land rover, let alone fixing one couldn't buy.

Get a better car man, your family is worth it.

TXL


that's the fucking lesson


Like everything else, depends on the vehicle. I have the complete service history for this one, and know that its been well looked after, and reliable. The (few) problems that I've had with this one are age-related, rather than make related. I've had similar issues with similar-aged toyotas. I did my research before I bought it, and am confident in this particular year-model. I also got a 3 year warranty to cover anything major (which I would have done for the Landcruiser Prado that we were thinking for getting). Later models had a few issues, but they also have significantly more computerized ignition systems, which ruled them out.

Landrovers are fairly common here, and if you know where to look, parts are comparable in price to other makes. I'm comfortable with my decision.
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 10:58:58 PM EDT
Quoted:
Great

PA story time

When our oldest girl was beginning the "terrible twos" we would tell her that she was two and tired, and to relax and take a nap.  So a few months of this pattern go by.....  Then one day we were at the largest grocery store in town, and she got tired.  So I'm carrying the infant in the bassinet and holding the 2yo by the hand....  the 2yo yells in crying voice at 110 decibels "I'm two and I'm tired"....  half the people in the store watched us walk out––me laughing her crying.  She took a nap in the BOV.


Thats awesome. "Tired and Two". I'll remember that. In out case it's "One and Weary"
Link Posted: 3/4/2010 11:50:08 PM EDT
Quoted:
Quoted:
Seriously, you have a fucking land rover as a bov?

SErisouly?

THe BIGGEST Piece of shit reliability wise on the fucking planet.  Ever heard the joke: Why don't the Brits make computers? 'Cause they haven't found a way to make them leak oil yet.


Really, i don't think there is a worse suv out there for reliabilty that anyone who can afford a land rover, let alone fixing one couldn't buy.

Get a better car man, your family is worth it.

TXL


that's the fucking lesson


TXL, the OP is in Australia, but you already noticed that.  I bet a Suburban like mine would be as difficult to maintain there as the Disco is here.  Now if Lert were to get a Hilux Surf(UK name) / 4Runner(US name) we'd probably cheer him on.




You're right. Proper American cars (as opposed to the local Holdens and Fords) are hideously expensive to buy and maintain. Back when they sold Suburbans here (they discontinued them about 5 years ago) the base model went for something like $80k. Base model Ford F-250s went for $60k, and $85k for the good ones. They've only just started selling Jeeps here again, and they're not cheap, and neither are the parts. Also, compared to say, Japanese cars, American ones a very powerful, and consequently, very thirsty. Fuel is much more expensive over here, not as bad as the UK, but still not that cheap, so are hard to run. This particular model of Discovery is common, and gets about 30mpg (the petrol one is crazy bad on fuel economy, but the diesel is very good) so is cheap to run.

Mind you, if you think I'm mad for buying an LR, you're going hate it when I say I sold a dual cab diesel Hilux to buy it. In my defence, it wasn't voluntary. I took a pay cut and couldn't afford the repayments on the Hilux, and my wife couldn't drive a manual vehicle, so we had to trade it, and the Disco was the result. The repayments are half what they were with the Hilux, and my wife can drive it, so it makes more sense. Price comparable Toyotas and Nissans had many more KMs on them and were in worse condition.

I went from this


To this



For a truck of its age its in very good condition, no rust, engine's good, and it solved several logistical problems. I'm going to join the local Land Rover owners club and learn how to get the best out of it. As much as I miss my Hilux, which was a better BOV, I comfortable with the Disco.
Link Posted: 3/5/2010 12:02:11 AM EDT
Quick edit your post and take out all talk of the other BOV before you get burned at the stake for having made such a trade.

When you said that the American BOV's were thirsty I was going to say that my Suburban was rated as good as or better than the Land Rovers of the same year, but you addressed that by getting a diesel.

