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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/5/2005 12:46:24 PM EDT
Ok, so I own a Kimber custom. I have had it for maybe 5 or 6 years. I have put about 1000 rounds through it give or take. I have been using Mec-gar mags for it. 7 and 8 rounders.

Here is the deal, every so often seemingly at random interval I get a failure to feed. Almost every single time the round gets lodged on the feed ramp at the bottom edge of the bullet. I am not sure if it is really on the bullet or on the case mouth. I know some of you are ready to say "crappy mags", well not so fast. Here is where it gets a bit dicey. I have tried using Mec-Gar's Wilson's, and Chip McCormick's, all had exhibited the same simptoms. It does not seem to be ammunition related either. I fire my reloads through it, someone elses reloads and a couple of different factory ammo types and had the same problems. I even tried different combinations of ammo, mags, and shooters, and still had the same issues.

Does anyone have any insight as to what the problem might be?

Also, while I am here. Is it just me or does everyone else's Kimber do this? Mine ejects brass everywhere. Forward, backward, 30 feet sideways. There seems to be no rhyme or reason to the randomness. Maybe I am over anylizing..


Thanks

Flame.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 1:55:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/5/2005 1:58:21 PM EDT by SGB]
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 3:26:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SGB:

.....................Here is the deal, every so often seemingly at random interval I get a failure to feed. Almost every single time the round gets lodged on the feed ramp at the bottom edge of the bullet....................

.................Also, while I am here. Is it just me or does everyone else's Kimber do this? Mine ejects brass everywhere. Forward, backward, 30 feet sideways. There seems to be no rhyme or reason to the randomness.




You've described classic symptoms of an out of tune (or crud clogged) extractor. When was the last time you pulled the extractor and cleaned the extractor channel out? If it's a barsock extractor it may need to be tuned, If it is a MIM extractor you need to trash it and replace it with an Ed Brown hardcore or Wilson Bulletprook extractor.




I pull it and the firing pin and spring every time I clean it.

Ok, how do I tell if it is a barstock or MIM(???) extractor? How does one tune the extractor?? Or do I just buy a new one??

Thanks for the help, sorry if these are stupid questions. I am just trying to learn.

Link Posted: 8/5/2005 8:34:51 PM EDT
I had very similar problems with my TLE. I tried just about everything; mags, extractor, polishing, springs, factory ammo, changed OAL of reloads. The problem continued to occur very irratically, usually in the middle of an IDPA, or 3-gun match. When it occured in a match I usually didn't get to examine it to much, I'd just clear it an continue. It seemed to happen more often with SWC bullets, but it still occured with round-nose bullets too.

Finally I noticed that when I rapped on the end of the slide to try to force it forward, there was a tiny ding in the case mouth of the jammed round. I examined the barrel closely and sure enough there was a sharp corner at the rear of the barrel hood. 10 seconds with a file and the problem has not re-occured in over 3K rounds.

I think the corner of the barrel hood was just sharp enough to catch on the case mouth when the case had a nice sharp edge. That may explain why it occured so infrequently, and randomly.

Check yours, it wouldn't hurt just to knock the point off of the corner.
Link Posted: 8/6/2005 3:30:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By HomerSimpson:
I had very similar problems with my TLE. I tried just about everything; mags, extractor, polishing, springs, factory ammo, changed OAL of reloads. The problem continued to occur very irratically, usually in the middle of an IDPA, or 3-gun match. When it occured in a match I usually didn't get to examine it to much, I'd just clear it an continue. It seemed to happen more often with SWC bullets, but it still occured with round-nose bullets too.

Finally I noticed that when I rapped on the end of the slide to try to force it forward, there was a tiny ding in the case mouth of the jammed round. I examined the barrel closely and sure enough there was a sharp corner at the rear of the barrel hood. 10 seconds with a file and the problem has not re-occured in over 3K rounds.

I think the corner of the barrel hood was just sharp enough to catch on the case mouth when the case had a nice sharp edge. That may explain why it occured so infrequently, and randomly.

Check yours, it wouldn't hurt just to knock the point off of the corner.



