Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Site Notices
Posted: 10/2/2004 9:51:46 PM EST
Over the history of this planet mankind has given a lot of value to gold. But why? Gold has no use. It cant be made into anything of use because it is so soft. Why has it always been used for a measure of wealth?
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 9:54:01 PM EST
because if you take the "L" out of gold, what do you get?
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 9:54:30 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/2/2004 9:55:50 PM EST by raven]
Because of the difficulty and expense involved in extracting it. It's difficult and hard work to mine gold on any scale. Whether it's just you and a pan or with a giant strip mine and cyanide leach amalgamation.

As for why do men value it intrinsically? All that's important is that they always have, and probably always will.
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 9:56:18 PM EST

Originally Posted By raven:
Because of the difficulty and expense involved in extracting it. It's difficult and hard work to mine gold on any scale. Whether it's just you and a pan or with a giant strip mine and cyanide leach amalgamation.



That reminds me of when I was in school they gave us a book about shopping and how things like, gold, meat, certain clothes and a few other things were bad for the enviroment,
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 9:56:18 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/2/2004 9:56:52 PM EST by MT_Pockets]
But gold is used for many things....the computer you are sitting infront of has gold in it. The space shuttle has gold in it.

And the rapper's teef down the street have gold in them too.

MT
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 9:57:16 PM EST
thats not street, but "screet".
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 9:59:13 PM EST

Originally Posted By Taxman:

Originally Posted By raven:
Because of the difficulty and expense involved in extracting it. It's difficult and hard work to mine gold on any scale. Whether it's just you and a pan or with a giant strip mine and cyanide leach amalgamation.



That reminds me of when I was in school they gave us a book about shopping and how things like, gold, meat, certain clothes and a few other things were bad for the enviroment,



Not that I'd be surprised, but did your text say your very existence on Earth as a human was bad for the environment? A lot of the enviro-nutsos believe that.
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 9:59:21 PM EST

Originally Posted By MT_Pockets:
But gold is used for many things....the computer you are sitting infront of has gold in it. The space shuttle has gold in it.

And the rapper's teef down the street have gold in them too.

MT



Used for dental purposes. like that rapper that carries a huge clock on a "GOLD" chain
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 9:59:23 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/2/2004 10:00:19 PM EST by MT_Pockets]

thats not street, but "screet".


Sorry I forgot to axe you tha right way to spell it.

MT
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 10:00:51 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/2/2004 10:02:21 PM EST by Taxman]

Originally Posted By raven:

Originally Posted By Taxman:

Originally Posted By raven:
Because of the difficulty and expense involved in extracting it. It's difficult and hard work to mine gold on any scale. Whether it's just you and a pan or with a giant strip mine and cyanide leach amalgamation.



That reminds me of when I was in school they gave us a book about shopping and how things like, gold, meat, certain clothes and a few other things were bad for the enviroment,



Not that I'd be surprised, but did your text say your very existence on Earth as a human was bad for the environment? A lot of the enviro-nutsos believe that.




No it didnt say that.

But its hearing stuff like that for 12 years that is damaging the youth of society

Heraring about that for a week but spending 1 day on the Bill of rights.
Wathcing the Lion Kind 11 times in the 11th grade.
Lots of other things, I cant remember then all anymore
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 10:00:59 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 10:02:38 PM EST

Originally Posted By WI_Rifleman:
Gold has no use. It cant be made into anything of use because it is so soft. Why has it always been used for a measure of wealth?



To answer the second one, because people like it .
And not always though. In celtic cultures silver was the measure of wealth. Not gold.


To answer the first one, pull your processor out. Note the color of the pins. Gold has a couple thousand uses, many of them relating to electronics.
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 10:05:57 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/2/2004 10:09:09 PM EST by raven]
Here's an interesting article about platinum. Platinum today's worth more than gold because it is rarer and so useful in industry. But until technology developed to a certain point, it was basically worthless, and no one wanted it. Gold has never been treated like this,even though it is more common.

Platinum: The Precious and Pretentious Metal
Article #697

by Larry Gedney

This article is provided as a public service by the Geophysical Institute, University of Alaska Fairbanks, in cooperation with the UAF research community. Larry Gedney is a seismologist at the Institute.

Among the 50 states, only Alaska can lay claim to being a commercial producer of platinum, the fabled metal of kings whose rarity exceeds that of gold. Over half a million ounces of the metal have been extracted by placer operations near the village of (what else?) Goodnews Bay in Southwest Alaska.

Fabled and rare it is, but in truth, platinum doesn't have much of a history and the little that it does have has been mainly one of frustration to kings and chemists alike. Because of its extremely high melting point (3,216 degrees F., as compared with 1,944 F. for gold) and its virtual indestructibility, it is highly valued in industry, in medicine and in the sciences. These features also make it maddeningly difficult to process and purify. Trade secrets of platinum refiners are as jealously guarded as any of those used by the petroleum industry.

