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So I needed a deck built. I talked my landscaper who I have known for a while now, call him Jeff, and asked if he knew anyone. He knew a guy, his best friend, who has done construction work for 30 years and will be happy to help. The only thing is that this guy, call him Jim, lives 5 hours away but he will stay at Jeffs house during the week while he works on my Deck and goes home on the weekends. I meet with Jim and we draw up an agreement. He estimated about 3-4 weeks to finish the whole thing. He told me that he can guarantee quality of work but not speed so thats why 3-4 weeks. He said he would have a crew of 2-3 guys.



2 months goes by and Jim is still only 70% finished with the deck. He never got the crew he said he was going to get (just 1 Mexican helper he is training) and he takes half days on monday and Friday. He works extremely slowly. I was patient with him because he does excellent work and is truly a craftsman.  I ended up being friends with the guy. He is into guns and shooting, is a smart guy, we go to lunch all the time where I usually buy him his meal.



So one day Jim shows up with a big box. He says its counter top material for Jeff's kitchen. Apparently he is doing some work on their house as payment for letting him stay there. I said, why do you have this here? He said it was just easier to have it with him. Then he tells me, don't worry I would never work on it here while on your job I would wait until I'm done here. I said OK and left it at that.



The next day I noticed I haven't seen Jim working on the deck for a few hours (I work at home so I can keep tabs). I go out to my side yard to see where he is. What I find is him and his Mexican helper working working on Jeff's kitchen counter tops.  I said why are you doing this here? You said you would not work on it while on my time. He then counters with, well it's not technically your time, I am a contractor and I do not work hourly. He then says, look I really need to get this done, just do me a favor and let me work on this today so that Jeff's wife is happy or she will get mad if I don't have it done by tonight. I was so shocked I just left without a word.



I think what offended me most is that the guy didn't even have enough respect to ask me permisson if he could do the work while using MY house and MY property. If he had just came to me and said, "hey Kevin I know what I said yesterday but I am really under the gun on this, would you let me work on this today?" I would have probably said yes. Or if he had been ahead of schedule on the deck instead of 1 month BEHIND schedule maybe I wouldn't have cared. Instead I felt like he was sneaking it.  Maybe he figured since we struck a friendship I wouldn't care, I don't know..



He tells me I am overreacting and it's not a big deal. I feel like it is a big deal. If this happened to you how would you react? Is my reaction the correct one or am I indeed overreacting?

ibtp !

Is there a deadline written into the contract?

Was he using power tools (as in, your electricity) to do the work on the other project?

And yeah, I'd be ticked unless I was getting a really sweet deal on the price.

No deadline. He did tell me it would be slow but not nearly as slow as he said it would be. Yes I believe he was using my power. No I am not getting a sweet deal.



 

If you like his work,let him finish the deck and then send his ass packing!I am a contractor and if he is  on your job then he is there to work on your deck!!just bite your tong and let him finish so he don't half ass the rest!

 

Well the thing is that I do like his work. In fact he is scheduled to remodel my bathrooms next...



 

If you're paying him by the job, it doesn't matter how many people he hires or how many hours they work as long as it's done to spec in the time frame discussed.  If he was hitting deadlines on scope of work, I'd be inclined to let him slide on side work.  Clearly he's not hitting his dates.



I see you said there was not a contract completion date, but a verbal 3-4 weeks completion.  A smaller crew on HIS part means HE works more hours /week to hit the discussed completion.  Tell him to hurry it the fuck up.

Just grin and bear it. It's too late to go back to being All Business. You had a buddy get a buddy-there are always problems and hitches when construction is not done with timelines and draws tied to timelines and completion points.

As a contractor I don't mix jobs. It creates trust issues.

If I absolutely have to work on something, I make sure the customer knows and I'm not billing them. I usually work T&M.

Another thing is insurance and liability. If he cuts his hand off at your house while working on someone else's project, it could be a nightmare!

If he works this slow on a deck,How long do you think it will take him to do the bathrooms! Do you wont him in your house after he lied to you?

i used to do construction before i took a factory job,sounds to me you got one hell of a deck being built or he is just milking out the job, and no way in hell i would have him working on your bath room doing shit like working on other peoples prodjects while he is suppose to be working on your deck..

contractors...never trust them, they are lower than used car salesmen.

Spread the wealth!

Have him work on your bathroom while on someone else's project....

As a former professional contractor, that is unacceptable. Not just the time, but working on other projects. 3-4 weeks to build a deck? No way. And OK, I could understand if he told you 3-4 weeks, and because of two weeks of daily rain it took longer. But not 2 months!

