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Posted: 9/3/2010 2:34:38 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 2:36:37 PM EDT
Are the numbers of police shootings actually going up, or is it just that people are noticing more?
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 2:38:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BusySquirrel:
Are the numbers of police shootings actually going up, or is it just that people are noticing more?


Link Posted: 9/3/2010 2:50:54 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 2:55:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By BusySquirrel:
Are the numbers of police shootings actually going up, or is it just that people are noticing more?


That is a 2 part question.

Part 1) Answer: YES.

Part 2) Answer: YES

YMMV

and keep your head down.
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 2:58:29 PM EDT
So we dont try to talk people down anymore huh? We just tell them to drop it, and if they break the 21ft barrier we shoot to kill? Where's the training come into play here, Any retard with a gun could have done that much.
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 3:31:02 PM EDT
Originally Posted By AudiDat:
So we dont try to talk people down anymore huh? We just tell them to drop it, and if they break the 21ft barrier we shoot to kill? Where's the training come into play here, Any retard with a gun could have done that much.


Bingo.

They've removed thought from the decision making process. It's all about atc/react SOP's.
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 3:32:40 PM EDT
Not entirely true...
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 5:27:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DrewXD:
Not entirely true...


It's what I was taught in the academy.
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 5:31:35 PM EDT
From the linked news story:

"...he tried to make a run on the cop,..."

“He did have a knife in his hands. They made repeated directions to him to drop the knife, put it down and get rid of it,”

“He refused to comply and, eventually, he moved the knife into an overhand position, a threatening manner, and moved toward the officers, at which point both fired shots,” said Fulghum.

Sorry, who the FUCK moves TOWARD cops with a knife, raised up in a threatening manner? Once again, sounds like "good shoot" to me.

I like that we're getting rid of these shitbags one at a time. Society DOES need to be cleansed.
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 7:06:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/3/2010 7:12:03 PM EDT by stratfordwill]
Originally Posted By ViniVidivici:

Once again, sounds like "good shoot" to me.

This may well be true in this case.

Originally Posted By GrumpyM4:

They've removed thought from the decision making process. It's all about atc/react SOP's.


But this is becoming disturbingly more common. And it's not just evident in cases that result in shootings. My observation has been that LEOs are being trained to act more and more aggressively in the name of officer safety. And I've dealt with more than one situation where that behavior has resulted in more danger for the LEO rather than less. At the same time, the line between citizen and scumbag seems to be getting thinner and thinner in the eyes of many officers.

ETA: Fucking quote edits. still not working right.

Link Posted: 9/3/2010 7:25:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ViniVidivici:
Society DOES need to be cleansed.


May I ask who do you think should make the choice on who gets "cleansed"?



Link Posted: 9/3/2010 7:33:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/3/2010 7:34:12 PM EDT by spankybear]
Originally Posted By stratfordwill:
But this is becoming disturbingly more common. And it's not just evident in cases that result in shootings. My observation has been that LEOs are being trained to act more and more aggressively in the name of officer safety. And I've dealt with more than one situation where that behavior has resulted in more danger for the LEO rather than less. At the same time, the line between citizen and scumbag seems to be getting thinner and thinner in the eyes of many officers.


ETA: Fucking quote edits. still not working right.


I think this is a very good observation.

It's a problem when trust is lost between cops and people...

Link Posted: 9/3/2010 7:34:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By spankybear:
Originally Posted By ViniVidivici:
Society DOES need to be cleansed.


May I ask who do you think should make the choice on who gets "cleansed"?




You should already know...

Link Posted: 9/3/2010 7:34:57 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DrewXD:

Originally Posted By spankybear:
Originally Posted By ViniVidivici:
Society DOES need to be cleansed.


May I ask who do you think should make the choice on who gets "cleansed"?




You should already know...
http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz326/bhpdrew/thecleaner.png


Ok you got me there...
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 7:37:48 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 7:55:14 AM EDT
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 8:18:15 AM EDT
It ain't an asshole unless it has a hole in it. They're just getting busy putting the "hole" in assholes. As bad as it may look on paper, not one of these "victims" would have been welcome at my Thanksgiving Day dinner table. Or even on my porch.
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 8:47:20 AM EDT
What about your lawn?
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 8:57:31 AM EDT
How many of you armchair quarterbacks are going to let a man with a knife rush you to close range without using every means at your disposal to defend yourselves?