Exactly what I thought when I read the original post.
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 3:56:12 PM EDT
Ok so I went to the range and this is how I approached the testing.
When the FTF occurred I would inspect the malfunction to see if it was hanging up on something. I would use a marker and mark the 12oclock position on the case. Then rap the back of the slide to possibly exagerrate any markings the malfunction would make on the case, also to see if it would chamber. I would then properly chamber the round and fire it then retrieve the brass and inspect.

It did not take long before FTF's began to occur. I started my procedure as stated.
1st thing I noticed is every round would half chamber. The rim would never enter the extractor groove.

2nd Every time I would rap firmly on the back of the slide the round would never chamber on it's own.

3rd A firm rap on th magazine would allow the round to chamber and the slide to close.

I noticed on all of the brass from the FTF group (about 25 out of 75) a diagonal ding on the case at the 1 O'clock position I see them on the non-FTF cases but not nearly as deep. (Slide marks from ejecting??)
As well at the 6 O'clock a horizontal indentation about 1/8" down from the mouth. Which is on present on the non-FTF cases.

I will inspect the chamber area closely to see if I find any imperfections. Does anyone else see any patterns here??

I still have not heard anyone say how to "tune" and extractor.


Now for the pictures.



Link Posted: 8/9/2005 4:46:15 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 4:54:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SGB:

Originally Posted By Flamethrower:


I still have not heard anyone say how to "tune" and extractor.





forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=73565



Thank you very much.
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 6:33:00 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/21/2005 7:26:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/21/2005 7:28:36 PM EDT by Flamethrower]
After some advice from a long time competition shooter I decided to pull out the heavy hardware.
With Class III Dremel in hand, I removed the sharp edge at the top of the feed ramp on the barrel. I removed enough to make a smooth transition into the chamber. I then polished it with a polishing bit for said Dremel. I also polished the breech face.

I have not test fired it yet, but I did run some loaded ammo through it and cycled the slide by hand. I can say this. It is noticable better. Very smooth feeding. It does not feel sluggish like before, at all. I will test fire tomorrow and let you know how it turns out. If anyone cares.


Flame

BTW I did have to tune the extractor a bit. At least the brass is now landing in about a 5 foot diameter circle, and not all over the place.
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 12:53:46 PM EDT
Please let us know the results. I've got a Custom II that has had only about 4 FTF in about 300 rounds. Not too bad but I may polish mine up a little too.
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 2:01:34 PM EDT
...tick-tock, tick-tock, tick-tock,...
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 3:01:43 PM EDT
Alright alright....

I ran 200 rounds through her and it went well. For the most part. Of the 200 rounds I had only 3 FTF. They were at random intervals, and non-magazine specific. I think this did the trick. I do think I will work the barrel just a bit more, 1 FTF is 1 more that I should have. 1 FTF could mean life or death.

With that said, I am still have a bit of trouble with magazines. The follower overriding the slidestop and havving to pull the mags out. It started with 3 mags and then corrected itself down to consistantly 1 mag. I have yet to really inspect the follower to see if it is out of spec or not.

Is there a better follower out there?? When ever I load any of the Mec-gar mags it seems like the follower on the first or second round gets hung up until it pops back into place. Is the mag spring suppose to be under the little tab on the center of the follower? Or is it just suppose to be resting on the front of the follower??

I will post another range report when I have one.
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 3:53:15 PM EDT
Not all mags are built the same. I have had problems with the follower going over the slide stop, too. I started running the Wilson 47D's exclusively (one piece follwer) and never had another problem. That was roughly 1500rds ago.

The only pistol I have that the Mec Gar mags have performed flawlessly in, is my Sig P228.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:38:28 PM EDT
First, the hash marks are on your cases in the picture are normal. I have had a couple of FTF's. It occurred at about the same # of rounds you fired when you experienced your problem. I use Wilson mags (D47's). I have 10 mags and it was not mag specific. The round would not chamber - just as you described. I noticed that in 2 cases the previous casing was still in place in the extractor. Did you have this situation? In this case, the casing was carried forward and blocked the chambering round from chambering. I tuned the extractor - which did not appear to be clogged. I also felt that the casing was not being forced out of the extractor by the ejector. I checked that out too. No signs of error there either. I thought possible wrist flex was causing the slide to return weakly and therefore not eject properly. Still don't know the answer, but that problem has not returned. I have not had any further FTF's either. I've fired more than 2000 rounds since then with no problems. Heh, I almost want a FTF now so I can tweak it abit.
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