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Posted: 3/28/2012 6:34:23 PM EDT
Customer: "Yeah, I'm looking for a tactical light for my Noveske. I bet you haven't even heard of Noveske, have you?"
Me: "I've owned a Noveske N4 with a 14.5 inch cold hammer forged barrel and carbine length gas system."
Customer: "Oh, well I'm looking for something that I can stick on to make it look cool."
Me: "Well, we do carry the Surefire X300 and Streamlight TLR-1, which are extremely high quality weapon lights."
Customer: "What about that UTG over there?"

Customer: "I need a tactical optic for my AR."
Me: "We have Eotechs, Leupold, Burris, etc."
Customer: "I'll take that BSA scope."

Customer: "Do you have any .338 Lapua Magnum?"
Me: "Right here."
Customer: *Scoffs at our $84.97 price tag and proceeds to buy a bolt action .50 BMG. On the way out he picks up a UTG bipod.*



I'm not a gun snob or anything as I'm probably more broke than most of my customers, but damn.
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 6:44:57 PM EDT
It doesn't really matter. Most of them probably don't shoot their guns anyway.
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 6:52:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Vespid_Wasp:
It doesn't really matter. Most of them probably don't shoot their guns anyway.


This.

When I wasn't getting any range time, Tapco, tasco, and UTG shit seemed good enough.

Once I started putting it to hard use (finally had some pocket change for shooting) I realized how shitty the chinese shit is.

Also, the AR15 tech forums will empty your fucking pockets very quickly.

I took a 900 dollar no name AR A2 carbine, and eventually replaces every part but the barrel with higher quality shit and it now has a Comp M4 and troy BUIS etc.

$$$$$
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 7:07:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Vespid_Wasp:
It doesn't really matter. Most of them probably don't shoot their guns anyway.


hahahaha
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 7:50:17 PM EDT
When you sell this stuff all day, it gets tiring. I'm fucking sick and tired of telling people "Don't buy cheap shit or it'll break" only to have them come back later with pile-o-broken-shit and the attitude that it's somehow my fault for failing to will them out of their ignorance. What it boils down to is experience in firing lots of rounds downrange with a variety of weapons, but trying to communicate the importance of that to most people seems almost impossible at times. "Well, I want an optic that's perfect for home defense, but will let me see my bullet holes from my Bushmaster M4A3 at 600 yards, and I don't want to spend more than $75." Because you have to ask the question, you aren't ready yet to really understand the answer. Go forth, buy a basic weapon, and learn from experience on the range. But that's not the popular answer because it costs money and time and can't be wrapped up and shoved into a Dosko case in ten minutes.
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 8:18:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Vespid_Wasp:
It doesn't really matter. Most of them probably don't shoot their guns anyway.

/thread


People who shoot from a bench once a year don't care about the shit on their guns.
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 8:26:34 PM EDT
I have a utg bipod beside it wiggling a little, It's not bad.

Will it effect accuracy?


Link Posted: 3/28/2012 8:35:28 PM EDT
Not everything needs to be "top shelf" I have a utg mount that has held the light on my duty rifle for years.
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 8:37:41 PM EDT
Originally Posted By texas_mustang_01:

Originally Posted By Vespid_Wasp:
It doesn't really matter. Most of them probably don't shoot their guns anyway.

/thread


People who shoot from a bench once a year don't care about the shit on their guns.


Some of us buy the best just to be able to look at it on the shelf/in the safe. Not going to shoot it, might get it dirty.
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 8:41:40 PM EDT
I'm not a big fan of UTG, but I've seen BSA and Tasco stuff get the S beat out of it and keep ticking. Even if it keeps breaking you can buy 10 of them for the cost of an Aimpoint. Most people aren't going to break something 10 times.

Now for those that like to just buy something once and have it forever (which I tend to do once I know what I want), buy the Eotechs, Leupolds, Trijicon stuff.
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 8:45:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/28/2012 8:51:05 PM EDT by Noname]


Massive LOL ––––––- But dude YOU'RE stocking and selling the shit ––––––––––––––- why complain...?!!






