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Posted: 6/14/2017 6:00:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/14/2017 6:01:13 PM EDT by UZIBoy]
I ordered a new Ruger Vaquero from them. It came in so I paid my money. Got it home and was able to see it clearly without contact lenses in. The revolver was well used and abused.

Screws boogered up, scuff marks that look like holster wear, the bore is black and caked with residue. I ran out of patches trying to clean it. Can't find chore boy pads anywhere around here either. The loading gate was tough to open, the base pin and cylinder pin hole are worn all to hell. When I took it back in the next day their "gunsmith" told me that is how they come from the factory.

I sent it to Ruger and they replaced the boogered screws, the hammer, the base pin, and polished it up.

I was charged full price for a used gun so basically, screwed. I'll never buy so much as a cleaning patch from them again. So if you do go there take a flashlight and a magnifying glass and look over their "new" guns.

I'll be getting back with Ruger tomorrow so we'll see if I ever buy another Ruger again either.

I am going to take it out tomorrow and run some rounds through it just because, but it will be for sale soon at a price it is worth. If Ruger doesn't step up and hammer Williams to replace the gun it will be my last Ruger ever.

I shit you not, my 2 Pietta 1851s, Pietta 1860, and Pietta 1873 SAA all came out of the box in 1000% better condition than the Ruger, and they weren't used either.
Link Posted: 6/14/2017 8:23:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/14/2017 8:23:33 PM EDT by -db-]
No dog in this fight but lemme get this straight- you got home, took your contact lenses out and realized you bought a used, instead of new, gun?

Link Posted: 6/14/2017 8:53:45 PM EDT
I'm confused. Who are blaming? Ruger or Williams?

If it was indeed used from Williams, why did Ruger agree to take it and fix it up for you?  If it was indeed new, but in shitty condition, why are you blaming Williams?  And of course, if you noticed all this when you got it home, why bother trying to clean it up before returning it the next day?

My money is that it came like that new from Ruger.  There are countless stories like this of shit guns direct from the manufacturer.
Link Posted: 6/14/2017 9:48:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/14/2017 9:55:03 PM EDT by UZIBoy]
I wonder why they replaced Hammer, grip screws, polished the frame and cylinder, replaced the base pin, and had to repair the loading gate if it was new in the box? That also doesn't explain the powder residue in all the nooks and crannies, the bore is packed with power residue and the leading is going to be a pain to get out. Doesn't look like normal test firing from the factory.

I wear contacts to drive with, can't see closer than 4 feet with them in. With the contacts out I can damn near see microbes. Wearing my glasses causes headaches after about an hour or so, I don't wear them much, mostly when I am at the range so I can pick up the sights.

I started cleaning it cause I pretty much knew that they wouldn't take it back, but I tried anyway when I ran the bore brush through it about a dozen separate times and every patch I had left, between 30 and 40 patches and the loading gate didn't free up after a good lubing. After that I just said screw this, i'll try running it back.

Doesn't matter though, I'll clean it as best I can and sell it for a loss. I had planned on another Ruger from williams and 2 Ubertis with 7.5 inch barrels. Also going to need a lever action in 45 Colt and a double barrel shotgun, ain't coming from them. I also have planned a 2nd Colt 1991, but Cabelas or Buds Gun Shop will get my business.

I had no issues with any other new purchases from them so looking it over wasn't high on the priority list. I used to recommend them to everyone, but that has stopped. Now it is more of a warning to not trust them as far as you can throw them.

All they really had to do was admit the special order was a used gun and blame the supplier for accidentally shipping it to them. I really wanted to just exchange for a new one, but that was asking too much, so the blame is on the supplier and williams, to hell with them both. In the last year I have spent about $2400.00 on new firearms (not including the Ruger) and have been buying my primers, 1k at a time from them along with other items. In the previous 2 years I spent about $1800.00 on firearms, never a problem before on those and never a problem in the future.
Link Posted: 6/14/2017 9:49:35 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By -db-:
No dog in this fight but lemme get this straight- you got home, took your contact lenses out and realized you bought a used, instead of new, gun?

View Quote
Yep, see above. I actually trusted them 100%, stupid of me.
Link Posted: 6/14/2017 11:39:22 PM EDT
Some good news! Using a brand new 50 caliber brush, 1300 strokes, and 120 patches soaked with Barnes CR-10 I actually have lands and grooves! The brush didn't make it though....
https://www.flickr.com/photos/983064...posted-public/
Link Posted: 6/15/2017 2:17:32 PM EDT
Maybe it is time to get some bifocals. This is 90% your fault. If you would have thoroughly checked out the pistol you would have saw the condition.
Link Posted: 6/16/2017 9:05:13 AM EDT
You should inspect the condition before buying any weapon.