Both those rigs are good looking.  I hope to be doing a few more BOV threads soon.  I'm waiting on the parts and a sunny day.
Link Posted: 3/5/2010 12:21:51 AM EDT
Quoted:
Quick edit your post and take out all talk of the other BOV before you get burned at the stake for having made such a trade.

When you said that the American BOV's were thirsty I was going to say that my Suburban was rated as good as or better than the Land Rovers of the same year, but you addressed that by getting a diesel.

Both those rigs are good looking.  I hope to be doing a few more BOV threads soon.  I'm waiting on the parts and a sunny day.


LOL, I know what you mean. I REALLY didn't want to get rid of it. It was brilliant. Built like a tank, carried 1 tonne in the tray (bed), massive ground clearance, 4 wheel drive, easy to work on, etc. It took my wife 6 months to convince me that selling it was the right thing to do. She was stuck at home with a baby traveling on public tranport, and I was only driving to work 3 days a week ( I took the bus the other 2). I reasoned that she wouldn't get enough use out of it driving 2 days a week to justify trading the Hilux in, and that we'd save up and buy her her own car. Then I got a new job where I caught the bus to work and, well, couldn't justify a car that only I could drive, esp with the repayments, so in the end I gave in to common sense.

I decided when I was looking to buy the Hilux that diesel was the only way to go. The 2.7L V6 Hilux would have cost too much to run, and the 3.8L V8 that a very nice Discovery had would have bankrupted us. Even the guy at the car yard said that its the only vehicle that he's ever driven where you can watch the fuel gauge fall as you drive.

What is your BOV? We don't have those here.
Link Posted: 3/5/2010 12:46:59 AM EDT
Quoted:
Seriously, you have a fucking land rover as a bov?

SErisouly?

THe BIGGEST Piece of shit reliability wise on the fucking planet.  Ever heard the joke: Why don't the Brits make computers? 'Cause they haven't found a way to make them leak oil yet.


Really, i don't think there is a worse suv out there for reliabilty that anyone who can afford a land rover, let alone fixing one couldn't buy.

Get a better car man, your family is worth it.

TXL


that's the fucking lesson


+1

Seriously though...Land rover?

Isn't Isuzu over there?  

Link Posted: 3/5/2010 1:05:46 AM EDT
Quoted:
Quoted:
Seriously, you have a fucking land rover as a bov?

SErisouly?

THe BIGGEST Piece of shit reliability wise on the fucking planet.  Ever heard the joke: Why don't the Brits make computers? 'Cause they haven't found a way to make them leak oil yet.


Really, i don't think there is a worse suv out there for reliabilty that anyone who can afford a land rover, let alone fixing one couldn't buy.

Get a better car man, your family is worth it.

TXL


that's the fucking lesson


+1

Seriously though...Land rover?

Isn't Isuzu over there?  



1997 Holden Jackaroo (really a re-badged Isuzu something or other)


Fairly reliable, fairly cheap, and get it within 50km of the coast and it'll rust away to nothing while you sleep. They don't have the best reputation here. Good engines, not so good body.
Link Posted: 3/5/2010 3:27:42 AM EDT
My BOV is a 1999 Chevy Suburban.
Seats for 8
34 cubic feet of cargo room.
5.7L V8 petrol
Automatic overdrive
Autotrac 4x4––allows 2wd, all wheel drive, 4x4 hi, and 4x4 low.
limited slip rear differential
152L fuel tank, this allows me to drive without watching the gas gauge move.
Dual heater and air-conditioner.

These BOVs have gotten better fuel economy than the Land Rovers here for the last 25 years.  Really it is just a bit bigger than the Range Rover.  So a Suburban is like having a Range Rover with 10% more free in the box.
Link Posted: 3/5/2010 4:18:35 AM EDT
Quoted:
My BOV is a 1999 Chevy Suburban.
Seats for 8
34 cubic feet of cargo room.
5.7L V8 petrol
Automatic overdrive
Autotrac 4x4––allows 2wd, all wheel drive, 4x4 hi, and 4x4 low.
limited slip rear differential
152L fuel tank, this allows me to drive without watching the gas gauge move.
Dual heater and air-conditioner.