And only one helper and he's working on another customer's project? Rediculous! It would be one thing if he had an entire crew out there building away––on time––and he took the liberty of doing a little side project on his own, while he had the tools rolled out. But not if he's behind on your job and low on help!

Just curious, was there any contract signed before work began? I speifically had a detailed contract that listed (among other things) tme necessary to complete project and a concrete payment schedule.

Well like I said it was this guy Jeff's project. As I stated in the OP he was working on some things in his home for free as payment for Jeff letting him stay there. As far as the contract the schedule was verbal It just had the description of the deck and cost.



 

I would let it slide but it took me NINE months to build a shower from the pan up working slowly but doing it right. This guy sounds like a year PER bathroom. Where is he going to stay during that if the landscapers wife gets tired of his ass. He will end up with you or he will beat feet back home.SS


I have sworn off doing ANY business with buddies of buddies.

Here is a rendering of the deck he is building I'll let you decide if its very elaborate. It's 750 square feet. Yes I am leary about him doing the bathrooms but maybe if I lay down a schedule..







 

It happened to us. We also suspect that some of the materials he charged to us went into the contruction project the contractor had going on athis own home at  the same time.

OP, you got too buddy-buddy with him.  When he showed up with that big box and told you he wouldn't think of working on it at your place, he was lying through his teeth, b/c that's exactly what he was planning and why he brought it with him.  

He wouldn't be doing any bathroom renovation on my place after all that either.  But maybe wait till he finishes your deck to tell him that...

Well one of his chief complaints about the time the deck is taking is that he is doing it during the middle of summer in south Florida. Brutal 93 degree high humidity weather and of course rain showers every now and then... Thats his excuse anyway..



 

The fucker LIED to YOU !!

I'm a handyman, and due to the size of my jobs and people's schedules sometimes I have to work on multiple jobs in the same time frame.  However, I would never do work for one job at a different site (especially without permission!), and I generally let people know what is going on with my scheduling.  Now, almost nothing ever gets done on time or under budget, but I'd say this guy's stretching the boundaries of politeness in using YOUR space and YOUR electricity for someone else's project.  I'd forgive him the half-days to work at the place where he's staying.  But if it were me I'd pack up my tools and take them back to my friend's house to work there, in his shoes.

In other words, I don't think you're overreacting much - I'd be a bit peeved in your place.

It isn't cool.  You haven't paid him up front, have you?

Very good point!

Nice deck by the way!  I'd maintain my composure with the guy, stay friendly (wouldn't be buying him meals anymore though), and smile, but keep the pressure on him to finish, pay him, and be done with him.

Yeah I know.. I have a hard to accepting it because I thought this guy was great up until then. I was truly shocked.



 

That deck is not complex in the slightest––not for a deck contractor worth his salt. Two weeks work, tops, for a good crew of 3 or 4 guys.

Now, for both the OP's and other's benefits, let me state: GET A WRITTEN CONTRACT BEFORE WORK BEGINS OR MONEY IS EXCHANGED!

A good contract should include:
-time to do the job
-a start and finish date
-a payment schedule
-materials and specific construction techniques to be used
-the exact scope of work
-working conditions (i.e., time work begins, time it ends, what days will be worked, bathroom acomodations, site clealiness, etc.)
-total cost of the project
-procedure for change orders
-dispute resolution

I'm sure I left out a few other important considerations, but it's been a few years since I did contracting professionally.

Good luck, OP. I'd try and make the best of the current situation with the deck––be firm, but don't piss the contractor off to the point where he either quits outright or does things half-ass. I would let him know upon completion of the deck that you've decided not to let him do the bathroom project, due to his lack of adherance to his timeline on the deck. Without a written contract (again, this is where it protects you), he has little recourse against breach of contract.

Yeah I am leaning toward this. It kind of pisses me off that the wife can motivate him to work on her stupid counter tops but he puts my deck on the back burner. I feel like his welcome is probably wearing thin over there as he mentioned he was looking for a place to stay in the area so as not to bother them.





 

Is that so?

He shouldnt as its poor form but if he isnt paid by the hour....Well...

He was generally honest up front in saying its going to take a while. If you dont have a set deadline in the contract and you dont pay him by the hour but rather by the job, I wouldnt lose any sleep over it. In fact, I dont think I'd care if he was drinking beer and dancing as long as he met the deadline.

I do full-scale house renovations. I mean studs-out renovations. I work with contractors and deadlines day-in, day-out.