Play stupid games and whatnot...
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 9:25:32 AM EDT
I remember a episode of COPS from several years back set in Pierce County where several deputies rushed a woman waving a knive around, during the struggle she was put on the ground and was stabbed by her own knive when she hit the ground. If that would have happened today my guess is that she would have been shot.

A person with a knive wheter it be a 3" folding or a KBAR can do a shitload of damage to human flesh.
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 9:47:34 AM EDT
I am sitting in sbutts about a mile from that apt complex. That incident was a loooooong time ago. iirc, tasers weren't issued and she wasn't what one would call "fleet of foot". She did get a tummy tuck out of it. Big fing knife.
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 10:37:08 AM EDT

Originally Posted By spankybear:
Originally Posted By ViniVidivici:
Society DOES need to be cleansed.


May I ask who do you think should make the choice on who gets "cleansed"?

He does. He has the "Official" list of "shitbags".
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 11:47:49 AM EDT
Originally Posted By DoberDude:

Originally Posted By spankybear:
Originally Posted By ViniVidivici:
Society DOES need to be cleansed.


May I ask who do you think should make the choice on who gets "cleansed"?

He does. He heads the "Official" list of "shitbags".


Link Posted: 9/4/2010 2:12:05 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Unicorn:
putting themselves more in harms way by interacting with these people, it's going to result in more shootings. Not becaus the cops are more likely to shoot, but because they are in more positions where they will need to. If they only interact with 20 criminals a year they will have less shootings than when they interact with 100 per year. Common sense here. If you want to reduce the number of dumbasses with knives getting shot, then stop whining when cops spend most of their shift at Starbucks and the donut shop.


Did you REALLY just say that our choice as citizens is limited to cops sitting round doing nothing or cops shooting more people?
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 2:18:17 PM EDT
...and thus ends page one.
Taze 'em or shoot 'em.
Talking is for suckers!
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 3:38:54 PM EDT
Originally Posted By BusySquirrel:
Originally Posted By Unicorn:
putting themselves more in harms way by interacting with these people, it's going to result in more shootings. Not becaus the cops are more likely to shoot, but because they are in more positions where they will need to. If they only interact with 20 criminals a year they will have less shootings than when they interact with 100 per year. Common sense here. If you want to reduce the number of dumbasses with knives getting shot, then stop whining when cops spend most of their shift at Starbucks and the donut shop.


Did you REALLY just say that our choice as citizens is limited to cops sitting round doing nothing or cops shooting more people?


Yes. You can pick if you want suburb cops, who show up to take statements after someone goes to the hospital, or you can pick city cops, who spend enough time on patrol to actually intervene before potentially violent crimes occur.

Suburb Cops = Donuts and statements, reduced statistical threat to their lives, as noted in their overall posture and threat escalation

City Cops = Patrolling larger population areas, statistically an increased threat to their lives, as noted in their overall posture and threat escalation.
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 7:25:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2010 7:28:34 PM EDT by Unicorn]
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 9:34:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2010 9:35:19 PM EDT by CavVet]
I am still waiting to read one of these stories I dont think is a good shoot.



As many times as I have been pulled over, interacted, etc, I dont think I have ever been close to being shot. People are stupid these days, and the more stupid people do stupid shit with cops the more of them will get shot. If you dont know how to act around cops (who are likely scared, green and may have some degree of stupid int hem as well), perhaps a lesson from Chris Rock will help...















And if I think I have to shoot someone who is armed (gun, knife, car, whatever), Im shooting to slidelock, reload, and reassess. I dont think any of these cops have done that, so Im willing to give them restraint points.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 3:51:52 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Unicorn:
Originally Posted By BusySquirrel:
Originally Posted By Unicorn:
If you want to reduce the number of dumbasses with knives getting shot, then stop whining when cops spend most of their shift at Starbucks and the donut shop.

Did you REALLY just say that our choice as citizens is limited to cops sitting round doing nothing or cops shooting more people?

And you accuse me of making up shit and not reading everything you wrote.