These BOVs have gotten better fuel economy than the Land Rovers here for the last 25 years.  Really it is just a bit bigger than the Range Rover.  So a Suburban is like having a Range Rover with 10% more free in the box.


Suburban, right. You mentioned a bunch of numbers before, which is why I didn't get it. We used to have them here. You still see them around occasionally. They're impressive looking vehicles, about the same size as a Land Cruiser 75 Troopie but wider, and not as tall. What are they like off-road?

The petrol (gas) powered Land Rovers are notoriously thirsty vehicles. In fact petrol-powered 4wds in general are cost too much for me to run. As nice as it would be to have the power, I wouldn't touch one. Personally, if I didn't have to listen to my wife ( who says they're too big and won't drive one) I'd have gotten a turbo-diesel Toyota Landcruiser 60-series


or 80-series


The Land Rover's an experiment. Its a 4wd that my wife is happy to drive, that we can afford to buy and run, which is a good compromise. We'll keep it for a few years and see how it goes. From what I've read you need to be on the ball with scheduled maintainance, unlike a Toyota, which you can usually get away with neglecting more before something major breaks. If you do that you have few problems. Thats ok, because I intend to be proactive about it. We'll see.

You mentioned before that you're planning another BOV thread but are waiting on parts. What are you looking at doing?
Link Posted: 3/5/2010 5:57:28 AM EDT
<––-my name

Ok 22-400 is us PA, MA, JR1, JR2, JR3, and JR4

The Suburban is a bit longer than the Land Cruiser 75.  The easy way to see the difference is in the rear door.  The rear door of the Cruiser has the lower corner cutout for the rear tire.  The Suburban rear door is a rectangle, and the rear tire is completely aft of the door.  

This extra length in the Suburban allows for three rows of seats and 34 cubic feet of cargo.  Having 8 seats gives us the ability to invite a guest along with the 6 of us.  

In your OP you used the train to get home.  Here I would have had to call a friend because there is no affordable train service.

Originally Posted By Mrs Lert:
It is too big and I won't drive one


But but but .. ya'll have road trains there!

MA gets grumpy when I talk of something smaller than the Suburban
Link Posted: 3/5/2010 11:11:19 AM EDT
Quoted:
<––-my name

Ok 22-400 is us PA, MA, JR1, JR2, JR3, and JR4

The Suburban is a bit longer than the Land Cruiser 75.  The easy way to see the difference is in the rear door.  The rear door of the Cruiser has the lower corner cutout for the rear tire.  The Suburban rear door is a rectangle, and the rear tire is completely aft of the door.  

This extra length in the Suburban allows for three rows of seats and 34 cubic feet of cargo.  Having 8 seats gives us the ability to invite a guest along with the 6 of us.  

In your OP you used the train to get home.  Here I would have had to call a friend because there is no affordable train service.

Originally Posted By Mrs Lert:
It is too big and I won't drive one


But but but .. ya'll have road trains there!

MA gets grumpy when I talk of something smaller than the Suburban


Gotcha.

All that cargo capacity'd be handy. The Disco's a 7 seater, if you count the 2 inward facing jump seats in the back. No good for adults for any length of time, but we figured there'd be kids' friends to haul around eventually and they'd go ok in there.

With the landcruiser 75 you could set it up as an 11- seater, but your passengers would sit on inward facing benches, so not ideal for family outings. The 60/80/100/200 series do come in 7-seat  varieties, but you lose all your cargo space.

We were lucky where we broke down. We were just in range of the auto club, and about 30 km from the suburban rail line, so the auto club towed the disco back to their depot, which is at the very end of the rail line, and we caught a taxi to the nearest train station. Had we broken down 10 minutes earlier it would have been a different story. Our auto club membership wouldn't have covered us that far out (its due for renewal, so I'm upgrading it) and we'd have to have paid for a part of the towing @ $6.60 a km. Fortunately, where we we stopped we were just within the 40km free tow to depot radius.