If you ordered it online, you should've inspected before you accepted the firearm.

10/10 your fault
Link Posted: 6/16/2017 9:57:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/16/2017 9:57:47 AM EDT by TacticalHeater]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By NotanATFagent:
You should inspect the condition before buying any weapon.

If you ordered it online, you should've inspected before you accepted the firearm.

10/10 your fault
View Quote
I disagree.



By this logic a blind man is always at fault.



While he shouldn't have accepted it, it was told to him that it was brand new, and when he inquired about it they lied and told him it comes like this from the factory.  Not everyone who buys guns are experienced enough to know wear, so who knows how many people who didn't know better got had on the same story.
Link Posted: 6/18/2017 8:46:43 AM EDT
I have bought and sold enough guns over they years I can tell new from used. My problem is complacency. I never had a problem so never expected a problem. This Ruger may be my last depending on what they say when I call them Monday. I may keep it and use it as a sacrifice to learn smithing on a single action revolver. If I screw it up beyond repair, oh well. I had planned the same for a Tisas 1911, get a cheapie and learn on that.

I have actually purchased 2 more revolvers, from Cabelas. I picked up the Pietta 1860 Army revolvers. In the past they would have just been ordered in from williams. Trying to decide for sure now on either a set of Uberti SAA with 7.5 inch barrels or the 1872 Army Open-Top cartridge models from Uberti. Thought UI settled on the SAA reproductions, but the open-tops are just too nice. One again, not from williams.

So anyway, I have related my experience to you all, feel free, as you should, to buy from whoever but make damn sure that you check over your williams guns. If they would blow off someone who comes in regularly then they will do it to anyone.
Link Posted: 6/18/2017 5:10:11 PM EDT
Did the revolver have the yellow disc in the cylinder , hanging tags wrapped up in a plastic bag ?  We try not to open new special order guns till the customer is standing right there. If the customer doesn't approve it goes back to the distributor.
Did you drop off paperwork to the sheriffs dept ? I would ask them if it had any registered owners before you they will know.
Link Posted: 6/19/2017 8:11:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/19/2017 9:34:34 AM EDT by UZIBoy]
I asked them to check if it had been registered before when I dropped off the MI registration, but nothing came up. The gun could have come from anywhere. When I went in to williams the next day I honestly thought they would be angry that a used gun was shipped to them as new. My guess was that they just checked the serial number on it and gave me a call. In my past experiences I thought they would take a look at it and actually help me get a new one, but nope. I just got lectured by the "gunsmith" about how they couldn't have remained in business for 90 years by selling used guns as new.

Now if I had waited a week before bringing it back in I would have told myself to get bent too, but it was the next day.

When it came back from Ruger it was polished in a couple spots but the finish is a mix of matte, scratched, perfect, and pits on the frame. Kinda reminds me of an old rusted beater chevy with bright new shiny spinners on it.

The bore is now clean, I shot 104 rounds through it on Friday just so I could say I did. After coming home it took the usual amount of cleaning. Couple wet patches and about 30 strokes of the bore brush to get a clean dry patch with a hint of crud on it.

I'll be checking with Ruger to see about what can be done with it but I suspect I'll be sol. Since it shows all the signs of an idiot trying to "improve " the action, which means I will never trust it to be reliable, I'll do one of the following with it;

1. Do a cool video to see what it takes to blow up a Ruger New Vaquero. I have all sorts of powders I can overload it with.
2. Run a shit ton of black powder rounds through it and never clean it to see how long it takes for it to disintegrate.
3. sell it for a big loss. My guess is $300 worth of loss.
4. Use it to learn how to replace barrel, cylinder, bolt, hand, and whatever else I can learn.

Kinda sux too that i won't be dealing with williams again. I took hunters safety there in the 70's and they have a decent selection of new and used guns, and are pretty close to home. I do like driving and listening to music cranked to full blast so I guess the drive to Saginaw or Dundee won't be too bad whenever I want particular firearms that aren't stocked by the locals.

So all it took to lose a customer for life and have that customer no longer recommend them is not admit that their supplier screwed up and sent a beater as new. Wasn't williams fault that they received a used beater, but the lack of assistance to resolve the problem and failure to admit that the firearm was used (when it wasn't their fault) while telling the customer that spends a lot of money on firearms, bullets, powder, etc to get bent, that is the problem.

If I pulled crap like this where I work I would be fired instantly. I suppose that is why the company I work for is solid, steady, and growing like a field of weeds.