Read the first part again. The more cops interact with people, the more criminals they actually deal with the more shootings will happen. It's pure numbers.

I'm not accusing you of anything. I quoted you to get the phrase accurate, and even included more than what I was pointing at, for context.

The fact remains that you've suggested it's not possible to have cops make a difference without making a higher percentage of mistakes. If that's the case, why would anyone want any cops? IF the only options are do nothing, ruin nothing OR be pro/reactive, and live with whatever collateral damage happens (as you are apparently suggesting) than neither is acceptable, and law enforcement would not be worth it.

I'm not asking for perfect robots who make no mistakes. In that line of work, I believe it's impossible to never make mistakes. But I do believe that constant reevaluation helps improve the decisions they make The whole "Kaizen" continuous improvement idea. Simply saying that we should assume they made the right call, or saying that they are above questioning, is unacceptable I believe it is possible to have higher numbers of interaction (with a higher number of mistakes) but a lower percentage of mistakes. If I didn't then the only logical conclusion would be that spending money on law enforcement would be wasteful.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 5:10:20 AM EDT
I think I have already posted this before but you would be surprised at the number of times officers have had to deal with a person with a gun and it ends with no one taking a trip to the hospital or morgue. We just never hear about it on the news.

Link Posted: 9/5/2010 7:19:59 AM EDT
Remember when officer Herzog was killed with his own gun by a crazy naked negro? I maintain he was reluctant to shoot because of the several blacks that had been recently shot and Jesse et al were on SPD like a hobo on a hot dog.

Kill the mall.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 9:47:43 AM EDT

Originally Posted By CavVet:
I am still waiting to read one of these stories I dont think is a good shoot.

You must have missed the unarmed guy shot in the back 7 times after being tazed and the guy sitting home minding his own business that didn't want his weeds sprayed.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 10:15:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DoberDude:

Originally Posted By CavVet:
I am still waiting to read one of these stories I dont think is a good shoot.

You must have missed the unarmed guy shot in the back 7 times after being tazed and the guy sitting home minding his own business that didn't want his weeds sprayed.


The weed sprayer guy was armed, and drew down on the county guys, and on the responding police. Good shoot, but probably escalated by the county sprayer folks.

Link Posted: 9/5/2010 10:26:17 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Lord_Grey_Boots:


The weed sprayer guy was armed, and drew down on the county guys, and on the responding police. Good shoot, but probably escalated by the county sprayer folks.


Not once during that whole thing was it ever mentioned he drew down on the county weed sprayer that I saw. Is that a new "Detail". Kinda popped up like a box of ballots in a trunk?

Don't want to rehash the weed incident but one common theme in these fatal events is after the smoke settles the only detail remembered in the final one. The guy was home bothering no one.
Minding his own business on his own personal property.
It's not like he ordered his own demise like someone else orders a pizza.

Link Posted: 9/5/2010 10:29:21 AM EDT
Lets go through the list.

The week started off with a Seattle police officer killing a man at a busy street corner near downtown. John T. Williams was shot several times when he ignored the officer's repeated orders to drop a knife he was holding.

But the local Native American community says Williams was a known wood carver, and that's why he was carrying a knife. They also say he was partially deaf and may not have even heard or understood the officer's instructions.

Note the knife was bared, he was 10' or so from the officer and facing him. John Williams was known for violent outbursts. Sounds like a good shoot. All Mr Williams had to do is drop the knife. He had "interfaced" with the police often enough to know the drill.


On Tuesday, Federal Way police fatally shot David Charles Young, 23, who was driving a stolen truck and reportedly tried to run down an officer who approached him.

Trying to run down an officer, and getting shot for it sounds like a good to me.

Also on Tuesday, Pierce County sheriff's deputies used a stun gun on a 27-year-old man who reportedly was causing a disturbance at a Spanaway apartment complex. A few minutes later, deputies noticed the man was having trouble breathing. He was taken to a nearby hospital, where he died. An autopsy was inconclusive; the Pierce County medical examiner is still assessing the cause of death.

One of the reports said that the taser had no effect, he was still struggling. Sounds like the taser missed, and the drugs in his system killed him.

On Friday afternoon, a man was fatally shot in Tacoma by two police officers at a bus stop. They fired at the man after he refused to put down a knife. Police say he raised the weapon in a threatening manner, and lunged at the officers.