My wife's not a fan of big vehicles- Discovery/Prado/Hilux size is about as big as she's comfortable with. She's worried about maneuvering them in tight spaces like car parks. On the road, she hates semi-trailers, esp. the big B-doubles. One tried to run her off the road a few years back and she hasn't liked them since. Never come across a road train though. They only really operate in remote areas, like central Australia. There's no real need for them here where there's plenty of infrastructure.
Link Posted: 3/5/2010 11:52:30 AM EDT
Some of my favorite mods

gaint ice chest––152 quarts


bike rack


roof top cargo box
Link Posted: 3/5/2010 1:04:26 PM EDT
Why can't your wife drive a stick? does she have an injury etc?
Link Posted: 3/5/2010 1:12:40 PM EDT
Quoted:
Why can't your wife drive a stick? does she have an injury etc?


Sometimes it is cheaper to buy the automatic than fight the wife.  Getting her to drive a stick might not be worth the issues that it would create.
Link Posted: 3/5/2010 1:18:18 PM EDT
Quoted:
Quoted:
Why can't your wife drive a stick? does she have an injury etc?


Sometimes it is cheaper to buy the automatic than fight the wife.  Getting her to drive a stick might not be worth the issues that it would create.


That would suck- my wife wanted to learn to drive a stick when we started dating.
Link Posted: 3/6/2010 12:28:53 AM EDT
Quoted:
Quoted:
Why can't your wife drive a stick? does she have an injury etc?


Sometimes it is cheaper to buy the automatic than fight the wife.  Getting her to drive a stick might not be worth the issues that it would create.


This.

I taught her how to drive it, and was quite good at it while learning, but doesn't like it and finds it stressful, so won't do it. That's ok, I have a preference for large, 4wd vehicles. She's happy to drive one so long as its automatic, an not too big. Its a compromise that works for us. There's survival benefit in a marriage that works well
Link Posted: 3/6/2010 12:36:20 AM EDT
Oh, btw, I've just finished installing the new alternator. It took most of the day, mainly because of very tight bolts and not knowing how much force to use. I also had trouble getting the drive belt off and on, but now I know how to do it for next time. I took it for a drive afterward and it was perfect. Not a sound beyond the engine, and a good charge. A very successful enterprise.
Link Posted: 3/6/2010 2:23:55 AM EDT
Congratulations
Link Posted: 3/6/2010 6:08:56 AM EDT
Quoted:
Seriously, you have a fucking land rover as a bov?

SErisouly?

THe BIGGEST Piece of shit reliability wise on the fucking planet.  Ever heard the joke: Why don't the Brits make computers? 'Cause they haven't found a way to make them leak oil yet.


Really, i don't think there is a worse suv out there for reliabilty that anyone who can afford a land rover, let alone fixing one couldn't buy.

Get a better car man, your family is worth it.

TXL


that's the fucking lesson


+1000 Ive know multiple people who have owned them. I cant think of 1 that didnt have an absurde amount of problems. Mostly electrical. One friends range rover has wicked ghosts in it. all the rear light would randomly shut off along with the dash lights. The rest of the light would randomly go out but at seperate times. When that happened the air ride also dropped to parked level. One had the pin in the auto trans break or fall out and it rolled into his ooollldddd fully restored bentley. My Ex discovery used to just fucking stop running. IE driving and just like the key was shut off. Usually at night in the rain with no cell service. Her option was get rid of it or im torching it in the drive way.
Link Posted: 3/6/2010 10:15:22 AM EDT
Quoted:
Congratulations


Thanks!
Link Posted: 3/6/2010 10:50:47 AM EDT
Quoted:
Quoted:
Seriously, you have a fucking land rover as a bov?

SErisouly?

THe BIGGEST Piece of shit reliability wise on the fucking planet.  Ever heard the joke: Why don't the Brits make computers? 'Cause they haven't found a way to make them leak oil yet.


