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Posted: 4/19/2013 1:19:34 PM EDT
Let me know what you think.


Link Posted: 4/19/2013 3:07:37 PM EDT
Any thoughts?.....
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 3:14:09 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 3:21:58 PM EDT
I don't think it'd last very long... unless it's a really high temp capable plastic.
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 3:37:05 PM EDT
Go for it.
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 3:38:48 PM EDT
why
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 3:44:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SleeperShooter:
I don't think it'd last very long... unless it's a really high temp capable plastic.


This.

How would it stand up to direct impact? Say the shotty was dropped muzzle first?

Link Posted: 4/19/2013 3:46:04 PM EDT
only would ever want a plastic muzzle break if I had a 3d printer and it was free and I could make new ones.
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 3:46:35 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 4:35:15 PM EDT
geez I responded and just as I hit submit, the web site crashed.

I made delrin muzzle brakes for my .22lr.  Here's what happens.  The delrin expands with heat and eventually fails.  As long as you give it time to cool down it works but if it gets too warm it expands rapidly.  Mine were designed to be press fit on my rifle barrel and I used  four 4-40 set screws to keep it in place.  It lasted until I rapid fired, then the heat caused it to expand and it fell right off.  

the set screws loosened in the threads and fell out.  

as soon as it cooled down it went back to its original machined shape and pressed back on but it always fell off again.  Eventually I just made them out of 6061-t6 aluminum and they never fell off again.

I would say that for prototyping, to see if it actually works, it will as long as you take it easy but expect it to fail as soon as it heats up.  

it will expand faster than the threadserts and will be either blown off or blown to smithereens
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 4:38:13 PM EDT
Interdasting.  Keep us updated.

My predictions:  It will not last very long.


Still a cool project, though.  I wish I had the access and know-how, to machine stuff.



Link Posted: 4/19/2013 4:39:45 PM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
Originally Posted By NeddySeaGoon:
Originally Posted By SleeperShooter:
I don't think it'd last very long... unless it's a really high temp capable plastic.


This.

How would it stand up to direct impact? Say the shotty was dropped muzzle first?


or buckshot or birdshot eats it up.


I don't think the buckshot will spread that much within 2" of leaving the barrel.  Who knows...
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 4:54:36 PM EDT
It's amazing what plastic can do now.  We use HDPE instead of steel for almost all pipes where I work now.
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 6:51:32 PM EDT
Neat. I'm interested to see how it turns out.
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 6:53:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
for a real gun or airsoft.

sorry there is no polymer i would trust as a muzzle device. jmho


I have a steel brake on my Airsoft.
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 7:29:43 PM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Beer_Slayer:
for a real gun or airsoft.

sorry there is no polymer i would trust as a muzzle device. jmho


For a REAL firearm. My Saiga-12!.....I think you might be in for a surprise lol
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 7:31:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SleeperShooter:
I don't think it'd last very long... unless it's a really high temp capable plastic.


Well I'm making 2....one for normal shooting, nothing crazy. The other for a torture test to see how many rounds it will take rapid fire.
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 7:32:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By popsickles:
why


Because I can.......'Merica! lol
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 7:45:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/19/2013 7:49:46 PM EDT by kpel308]
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 7:47:52 PM EDT
Should probably make the baffles a bit thicker than the metal versions
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 7:50:12 PM EDT
Those things are fantastic and worth every penny!!

I used the money I saved outfitting all my rifles to buy a 10oz gold bar on eBay.. I got a great deal on that one too!
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 7:51:40 PM EDT
Did somebody fart when you were taking your picture for your avatar?
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 7:54:30 PM EDT
saiga 12....gyeah buddy!

interested to see how it holds up
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 7:54:44 PM EDT
It could be cool. Go for it!
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 8:00:42 PM EDT
Should be interesting.  I can't stand people who hate on innovation.  How many of you morons would have thought a polymer AR mag was shit?
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 8:11:08 PM EDT
Im in, I wouldnt think it would last long
Link Posted: 4/19/2013 8:21:07 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 6:34:05 AM EDT
Originally Posted By kpel308:
Partner, the service temp for Delrin for intermittent use is only 300F.  For continuous use, it's only 185F.  Wait for the aluminum or steel for actual use, while using the Delrin for a proto.  Please.  I used to do injection molding with the stuff.

http://www.sdplastics.com/delrin/delrin[1].pdf

Can't make it a link due to the [1] in the document name.