When he lunges at the officers, the time to talk is over. He gets put down at that point.

Then on Friday night, three officers opened fire on a 59-year old man at a West Seattle home after police say he pointed an AK-47 assault rifle at them. Police say he had earlier made suicidal threats.Witnesses said they heard up to 12 rapid-fire shots before the suspect fell to the ground. But that man survived his gunshot wounds and currently is undergoing treatment at Harborview Medical Center in Seattle.

Suicidal idiot with a rifle aims at officers? Good shoot.

Then early on Saturday morning, 25-year-old Adam Colliers of Sultan died after a deputy stunned him with a Taser in the town of Gold Bar.

This is the guy that was running around in the street in a full freak out, then attacked the responding officers. Meth + cocaine anyone? Sounds like the drugs killed him as his system shutdown.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 10:34:48 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Lord_Grey_Boots:
<snip>

That was this week and dead men tell no tales. We were talking about earlier events like the weed guy. Why no mention of the Pastor shot at midnight after investigating an unmarked car on his private property? Or the 7 in the back in Everett?
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 11:42:05 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DoberDude:

Evidently you have been reading these a little more closely than I. I read through them as I see them, evaluate and keep going.

Since you seem to be well read, can you show me (links) which shootings you feel are bad shoots? Perhaps with education I can agree.

Link Posted: 9/5/2010 12:44:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Gibby:
the number of times officers have had to deal with a person with a gun and it ends with no one taking a trip to the hospital or morgue. We just never hear about it on the news.


this is easy to forget.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 1:17:58 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 1:20:19 PM EDT
Wow. Just... wow.


Link Posted: 9/5/2010 1:24:22 PM EDT
Indeed, as others have said, why don't the naysayers sign the fuck up and see how they handle threats of lethal force.

Then get back to us when the get out of the hospital after being treated for stab wounds.

For the life of me, I just don't see how folks have a problem with a cop shooting someone who's coming at them with a knife.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 8:02:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DoberDude:

Originally Posted By Lord_Grey_Boots:
<snip>

That was this week and dead men tell no tales. We were talking about earlier events like the weed guy. Why no mention of the Pastor shot at midnight after investigating an unmarked car on his private property? Or the 7 in the back in Everett?

The weed guy was a good shoot. The drunk in the corvette was a questionable one alright.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 8:22:12 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DoberDude:

Not once during that whole thing was it ever mentioned he drew down on the county weed sprayer that I saw. Is that a new "Detail". Kinda popped up like a box of ballots in a trunk?

Don't want to rehash the weed incident but one common theme in these fatal events is after the smoke settles the only detail remembered in the final one. The guy was home bothering no one.
Minding his own business on his own personal property.
It's not like he ordered his own demise like someone else orders a pizza.




Deputy Greg Rasar shot and killed Wasilchen on May 29 after the Verlot man pointed a gun at the deputy and three other people outside his home, according to investigators.


http://www.heraldnet.com/article/20100409/NEWS01/704099895

It's frustrating to try and discuss issues when people have their conclusion already in mind and just bulldoze throught the facts which would otherwise call that conclusion into question...
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 8:38:31 PM EDT
Nice to see not much has changed in the HTF. It's like reading the Seattle Times comments section at the end of any police shooting article............minus the "this would never happen if marijuana was legal" rants.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 9:03:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By twotwothree06:
Originally Posted By DoberDude:
The guy was home bothering no one.

Minding his own business on his own personal property.



http://www.heraldnet.com/article/20100409/NEWS01/704099895


After further review this was a bad situation but the Deputy had a green light to shoot.


The .gov weed faggot had NO fucking business on his property, PERIOD.


That said his gun should have been holstered, he should have only repeated the command to leave until it was obeyed. When Deputies arrived they should have been told to remove the trespasser, and if they refused his superior should have been summoned.



#1 rule on drawn gun- Make sure you are ready to open fire, do not use it to raise the threat level and then end up surprised when it you get called on it.

Link Posted: 9/6/2010 12:28:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/6/2010 12:29:43 AM EDT by BusySquirrel]
Originally Posted By ViniVidivici:
Indeed, as others have said, why don't the nay sayers sign the fuck up and see how they handle threats of lethal force.