Really, i don't think there is a worse suv out there for reliabilty that anyone who can afford a land rover, let alone fixing one couldn't buy.

Get a better car man, your family is worth it.

TXL


that's the fucking lesson


+1000 Ive know multiple people who have owned them. I cant think of 1 that didnt have an absurde amount of problems. Mostly electrical. One friends range rover has wicked ghosts in it. all the rear light would randomly shut off along with the dash lights. The rest of the light would randomly go out but at seperate times. When that happened the air ride also dropped to parked level. One had the pin in the auto trans break or fall out and it rolled into his ooollldddd fully restored bentley. My Ex discovery used to just fucking stop running. IE driving and just like the key was shut off. Usually at night in the rain with no cell service. Her option was get rid of it or im torching it in the drive way.


Air suspension? That would make it a series II Discovery at least. According to my research, by the time my series I was built in '97 they'd ironed out most of the bugs, esp the electrical ones.  

They introduced the Series II in 1998, which had the autoleveling air suspension and a lot of electrical problems, like the ones you've mentioned. They don't apply to mine, because it doesn't have those systems. The few problems I've had in the 6 months we've had it are age-related, not make related. There hasn't been 1 fault that its had (and it hasn't had many, just the alternator, water pump (maybe) and the rear power window controller)  that I haven't had on similar-aged Toyotas (13 years and 172k km).

Yes, LRs do have a reputation for uneven quality, esp the North American Spec vehicles. Most negative reviews of this make are American, where as most positive ones are from the rest of the world that use the same or similar specs to the British. My guess is that in making them compliant with US law they didn't take enough care. The US was a minor market for them at the time. I don't know. I do know that there are tonne of these things running around over here with 200k - 300k km on them and covered in mud and off-road accessories, so they're reasonably popular with off-roaders despite the reputation. In fact, they're very popular with Brits doing the trek down the spine of Africa, and they do have the choice of turbodiesel, non-luxury model Hiluxs and Landcruisers.

Anyway, as I said, its both a compromise and an experiment. We'll see how we go.
Link Posted: 3/6/2010 1:40:40 PM EDT
I wish we had more diesel options in the US.

Imagine the potential of a diesel XJ....
Link Posted: 3/6/2010 3:41:30 PM EDT
Hey Lert, happy that the alternator replacement went well for you.  I understand that you are learning to repair your own BOV, so you have not been a mechanic for years.  I'd like to help you climb part of the learning curve, so you don't have to fight the whole assent alone.  

1) keep your credibility with the bride.  You can show her the estimate that the garage gave you for the repairs and then show your bill, so that she sees the value of the work you did.  

2) Get good tools.  I could tell yo brand names, but that is not really my message here.  You want tools that are easy to use.  Sometimes a detail as simple as a brand logo in the wrong place can make the tool terrible to use.  Go to the garage that you like and ask the mechanics if they would explain their tools to you.  You will find a mix of top brand and least expensive in their tool box.  Pay attention to the trend here.  If the mechanic has to hold that tool for an hour a day what brand, shape, type do they select?  If they use the tool for 10 minutes each 3 months what do they select and why.  Some good tools can make you go at the $$$, so this is where you need to educate yourself about where you need a top $$ tool or a least $$ tool.  This is where you need the credibility with darling Mrs Lert, so she sees the value of the tools that make self-service possible.

3)  Get good information.  You have the shop manual.  There are forums on the www.  There is the car and bike forum here, and you can ask us in the SF for help.  When I started there was no www forums and the tech manual read like; a) remove old part. b) install new part––difficult days.


Here is a tool kit that I built up for the other BOV we had

At the top is a Snap-On ratchet I hold the ratchet for the whole job so how the tool feel in my hand is very important.  A bad fit here can make a job impossible.  A bad fit here can cause long term physical damage requiring medical care that will far exceed the cost of a good tool.  DO NOT GIVE YOURSELF CARPAL TUNNEL INJURIES!  Carpal tunnel pain is unpleasant.  Not being able to hold your baby because your hands hurt is heartbreaking.  Do not go there.

