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Posted: 1/2/2003 2:58:33 PM EST
yeah i know spelling sux.. i know they are called different things, but i have heard of people useing home heating oil in a diesel engine in a pinch. was just wondering if it is true.. could diesel be used in a MH furnace?
Link Posted: 1/2/2003 3:14:51 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/2/2003 3:25:07 PM EST by gaspain]
if you are referring to kerosene the answer is no, they are not the Same but similar. Diesel may work in your furnace, but may be too thick for the injectors. Question What is the difference between gasoline, kerosene, diesel fuel, etc.? Answer The "crude oil" pumped out of the ground is a black liquid called petroleum. This liquid contains aliphatic hydrocarbons, or hydrocarbons composed of nothing but hydrogen and carbon. The carbon atoms link together in chains of different lengths. It turns out that hydrocarbon molecules of different lengths have different properties and behaviors. For example, a chain with just one carbon atom in it (CH4) is the lightest chain, known as methane. Methane is a gas so light that it floats like helium. As the chains get longer, they get heavier. The first four chains -- CH4 (methane), C2H6 (ethane), C3H8 (propane) and C4H10 (butane) -- are all gases, and they boil at -161, -88, -46 and -1 degrees F, respectively (-107, -67, -43 and -18 degrees C). The chains up through C18H32 or so are all liquids at room temperature, and the chains above C19 are all solids at room temperature. The different chain lengths have progressively higher boiling points, so they can be separated out by distillation. This is what happens in an oil refinery -- crude oil is heated and the different chains are pulled out by their vaporization temperatures. (See How Oil Refining Works for details.) The chains in the C5, C6 and C7 range are all very light, easily vaporized, clear liquids called naphthas. They are used as solvents -- dry cleaning fluids can be made from these liquids, as well as paint solvents and other quick-drying products. The chains from C7H16 through C11H24 are blended together and used for gasoline. All of them vaporize at temperatures below the boiling point of water. That's why if you spill gasoline on the ground it evaporates very quickly. Next is kerosene, in the C12 to C15 range, followed by diesel fuel and heavier fuel oils (like heating oil for houses). Next come the lubricating oils. These oils no longer vaporize in any way at normal temperatures. For example, engine oil can run all day at 250 degrees F (121 degrees C) without vaporizing at all. Oils go from very light (like 3-in-1 oil) through various thicknesses of motor oil through very thick gear oils and then semi-solid greases. Vasoline falls in there as well. Chains above the C20 range form solids, starting with paraffin wax, then tar and finally asphaltic bitumen, which used to make asphalt roads. All of these different substances come from crude oil. The only difference is the length of the carbon chains! KEROSENE & DIESEL FUEL Both kerosene and diesel fuel are flammable and are petroleum distillate products. Kerosene is used in lamps, domestic heaters or furnaces, jet engine fuel, and as a solvent for greases and pesticides. [B]Diesel fuel has a higher boiling point[/B] than kerosene and is used to power diesel engines. It may work, there are multi-fuel heaters out there. K1 kerosene is a different "animal" than Diesel # 2. It is, however, very close to the same fuel as Diesel # 1, there are 2 types of diesel. [viscosity] Diesel # 1 1.33 Kerosene 1.63 Diesel # 2 3.20 Diesel # 1 should work great because it is less dense. diesel #2 has more lubrication and is engineered for engines. try to find diesel# 1 sorry about the confusion.
Link Posted: 1/2/2003 3:32:22 PM EST
Give me a 6-pack of stout beer and a couple of hot links and I'll make you all the methane you can use.
Link Posted: 1/2/2003 3:33:31 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/2/2003 3:34:22 PM EST by Garand_Shooter]
Link Posted: 1/2/2003 3:40:17 PM EST
Link Posted: 1/2/2003 3:44:32 PM EST
Link Posted: 1/2/2003 6:59:49 PM EST
The Navy, Marines and the Air Force all went to JP-8 as the main fuel source for all of their aviation support equipment back in 1996. If a piece of GSE (Navy, Marines) or AGES (Air Force) has an engine that can not be converted to JP-8 operation it is slowly being replaced by equipment that uses JP-8 fuel.
Originally Posted By Sweep: Hmmm, we never did that in the Air Force. I was a Fuel Specialist for 8 years of the 9 years I was in. We had just switched over to JP8 for the air craft when I got out in '93, but we never used it in any vehicles.
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Link Posted: 1/2/2003 7:12:27 PM EST
Hey Gaspain - that was very interesting information. Where does bunker oil fit into the scheme of things?
Link Posted: 1/2/2003 7:47:58 PM EST
Bunker oil is a heavy fuel oil used to power ships. It comes from "Residual" fuel was originally defined as whatever liquid was left behind in the petroleum distillation unit after the removal of more valuable products like kerosene, diesel and naphtha. Bunker oil is currently produced by blending the oil remaining after the refining process with lighter oil, its used in the majority of large marine diesel engines, bunker oils are used in power generating stations, industrial boilers and furnaces, and pumping plants.
