I have been thinking of buying a pellet gun I have been looking at the ones with the noise damping but I have been thinking is it worth buying on if I have a 22lr? I once had a pellet gun and the only problem with it was that it was loud at times. Also is it better to get the .177 or 22?

I kinda went thru the same thing this week.  Only my dilema was slingshots.  they arent nearly as exspensive as a good pellet rifle, so I pulled the trigger and bought three.  Pellet guns and slingshots definately have advantages over real firerms in certain situations IMO.  I think you should do it, besides they can be a blast.

ETA:  I would go with a .22 Ive killed a couple of rabbits with an old beeman back in the day...  177 doesent seem to have the umph.

I have been thinking the same about the slingshot... and an air rifle "for the kids".  My only concern with the air rifle is the need for CO2.

The spring piston gun are what I've used to kill a decent truckload of varmits for eating and problem solving. 800fps .20-.22cal hit like a rock on small game.

BK:American!

I picked up a Beeman R2  to quell the squirrel explosion that was plaguing my house.  It's a dual barrel rifle with both a .177, and a .22.

The only plus for an air rifle is they are quieter than a 22 for taking small game like squirl, chipmunk, some birds.  Sure you can get a supressor for a 22 but your talking $600 after threading, supressor and tax stamp.  An air gun would be like $200.

Well it is cheaper to shoot and quieter than a 22.

I use a 177 right now to scare crows off,  They dig thru garbge cans at my work site spreading trash all over.  They dont seem to come back after you pepper them a time or two

Can you get pellet molds and roll your own?

I've had a RWS .177 for almost 20 years and is a fine gun that shoots ~1000 fps.
however, it doesn't have the punch of a .22 at range.
if I were to do it again, I would get the .22

No, pellet guns suck. I can't think of a good reason for owing one . . . now, 27, that's another matter . . .

Only the gas guns are loud. A springer might seem loud to you but that's only because that spring is firing right next to your ear. Somebody 20 feet away won't hear hardly anything. In fact, the impact at the target would be louder. A PCP or C02 gun without a moderator is going to have a pretty noticeable crack.

As for the .177 vs. .22 question, match the caliber to the powerplant. A big springer like a RWS 48/52 should definitely be .22. A lighter, less powerful gun like the RWS 34 will do fine in .177. The .177 pellets are cheaper and they tend to have a flatter trajectory. The gas guns (CO2 and scuba-powered) tend to like the .22.

Don't buy into the 1,000 fps hype. It's meaningless, and often not even true. Usually, they use really light pellets to get those speeds and those pellets don't shoot all that well and are hard on the gun. Anything that does 700 fps or better in .177 with middle weight pellets (about 8 g) will dispatch squirrels and such just fine. If you're going after rabbits, you'll want something a bit more stout.

PCP guns like the Benjamin Discovery and Marauder are easier to shoot. The spring guns like the RWS 34 are harder because your technique needs to be perfect to overcome the forces of the spring. Still, it's hard to beat middle weight, mid-power springers like the RWS 34 or Beeman R9 as a general purpose sporting airgun. Again, the PCP guns are easier to shoot but require a separate pump or a scuba tank to fill them. The spingers are completely self contained. Another option would be a pumper, like a Sheridan, but those have gotten so costly you can buy a good springer for the same money.

The cheap guns –– Gamo, Ruger, Winchester, etc. –– are OK but there isn't much aftermarket support for them in the way of springs, guides, seals, etc.

.22 Cal rifle loaded with Aquila Colibri.  shoot 500 fps. problem solved.

roger that.
I have the 36, and IIRC, the gun need heavy projectiles to shoot good –– which I must mail order.
the local Wal*mart and such has the lighter stuff, which I understand –– tumbles......

Four pages, three or five spats, and at least one rant.

Several quotes from some expert somewhere––that may, or may not apply.







This is a survival forum, so you must understand that there are some answers that you get that have been standard for decades because some famous survivalist wrote it down in a famous survivalist book.

You must have that following weapons to be a respectable survivalist:
1) An AR or AK for each member of the household capable of shooting (individuals over about 6 years of age). A 30-30 will not do.
2) A shotgun to go with each rifle in 1. It does not matter if you have no use for a shotgun.
3) A handgun to go with each rifle in 1
4) Ammo stocked for 1, 2 , and 3.
5) A long range rifle in 308—This really needs to be a bolt gun if you intend to be a tier one survivalist. SR25 or SPR can't count. 30-06, 300mag, 338mag, 270, etc. just will not do, and it doesn't matter that the terrain will not allow a clear 250 yard shot.
6) SKS handout guns. Nope can't count a 30-30 here either. It doesn't matter if you have nobody that you would trust to hand out to.
7) Ammo stocked for 5 and 6.