ETA –––––– looks like they're attempting to improve product...


http://www.leapers.com/prod_detail.php?mitem=&level1=&level2=&itemno=MTU004&status=utg












Link Posted: 3/28/2012 8:56:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Daytona955i:
I'm not a big fan of UTG, but I've seen BSA and Tasco stuff get the S beat out of it and keep ticking. Even if it keeps breaking you can buy 10 of them for the cost of an Aimpoint. Most people aren't going to break something 10 times.

Now for those that like to just buy something once and have it forever (which I tend to do once I know what I want), buy the Eotechs, Leupolds, Trijicon stuff.


Most people aren't going to shoot their gun 10 times either, for that matter, but I don't base my purchasing decisions on their follies.

Personally, if I buy an optic I want to know that it's not going to fail me in the middle of a competition stage, while attending a training class, or while spending my hard-earned money out at the range for a day of practice with expensive ammunition. The expense of a poorly made tool is usually much greater than its cost was.
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 8:57:26 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 9:13:02 PM EDT
I have Utg light and rail on my ar had it for a few years now it's a little heavier than IDE like but for $50 it's rock solid. Also lots of Utg is made in the USA now .
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 9:16:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/28/2012 9:18:48 PM EDT by DanTSX]
Originally Posted By Vespid_Wasp:
It doesn't really matter. Most of them probably don't shoot their guns anyway.


+1

And if they do, it's off the bench at a random bullseye. "yep, It's still zeroed" and back it goes back into the safe after 3 hours of oanistic cleaning.
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 9:30:07 PM EDT
You need to develop a UTG Premier line, that would involve some embossed lettering filled with gold paint and some special screws that require a metric torx driver to tighten or loosen. I bet you could charge double.

On the other hand, that utg front sight flashlight mount on my rifle is still going strong.
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 10:07:30 PM EDT
If it looks like it, then it is the same. All 1911's are the same, all AR-15's are the same, all AK's are the same, all FAL's are the same, all ACOG's are the same, all mags are the same, etc....

Plus most people dont feel comfortable paying out the nose for high quality gear, when nobody is going to appreciate their taste anyway and the ones that are dont know anybetter.
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 10:38:51 PM EDT
Originally Posted By AzNooB:
Customer: "Yeah, I'm looking for a tactical light for my Noveske. I bet you haven't even heard of Noveske, have you?"
Me: "I've owned a Noveske N4 with a 14.5 inch cold hammer forged barrel and carbine length gas system."
Customer: "Oh, well I'm looking for something that I can stick on to make it look cool."
Me: "Well, we do carry the Surefire X300 and Streamlight TLR-1, which are extremely high quality weapon lights."
Customer: "What about that UTG over there?"

Customer: "I need a tactical optic for my AR."
Me: "We have Eotechs, Leupold, Burris, etc."
Customer: "I'll take that BSA scope."

Customer: "Do you have any .338 Lapua Magnum?"
Me: "Right here."
Customer: *Scoffs at our $84.97 price tag and proceeds to buy a bolt action .50 BMG. On the way out he picks up a UTG bipod.*



I'm not a gun snob or anything as I'm probably more broke than most of my customers, but damn.



You actually said all that? Sometimes I thank God for the simplicity found in m14 discussion circles.

"What kind of barrel do you have?"
"Medium profile"
"Chrome lined?"
"No, why? You writing my life story or something?"
"Twist rate?"
"Fuck off!"
Link Posted: 3/28/2012 11:33:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 5robert25:
Not everything needs to be "top shelf" I have a utg mount that has held the light on my duty rifle for years.


THIS.


Vortex, Primary, UTG, and BSA will make 90% of the shooters who walk through the door happy. They don't need it to hold zero for 15 billion rounds, or withstand some fat instructor throwing it down range to prove how "tough" it is.


