Posted: 11/18/2002 5:26:30 PM EDT
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I know, for some, I've just insulted the holy grail. "Oh crap, how could he say that?" Well, I've about it with these people who are so nuts about Redhat and Linux. Really. No matter where I go, I always run into someone who used Linux and says 'why are you running Solaris (or windows), you should run Linux' or ' For example, I called the help desk today at my place of my employment to open a ticket for one of my Solaris servers that was no longer able to access another server in the company because the account had expired. Anyhow, I get the tech on the phone and we start chatting while he fixes the issue. He asks me what the OS of the server is and I told him that it was Solaris 8 on a Sun Ultra 5. There was just silence on the other end of the phone and then he said "you know, you should really think about running Redhat - it is much better and blows Solaris out of the water". Really, I say. I tell him that I would have disagree with that statement, since I tried to use Redhat on a couple of webservers and it didn't come close to Solaris in terms of performance. Well, that set the Redhat dude off and he started on the speech where he tells me that I don't know how to config Redhat and blah blah blah. That pretty much set me off, since I already was having a bad day and I told him that he sounds exactly like the people who swear that Windows is the only OS to use and all other suck. No, No, he says. More Redhat crap from him, some who-ha about performance tests and crap. Whatever. Each OS has it's pros and cons. You use what is best for your needs. For me, it's Solaris and Windows. Not Redhat. Say what you want, but Solaris and Windows out-perform Redhat any day of the week in the way I use them. My .02 |
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You go Pete! [:)] I run with whatever I can talk the owner into and know that it will stay up, or I can at least understand how to keep it up. For me, it is MS and Cisco. I am thinking about considering the possibility of maybe using Linux to run Seti@home for fun. [:D] We go with what we know. Bob |
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I hate linux biggots. They can keep their shitty drivers for $OBSOLETE_CARD written by 3rd world lowlifes who can't get anything faster than a 386. I run about 100 Solaris machines ranging from solaris 2.6-9 on machines from ultra2 - E6500 (and our new Fujitsu machines). We also have about 4 *BSD machines and a few [cringe] SCO [/cringe] Linux has it's place I suppose if you'r really too poor to afford sun/ibm/hp hardware, and _NEED_ all these new gui's that they keep shoehorning into the already bloated ass linux. I'll quit ranting now. |
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Yeah, that's the other thing I forgot. They spend all this time trying to make their GUIs look like Windows. Have you seen KDE or GNOME lately? I looks like Windows - why not just run windows. Look at CDE - it hasn't changed in years, and most Solaris admins I know don't use it anyhow- they do it on the command line - like i do. I prefer it, you actually learn. Ok, i think I am almost done ranting.... Quoted: I hate linux biggots. They can keep their shitty drivers for $OBSOLETE_CARD written by 3rd world lowlifes who can't get anything faster than a 386. I run about 100 Solaris machines ranging from solaris 2.6-9 on machines from ultra2 - E6500 (and our new Fujitsu machines). We also have about 4 *BSD machines and a few [cringe] SCO [/cringe] Linux has it's place I suppose if you'r really too poor to afford sun/ibm/hp hardware, and _NEED_ all these new gui's that they keep shoehorning into the already bloated ass linux. I'll quit ranting now. |
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Quoted: Yeah, that's the other thing I forgot. They spend all this time trying to make their GUIs look like Windows. Have you seen KDE or GNOME lately? I looks like Windows - why not just run windows. Look at CDE - it hasn't changed in years, and most Solaris admins I know don't use it anyhow- they do it on the command line - like i do. I prefer it, you actually learn. I'll quit ranting now. Anyone who is a linux user and makes their X setup look like windows is NOT a power linux user. I'm sorry, but the windows environment is one of the least efficient I've ever used at getting something done. As a long time linux user (11 years, by my count, starting from kernel .93) I've grown quite fond of the OS myself. I used to be quite the slackware bigot because I didn't like the automation that Redhat offered, but as I started getting a lot busier and got my hands dirty on the administration side of solaris, I began to fall in love with good package managers. I have adminned enormous networks - from 1500 solaris machines to 500 linux machines to a heterogeneous network of bsdi, hpux, solaris, and aix. My take on things : Linux on good hardware and with a solid kernel is as reliable as solaris as far as dependability and uptime concerns. Solaris does have quite an edge when it comes to handling incredibly heavy loads(See Hotmail) but FreeBSD/BSDi will beat out any of the OS's in terms of network performance. I've never been a big fan of CDE - I felt it was rather underpowered for what you could actually do with the machine you were sitting on. Not only that, but the GUI apps that it offered were usually worthless. Most people were forced to use the command line completely in order to do anything because there was not a GUI application that was worth a snot. IRIX, on the other hand, has incredibly wonderful GUI applications for routine system administration tasks. I am a command line junkie myself - my linux desktop (which is Enlightenment, coincidentally) spans two monitors and is