To add to the woes of platinum-producing nations, the dreamed-of riches which they hoped that the rare metal would bring never materialized. Gold, though more common, has always been preferred for coinage.

The story of platinum's involvement in modern history really begins in Columbia with gold placer mining operations by the Spanish conquistadors during the late 1600s. To the annoyance of panners, small grains of a gray-white metal continually settled out with the gold. The Spanish referred to the tiny pellets by the derogatory term "platina," meaning "little silver." It was such a nuisance that several operations had been abandoned on its account. It was first brought to Europe in 1735, in the hope that some use might be found for it, but metallurgists in Spain, England and France were unable to do much with the metal. In fact, they couldn't even melt it.

The key to doing that came in 1774, when Joseph Priestly succeeded in isolating oxygen. The French chemist Antoine Lavoisier then tried directing a stream of that gas onto charcoal to generate enough heat, and was able to melt platinum for the first time.

With this accomplished, Spain, which still held a monopoly on the world's supply of platinum in Columbia, suddenly saw a virtue in the previously despised metal. In 1778, King Charles of Spain decreed by royal edict that "platinum was to be worked exclusively for His Majesty," and that all subjects who possessed samples were to hand them over without payment. He also demanded that his scientists work in absolute secrecy to protect their discoveries in platinum research from duplication--an attitude which apparently persists to this day.

Napoleon discourteously interrupted the king's plans for growing wealthy on platinum by invading Spain in 1794. As a consequence the techniques which had been painstakingly developed for handling platinum were lost for many years.

By 1820, commercial uses were being found for what platinum was available. Although the platinum trade had now opened up after Columbia had won independence from Spain, most of the easily accessible deposits were almost depleted.

But then, new discoveries were made in the Ural Mountains, and Russia was soon supplying 92 percent of the world's platinum. As Spain had done before, Russia declared a state monopoly, forbidding the export of the unrefined metal and limiting all refining to the St. Petersburg mint. Nicholas I of Russia hoped to use this metallic wealth to enhance Russia's power and influence, and in 1828 he ordered the minting of hundreds of thousands of platinum coins.

It must have come as a bitter surprise to Nicholas that nobody in the world market wanted to trade for his coins. This situation must stand as one of the classic examples of all time that having a monopoly on, say, blivets, doesn't necessarily mean that people will beat a path to your door. Russia did not learn this lesson until it had used almost half a million troy ounces of platinum in an effort to make it a medium of exchange comparable to gold and silver. The coins were withdrawn from circulation in 1846.

That was the last platinum fiasco. Since then, platinum has done quite well for itself on the world market. It is a more stable

The coins were finally commodity in the metals market than either gold or silver, but the reason for this lies in its many uses and not in its intrinsic value. The keen edge it maintains on your Platinum Plus razor blade and its use in the catalytic converter in your car are daily reminders of its more mundane uses. The price you pay for a piece of platinum jewelry tells you that it's not common and that it's not easy to produce. More important, it has many exotic uses in space, engineering and science technology for which it's all but irreplaceable.
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 10:20:40 PM EST
Shiny objects... mmmmmm...
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 11:19:42 PM EST
Looks pretty => women want it => you must get it.
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 11:23:28 PM EST
Because I said so. Thats why.
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 11:39:30 PM EST

Golds only value is the fact that it's a better medium of exchange than the alternatives, such as debt instruments.

An economy built on debt is an abomination.

God created gold to be money.
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 11:47:08 PM EST
Supply and demand determine the price.
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 11:50:56 PM EST
Gold’s value is based on its rarity as an element , FWIW there are several others that are much more expensive .

There was also a Tin Hat rumor that the government found a huge gold deposit in Yellowstone back in the 30's . So big that it would have devalued Gold to the price of Copper . Which would have destroyed the dollar which was based on federally held Gold reserves at the time .

Supposedly they blasted a large landslide to cover it and divert a river that
was exposing it
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 12:13:21 AM EST
Gold and platinum are immutable. They are non-reactive, don't corrode and don't tarnish. Before the industrial revolution and vast pollution, silver was the same way. They're easy to work, very bling....Gold implements were the safest to eat with. Silver was once popular because a silver cup reacted with just about anything that would kill you, poison wise, and tended to kill dangerous organizms. It made the food tasters feel better.
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 4:11:21 AM EST
Gold, and most anything without inherent usefulness or value, is valuable because people believe it is, just like the US dollar. And, other people want it. If people start to disdain gold and gold items and not value it anymore, it will drop in value.