I almost forgot, it did come with the yellow disc, but when it came back from Ruger it had the polishing cloth that did not come with the gun originally. I don't recall a tag through the trigger guard. It wasn't in the box when I put it up yesterday so my guess is no, just the plastic bag it was wrapped in. I keep all that stuff along with receipts in the boxes that my new guns come in. Don't know why I do but I do.
Link Posted: 6/19/2017 10:36:06 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By UZIBoy:
I wonder why they replaced Hammer, grip screws, polished the frame and cylinder, replaced the base pin, and had to repair the loading gate if it was new in the box? That also doesn't explain the powder residue in all the nooks and crannies, the bore is packed with power residue and the leading is going to be a pain to get out. Doesn't look like normal test firing from the factory.

I wear contacts to drive with, can't see closer than 4 feet with them in. With the contacts out I can damn near see microbes. Wearing my glasses causes headaches after about an hour or so, I don't wear them much, mostly when I am at the range so I can pick up the sights.

I started cleaning it cause I pretty much knew that they wouldn't take it back, but I tried anyway when I ran the bore brush through it about a dozen separate times and every patch I had left, between 30 and 40 patches and the loading gate didn't free up after a good lubing. After that I just said screw this, i'll try running it back.

Doesn't matter though, I'll clean it as best I can and sell it for a loss. I had planned on another Ruger from williams and 2 Ubertis with 7.5 inch barrels. Also going to need a lever action in 45 Colt and a double barrel shotgun, ain't coming from them. I also have planned a 2nd Colt 1991, but Cabelas or Buds Gun Shop will get my business.

I had no issues with any other new purchases from them so looking it over wasn't high on the priority list. I used to recommend them to everyone, but that has stopped. Now it is more of a warning to not trust them as far as you can throw them.

All they really had to do was admit the special order was a used gun and blame the supplier for accidentally shipping it to them. I really wanted to just exchange for a new one, but that was asking too much, so the blame is on the supplier and williams, to hell with them both. In the last year I have spent about $2400.00 on new firearms (not including the Ruger) and have been buying my primers, 1k at a time from them along with other items. In the previous 2 years I spent about $1800.00 on firearms, never a problem before on those and never a problem in the future.
View Quote
Link Posted: 6/20/2017 2:48:12 PM EDT
Williams Gunsite has been in business for longer than I am old. They have never been known for being inexpensive, but they have never been known to cheat either. Their gunsmith work costs more than I think it should.

I ordered a revolver through a friend who had a FFL 30 years ago. It arrived smeared in dried nasty grease. It was purchased from a hardware having a going-out-of-business sale. It cleaned up just fine, but I was puzzled why it would show up in that condition.

I have ordered firearms off GunBroker and had them shipped to local FFL's who never opened the package. They simply entered the numbers printed on the invoice into their record keeping system.

Maybe the guy who sold it to you across the counter has eyesight worse than you.

I have owned close to hundred firearms in my life. Most were purchased new, one thing that is certain is they weren't new when I get done with them. I don't sweat dings and minor imperfections that don't effect safety or reliability. I'll actually offer to buy a "new" firearm (at a discount) that has these imperfections. They are tools to me, not works of art.
Link Posted: 6/20/2017 5:20:57 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By borderpatrol:
Williams Gunsite has been in business for longer than I am old. They have never been known for being inexpensive, but they have never been known to cheat either. Their gunsmith work costs more than I think it should.

I ordered a revolver through a friend who had a FFL 30 years ago. It arrived smeared in dried nasty grease. It was purchased from a hardware having a going-out-of-business sale. It cleaned up just fine, but I was puzzled why it would show up in that condition.

I have ordered firearms off GunBroker and had them shipped to local FFL's who never opened the package. They simply entered the numbers printed on the invoice into their record keeping system.

Maybe the guy who sold it to you across the counter has eyesight worse than you.

I have owned close to hundred firearms in my life. Most were purchased new, one thing that is certain is they weren't new when I get done with them. I don't sweat dings and minor imperfections that don't effect safety or reliability. I'll actually offer to buy a "new" firearm (at a discount) that has these imperfections. They are tools to me, not works of art.
View Quote
I have purchased a few firearms from William's when I lived in Michigan.  Other than the drunk who works there and a few part time hillbillies, I have always been treated fairly.  His story makes no sense.  If the gun was that bad I would have demanded a refund.

I would have posted pictures on this site with updates.  I cannot believe it shipped from Ruger like that.  What was the story from the distributor?  

Why would they not take it back?

I am not a William's cheerleader, but the OP's story sounds like BS to me.
Link Posted: 6/23/2017 3:30:02 AM EDT
What Williams say when you asked for a refund for the gun?

J-
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