Link Posted: 1/2/2003 8:41:03 PM EST
[img]http://www.chevron.com/about/learning_center/refinery/chart.gif[/img] Refineries sort, split, reassemble and blend the hydrocarbon components of crude oil to develop commercial products such as gasoline, diesel fuel and jet fuel, and feedstocks that are used in the petrochemical industry. When crude oil arrives at the refinery it first undergoes a process of fractional distillation. Crude oil is not a single compound but a mixture of hundreds of hydrocarbon compounds, all with different boiling points. Fractional distillation is used to separate these compounds based on their boiling points. The crude oil is heated and piped into a large tower with perforated trays welded to the walls every few feet. The heated vapours rise, cool and condense at different levels (trays) in the tower. The lighter hydrocarbons condense on the upper trays. In this way the crude is separated into fractions or distillates. The lightest (gaseous) fractions are used to fuel refinery furnaces or are directed to gasoline blending, depending on their boiling points. Naphtha and kerosene are light distillates; naphtha is used for gasoline blending and petrochemicals, while kerosene is used for jet fuel and stove oil. The middle distillates are made into jet, diesel and furnace fuels or cracked (further processed) into naphtha and other products. The last group of fractions are the residual products which may be severely processed to produce more gasoline and diesel fuel, or used for refinery fuels, heavy fuel oil and asphalt which is used for surfacing roadways and roofs. Cracking, or breaking heavy fractions or more complex molecules into simpler molecules (for gasoline and diesel fuel), can be accomplished using one of three techniques: thermal cracking, catalytic cracking, or hydrocracking. Thermal cracking uses heat and pressure to break down the molecules. Catalytic (cat) cracking uses a catalyst, heat and pressure and hydrocracking uses hydrogen and a catalyst and very high pressure and temperature to break down large molecules into the gasoline and diesel fuel range. Different types of cracking are used to produce different products. Sometimes just cracking the molecules is not enough, reforming may also be needed to produce the desired product. Reforming is a chemical process which results in minor modification (re-arrangement) to hydrocarbon molecules. This is used in gasoline refining to upgrade low octane gasoline to high octane gasoline components. Compared to conventional light crude oil, bitumen and heavy oil typically contain more sulphur and a much higher proportion of large, carbon-rich hydrocarbon molecules. Upgrading is the process that converts bitumen and heavy oil into a product with a density and viscosity similar to conventional light crude oil. This is accomplished by using heat to “crack” the big molecules into smaller fragments. Adding high-pressure hydrogen and/or removing carbon then creates smaller hydrocarbon molecules.
Link Posted: 1/2/2003 9:25:55 PM EST
Interesting - thanks for posting
Link Posted: 1/2/2003 11:00:52 PM EST
JP-8, I have heard, is basically Kerosene plus an antifungal agent. I know for a fact that land vehicles, even the Abrams Turbine engine, are run on diesel.
Link Posted: 1/2/2003 11:38:31 PM EST
Not in the Marines, Navy and Air Force... The Marines M1A Abrams is listed as a "multi-fuel" vehicle. Here are the ingrediants to make Mil-Spec JP-8: [b]Exxon:[/b] ------------------------------ Name: KEROSENE, HYDRODESULFURIZED. % Wt: 81.0 ------------------------------ Name: SULFUR % Wt: <0.3 ------------------------------ Name: TOLUENE % Wt: 0.05 ------------------------------ Name: XYLENE % Wt: 1.17 ------------------------------ Name: BENZENE, ETHYL-; (ETHYL BENZENE) % Wt: 0.17 ------------------------------ Name: BENZENE, 1,2,4-TRIMETHYL-; (1,2,4-TRIMETHYLBENZENE) % Wt: 1.64 ------------------------------ Name: CUMENE % Wt: 0.07 ------------------------------ Name: ANTIFREEZE (ANTI-ICING). % Wt: <0.15 ----------------------------- Name: ANTI-OXIDANT. % (WT):6.0 ----------------------------- Name: CORROSION INHIBITOR. % (WT):9.4 ----------------------------- Name: CONDUCTIVITY IMPROVER. % Wt: <0.1 ----------------------------- [b]MAPCO:[/b] Name: KEROSENE, LIGHT DISTILLED. % Wt: 97.5 ------------------------------ Name: BENZENE % Wt: 0.04 ------------------------------ Name: CYCLOHEXANE % Wt: 0.11 ------------------------------ Name: ETHYL BENZENE % Wt: 0.11 ------------------------------ Name: 1,2,4-TRIMETHYLBENZENE % Wt: 0.78 ------------------------------ Name: TOLUENE % Wt: 0.18 ------------------------------ Name: XYLENE (MIXED) % Wt: 0.65 ------------------------------ Name: HEXANE; (N-HEXANE) % Wt: 0.04 ------------------------------ Name: NAPHTHALENE % Wt: 0.64 ------------------------------ Mostly it has to do with the flash point. JP-4 Flash Point: 0F, -18C JP-5 Flash Point: 140F, 60C JP-7 Flash Point: 140F 60C JP-8 Flash Point: 100F, 38C
Link Posted: 1/3/2003 3:15:04 AM EST
Link Posted: 1/3/2003 3:20:30 AM EST
Originally Posted By mattja: Give me a 6-pack of stout beer and a couple of hot links and I'll make you all the methane you can use.
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LMAO
Link Posted: 1/3/2003 4:45:40 AM EST
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