You have just disqualified yourself from ever being able to use the "Fuck Obama" line ever again. Do you know why? Because you don't understand accountability. By your logic, you've never been President, so you don't get to question his performance.

If I don't get a say in how my taxes are spent, aren't they theft and not taxes? What you're suggesting (that noone gets to make criticism, even constructive criticism, unless they've done the job) is equivalent to telling your boss to fuck off when he tells you you didn't serve enough customers well enough today. I wonder how well that would go over?

Sure, you can grumble the blue collar ego crap about how your boss doesn't know your job (because he never does it anymore) and has his head up his ass, but in the end, there has to be some chiefs and many indians. Because there has to be doers, and there has to be policymakers. If you advocate everyone being the same, that's communism at it's most straight forward. That's certainly not the idea of a republic that this country was founded on. Are you a communist, or an American?

But the fact is that LEOs must answer to someone because we pay their wages. Now sure, that "feedback" or accountability is indirect (they don't answer directly to taxpayers) but they still answer to us. Which is why we have just as much right to question an application of force as your boss has to question what took you so long at the scene of a vehicle lockout.

It's funny how some people on here have no problem with state patrol ticket quotas and the idea of "making sure they're working" or that we're "getting our monies worth", yet people have problems with expecting officers to answer for their actions. If you refused to answer for your actions, how long would you have a job?

It really has nothing to do with my ego, or thinking I can do the job better. I certainly have never claimed I can do better, only that I expect more. It has everything to do with their performance, and "Are they doing the best they can given the nature of the work?"
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 1:28:18 AM EDT
Holy shit man, you are out of your mind. Squirrel, you are my friend, and I know you to be a cognizant, logical person, for the most part, but I just don't see where you're coming from on this.

It's simple: play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Cops confront you, you drop your knife, drop your gun, whatever, and shit will get sorted out.

You don't, it's on you.

How are YOU gonna play it, when YOU are running around, acting crazy with a knife/whatever, you gonna debate/fight/resist, or you gonna drop your shit and let shit get sorted out?

Yeah...I thought so.

Clowngun is right...why let this debate create hard feelings. I don't think I'll debate this crap too much in the future...this is just asinine. I do NOT understand where a few of you are coming from.
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 11:17:37 AM EDT

Originally Posted By twotwothree06:


http://www.heraldnet.com/article/20100409/NEWS01/704099895

It's frustrating to try and discuss issues when people have their conclusion already in mind and just bulldoze throught the facts which would otherwise call that conclusion into question...

Which is exactly what you have done. You read the above linked article written by two cum stain, libtarded, so called journalists and drew your own conclusion
from it. Then you "Bulldozed" past my original point that the Power tripping county weed sprayer caused the whole fucking incident in the first place and via erroneous, embellished info he passed onto the sheriffs dept, cost a man who was previously home bothering no one, his life.

Lets look at an excerpt from your link:


"Wasilchen repeatedly asked Gohrman to leave his property, records show
. The two men argued and Wasilchen, a Boeing crane operator, reportedly shoved the county worker."
What part of get off my property is hard to understand? Not only does the control freak county dildo refuse to vacate the premise when asked to do so, he escalates it into an argument.


"Raymond Dearie, an attorney for Wasilchen’s family, said Roe’s finding was not surprising but troubling. Roe didn’t address Gohrman’s behavior, Dearie said."
Talk about "bulldozing" past facts. The investigation doesn't even address the root cause of the incident. Why? Because the investigations are done by the police. They are busy looking for a way to demonize and blame the deceased to exonerate the shooter. They showed up at his house, trespassed, verbally assaulted and harassed the guy. Then came back in greater numbers armed and confronted him again after being asked to stay off his property in the first place.


"The central problem is the unlawful action of Sonny Gohrman. What about Sonny Gohrman going onto Dan Wasilchen’s property against his will?” Dearie asked.
Valid question, what about Sonny fucking Gohrman, weed nazi, liar, tresspasser and herbicidal strongman? Nothing that's what. Nothing about him. Gorhman wins his little game of "I work for the county and I'll come on your property and do whatever I please", the officers go home safely to their families and start a paid vacation and Dan is laid to rest by grieving family members never to breathe fresh air , see a sunset or pet his dog again. WTF is wrong with this picture?

