Posted: 8/6/2011 3:22:19 PM EDT
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I work around alot of union members and have noticed a trend.
A little background. My dad was a member of a local Steelworkers union when I was in high school, so I know some about the mindset. I have never worked a union job, althou the job I early retired from was basicly a non-union union job. By that I mean you were job specific. The trend I noticed different from my dads era: Union members now a day seem to talk how great it is to be unionized, but will not go out of their way to support other union jobs. I hear them always talking about gettin a house built and when I ask if they use union skills they laugh and tell me it cost to much to. Am I imagining this or has anyone else noticed this? |
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I think because of that, many people are looking towards profession based groups for liability insurance, legal representation, and policy/contract help. I'm looking around for something to join not because I'm a union guy, but $40 a month for $300,000 liability coverage and an attorney and a Rep are a phone call away.  |
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Quoted:
When UAW Local 442 in Webster City Iowa added onto their Union Hall, they used non-union labor because "local unions weren't available" They caught alot of crap over that deal Try pulling up to the Operating Engineers hall to replace an air conditioning unit on the roof with a non union crane company... My company caught hell fir that one. I guess the operator wouldn't even pull in the driveway. As for supporting my union... I do when it comes to teaching the trade, keeping high quality work standards, and working safely. I do not attend meetings, rallies, etc. unless it's something very important. I also do not play the politics game. |
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I'm in a union and, while I don't hate unions, I'm not blindly loyal to them. I recognize that there's both good and bad.
When I buy goods and services, I make a point to buy American when possible. I prefer goods that are made in America and would happily pay more to a company that employs Americans than one that hires a bunch of illegals (like for landscaping, for example). |
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When I buy goods and services, I make a point to buy American when possible. I prefer goods that are made in America and would happily pay more to a company that employs Americans than one that hires a bunch of illegals (like for landscaping, for example). My last instructor was a retired union ironworker and he mentioned several times that he tries to buy USA made items (mainly talking about tools), even if they cost more, and encouraged us to do the same. Basically I think he was tired of students showing up with pliers and such from walmart and breaking them after a week of use. |
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I was IBEW for 7 years.
Where are all the union tradesman when there's no union work? They used to get paid by the union to walk a picket line ($10/HR cash) but the unions found it cheaper to hire non-union labor at minimum wage to walk the line, so they're out taking non-union work next to the guy whose car they keyed the week before. You'll be hard pressed to find union employees (not dues paying members, but actual employees) who are union members. Unions refuse to pay union wages themselves. And as for their claims of "being responsible for the 40 hour week"...good luck finding a salaried union employee who isn't forced to work 60 hour weeks. Unions know that having a unionized workforce is too expensive so do everything they can to prevent being unionized. My MIL was one of the few "unionized" union employees. Not a member of the union she worked for, they voted in a clerical union because of working conditions working for the union (yeah, ashamed to say she was an office worker for SEIU). She lost her job though. SEIU demanded cuts in their benefits at contract time so they went on strike for 3 months and she finally quit...she suffered from unionitis - the insane desire to eat! I worked for a union company (Lucent) and we had a twenty man wire crew, yet Lucent got caught sneaking in a non-union wiring company to re-wire our office. It was cheaper to bring in non-union labor than to pay their own employees. It got ugly and the non-union guys couldn't get out of there fast enough when confronted by a bunch of pissed off union workers in their own office. Unions don't get along with each other. Locals within the same union don't get along with each other. There are 2 IBEW locals in Boston and they battle with each other. One of them actually crosses picket lines (yeah, you fuckers in 103, I'm talking about you!)....crossed AT&T picket lines, crossed Boston Police picket lines at the DNC in 2004 (they paid for that one, was a bad time to have a 103 sticker on your truck), they actually threaten businesses in Boston, IN WRITING, if they bring in another local. They even blackmail other locals - blocked 2222 from working at the new Patriots stadium when it was being built even though they were incapable of doing 2222's work (installing data and telecom equipment, 103 is electricians). IBEW local 2222 had to pay $20,000 to their "brothers" in IBEW local 103 for the "permission slip" to be onsite. Foxboro isn't even 103's area. Now between the unions themselves..... Job sites get shut down by glaziers if they see carpenters installing doors with windows in them. Steel workers shut down jobs if carpenters are installing counters that will get stainless steel countertops. Laborers raise holy hell if you pick up your own trash. Electricians will shut off power if the HVAC or data crews plug anything in without paying for an electrician to supervise using an outlet. Wars break out between laborers, electricians, and wire crews over assembling cubes because electrical and voice wiring is involved, and if the carpenters need work, they'll try to claim cube assembly. Elevators are run by out of work $60.00/HR union crane operators. If he doesn't show, nobody gets to use the elevator, and I'm not talking about the outer construction elevators that run up the side of the building, I'm taking about passenger elevators inside the buildings. We had to dismantle and carry almost 35 pallets of equipment up 6 flights of stairs because the crane operators were pissed their "elevator operator" was sent home. Everything mentioned above constitutes a "change order" requiring 2 hours of paperwork, settling of disputes, payoffs, and hours and sometimes days of delays. They all act like frigging thugs. If you need an extra outlet on a union job, you need a change order and will wait a week. On a non-union job, you'll usually have it in an hour. The added costs and overruns for this kind of BS really add up fast. The unions are trying to suck every last penny out of every job creating all sorts of unnecessary work. Non-union companies know they have a contract to honor and the better job they do and sooner they finish, the more profit they make. It's that simple. When I left the union (only job I've lost in my 