Link Posted: 3/29/2012 12:33:49 AM EDT
Meanwhile, they get back to the trailer, break out some buds, turn the NASCAR race one and wait for some bros to show up and check out the new toys for the gat. Everyone will be wicked jealous of the add-ons.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 1:27:56 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Jimmeh:
Originally Posted By 5robert25:
Not everything needs to be "top shelf" I have a utg mount that has held the light on my duty rifle for years.


THIS.


Vortex, Primary, UTG, and BSA will make 90% of the shooters who walk through the door happy. They don't need it to hold zero for 15 billion rounds, or withstand some fat instructor throwing it down range to prove how "tough" it is.





Ummm, I wouldn't exactly call Vortex products "shit" or even include them on that list.


Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 1:34:32 AM EDT
Don't know about BSA but the couple of UTG products I have purchased are of great quality.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 1:39:56 AM EDT
When I found arfcom, I had 1 plain jane A2.

Now I have about $3000 worth of shit on my OBR thanks to all of you bastages!!



Don't even ask what I have on the 9 others.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 1:42:56 AM EDT
These threads are so freaking stupid. You utg bashers are no different than spoiled rich teenage, girls making fun of the poor kids who can't afford $100+jeans or $200 purses.

Seriously, grow the fuck up.

If people want to buy cheap shit to put on their guns, and it makes them happy, why the hell do you care? Stupid armchair elitists. If you really need to pick some sort of battle to prove that you are better than a stranger in the Internet, at least pick up a worthwhile cause, and stop acting like immature stupid little bitches.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 1:48:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By aplehr:
Originally Posted By AzNooB:
Customer: "Yeah, I'm looking for a tactical light for my Noveske. I bet you haven't even heard of Noveske, have you?"
Me: "I've owned a Noveske N4 with a 14.5 inch cold hammer forged barrel and carbine length gas system."
Customer: "Oh, well I'm looking for something that I can stick on to make it look cool."
Me: "Well, we do carry the Surefire X300 and Streamlight TLR-1, which are extremely high quality weapon lights."
Customer: "What about that UTG over there?"

Customer: "I need a tactical optic for my AR."
Me: "We have Eotechs, Leupold, Burris, etc."
Customer: "I'll take that BSA scope."

Customer: "Do you have any .338 Lapua Magnum?"
Me: "Right here."
Customer: *Scoffs at our $84.97 price tag and proceeds to buy a bolt action .50 BMG. On the way out he picks up a UTG bipod.*



I'm not a gun snob or anything as I'm probably more broke than most of my customers, but damn.



You actually said all that? Sometimes I thank God for the simplicity found in m14 discussion circles.

"What kind of barrel do you have?"
"Medium profile"
"Chrome lined?"
"No, why? You writing my life story or something?"
"Twist rate?"
"Fuck off!"


Noveske makes 2 types of barrels, in a bunch of different finishes, lengths, with several different gas block/sight configurations, The OP was conveying to the customer that not only had he heard of them, but he had a specific one that he owned at one point and was very familiar with them....
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 1:50:18 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Justin3:
These threads are so freaking stupid. You utg bashers are no different than spoiled rich teenage, girls making fun of the poor kids who can't afford $100+jeans or $200 purses.

Seriously, grow the fuck up.

If people want to buy cheap shit to put on their guns, and it makes them happy, why the hell do you care? Stupid armchair elitists. If you really need to pick some sort of battle to prove that you are better than a stranger in the Internet, at least pick up a worthwhile cause, and stop acting like immature stupid little bitches.


You have never worked in the biz, have you?

Link Posted: 3/29/2012 2:01:57 AM EDT
At first I was thinking, wow, you must work at "that" store.
Then I saw who posted it, and I was right.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 2:02:45 AM EDT
This way to the "I just spent $21 on a screwdriver" thread.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 2:15:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/29/2012 2:30:33 AM EDT by 1srelluc]
Originally Posted By Justin3:
These threads are so freaking stupid. You utg bashers are no different than spoiled rich teenage, girls making fun of the poor kids who can't afford $100+jeans or $200 purses.