covered in open terminals. I use mutt as a mail reader, opera as a browser, and vmware to run that crappy MS OS so I can read my work email and use the VPN. Ugh. Either way, this system (a dual 750 P3 w/a gig of ram) runs incredibly smooth, and I have been unable to crash it in the last 3 years. It's been through several processor upgrades, and has actually become the home of the 180G raid5 fileserver. Linux has its place. The development that is ongoing will push it more and more into the server market. My company released a notice to the world in the last year or two that we are officially supporting Linux on our high end servers. I don't think we would be dumb enough to do that if we didn't think the OS could handle the large loads our customers expect them to. I know all you SYSV rivetheads are spinning in fury, but the truth is that linux is more adaptable to intel hardware than any other OS available right now. Period. If you want specialized unix hardware, yeah - the native OS will run better. But I can build a Linux server with a massive amount of ram and more processors for the same price of one Ultra 30. This makes a difference when you start counting the pennies. And shame on you all for looking at the packaged setup that comes with the OS and judging it by that! I can't think of using a Solaris system without installing *all* of the gnu utilities ... although with recent releases, they've started doing that for me. Who developed those ... hrm... :) I view Linux as the toolbox of unix os's. It'll install on anything, runs reliably, and has support for almost every piece of intel hardware on the planet. Solaris is still my choice for high load servers, but I'm still using apache and not netscape commerce .... The Linux world has brought huge improvements to the entire unix arena. Don't let the monkeys who are trying to jump on the unix bandwagon turn you off to an incredible tool. (You wouldn't give up samba because it emulates a windows product, would you?) Doc Linux Bigot |
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I like Solaris [:)] and linux. They have their place. Solaris on a good Sparc box is an excellent enterprise platform. Linux on a PC is a good desktop. Linux on a PC server is a good low-end solution for a lot of things. Personally, I prefer FreeBSD instead. Heh, once at a LAN party I had a headless setup and a keyboard with no letters. Had to start the quake server. Is using the command line such a dead art that that's impressive anymore? |
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I've had some excellent pro-Windows/anti-Linux rants on here in the past. But I agree that each operating system has its pros and cons. The reason that I hate RedHat is different. I recently recommended RedHat for a clustered database environment (Oracle 9i). The intention was to consolidate about 16 different disparate development machines down to a primary and tertiery with redundant failover via clustering. Even though we develop for the Windows environment, the Oracle TNS listener doesn't care what operating system it's loaded on. (our applications use ODBC instead of ADO) So in a bid to save some licensing dollars, I spec and order two kickass Dell servers with RedHat instead Windows Advanced Server. They are delivered and I have wood. I work and work and work for several days trying to set up the clustering. I try recompiling the kernel a couple of ways. Turns out... RedHat BOUGHT the company whose clustering software they are using and took it out of GNU circulation. You now have to PURCHASE a SUPPORT AGREEMENT with RedHat in order to gain access to this software download. The cheapest support tier per machine costs..... THE SAME PRICE AS WINDOWS 2000 SERVER. Are you frickin' believing it? Oh by the way.... Oracle doesn't certify Mandrake or Caldera. Aren't you loving this?? So anyway... now I am working with OptimalJ from Compuware. I set up a RedHat server with Apache/Tomcat and Struts. I have long been a HUGE flag waver of Microsoft and especially .NET development. But lately, J2EE has been calling out to me so I followed. It's not that tough, especially when you flip $4K for a serious IDE like OptimalJ. |
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BLACKBIRD_PILOT I wanna work there!! That's awesome. I manage a lot (>300) of linux, bsd, solaris, irix, and osX workstations where I work and I wish that we had more linux. Solaris is such a pain in the ass sometimes and osX is just completely impossible to remote manage. I was on the phone with Sun tech support the other day, (it's amazing how often I stump them with the most mundane things) and the tech was telling me all about how they are abandoning cde and moving over to gnome. Thank god. I heard a rumor too that the newest Sun OS (sunlinux) is really a red had 7.3 derivative. I can't say that I'm fond of Redhat at all, and I'm a RHCE, but I'd take it over sloaris or osX any day. |
| I've always been tought that one of the first things a helpdesk guy should learn is "don't p*ss off the guy on the other end of the line." There is usually a reason why they are using one platform over another, and if they feel there's something better, hook them up with a sales guy or send them product info. The "honest opinion" gene in tech types seems to fire off at the wrong time, and telling somebody they are an idiot or they should stop smoking crack is not the way to improve the situation. We once had a guy, second week on the helpdesk, get a call from a member of the senior management at our office. The guy was having browser problems. The tech put the guy on "hold", said to the other helpdesk guy, "this f*cking idiot should have his pc taken away!" The other tech told him to look at the "hold" light. He was never put on "hold" and the tech was let go the same day! |