I know the melting point....remember it a TEST just to see how much the Delrin can take.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 6:35:15 AM EDT
Originally Posted By kpel308:
Absolutely no hate here.  Much respect to Fitty.  I just have worked with the stuff.  I wouldn't trust it.
Originally Posted By Gentleman4561:
Should be interesting.  I can't stand people who hate on innovation.  How many of you morons would have thought a polymer AR mag was shit?




I plan on tying other polymers as well
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 7:08:24 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 7:22:39 AM EDT
As long as the baffles are closer together than the wads length, I think it will work.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 8:04:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ziarifleman:
As long as the baffles are closer together than the wads length, I think it will work.

I dont think that is going to matter anyway.  I have fired a lot of shots out of a shotgun with the mag tube 2" longer than the muzzle and never had a strike. on the mag tube.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 8:31:19 AM EDT
Worth a try. Not sure delrin will last very long.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 8:41:03 AM EDT
Subscribing.



We'll never know for sure until someone gives it a go.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 8:48:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/20/2013 8:49:46 AM EDT by gmtmaster]
Why not.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 9:04:07 AM EDT
Originally Posted By tfblkhwkguy:
Originally Posted By popsickles:
why


Because I can.......'Merica! lol


Damn right.

Link Posted: 4/20/2013 2:06:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By whatarippa:
Subscribing.

We'll never know for sure until someone gives it a go.


EXACTLY!
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 3:04:50 PM EDT
First , a muzzle brake on the END of a shotgun barrel is virtually worthless, not enough gas pressure at that point to be effective.

Second, as the other poster described Delrin DOES NOT like heat, try cutting it with a laser, it will crawl off the table.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 5:27:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By toothandnail:
First , a muzzle brake on the END of a shotgun barrel is virtually worthless, not enough gas pressure at that point to be effective.


That's funny because I've done a couple recoil videos showing that a muzzle brake on the Saiga-12 does work.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 5:42:18 PM EDT



Originally Posted By tfblkhwkguy:



Originally Posted By toothandnail:

First , a muzzle brake on the END of a shotgun barrel is virtually worthless, not enough gas pressure at that point to be effective.




That's funny because I've done a couple recoil videos showing that a muzzle brake on the Saiga-12 does work.




Your tests are flawed.  10K LUP / PSI is not enough pressure to have any statistically significant effect.  



This is one reason why barrel porting has fallen out of favor with shotgun shooters who understand simple physics.  



But don't let this stop you.  



 
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 5:48:52 PM EDT
OP, are you familiar with flame cutting?

Basically, even if you could get a plastic to handle the heat, there's an immense amount of pressure from the gasses as well as a sand-blasting effect from any unburnt powder. This pressure builds up on any portions facing the muzzle and will erode those portions resulting in a lose of performance. With a muzzle break you're also worried about the pressure build up, as breaks involve redirecting the gas forces.

I've done a little bit of work testing muzzle devices, and even with rapid prototyped metal hiders we were concerned about losing performance after a handful of rounds.

I can't imagine a plastic muzzle break being able to take the pressure without exploding in short order.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 5:56:38 PM EDT
The first time a wad strikes a baffle and gets lodged,  or a piece gets gets lodged,  you are in for a hurting.
We fired SLAP out of the Barrett  .50s and a piece of the sabot would sometimes get lodged in the brake. Next round would make for some excitement.

Tread carefully.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 6:01:02 PM EDT
Steel muzzle brakes installed with setscrews often get shot off the end of the barrel due to the forces seen.  I've seen two go down range myself - a Smith and some off brand one.

I'd not expect a plastic one to last long.  Prove me wrong and you might be onto something.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 6:07:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/20/2013 6:10:01 PM EDT by tfblkhwkguy]
Originally Posted By SevenMaryThree:

Originally Posted By tfblkhwkguy:
Originally Posted By toothandnail:
First , a muzzle brake on the END of a shotgun barrel is virtually worthless, not enough gas pressure at that point to be effective.


That's funny because I've done a couple recoil videos showing that a muzzle brake on the Saiga-12 does work.


