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Posted: 9/29/2011 12:42:29 PM EST
I am curious why the government was allowed to make arrests here.

Aside from the usual DA Rice overstepping her authority crap, was this really an arrestable offense?
I mean, I can see prosecuting a crime when it comes to committing fraud to steal money or property or even identity, but what exactly was stolen here.
Are there really any victims? In fact, if cheating on tests is a crime, should we bust a 7th grader for writing crib notes on the palm of his hand for his science test?
Perhaps if the test were administered by the state, the state could enforce its own security. However, the ETS is a private company. No one is "forced" to take this test. Shouldn't the ETS have the responsibility to police and punish cheaters, not the .gov?

What say you?
Link Posted: 9/29/2011 1:45:26 PM EST
I'm in to hear the legal eagles response to this. I thought pretty much like you when I heard this story, I'm assuming they charged the test taker with fraud, but wouldn't there have to be some financial gain from the results of said test for that to be a crime? Not sure, but again, I'm wondering if this will all go away like all the "militia members", with "arsenals", when the police stumble upon a duck hunter with a few shotguns camping out in his blind, after the headlines are achieved.
Link Posted: 9/29/2011 2:30:11 PM EST
Link to story would be helpful.
Link Posted: 9/29/2011 3:18:03 PM EST
While I cannot condone cheating, I was stunned that these two were lead away in cuffs like a couple bank robbers.
Link Posted: 9/29/2011 3:29:54 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/29/2011 3:59:06 PM EST
Originally Posted By fp1201:
While I cannot condone cheating, I was stunned that these two were lead away in cuffs like a couple bank robbers.


It's for the children!
Link Posted: 9/29/2011 4:55:27 PM EST
This testing crap has gotten WAY out of hand. Here's a thought, not everyone needs to go to college...
Link Posted: 9/29/2011 4:57:56 PM EST
6 replies and no one has any strong opinion on this??!?!?!

Shoulda posted this in GD!
Link Posted: 9/29/2011 5:45:35 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/29/2011 5:52:27 PM EST by Danj]
When all is said and done I wonder if the students who paid the test taker are going to get punished and if is really going to negatively effect their lives. If it were me I'd cry and say my parents pressured me to get good SATs or they couldn't afford college unless I got a scholarship.

I wonder how often stuff like this happens without the students getting caught. You stand to gain a lot from good SAT scores and the punishment will probably be minimal.

Originally Posted By 45stops-em-quick:
I'm in to hear the legal eagles response to this. I thought pretty much like you when I heard this story, I'm assuming they charged the test taker with fraud, but wouldn't there have to be some financial gain from the results of said test for that to be a crime?
Scholarship money for good scores.

Link Posted: 9/29/2011 9:34:22 PM EST
The kid was arrested on 6+ counts of defraud/fraud, possessing/altering a government ID, and passing a fake ID.

Technically, if you pass yourself off as someone and sign that persons name, but that isn't you, it's fraud..
It's sort of like a contractual obligation, not to mention the definition of fraud.. "deceit, trickery, sharp practice, or breach of confidence, perpetrated for profit or to gain some unfair or dishonest advantage. "
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 2:03:39 AM EST
I am a bit surprised they got caught ... when I saw this story initially I thought 100's of people were involved.
This has been going on forever and is nothing new. Unfortunately so much weight is placed on these tests.
It is similar to resume padding because companies are becoming so demanding / specific in their hiring requirements where it is almost impossible to meet those requirements.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 11:39:21 AM EST
If they ban them from ever taking the test, they won't get into college.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 1:15:55 PM EST
There was an op-ed piece in Newsday today by a defense lawyer bringing up the fact that is being blown way out of proportion. With the DA pressing for criminal charges, these teenagers could very well be FU'd for the rest of their lives. Unable to get into any reputable college, unable to get jobs as convicted criminals and many other penalties. If they were to have working lifespans to the age of 70, you are looking at close to 50 years of punishment.

I am not libtard by any stretch of the imagination but I think there were plenty of administrative penalties that could have been applied in this case. Kick them out of their colleges. Make them retest, under strict supervision, and have them start the college application process all over again. Criminal sanctions in this case are way out of proportion at this time.

For the test taker, I can kind of go along with the charges. If it was one case of taking an exam for someone else I would be less aggressive with prosecution. But six cases and this was a small illegal business.
Link Posted: 9/30/2011 2:14:01 PM EST
Originally Posted By Aardvark:
There was an op-ed piece in Newsday today by a defense lawyer bringing up the fact that is being blown way out of proportion. With the DA pressing for criminal charges, these teenagers could very well be FU'd for the rest of their lives. Unable to get into any reputable college, unable to get jobs as convicted criminals and many other penalties. If they were to have working lifespans to the age of 70, you are looking at close to 50 years of punishment.

I am not libtard by any stretch of the imagination but I think there were plenty of administrative penalties that could have been applied in this case. Kick them out of their colleges. Make them retest, under strict supervision, and have them start the college application process all over again. Criminal sanctions in this case are way out of proportion at this time.

For the test taker, I can kind of go along with the charges. If it was one case of taking an exam for someone else I would be less aggressive with prosecution. But six cases and this was a small illegal business.


Everyone calm down. NY has a criminal coddling solution. All of the kids including the brain are Youthful Offender elegible, thus they will receive an "adjudication" and not a "conviction" Many schools accept the ACT in lieu of the SAT, so all is not lost.

Link Posted: 9/30/2011 2:36:30 PM EST
Arrested yes, But then again people steal id all day long and get away with it b/c of the system. A friend got her c/c stolen by a card reader 900.00 lost, cops did nothing. Some kids cheating and there fed, the system is Fed .
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