So now that you know the rules, and your ammo stocks have been measured and found lacking.

Have you tried one of the gas piston rifles? I have seen a few of them and they look nice.

i bought a Winchester .177 pellet gun several years ago to take out squirles and rabits in the yard when i lived in the city.

prolly the best justification for a pellet rifle is ammo cost. $15 buys 550 rounds of .22lr.  $15 buys you about 1000 pellets. makes for cheap fun and practice.

No. Sorry, I don't have any experience with those.

I've owned adult airguns for 20+ years and have read a lot about them on the airgun forums, books, etc. I have NEVER heard of anyone making their own pellets. Yes, some folks who shoot large caliber airguns (.32 caliber or larger) may cast their own balls, but I've never seen anything about making your own pellets.

I got my 8 year old a Daisy red ryder bb gun to teach him how to shoot.

The sights on it were terrible and were way left of of POA with no windage adjustment.

A few day ago I got a wild hair and tossed my parts box for left overs.

With a bit of jb weld, my dremel, one hour of free time, and no worries about cosmetics, this emerged:

http://mattlittell.smugmug.com/photos/953967018_qpYge-X2.jpg

Matech BUIS, AR front sight and sling swivels, magpul handguard, TIS sling

It's a tack driver..

Now when the boy comes to the range with me he's going to be comfortable with the AR

I sure hope they're worth it.  I picked up a Hammerli spring .22 last year for pot hunting.  Then I got to explain what pot hunting meant to my youngest daughter.  Yeah, that went well.

Mine is advertised to throw a .22 pellet at 820fps.  Haven't chronographed it though.  

As for noise, we practice with it at ten meters here in the store when there aren't any customers. We have the rifle set up behind the counter and a pellet trap in the back of the inventory room (actually four or five inches past ten meters)  We use the cash register as a rest. We can shoot all day without anybody wondering what the hell is going on, and it gets my son some decent riflery practice.  a .22LR, on the other hand, echoes well beyond the walls of the building, and we don't dare, even though the trap is rated for .22.

C02 is just one of several options in airguns. There are, essentially, five types of airguns:

Spring powered –– Guns like the RWS 34/36, 48/52 and the Beeman R series use a spring for a powerplant. The main body of these guns is an air cylinder. Inside that there is a piston with a tight fitting seal on one end. Behind the piston is a big spring. You cock the gun by A.) "breaking" the barrel at a pivot hinge and bending it down about 90 degrees, B,) operating a lever under the barrel, or C.) operating a lever on the side of the gun. This action compresses the spring and allows a notch on back of the piston to catch on a corresponding hook at the trigger. Once it's cocked, you load a single pellet into the breech of the barrel and then close the barrel back to shooting position. When you pull the trigger, the spring releases, the piston flies forward and the air between the piston and pellet compresses until the pellet flies out the barrel. These guns would be great for the survivalist because they are totally self contained (no gas, tanks, etc. needed). They're simple and robust. German guns are extremely well made and will literally last generations. The downsides include a practical limit on power, and a somewhat harsh firing behavior (by various degrees depending on power level and the quality of the gun). The vibration and twang of a springer can be lessoned by "tuning," which usually involves an aftermarket spring, spring guide and seal and different lubes.These guns are hard on scopes.

C02 –– You charge these guns either with Crosman powerlets or from a bulk-fill tank (think Paintball tank). The advantages are a fair number of shots for not much money (bulk-fill) and NO RECOIL. There is a practical power limit. The guns are loud (though quasi-legal suppressors are available for some guns). Also, C02 does not work well in cold weather. With few exceptions, most C02 guns tend to be lower quality and often are copies of firearms. Notable exceptions are 1970s/80s-era match guns (think super accurate Olympic grade stuff) and some of Crosman/Benjamin's offerings. Back in the 1950s Crosman had a series of really great C02 guns –– some of these are true classics and treasured by collectors and shooters today. One of those was the Crosman 160 rifle, which the military used as a trainer. The Chinese have copied this gun as the QB-78 and there's a cottage industry of people modding them. Crosman currently has a custom shop that makes some really nice pistols and there's a whole industry of guys making aftermarket parts and mods for these. In recent years Crosman set the airgun world on fire with their Discovery and Marauder rifles, which are dual-fuel guns that can run on either C02 or compressed air.