It is valuable as long as other people will accept it as a medium of trade.

jf1

Link Posted: 10/3/2004 4:15:52 AM EST
In the U.S. Geological Survey report on gold early in 2002, they have the following to say on above ground gold. "Of an estimated 128,000 tons of gold ever mined (Worldwide), about 15% is thought to have been lost, used in dissipative industrial uses, or otherwise unrecoverable or unaccounted for. Of the remaining 108,000 tons, an estimated 34,000 tons is official stocks held by central banks and about 74,000 tons is privately held as coin, bullion, and jewelry." It is the central bank gold that has helped create a problem. On first glance, having 34,000 tons of gold sitting in central bank vaults, approximately 27% of all the gold mined from the dawn of civilization,



YEARLY GOLD SUPPLY AND DEMAND NUMBERS

We now need to review the recent supply/demand numbers for gold. Turning to the USGS official publications5, we find they list worldwide mine production for gold at 2,460 tons in 1998, and 2330 tons in 1999. The average for these two years is close to 2,400 tons, so we will use this figure in our analysis. On the demand side, the World Gold Council6 had this to say recently about gold demand: "Gold demand remained strong during the first quarter of 2000. Total demand of 795.2 tonnes maintained the level of the first quarter of 1999, when demand went on to set a record for the full year." According to the WGC's latest publication, the average annual gold demand worldwide for the last five years has been 2,938 tons, with 1999 usage at 3,280 tons. We should note that the WGC states in the literature that these numbers are not complete, because they only include statistics from countries they feel have reliable numbers. An estimate for the total world demand would be at least 10% higher than these numbers. In this analysis, we will use a conservative number for world usage of 3,000 tons; fully realizing this figure is probably low by several hundred tons. When we compare these numbers, 2,400 tons of supply and 3,000 tons of demand, we come up with a deficit of 600 tons annually (Other sources project this deficit to be over twice this amount). This deficit has been covered from central bank holdings.

JUST HOW MUCH GOLD REMAINS TO BE MINED?

We have set the stage for the introduction of our missing link. Which is simply, how much gold remains unmined in the crust of the earth for future mining operations? For this number we go again to the USGS7. Their most recent official publication states that there remains only 49,000 tons of gold available for future recovery. This should turn on a lightbulb in our consciousness. Let's examine why!

We previously mentioned that from the dawn of civilization only 128,000 tons of gold has been mined. Of this amount, only about 108,000 tons remain (For a discussion of gold throughout recorded history, see Endnote8). We just learned that from now until the end of time we have only 49,000 more tons of gold available. That is a frightening revelation. We are consuming gold at the rate of 3,000 tons per year. That means we only have about 16 years of gold available until we run out of gold to mine. What happens then? Doesn't this information make it apparent that it is the height of folly for world governments to be currently wasting our gold reserves? Isn't it also obvious that it is again the height of folly to have an official policy to depress the price of gold when this only increases consumption and moves forward the date when we run out of gold? I think so. An artificially low price of gold increases consumption while simultaneously decreasing production due to unprofitable mining operations. A crisis is brewing, and few people are aware of what is happening. They are focusing on current above ground supply (Which is likely smaller than they believe) and are not looking to the future. This is a perilous error, which will be made even worse by another factor we need to introduce at this point in our discussion, namely, population growth.

Link Posted: 10/3/2004 4:21:56 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 4:24:31 AM EST
Because it's easier to carry than a wallet full of clam shells.
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 4:28:02 AM EST
Technically, it's not valuable anymore. It's because man covets it.
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 4:28:44 AM EST
I saw a show on PBS not that long ago, that showed how much gold was used in electronics. They then showcased a company in CA that reprocesses electronics to salvage the gold. Each computer processor had about 1/100th oz gold in it, with a similar amount in various PC boards. As I recall, they were saying that it cost about $5 to reclaim the gold per CPU.

$500/oz to reclaim, and the gold is only worth about $400ish. BUT, it does get it back into circulation.
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 4:30:50 AM EST

Originally Posted By raven:
Because of the difficulty and expense involved in extracting it. It's difficult and hard work to mine gold on any scale. Whether it's just you and a pan or with a giant strip mine and cyanide leach amalgamation.



Not to nitpick, but cyanide leaching and amalgamation are two entirely different processes.