Gohrman left Wasilchen’s property and called deputies. Rasar and reserve deputy Tim King, plus Gohrman and an assistant, arrived at Wasilchen’s home and parked about 100 feet away from the house.
Now the property owner is faced with 4 trespassers. At least 2 are heavily armed and trained to kill him. Are you under the impression his property was breeched a second time because these were guests he invited over for a BBQ?


RIP Dan Wasilchen.

May the chains of the blind totalitarian apologists rest lightly upon those that wear them.

Link Posted: 9/6/2010 12:50:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DoberDude:

Originally Posted By twotwothree06:


http://www.heraldnet.com/article/20100409/NEWS01/704099895

It's frustrating to try and discuss issues when people have their conclusion already in mind and just bulldoze throught the facts which would otherwise call that conclusion into question...

Which is exactly what you have done. You read the above linked article written by two cum stain, libtarded, so called journalists and drew your own conclusion
from it. Then you "Bulldozed" past my original point that the Power tripping county weed sprayer caused the whole fucking incident in the first place and via erroneous, embellished info he passed onto the sheriffs dept, cost a man who was previously home bothering no one, his life.

Lets look at an excerpt from your link:


"Wasilchen repeatedly asked Gohrman to leave his property, records show
. The two men argued and Wasilchen, a Boeing crane operator, reportedly shoved the county worker."
What part of get off my property is hard to understand? Not only does the control freak county dildo refuse to vacate the premise when asked to do so, he escalates it into an argument.
I agree

"Raymond Dearie, an attorney for Wasilchen’s family, said Roe’s finding was not surprising but troubling. Roe didn’t address Gohrman’s behavior, Dearie said."
Talk about "bulldozing" past facts. The investigation doesn't even address the root cause of the incident. Why? Because the investigations are done by the police. They are busy looking for a way to demonize and blame the deceased to exonerate the shooter. They showed up at his house, trespassed, verbally assaulted and harassed the guy. Then came back in greater numbers armed and confronted him again after being asked to stay off his property in the first place. Really? You actually believe that the police protect their own when this kind of shit happens? Gohrman is the root cause of this entire issue. He pulled his bullshit and then called the cops when he couldn't get his way. The police showed up to investigate the complaint.


"The central problem is the unlawful action of Sonny Gohrman. What about Sonny Gohrman going onto Dan Wasilchen’s property against his will?” Dearie asked.
Valid question, what about Sonny fucking Gohrman, weed nazi, liar, tresspasser and herbicidal strongman? Nothing that's what. Nothing about him. Gorhman wins his little game of "I work for the county and I'll come on your property and do whatever I please", the officers go home safely to their families and start a paid vacation and Dan is laid to rest by grieving family members never to breathe fresh air , see a sunset or pet his dog again. WTF is wrong with this picture? Again Gohrman is the issue and problem not the SCSO.

Gohrman left Wasilchen’s property and called deputies. Rasar and reserve deputy Tim King, plus Gohrman and an assistant, arrived at Wasilchen’s home and parked about 100 feet away from the house.
Now the property owner is faced with 4 trespassers. At least 2 are heavily armed and trained to kill him. Are you under the impression his property was breeched a second time because these were guests he invited over for a BBQ? You know if Wasilchen had simply talked to the officers instead of pulling a gun and then refusing to put it down when ordered Dan would be around today to file whatever complaint or lawsuit against the county he wanted.


RIP Dan Wasilchen.

May the chains of the blind totalitarian apologists rest lightly upon those that wear them.



Link Posted: 9/6/2010 4:22:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DoberDude:

[/span]


Hey cool out for a second.... You've just proven my point again.

All I was responding to was your statement that the guy didn't point a firearm at anyone. According to the investigators (not the people who wrote the article mind you) he did. A fact which you previously admitted being ignorant of. You're continually defending your conclusion and not the facts which coincidentally don't support it. Get off the he-was-killed-over-weeds train for a moment and realize that all that happened before the instant he pointed a firearm at a deputy sheriff is completely and utterily irrelevant to the extent that law enforcement had nothing to do with it.
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