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Posted: 9/20/2009 3:58:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/20/2009 3:59:59 PM EST by fp1201]
According to a New Jersey FFL that had a table at the Syracuse show, he could NOT deliver to any person or other dealer at that show because he was operating outside the State he was licensed in: It would have to be shipped from NJ to the dealer in the reciepients home state.
He had a copy of FAQ's from BATFE that was a little old, but fully supported that premise.
I read through 478.92~99 of CFR 27 and did not find that he was right or wrong.
Several other dealers concurred with the NJ dealer, while as many said that it wasn't so, and to add more confusion if it was a C&R licensees are exempt on C&R weapons.
What say you and can you cite it?
Link Posted: 9/21/2009 2:15:02 AM EST

Originally Posted By fp1201:
According to a New Jersey FFL that had a table at the Syracuse show, he could NOT deliver to any person or other dealer at that show because he was operating outside the State he was licensed in: It would have to be shipped from NJ to the dealer in the reciepients home state.
He had a copy of FAQ's from BATFE that was a little old, but fully supported that premise.
I read through 478.92~99 of CFR 27 and did not find that he was right or wrong.
Several other dealers concurred with the NJ dealer, while as many said that it wasn't so, and to add more confusion if it was a C&R licensees are exempt on C&R weapons.
What say you and can you cite it?

What the heck then was he doing at the Syracuse show? Seems kind of odd to go through all the trouble and not be able to sell anything.
Link Posted: 9/21/2009 3:55:25 AM EST
I guess he was there to give out his name and number and do business when he returned to NJ.
Link Posted: 9/21/2009 4:12:12 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/21/2009 4:29:04 AM EST by rkbar15]
http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/2005/p53004/27cfr_part478.pdf

§ 478.50 Locations covered by license.
The license covers the class of business
or the activity specified in the license
at the address specified therein. A separate
license must be obtained for each
location at which a firearms or ammunition
business or activity requiring a license
under this part is conducted except:
(a) No license is required to cover a
separate warehouse used by the licensee
solely for storage of firearms or ammunition
if the records required by this part are
maintained at the licensed premises
served by such warehouse;
(b) A licensed collector may acquire
curios and relics at any location, and dispose
of curios or relics to any licensee or
to other persons who are residents of the
State where the collector's license is held
and the disposition is made;
(c) A licensee may conduct business at
a gun show pursuant to the provisions of
§ 478.100; or
(d) A licensed importer, manufacturer,
or dealer may engage in the business of
dealing in curio or relic firearms with another
licensee at any location pursuant to
the provisions of § 478.100


§ 478.100 Conduct of business away
from licensed premises.
(a) (1) A licensee may conduct business
temporarily at a gun show or event
as defined in paragraph (b) if the gun
show or event is located in the same State
specified on the license: Provided, that
such business shall not be conducted from
any motorized or towed vehicle. The
premises of the gun show or event at
which the licensee conducts business
shall be considered part of the licensed
premises. Accordingly, no separate fee or
license is required for the gun show or
event locations. However, licensees shall
comply with the provisions of § 478.91
relating to posting of licenses (or a copy
thereof) while conducting business at the
gun show or event.
(2) A licensed importer, manufacturer,
or dealer may engage in the
business of dealing in curio or relic
firearms with another licensee at any location.
(b) A gun show or an event is a function
sponsored by any national, State, or
local organization, devoted to the collection,
competitive use, or other sporting use
of firearms, or an organization or association
that sponsors functions devoted to the
collection, competitive use, or other sporting
use of firearms in the community.
(c) Licensees conducting business at
locations other than the premises specified
on their license under the provisions
of paragraph (a) of this section shall maintain
firearms records in the form and manner
prescribed by subpart H of this part. In
addition, records of firearms transactions
conducted at such locations shall include
the location of the sale or other disposition,
be entered in the acquisition and
disposition records of the licensee, and
retained on the premises specified on the
license.


http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/2005/p53004/p53004.pdf

Read the entire ruling!