Seriously, grow the fuck up.

If people want to buy cheap shit to put on their guns, and it makes them happy, why the hell do you care? Stupid armchair elitists. If you really need to pick some sort of battle to prove that you are better than a stranger in the Internet, at least pick up a worthwhile cause, and stop acting like immature stupid little bitches.


I'd have to agree with that. They should wear skirts and fishnets to the range or keep their mouth shut.

I think there is a reason I see folks lined-up three deep in front of the Chi-Com knock-off table at the last show I went to.

Add to that the very last thing in the world I would want on my weapon is any widget with the profile of Texas on it. Talk about pretentiousness.

Link Posted: 3/29/2012 2:26:11 AM EDT
My GF has a UTG/Leapers 4x32 CQB scope on her M4. It ain't that bad (for like $80...).

Me? Trijicon TA31F. Got used to it on the job and like it alot.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 2:26:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/29/2012 2:50:03 AM EDT by UncleJerr]
the butthurt expressed by tier 1 operators in this thread is simply a result of them not getting positive reinforcement about their expensive gear.

not everyone shoots 15k rounds of ammo at their bi-weekly carbine course

Link Posted: 3/29/2012 4:49:02 AM EDT
Lots of butthurt from people who don't understand the OP's post......

Same crowd who will spend $15 in gas because the widget they want is $4 less across town and cry about getting 'gouged'....
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 4:54:02 AM EDT
Originally Posted By sigp47:
I have a utg bipod beside it wiggling a little, It's not bad.

Will it effect accuracy?




I hope you're kidding.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 5:04:17 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Hydguy:
Lots of butthurt from people who don't understand the OP's post......

Same crowd who will spend $15 in gas because the widget they want is $4 less across town and cry about getting 'gouged'....


i understand the OP, and i think that some people probably spend their whole BRD budget on a nice gun and lack the patience or discipline to wait / save up for top accessories.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 5:11:21 AM EDT
My favorite ads have this crap on them.

FS- Hesse HARHAR-15 Assassin's rifle
Comes with:
UTG Ninja Quad Rail
UTG Delta Force Tactical light
BARSKA SUPER SWAT Badass Sniper Scope with lighted cross-thing
TAPCO 15 position stock like the SEALs use

I have $2400 in the gun but will sacrifice for $1700.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 5:12:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/29/2012 5:15:38 AM EDT by J_E_D]
Originally Posted By UncleJerr:
Originally Posted By Hydguy:
Lots of butthurt from people who don't understand the OP's post......

Same crowd who will spend $15 in gas because the widget they want is $4 less across town and cry about getting 'gouged'....


i understand the OP, and i think that some people probably spend their whole BRD budget on a nice gun and lack the patience or discipline to wait / save up for top accessories.


Not everyone lacks the discipline.
Sometimes it's a conscious choice.

Someone that looks like Keith Stone (of keystone beer fame) is who I picture the OP talking with.

I, on the other hand, choose to sometimes go cheap when something is good enough but not a critical component like a bipod for range days.

and that Willy Wonka picture is excellent.

For the record, I do not resemble Keith Stone. I can't pull off the mullet/hat combo that well.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 5:15:38 AM EDT
If you didn't offer those products maybe you wouldn't have to sell them.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 5:22:51 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 5robert25:
Not everything needs to be "top shelf" I have a utg mount that has held the light on my duty rifle for years.


A lot of the UTG gear is made in America now, too.