Your tests are flawed.  10K LUP / PSI is not enough pressure to have any statistically significant effect.  

This is one reason why barrel porting has fallen out of favor with shotgun shooters who understand simple physics.  

But don't let this stop you.  
 


There really isn't much compensation when shooting low brass but when shooting high brass buck/slugs there is a visible and felt reduction in recoil.
Link Posted: 4/20/2013 6:53:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 50cal:
The first time a wad strikes a baffle and gets lodged,  or a piece gets gets lodged,  you are in for a hurting.
We fired SLAP out of the Barrett  .50s and a piece of the sabot would sometimes get lodged in the brake. Next round would make for some excitement.

Tread carefully.




Those SLAP rounds are how we know a brake needs to have ports that are closer together than the length of the sabot.
Link Posted: 4/21/2013 4:02:04 AM EDT



Originally Posted By tfblkhwkguy:



Originally Posted By SevenMaryThree:




Originally Posted By tfblkhwkguy:


Originally Posted By toothandnail:

First , a muzzle brake on the END of a shotgun barrel is virtually worthless, not enough gas pressure at that point to be effective.




That's funny because I've done a couple recoil videos showing that a muzzle brake on the Saiga-12 does work.




Your tests are flawed.  10K LUP / PSI is not enough pressure to have any statistically significant effect.  



This is one reason why barrel porting has fallen out of favor with shotgun shooters who understand simple physics.  



But don't let this stop you.  

 




There really isn't much compensation when shooting low brass but when shooting high brass buck/slugs there is a visible and felt reduction in recoil.




Again, you have no idea what you are talking about.  Some 3" magnum "high brass" as you call them actually operate at lower pressures than some "low brass" target loads.  



The recoil is generated by the total weight of the ejecta.  More ejecta, more recoil.  Muzzle brakes need pressure - and lots of it - to work.  Shotguns do not operate within ranges of pressure suited for use with muzzle brakes.  Period.  You are kidding yourself.
 
Link Posted: 4/21/2013 6:43:37 AM EDT
Originally Posted By SevenMaryThree:

Originally Posted By tfblkhwkguy:
Originally Posted By SevenMaryThree:

Originally Posted By tfblkhwkguy:
Originally Posted By toothandnail:
First , a muzzle brake on the END of a shotgun barrel is virtually worthless, not enough gas pressure at that point to be effective.


That's funny because I've done a couple recoil videos showing that a muzzle brake on the Saiga-12 does work.


Your tests are flawed.  10K LUP / PSI is not enough pressure to have any statistically significant effect.  

This is one reason why barrel porting has fallen out of favor with shotgun shooters who understand simple physics.  

But don't let this stop you.  
 


There really isn't much compensation when shooting low brass but when shooting high brass buck/slugs there is a visible and felt reduction in recoil.


Again, you have no idea what you are talking about.  Some 3" magnum "high brass" as you call them actually operate at lower pressures than some "low brass" target loads.  

The recoil is generated by the total weight of the ejecta.  More ejecta, more recoil.  Muzzle brakes need pressure - and lots of it - to work.  Shotguns do not operate within ranges of pressure suited for use with muzzle brakes.  Period.  You are kidding yourself.


 





Link Posted: 4/21/2013 1:38:30 PM EDT
Thank you for proving my point with your own video, OP.  



Carry on.  I'm not wasting any more time looking up those nostrils or trying to explain this to you.  



You very obviously consider yourself the subject matter expert and have no interest in considering empirical data.




Link Posted: 4/21/2013 1:45:48 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SevenMaryThree:
Thank you for proving my point with your own video, OP.  

Carry on.  I'm not wasting any more time looking up those nostrils or trying to explain this to you.  

You very obviously consider yourself the subject matter expert and have no interest in considering empirical data.



Looked like a difference to me.

Granted, a sample of 1...

Link Posted: 4/21/2013 1:54:16 PM EDT
The delrin won't hold up even without any strikes. If the design is good enough that it will reduce recoil then physics will be trying to pull it off the end of the gun with every shot.

As soon as it heats and expands there's slop in the thread engagement, that allows movement, movement allows inertia to be formed, inertia means threads go bye bye.

T
Link Posted: 4/21/2013 2:07:00 PM EDT
oh this is going to be good!

let me get my popcorn!
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