Multi-pump pneumatic –– You probably had something like this as a kid. Remember the little Crosman 760? These guns have an air reservoir which you fill by pumping a handle that's built into the gun. These range from guns that are essentially toys, to some pretty nice guns like the Sheridan Silver Streak. The better guns would be a good choice for a survivalist since they are self contained. They are somewhat limited in power, but probably adequate for true survival purposes. Noisy, but no recoil.

Single-stroke pneumatic –– These are similar to the multi-pumpers, but you only pump once. Typically these are lower powered guns. You see quite a few pistols built like this. There's also a generation of SSP match guns. Probably not too practical for the survivalist. Still, if you want a sweet-shooting, low powered gun for target shooting and informal plinking, there are some good choices out there. The Russian IZH-46M is a quality, yet affordable entry into match pistols.

Pre-charged Pneumatic –– These are all the rage today. They have an air reservoir that you fill from a hand pump or a SCUBA tank. The advantages are potential for very high power with no recoil. Until a couple of  years ago  you were looking at $1,000 or more for a quality gun (not to mention the cost of the SCUBA tank). That all changed when Crosman introduced the Discovery –– a single-shot C02/PCP dual fuel gun that came with a pump for about $350. They followed that up with the Marauder –– a multi-shot duel fuel gun for $400. The Marauder has a built in moderator and is said to be very quiet (I've never shot one). This is the current hot ticket in airguns, though the Europeans still sell quite a few of their $1,000 PCP guns. I'm not that up on match shooting, but I believe all the top shooters are using PCP guns now. You can also buy large caliber (.32-.50) PCP airguns that are suitable for hunting deer and other large game.

Look in the electricity tools/supply section of a well-stocked hardware store for a product called "Duct seal." This dense, sticky putty will stop a pellet cold. A lot of airgunner build a target box and line it with about 10 pounds of duct seal for a great silent pellet trap.

And yes, the ability to practice indoors, any time, any weather is one of the best things about airguns, IMO.

There is very little that can be said about an high powered airgun that can't be said for a 22 with subsonic ammo.

The noise is pretty similar. I now have a can, but all in all, these $400 airguns are on par with a 22 and the quality pellets are still about half the cost of 22 ammo. I would get a quality bolt 22 if you don't have one, like a cz 452.

I think airguns are a bit of a novelty and in general will be 10x less reliable and have more quirks if you shoot 1000s of rounds through them. I don't have much experience with the high dollar ones, but I suspect they still have many seals/springs/etc. that you are counting on.

Assuming you have plenty of land to shoot on, this is largely true. But in circumstances where overtravel is a concern, the airgun can be a useful hunting/pest control tool. In urban settings, the airgun is often your only option. Also, airguns allow you to shoot indoors and we all know that the more practice we can get in, the better. Besides, they're fun. Chances are good that the fella who has a basic battery of firearms and one good airgun will end up getting more trigger time with the airgun that all the other guns combined.

Are there any companies that you should stay away from? I guess I'm going to go with a 22. As it sounds like everyone is saying they wish they would have bought a 22 over the .177

The one I'm looking at is a Benjamin Trail Nitro-Piston .22 cal. Air Rifle

Link

There's been quite a bit of buzz on the Airgun "Yellow" forum about the Nitro piston, but I haven't really paid attention. I'm pretty slow to adopt the new stuff and tend to prefer the classics. You might go over to that forum and do a search for the gun you're interested in. I'm sure  you'll learn more than  you'd ever want to know.

FWIW, if I had $230 to spend on an airgun, I'd look for an RWS 34 or 36 with a decent scope and mounts used on the Yellow Forum Classifieds. But that's just me. Like I say, I like the classics. I won't tell you what brands to avoid, since there's bound to be guys who own those brands who think they're great. I will say that if you go with a German gun like a Weihrauch (Beeman) or Diana (RWS) you'll get a time-tested design with good support from the airgun industry. Springers benefit from tuning, but you can only get aftermarket springs, guides and seals for certain brands. Of course, maybe these new Nitro gas pistons are so good that they will make steel springs a thing of the past. I sort of doubt it, though. There have been gas rams on the market for 25 years and they haven't replaced steel springs yet.