THIS IS BOOOOLLLSHIIITTT.

The deck you have rendered there is NOT a complicated deck. It's not high off the ground, it doesn't have a lot of complicated woodwork or lots of complicated levels... It is not a complicated deck.

A deck like that SHOULD take a couple of weeks... TOPS. 2-3 weeks on the outside. The first few days should be spent putting in footings, and then go like gangbusters. 2 months is totally unacceptable.

The totally other part of this is him working on another job WHILE ON YOUR JOBSITE.

Personally, I'd have told him under no uncertain terms that it was not acceptable for him to work on another job while on site. He needs to take that elsewhere. Your house is his JOB. He needs to work on that job while he's there, not some other job. No need to be nasty, but setting down expectations is in no way wrong.

I manage construction contracts for the Navy. Pro tip - Get EVERYTHING in writing. My contracts w/ specs are sometimes over 500 pages

Excellent post. I am a new home owner so I am still learning I guess. I still feel like maybe I should give him a chance to do the bathrooms by outlining a better contract like you have above. I guess I am too easy with people. I dont know...



 

Sometimes the end result justifies putting up with the bullshit. When he finishes this deck, are you going to have something that you will be able to truly enjoy? More so than if someone else had done the job?

I could build your deck without a mexican in two weeks, working 6 hours a day for 2 weeks easy.  With my crew of salvedorians, a week no problem. It looks to be no higher than 18"-30" off the ground at its highest point.  How long did it take him to lay it out and bury posts?  Are you using 5/4 boards or 2x6s?

Kevin- If/ when your deck finally gets built, you will probably hate this contractor for a million things more important than this.

Dude, you said months??
Honestly, sounds like you are picking the wrong thing to be upset about.
Just a contractors point of view.

Pardon, let me address this...

I would in no way, ever, not ever hire this guy again. If the deck is taking this long, a bathroom renovation would get done a few minutes before NEVER.

In fact, I'd probably tell him under no uncertain terms that if the deck wasn't done by the end of next week, he could go home and someone else can finish the work. I hope to God you didn't pre-pay him.

5/4 IPE with hidden plastic fasteners. It took him two weeks just to put in the ledger board, bury posts, and put up the joists...



 

This.

Nice materials, I'll add a day for the fasteners.

Again I say this is some day-old, freeze-dried bullshit. Footings and structural elements should have taken the first 2-3 days, maximum. Maybe an extra day if you're working alone.

Most likely, this guy doesn't actually know what he's doing. If he's spending all day on the jobsite, it either means he doesn't know what he's doing or moves slower than my dead grandmother.

pic of what is done so far!

Gotta love contracts/specs that are the size of a phonebook and prints that look like a roll ov tyvek

Reminds me why I do residential work.

dark right now





 

Set up lights. The hive contractors demand it so we can be morally outraged by your deck builder!

I think your contractor is taking advantage of your patience. He also shouldn't be working on other jobs at your site. That's shady.





If you ever get squared away with him on the deck, see if he can put some windows on the back of your house.



 

NO!!! It's okay to be a new home owner, and it's okay to be inexperienced––that's why contractors are SUPPOSED to be PROFESSIONALS. As in, we listen to your needs and wants, and we come up with a plan to make that happen. If our price and design fits your budget and idea, then we execute that plan––as closely to time and budget as possible.

You have already been too nice in giving this guy unlimited time (and patience) to get the deck done. If he is this unprofessional with building the deck (a relatively simple project for a contractor), then there's no way things will get any better on the bathroom––the latter is arguably MORE difficult, as it requires mutliple trades, multiple permits, multiple contractors, and closely-meshed timelines.

Remember, this is a business deal, first and foremost. It's okay to become buddies with your contractor––after they demonstrate professional work, behavior, and you're satisfied with the outcome. You need to look out for yourself first; he's supposed to be a big boy, so he should be able to take the loss of the bathroom job in stride. Hopefully (if he's worth his salt), he'll learn from this ordeal and realize he needs to tighten up if he wants to remain in business for long.

At this point, if he's doing quality work, just let him finish up.  When you look back on this, the experience with him will be a distant memory and the product you have will be enjoyed for many years.  He probably got in over his head and is just trying to get everything perfect so you'll be happy in the long run.  It's frusterating now but look at it this way - you could have had someone finish it in a week and turn out half assed.  Then you have a half assed deck for as long as you live there as opposed to a finely crafted deck.

I'd do what a real man does, and cry about it and post on an internet forum.

Also, just curious, but how is this job costing you?