The spanners are a mid grade set that feel good to me.  Feel good in the store, and feel good when your under the BOV pulling on the spanner with all your might––are two very different standards.  Notice that the spanners have no sharp edges where they are held hint hint.

The sockets are bargain store brand that grip the bolts well.  The bolt is inanimate and cannot get medical issues.  If the socket grips well then it will work fine.

This tool kit had all the needed tools to do any service that I was willing to do away from home.  In practical terms that meant that I would not be willing to change the transmission on the side of the road.  

The tool kit got moved into the red box and rode in our BOV.  Seating a family of six in the cabin the size of the one on your Hilux was very cozy.  We were so grateful when we were blessed to get the Suburban.



I hope this helps––cheers.





Link Posted: 3/6/2010 3:45:00 PM EDT
Quoted:
Oh, btw, I've just finished installing the new alternator. It took most of the day, mainly because of very tight bolts and not knowing how much force to use. I also had trouble getting the drive belt off and on, but now I know how to do it for next time. I took it for a drive afterward and it was perfect. Not a sound beyond the engine, and a good charge. A very successful enterprise.


Lert, congratulations.  I am an inveterate auto tinkerer myself, running a 93 Jeep XJ with the 4.0 inline six.  this thing is a fuel hog, not sure of how to convert to metric but it gets about 15 miles to a gallon of gasoline.  the "big One" is a full sized 01 Dodge 2500 4x4 diesel pickup truck. 19 mpg empty, 15 MPG towing the rig.  It's nice to know we will always have a bed to sleep in, no matter what.


All shiny, ready to go on our trip to New England in 07.


Returning fro northern Pennsylvania, Pine Creek Gorge.  "the Grand Canyon of the East"
typically dirty truck, I actually use it and we live in a VERY rural area.   the large young man is our 14 yr old old.

We can be out the door, and ready for 3 to 5 days out in about 30 minutes.  If we can find a water supply we are good for 14 days or so.  We keep the trailer stocked, just throw in a few perishables and some extra clothing, and down the road we go.
Link Posted: 3/6/2010 3:54:35 PM EDT
You know Ops that down in Oz they would hitch 4 cattle wagons to your Cummins and put a "Caution Road Train" banner on the bumper.

I'd do that here just to bother the tree huggers, but I don't need to spend time in the Martian County jail for violating length laws.
Link Posted: 3/6/2010 4:26:57 PM EDT
PA22, I've thought about it.  We like to take the ATVs if we can, and only one will fit in the truck.  I'm sorely tempted to bolt a ball hitch to the RV and tow my utility trailer behind it.  The Commonwealth frowns on it, it's only legal in a few states and they want the first trailer to be a 5th wheel or gooseneck.  

Ops
Link Posted: 3/7/2010 3:18:14 AM EDT
Quoted:
Hey Lert, happy that the alternator replacement went well for you.  I understand that you are learning to repair your own BOV, so you have not been a mechanic for years.  I'd like to help you climb part of the learning curve, so you don't have to fight the whole assent alone.  

1) keep your credibility with the bride.  You can show her the estimate that the garage gave you for the repairs and then show your bill, so that she sees the value of the work you did.  

2) Get good tools.  I could tell yo brand names, but that is not really my message here.  You want tools that are easy to use.  Sometimes a detail as simple as a brand logo in the wrong place can make the tool terrible to use.  Go to the garage that you like and ask the mechanics if they would explain their tools to you.  You will find a mix of top brand and least expensive in their tool box.  Pay attention to the trend here.  If the mechanic has to hold that tool for an hour a day what brand, shape, type do they select?  If they use the tool for 10 minutes each 3 months what do they select and why.  Some good tools can make you go at the $$$, so this is where you need to educate yourself about where you need a top $$ tool or a least $$ tool.  This is where you need the credibility with darling Mrs Lert, so she sees the value of the tools that make self-service possible.