You'd have to be pretty patient to crank out hundreds of pellets at a time. Besides, most serious airguns are pretty critical about their pellets. I don't think most of them would go for sprues running down the side of the pellet (and trimming a bunch of .177 pellets would be a total PITA).

I have used a Beeman R6 in .177 to kill a lot of squirrels. Beeman makes a great springer and I highly recommend them.

Accountant

How is shooting a 22 Airgun at 1000 FPS in your basement/backyard any safer than a 22 Rimfire at 1000 FPS?

I was just thinking I need a decent air gun. My neighbor has a bout 20 cats....

Assuming the airgun really produces 1,000 fps (which it probably doesn't), there's a huge energy difference between an 8g airgun pellet at 1,000 fps and a 40g .22lr bullet at 1,000 fps. (18 foot pounds vs. about 90)

Have you shot firearms indoors? The fumes/smoke from the gunpowder is pretty bad. There is none of that with air power. Also, the smaller pellet is much easier to control/capture. I use a silent pellet trap lined with electricians duct seal. There's not ricochet or lead splatter. I doubt my pellet trap would stop a .22 LR.

BTW, while I do shoot my "magnum" air rifles indoors with no problem, I find shooting lower powered guns (600 fps or so) to be much more enjoyable.

Maybe you should get one of those new Benjamin Marauders. They're a 10-shot repeater. You'd only need to load two magazines.

My Beeman C1 is advertised at 830fps with very light pellets. The heavier RamJet pellets kills rabbits and squirrels alot better. My friend's R1 in 177 with the heavier pellets works Great!

There is not a lot of trouble to keep these guns up and running. My C1 is 25yrs old and still shoots very well.

BK:American

Gamo Hunter 220 1,000 fps advertised w/scope, 177 cal.



Ditched the gamo scope and mount for an RWS mount (more clamping power, springer induced scope creep from hell), can kill chipmunks at 40 yards even when they hunker down in the grass.



The domed pellets seem to be the most accurate other than the match grade wad cutters.



For large targets like gray squirrels the pointed pellets do the trick.

Air guns can be a viable option. Lewis & Clark carried large bore airgun on their expedition. I have a Gammo in .177 that I use for snakes and tree rats that like to break into the garage for the bird food.
Mine is a single shot springer so it is kind of loud, but well placed shots work on varmints.
In this time of large cap mags a single shot takes you back to the basics of shot placement. The increased trigger time due to the low cost sharpens your skills also.

I can't speak for everyone, but discharging a firearm in an unauthorized area is verboten.
here, pellet guns are (still) legal to use.

(edit speeling)

looking through the manual and using my fingers, the 36 shoots about 960fps
it doesn't elaborate on pellet characteristics.....

I would get one but I would get a blowgun and a slingshot first.   My neighbor's 8 year old son kills lots of animals with his blowgun.

All I know is that I sometimes miss my R10 very badly, no matter how many .22s I have sitting around my mancave.  Hell, I have a blowgun, several slingshots, and some pointy sticks too.

Last time I checked it, my RWS 36 fired 7.9g pellets at 825 fps. I have an aftermarket spring installed in mine and that tones it down a bit from the factory spring. It's dead solid calm, though, with no twang or vibration. I also haven't shot it much since changing the spring, so it's possible it may speed up as the new seal wears in.

love it!

Feral made a point in a roundabout way,
if you do live in town,  or the 'burbs and do have ordinances against .22s and bigger,
a pellet rifle might be an easy way to skirt the ordinances
and still be able to get some "back porch" shooting in without heading off to the range.

I've always kept a .177 springer in the workshop for plinking or to take a crack at a pesky crow.

The .22 cal air rifles do pack a punch,  that's no joke.

Close, but you may want this one instead:
http://www.pyramydair.com/s/m/Benjamin_Trail_NP_XL/2052

I had a Benjamin .22 pump –– excellent gun. don't know where it went to
I still have a .177 which is an excellent "carbine".
I would prefer this to the RWS if it weren't so loud.....

I like that one also just not sure if its worth the extra cash for the 150FPS and a hard wood stock. Have you used one of these rifles?

I killed a bird ~15lbs with a .177 at 1000fps and good shot placement it has the ooomph.  bird fell over dead after a few steps, ironically we heard the bullet essentially fall out of the animal after i pulled the shot. up thru the breast and out thru the opposite side neck... like 10" penetration.

Turkey?

not sure the legalities, but its like a turkey... but has longer tailfeathers. think ornamental.  shot the thing off the roof