There's a lot of platinum jewelry. Once women found out it is more expensive and doesn't tarnish like silver they wanted it.
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 4:33:12 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/3/2004 4:34:23 AM EST by IamtheNRA]

Originally Posted By fight4yourrights:
We previously mentioned that from the dawn of civilization only 128,000 tons of gold has been mined. Of this amount, only about 108,000 tons remain (For a discussion of gold throughout recorded history, see Endnote8). We just learned that from now until the end of time we have only 49,000 more tons of gold available. That is a frightening revelation. We are consuming gold at the rate of 3,000 tons per year. That means we only have about 16 years of gold available until we run out of gold to mine. What happens then? Doesn't this information make it apparent that it is the height of folly for world governments to be currently wasting our gold reserves? Isn't it also obvious that it is again the height of folly to have an official policy to depress the price of gold when this only increases consumption and moves forward the date when we run out of gold? I think so. An artificially low price of gold increases consumption while simultaneously decreasing production due to unprofitable mining operations. A crisis is brewing, and few people are aware of what is happening. They are focusing on current above ground supply (Which is likely smaller than they believe) and are not looking to the future. This is a perilous error, which will be made even worse by another factor we need to introduce at this point in our discussion, namely, population growth.




Is that an official USGS article??? Sounds like FUD from a tinfoil hat site...

Don't forget that we reclaim and recycle much of the gold used in electronics.
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 4:46:17 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/3/2004 9:47:50 AM EST by cmjohnson]
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 4:58:27 AM EST
Gold is valuable because chicks dig it!!
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 4:58:56 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 5:05:00 AM EST

I know the answer to this question, because I got it wrong on my economics test.

I couldn't figure out why gold is a commodity (item having value outside of money, such as spices, tobacco, whiskey, or guns). It is because of its rarity as a precious metal. Others have already made many good posts, so I dont think I need to repeat it all.
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 5:10:56 AM EST
Gold=teh shinay pretties
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 5:25:50 AM EST
Evolution is the real answer. Take notes now because I might give a quiz later. When the human was evolving from his earlier form; be it ape or less advanced type of human which ever you believe in, he spent every waking minute trying to find enough to eat and not be eaten himself. It consumed his entire day. Then through evolution his mind developed enough to allow him to invent tools and weapons that made hunting/gathering and defense easier and more effective. This gave him FREE TIME. A luxury that had never been available before. Free time allowed man to think about things not directly related to staying alive and his thoughts turned to things that would make his life more comfortable. Art, sport, amusement, hobby, decoration, etc. Gold was discovered to be an element that was easy to form with primitive tools, stayed attractive with no maintenance, and was appealing to the eye. Once it was made into something to adorn the body or dwelling another person would envy the item and that gave the item value. Ivory, bone, seashells and other materials were used also but gold has retained a value throughout history.
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 6:22:42 AM EST

Originally Posted By WI_Rifleman:
why? Gold has no use.



Ummmm, wrong. Gold is one of the most useful metals. That combined with its beauty, its scarcity and its difficulty in extraction create its value.
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 6:30:05 AM EST
I prefer Platinum.
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 6:34:17 AM EST

Originally Posted By cmjohnson:
In fact, gold is so difficult to attack chemically that the only acid that will dissolve it is Aqua Regia, a mixture of nitric and sulfuric acid.



Again, not to nitpick, but Aqua Regia is a mixture of nitric and hydrochloric acid. It forms nitrosyl chloride (NOCl) which is the actual chemical that attacks and dissolves gold forming the soluble trichloride.
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 6:42:42 AM EST
Gold is so expensive because of it's unique ability to get you inside a girls pants…

Andy
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 6:46:50 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 7:02:44 AM EST

Originally Posted By DigDug:
You guys do realize that we can make real gold. It is very expensive, but if the time comes that we need more and the price is high enough, we can make our own.



That's news to me. When did alchemy prove feasible?
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 7:06:22 AM EST
b/c its shiny!!!

or maybe cause previouse generations and people considered it valuable; traditions die hard

or maybe cause it is a quiete resillent material as it does not corrode or change color when exposed to the elements like iron or copper

it stays shiny!!!!!!!
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 7:17:14 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/3/2004 7:21:06 AM EST by DigDug]
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 7:19:34 AM EST
It (Gold) is thought to be more abundant in the sea with about 70 million metric tons of  gold dissolved in sea water and as much as 10 billion metric tons deposited on the ocean floor.

www.chemistry.pomona.edu/Chemistry/periodic_table/Elements/Gold/gold.htm
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 7:31:44 AM EST
My favorite was the y2k idiots that were stocking up on gold. If the world really had collapsed, do you think anyone would have cared about a heavy-ass metal?
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 7:31:46 AM EST
actually it has nothing to do with what it is worth or how much their is /isn't,

Gold is used - almost world wide- by various nations as an exchange value of their national currency.

It secures the value of paper money by pegging its value against a recognized universal asset.

complicated? Not really. It is simply intended to ensure that the paper is redeemable for something with a universal value.

not to mention the Bling factor

Link Posted: 10/3/2004 7:41:35 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 7:50:01 AM EST
Gold gold gold!! all you faggots! shut up! Lead with a nice patina of Copper over it is all I need. Oh yeah, plus some Brass (Copper & Zinc alloy).
Link Posted: 10/3/2004 7:53:06 AM EST
Top Top