3)  Get good information.  You have the shop manual.  There are forums on the www.  There is the car and bike forum here, and you can ask us in the SF for help.  When I started there was no www forums and the tech manual read like; a) remove old part. b) install new part––difficult days.


Here is a tool kit that I built up for the other BOV we had
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u142/PA22-400/CIMG0174.jpg
At the top is a Snap-On ratchet I hold the ratchet for the whole job so how the tool feel in my hand is very important.  A bad fit here can make a job impossible.  A bad fit here can cause long term physical damage requiring medical care that will far exceed the cost of a good tool.  DO NOT GIVE YOURSELF CARPAL TUNNEL INJURIES!  Carpal tunnel pain is unpleasant.  Not being able to hold your baby because your hands hurt is heartbreaking.  Do not go there.

The spanners are a mid grade set that feel good to me.  Feel good in the store, and feel good when your under the BOV pulling on the spanner with all your might––are two very different standards.  Notice that the spanners have no sharp edges where they are held hint hint.

The sockets are bargain store brand that grip the bolts well.  The bolt is inanimate and cannot get medical issues.  If the socket grips well then it will work fine.

This tool kit had all the needed tools to do any service that I was willing to do away from home.  In practical terms that meant that I would not be willing to change the transmission on the side of the road.  

The tool kit got moved into the red box and rode in our BOV.  Seating a family of six in the cabin the size of the one on your Hilux was very cozy.  We were so grateful when we were blessed to get the Suburban.
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u142/PA22-400/CIMG0356.jpg


I hope this helps––cheers.







Thanks mate. I'm pretty new to this mechanic business. When I was a kid my step-father usually shooed me away whenever he was working on the car, or anything else for that matter, so I never really learnt. Since then the thing that stopped me from doing my own work was the fear of screwing up and breaking my only car, but I'm mostly over that now.

I need to develop a decent tool kit. The one I have now I bought cheaply at Kmart about 5 years ago, and while it does the job for minor stuff, its really not up to serious work. Case in point- I cracked one of the 10mm sockets just trying to get a bolt off. It looks like most of the smaller bolts on the vehicle are 10mm, so a good quality 10mm socket would be worth the investment, and a decent ratchet to go with it.

The alternator went a long way with Mrs Lert on the credibility front. Not only does it work, but saved about $800 on the mechanic's quote (OEM alternator from Land Rover was $1k. The LR specialists had the same thing at $385 which was as good as anywhere I saw). She was very happy with that.

I spent a bit of time posting on the .au LR forums yesterday asking questions. The alternator they sent me was for the wrong VIN range and I needed to know the difference. I also had trouble getting the drive belt back on, and they helped me out.

I'm always happy to listen to good advice. Thanks for helping.
Link Posted: 3/7/2010 3:55:38 AM EDT
Howdy Lert,  I've made some on my living in the past by being a mechanic.  I've been doing my own work for 26 years; I had to correct what the shop mechanic did wrong.  I reasoned that if I could see that the work was wrong then I could do the job.  That was the beginning.  I learn something each time I do a project too.  

I too started with the tool kit from K-mart.  

Like I said in my earlier post.  The tools can require some money.  I bought some of my tools from pawn shops and yard sales (jumble sale?).  Some of my tools were bought new at full retail.  You will find that the better quality tools help complete your project more quickly.  These tools are marketed to people who are paid by the project.  The man that earns $2 per job will see a tool that cuts his time per job as a pay raise.

About sockets, some of the sockets in my tool kit pic are from Harbor Freight––bottom of the quality scale.  Over time by holding many tools is pawn shops and yard sales I became sensitive to the density of the steel that a tool was made of.  So now if a set feels ok and I need the tool I don't worry about the brand.  However I have obtained several 10mm sockets, so if I break one after the store has closed I continue my project another way with a different tool and get the socket replaced later.

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