Sometimes people just want something that can get them by while they are saving for better gear. Or... They're just sticking it o. A range toy. I generally have ACOGs and Pride-Fowler glass on my rifles, but have a BSA scope on my 10/22. It works great for popping tin cans, targets, shotgun shells and the occasional varmint. Why should I pay more when it works fine for what I need it to do?
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 5:36:42 AM EDT
Originally Posted By bigjunk1:
Don't know about BSA but the couple of UTG products I have purchased are of great quality.


The UTG quad rails and flashlights are decent for the money, but heavy. I've had their AR15, Galil, and AK rails and haven't had any issues.

I had one BSA scope. Complete junk. Would not hold zero after a few mags - kept returning it and kept getting another.

If you want a cheap optic - Nikon, Vortex, Primary Arms are all pretty good.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 5:53:22 AM EDT
Originally Posted By MotorMouth:
If you didn't offer those products maybe you wouldn't have to sell them.


ahahahahaha.

No, its far more fun to take money, then bitch about our customers.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 5:55:16 AM EDT
Originally Posted By sigp47:
I have a utg bipod beside it wiggling a little, It's not bad.

Will it effect accuracy?




No. But it will likely fall apart eventually. Most likely the screws will strip out or the cheap sheet metal legs will kink/bend
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 5:58:48 AM EDT
Originally Posted By afroney:
Originally Posted By bigjunk1:
Don't know about BSA but the couple of UTG products I have purchased are of great quality.


The UTG quad rails and flashlights are decent for the money, but heavy. I've had their AR15, Galil, and AK rails and haven't had any issues.

I had one BSA scope. Complete junk. Would not hold zero after a few mags - kept returning it and kept getting another.

If you want a cheap optic - Nikon, Vortex, Primary Arms are all pretty good.


Lucid is good too.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 6:01:14 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Jimmeh:
Originally Posted By 5robert25:
Not everything needs to be "top shelf" I have a utg mount that has held the light on my duty rifle for years.


THIS.


Vortex, Primary, UTG, and BSA will make 90% of the shooters who walk through the door happy. They don't need it to hold zero for 15 billion rounds, or withstand some fat instructor throwing it down range to prove how "tough" it is.





I'm not looking for it to survive a war when I buy an ACOG. I'm spending the money on an ACOG so that when I go to pull it out of the safe and the sling catches on another rifle and the rifle falls to the concrete scope first that I get to say "oops" then cry a little but sill know that the scope most likely held zero or at the very worst has to be re-zeroed. My uncle once dropped his hunting rifle onto dirt from a couple feet onto a Tasco scope and the ocular housing broke off. He was pissed that he spent $50 on the scope and it wouldn't handle the fall.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 6:02:04 AM EDT
What's wrong with BSA? I own this fine BSA product!



Link Posted: 3/29/2012 6:09:20 AM EDT
OP
Any type of sales require a selective detachment to the urge to make one's self feel superior. IF you desire to sell and not just stroke your ego talking about your cool guns.

Example:
"Bet you haven't heard of Noveske?"
"I have HEARD of them, wow, those are tier 1, here is what I have that will be justified in putting on that weapon."

Link Posted: 3/29/2012 8:59:38 AM EDT
You dont appreciate good gear until you have it prove itself under adverse conditions. A few weeks ago I was hunting nilgai down in south Texas and dropped a rifle 6 feet out of an elevated seat in the back of a Polaris ranger when the rifle holder failed. The synthetic stocked savage 8400 and zeiss scope held up spectacularly despite the nasty fall. Sure enough everything was still zeroed. I highly doubt a BSA or other low quality optic would survive that kind of abuse. It's times like that which make you realize good gear is with it. On that same trip my AR with ACOG fell over and slammed scope down onto the floorboards. The Larue mount and trijicon scope were just fine. This statement makes it seem like I abuse my gear, but both of these case were just random chance and not intentional. Good gear is worth it.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 9:44:10 AM EDT
Originally Posted By opti12206:
You dont appreciate good gear until you have it prove itself under adverse conditions. A few weeks ago I was hunting nilgai down in south Texas and dropped a rifle 6 feet out of an elevated seat in the back of a Polaris ranger when the rifle holder failed. The synthetic stocked savage 8400 and zeiss scope held up spectacularly despite the nasty fall. Sure enough everything was still zeroed. I highly doubt a BSA or other low quality optic would survive that kind of abuse. It's times like that which make you realize good gear is with it. On that same trip my AR with ACOG fell over and slammed scope down onto the floorboards. The Larue mount and trijicon scope were just fine. This statement makes it seem like I abuse my gear, but both of these case were just random chance and not intentional. Good gear is worth it.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile



You sound like you could have scraped your AR down the driveway to give it character?? Are you ? .............




Link Posted: 3/29/2012 9:49:59 AM EDT
Originally Posted By WesJanson:
When you sell this stuff all day, it gets tiring. I'm fucking sick and tired of telling people "Don't buy cheap shit or it'll break" only to have them come back later with pile-o-broken-shit and the attitude that it's somehow my fault for failing to will them out of their ignorance. What it boils down to is experience in firing lots of rounds downrange with a variety of weapons, but trying to communicate the importance of that to most people seems almost impossible at times. "Well, I want an optic that's perfect for home defense, but will let me see my bullet holes from my Bushmaster M4A3 at 600 yards, and I don't want to spend more than $75." Because you have to ask the question, you aren't ready yet to really understand the answer. Go forth, buy a basic weapon, and learn from experience on the range. But that's not the popular answer because it costs money and time and can't be wrapped up and shoved into a Dosko case in ten minutes.


If you don't think people should buy it, why are you selling it?
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 10:01:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By AzNooB:


I'm not a gun snob or anything as I'm probably more broke than most of my customers, but damn.

Being a gun snob has nothing to do with being broke. In fact, I'd wager that most of gun snobs here buy their equipment on credit.


One way to look at it, is that a lot of the high end accessories will lose value quickly, whereas, guns usually don't, if you buy well. (Except Larue stuff. That Man has a Following. Even his FREE stuff commands a premium on the used market! )


Like it or not, the difference between $800 scopes and $200 scopes is shrinking. I haven't bought a UTG or BSA scope yet, but a lot of Midpriced scopes will get the job done, and done well.
Link Posted: 3/29/2012 10:29:23 AM EDT
Things I have that have never failed - firearms related...

A S.P.O.T. red dot, a Hakko Tacpoint red dot, a Tasco red dot, a Barska 6-24 mil dot illuminated scope, a BSA 2-7 Sweet 17 scope.

Taurus lineup...605 .357 revolver, PT145 .45 ACP pistol, Gaucho .45 Single Action revolver, 455 .45 ACP Titanium revolver.

A complete ModelOne Sales 24" bull barrel upper.

I don't understand the disdain.

Link Posted: 3/29/2012 11:58:44 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/29/2012 11:59:38 AM EDT by opti12206]
I assure you that I don't throw my gear down the driveway just to give it the well used look. I buy quality gear because at times my stuff gets abused though day to day use. I don't buy guns to keep imaculate in the safe. I buy them to use.
Originally Posted By quijanos:
Originally Posted By opti12206:
You dont appreciate good gear until you have it prove itself under adverse conditions. A few weeks ago I was hunting nilgai down in south Texas and dropped a rifle 6 feet out of an elevated seat in the back of a Polaris ranger when the rifle holder failed. The synthetic stocked savage 8400 and zeiss scope held up spectacularly despite the nasty fall. Sure enough everything was still zeroed. I highly doubt a BSA or other low quality optic would survive that kind of abuse. It's times like that which make you realize good gear is with it. On that same trip my AR with ACOG fell over and slammed scope down onto the floorboards. The Larue mount and trijicon scope were just fine. This statement makes it seem like I abuse my gear, but both of these case were just random chance and not intentional. Good gear is worth it.



You sound like you could have scraped your AR down the driveway to give it character?? Are you ? .............








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