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Posted: 7/12/2001 3:31:26 PM EDT
[#1]
Quoted: For long range work out to say 500m maybe an occasional 800m. I know .300 is flatter shooting but some say the relative lack of case neck support for the bullet makes it less accurate than a .308. .308 does have the advantage of more choices of cartridge selection and the ability to do cheap shooting with surplus. Experts? If you are not going past 1000m, 308 will do the job just fine. Not going past 800 it definitly will. Also, if you do not reload .300WM will put you in the poorhouse if you plan to shoot enough to maintain proficancy. |
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Posted: 7/12/2001 3:41:01 PM EDT
[#2]
I shoot the best gun for the job. Not an "adequate" gun for the job.
I also think for myself. I don't use rounds just because the millitary does. Why did the armed forces select the .308 for the primary Sniper weapon when there a littany of so many rounds available so superior to it (Mainly the hybrid 6MM's)?? Because they knew it, and [b]they had a shitload of it.[/b] Civillans aren't in such a boat. We aren't limited to select a gun because we just so happen to have a few million cases of it to burn up. We can select the best gun for the job. I shoot 125's out of my .300, and they are absolute LASERS. I can hit anything anywhere (to 500 with 125's), and punch through metal better, where your .308 (or '06 or .270)won't even scratch the paint. Remember. Smaller bullets at insane velocities punch hard targets better then slower big rounds. (That's why I use 125 NBT's in my .300) |
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Posted: 7/12/2001 3:42:19 PM EDT
[#3]
Believe it or not, both will shoot about the same trajectory out to 600 yards. The 300 Win will begin to shine beyond that range with flatter trajectory (up to 10 MOA less at 1000 yards) and less wind drift. I've shot a lot of 30 cal mags over the last seven years, all of them a lot bigger than the Win Mag. After all that, I came back to it. Forget all the crap you hear about the neck being too short or the case being under capacity, etc., etc. In 1000 yard benchrest, the 300 Win Mag is one of the dominant cartridges. With today's powders and bullets, it may well be the most efficient case on the market, 300WSM notwithstanding. If you really want to reach out, try a 240 grain Sierra at 2800 fps; this begins to rival the 338 Lapua in terms of performance. As far as cost goes, if you reload, its not that much more than the .308, but you will pay a price in recoil- no free lunches. If you don't reload, well, the .308 Fed Match is 40% cheaper than the Fed Match 300 Win. Like Garand said, important consideration. As far as accuracy, the Win Mag will shoot every bit as well as the .308, even better at long ranges.-
Its nice to say "well, I'm not going to shoot beyond 600 yards". That's like saying "well, I'll only have sex once." I recommend being prepared. Squeeze'em crisp. |
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Posted: 7/12/2001 4:20:23 PM EDT
[#4]
Well right now I don't reload and have no plans to in the near future (landlord will not allow it..long story). I plan to reload in due time (re: Not Rent but own). I would really like to have a .300 WM but for the ammo consideration. Just want to know if .308 is enough to 1000m. I already have .308s but really do want to be able to reach out and touch things.
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Posted: 7/12/2001 4:24:16 PM EDT
[#5]
Not to go too far off topic but, what are the opinions of the .338 Ultra Mag? I own a Sendero SF in this caliber and am extremely happy with it. (lot of kick though...) Granted, its expensive at (almost) $2.50 per shot but, its a monkey I can't shake! Would be interested to hear other feelings about the round.
Thanks |
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Posted: 7/12/2001 4:40:39 PM EDT
[#6]
Quoted: Not to go too far off topic but, what are the opinions of the .338 Ultra Mag? I own a Sendero SF in this caliber and am extremely happy with it. (lot of kick though...) Granted, its expensive at (almost) $2.50 per shot but, its a monkey I can't shake! Would be interested to hear other feelings about the round. Thanks I've heard some very reputable people hail the .338 Ultra Mag, and I've built quite a few (none for myself unfortunately.) The word is that the .338 Ultra Mag is like the big brother of the 300 WinMag - bigger and better. |
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Posted: 7/12/2001 4:44:42 PM EDT
[#7]
I'm partial to the 7mmSTW, shoots flat and hits hard. also 300winmag is another I have used.
next on the list is the ultramag !!! [x] |
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Posted: 7/12/2001 4:55:51 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted: I can hit anything anywhere (to 500 with 125's), and punch through metal better, where your .308 (or '06 or .270)won't even scratch the paint. Remember. Smaller bullets at insane velocities punch hard targets better then slower big rounds. (That's why I use 125 NBT's in my .300) You are correct about the penetration, HOWEVER..... Have you ever done any tests on how those lightwieght bullets preform AFTER they penetrate the metal? Lightwieght bullets will make neat little holes, but usually either: A: Leave 90% of the jacket in the metal (ever notice the copper rings around those neat holes in the metal?) leaving noting afterwords but a bunch of lead dust and small fragments B: Keep the jacket mostly intact, but fragment once they leave the metal anyway Either way you have made a neat little hole but not done much to anything behind it. I did some tests some time ago and found out that small fast bullets were great to penetrate but were useless in affecting anything behind the metal, wheras heavy rounds tended to stay together more often after they penetrated, or at least stay in larger fragments capable of doing more harm. The absolute winner in all these tests was GI AP rounds. Load em in 30-06 or 300WM (or 308 outside the US, the only nation stupid enough to consider .308 a handgun round) and you have some serious anti-material capability that punches through and continues to have a serious effect. It will also crack an engine block, after going through a fender, out to 800m, maybe more but that is all I have tested it to. See if your laser rounds will do that. |
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Posted: 7/12/2001 4:59:23 PM EDT
[#9]
Here is my baby:
Remington Sendero SF .338 Ultra Mag with Leupold VariX III 4.5-14x40mm Stainless (read:too damn expensive) [img]C:\SenderoSF338.jpg[/img] |
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Posted: 7/12/2001 5:03:17 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted: I shoot the best gun for the job. Not an "adequate" gun for the job. I also think for myself. I don't use rounds just because the millitary does. Why did the armed forces select the .308 for the primary Sniper weapon when there a littany of so many rounds available so superior to it (Mainly the hybrid 6MM's)?? Because they knew it, and [b]they had a shitload of it.[/b] Civillans aren't in such a boat. We aren't limited to select a gun because we just so happen to have a few million cases of it to burn up. We can select the best gun for the job. I shoot 125's out of my .300, and they are absolute LASERS. I can hit anything anywhere (to 500 with 125's), and punch through metal better, where your .308 (or '06 or .270)won't even scratch the paint. Remember. Smaller bullets at insane velocities punch hard targets better then slower big rounds. (That's why I use 125 NBT's in my .300) Finally somebody agrees with me. The .308 is not the other son of god. |
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Posted: 7/12/2001 5:16:19 PM EDT
[#11]
Quoted: Here is my baby: Remington Sendero SF .338 Ultra Mag with Leupold VariX III 4.5-14x40mm Stainless (read:too damn expensive) Let me try that again... [img]http://wsphotofews.excite.com/026/Tw/nm/LX/K582761.jpg[/img] |
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