26 years working was the one protected by a union contract with a "no layoff" clause) the "loaded rate" for a tech (pay, benefits, company vehicle, etc..) was almost $80/HR. We took home $32/HR. I went to a non-union company, and without the added union costs the loaded rate is only $65/HR and I take home $40/HR. I make more $$, and the company makes more $$. Sure, I have to pay for health insurance, but I get paid through my lunch hour so it's more than a wash. I also get paid for travel time which adds another 20 hours/week I wasn't getting paid before. If you're into mediocrity, I guess union can be a reasonable career choice. Another costly expense added to union jobs is the added insurance and damage. Piss off one of the unions and all your cables running down an elevator shaft will get cut, or all your workers will get "escorted" off site delaying your piece of the project. Frigging GC even had all our trucks towed once as retaliation, dumb ass not thinking he'd be handed the bill as a change order (and our OT costs to retrieve the trucks from the tow lot in S. Boston). Hooters in Boston was burned down because it was being built with non-union labor, the unions promptly contacted the owners with assurances it wouldn't happen again if the unions were given the contract - guess who ended up building it? Hooters isn't a standalone building, they could have killed dozens. A steel girder was dropped through the roof of a non-union vendors truck when New Balance world headquarters was being built. Teamsters and Laborers unions were driving away truckloads of computers from Reebok's world HQ outside Boston while they were moving IN! Talk about an inside job, nobody knows how many truckloads of computers were stolen before they got caught. Another problem with unions is their members get sucked in as political pawns. Like most Americans, the majority of union members know nothing about politics or even have any interest in it or local/world events. Yet the atmosphere turns them into rabid dogs when it comes to politics. I never hid my conservative views and it led to some ugly screaming matches. I'm stubborn and I don't back down, and I'm not afraid to go toe to toe with any of these meatheads. The "discussions" were always short-lived as they didn't know enough to put up an argument for what the unions told them to believe, and they're not used to being challenged or questioned. Discussions always went south when I'd ask the simple question, "Why are you a Democrat?" because they had no friggin' clue. They'd try to argue "Democrats care for the unions" but it only takes 20 seconds to break that argument, especially considering Boston's Mayor "Mumbles" Menino, a Democrat, is the most anti-union politician I've ever seen. He's called "Il Dulce" by the police and firefighters unions who've used the ladder trucks to put up big "Il Dulce" signs around the city at contract time, refusing to take them down as a "misuse of city property". Yet...he always gets the union vote 'cause he's a Democrat. And union members follow the unions orders! Why? They don't know, they just do as they're told. Now let's talk about union-busting. Union-busting......by the unions. My former employer was an international company with tens of thousands of employees worth about $15 billion I believe. The company spun off from AT&T and had a large union workforce of technicians. When I was hired 80% were retirement eligible, they hadn't hired since Divestiture in '81. They decided to break the union and enlisted our company's unions, IBEW and CWA, to make it happen. Our contract specifically stated no use of contractors if techs were available to do the work, and no lay-offs because they were using contractors. So they set up a "Business Partner" program (contractors) and gave sales incentives to give the work away. Then they started layoffs and early retirement packages. The unions didn't do a goddam thing to fight the layoffs or use of contractors. When the workforce finally reached the breaking point that they could no longer honor contractual obligations they worked out a deal with the unions to bring back retired technicians, on a week by week basis, as contractors, with $20,000 bonuses and 20% raises, so they could vary the size of the workforce every week and continue layoffs and still honor customer obligations. These old techs who preached to us for years about "all for one and one for all", about all the strikes they endured over the years, fucking with overtime lists and being at war with management, and all their "union struggles"....came back as Fucking Scabs so we could lose our jobs. Dues paying scabs at that. No benefits. No company vehicles. Just the opportunity to show their true selves as the worthless, lying, backstabbing, self serving wannabe play-pretend unions bullshitters that they were. They got in bed with management and gladly took it up the ass for a wad of cash. This "union brotherhood" bullshit is all a lie. They didn't have to become scabs, the contractor program they set up would provide full time work and benefits, but instead they chose to come and help destroy their "beloved" union. Then to top it all off, blamed the young guys because we wouldn't "mobilize"! What the fuck is that? Those corrupt bastards sold us all out. So enough of that. The greatest weapon unions have is the ignorance of their members. And they have more ignorance than they know what to do with. Unions are a business. They make money. They no more represent their dues paying members than Harvard is an educational institution, because it's not, Harvard is an investment house with a $26 billion endowment. Harvard students are pawns, and union members are pawns. UAW gives it's members votes to Obama as they lose their jobs and GM uses bailout money to build factories in China. Jeffrey Immelt is Obama's Jobs Czar charged with creating jobs, but his company GE is sending 20,000 jobs to China along with it's lightbulb and X-ray machine manufacturing business. These are mostly union jobs - so just keep on voting for your Democrats, you all deserve to lose your jobs for your own stupidity. Or maybe you can all grow a pair and actually use your skills to stand on your own two feet. Sell yourself and your "superb" skills. If you have any, you'll find work. |
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Quoted:
I work around alot of union members and have noticed a trend. A little background. My dad was a member of a local Steelworkers union when I was in high school, so I know some about the mindset. I have never worked a union job, althou the job I early retired from was basicly a non-union union job. By that I mean you were job specific. The trend I noticed different from my dads era: Union members now a day seem to talk how great it is to be unionized, but will not go out of their way to support other union jobs. I hear them always talking about gettin a house built and when I ask if they use union skills they laugh and tell me it cost to much to. Am I imagining this or has anyone else noticed this? Are you, or do you work with Dave Redmond, form Ice Road Truckers? He would be the typical "whining union bitch". 
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