Page #122 <snip>

27 CFR 178.41: General
(Also 178.42, 178.50)
Firearms or ammunition may not
be sold at gun shows by a licensed
dealer, but orders may be taken
under specified conditions; Revenue
Ruling 66-265 superseded.

.................................

Editor's Note:
In 1986, the GCA was amended to
allow licensees to sell firearms at gunshows
in the State in which their licensed
premises are located, and was
further amended in 1997 to allow licensees
to sell curio or relic firearms to
other licensees at any location. Moreover,
the interstate controls no longer
apply to ammunition sales. However,
the ruling is still applicable to licensees’
off-premises sales not addressed by
these amendments.
Link Posted: 9/21/2009 4:18:44 AM EST
Originally Posted By Aardvark:

What the heck then was he doing at the Syracuse show? Seems kind of odd to go through all the trouble and not be able to sell anything.


There are several dealers that attend: They mostly deal in rare, expensive, and exotic firearms.
Ever notice the old farts in the first few isles wearing suits & ties, the ones that have little interest in what you're carrying or even talking to you? That's some of them. Not bad folks, just a completely different interest and mind set than most of us.

Link Posted: 9/21/2009 4:26:47 AM EST
Originally Posted By rkbar15:
http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/2005/p53004/27cfr_part478.pdf

§ 478.50 Locations covered by license.
The license covers the class of business
or the activity specified in the license
at the address specified therein. A separate
license must be obtained for each
location at which a firearms or ammunition
business or activity requiring a license
under this part is conducted except:
(a) No license is required to cover a
separate warehouse used by the licensee
solely for storage of firearms or ammunition
if the records required by this part are
maintained at the licensed premises
served by such warehouse;
(b) A licensed collector may acquire
curios and relics at any location, and dispose
of curios or relics to any licensee or
to other persons who are residents of the
State where the collector's license is held
and the disposition is made;
(c) A licensee may conduct business at
a gun show pursuant to the provisions of
§ 478.100; or
(d) A licensed importer, manufacturer,
or dealer may engage in the business of
dealing in curio or relic firearms with another
licensee at any location pursuant to
the provisions of § 478.100


§ 478.100 Conduct of business away
from licensed premises.
(a) (1) A licensee may conduct business
temporarily at a gun show or event
as defined in paragraph (b) if the gun
show or event is located in the same State
specified on the license: Provided, that
such business shall not be conducted from
any motorized or towed vehicle. The
premises of the gun show or event at
which the licensee conducts business
shall be considered part of the licensed
premises. Accordingly, no separate fee or
license is required for the gun show or
event locations. However, licensees shall
comply with the provisions of § 478.91
relating to posting of licenses (or a copy
thereof) while conducting business at the
gun show or event.
(2) A licensed importer, manufacturer,
or dealer may engage in the
business of dealing in curio or relic
firearms with another licensee at any location.
(b) A gun show or an event is a function
sponsored by any national, State, or
local organization, devoted to the collection,
competitive use, or other sporting use
of firearms, or an organization or association
that sponsors functions devoted to the
collection, competitive use, or other sporting
use of firearms in the community.
(c) Licensees conducting business at
locations other than the premises specified
on their license under the provisions
of paragraph (a) of this section shall maintain
firearms records in the form and manner
prescribed by sub part H of this part. In
addition, records of firearms transactions
conducted at such locations shall include
the location of the sale or other disposition,
be entered in the acquisition and
disposition records of the licensee, and
retained on the premises specified on the
license.


If I'm reading these codes correctly then is IS permissible for a Licensed Dealer from one State to attend a sanctioned event in another State, and for said Dealer to transfer to another Dealer or in the case of a Curio or Relic, transfer that firearm to the C&R Licensee.
Link Posted: 9/21/2009 4:30:57 AM EST

Originally Posted By fp1201:

If I'm reading these codes correctly then is IS permissible for a Licensed Dealer from one State to attend a sanctioned event in another State, and for said Dealer to transfer to another Dealer or in the case of a Curio or Relic, transfer that firearm to the C&R Licensee.

See Page #122

http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/2005/p53004/p53004.pdf
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