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Posted: 6/13/2009 11:18:15 PM EDT
[#1]
It's a conspiracy?
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Posted: 6/13/2009 11:23:20 PM EDT
[#2]
thats why I rarely shoot any of the guns I want to :(
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Posted: 6/13/2009 11:37:21 PM EDT
[#3]
I shoot less, and I have more ammo then ever piled up. Funny how it all works.
Just wait it out. Eventually there will be a downswing as the coffers get full. It's already happening with rifles. |
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Posted: 6/13/2009 11:41:36 PM EDT
[#4]
Someone forgot to tell Wolf about the great conspiracy
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Posted: 6/13/2009 11:45:18 PM EDT
[#5]
So, does that mean that the ammo manufacturers are trying to get rid of guns?
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Posted: 6/13/2009 11:45:25 PM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
Someone forgot to tell Wolf about the great conspiracy You mean, the wolf that has gone up 3x in price from what it was 2.5 years ago? |
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Posted: 6/13/2009 11:46:38 PM EDT
[#7]
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Posted: 6/13/2009 11:50:25 PM EDT
[#8]
I just read a description of a defensive handgun course in Virginia (sorry...can't remember where it was) that said you had to have 1200 rounds of ammo.
Two things popped into my head: 1. Unless you already have it on hand, where ya gonna find the ammo these days? 2. At the current jacked-up prices, who can afford it even if you could find it? I haven't gone shooting in months because I refuse to dip below my current level of ammo. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 12:09:21 AM EDT
[#9]
Quoted:
Someone forgot to tell Wolf about the great conspiracy Somebody forgot to tell Wolf a lot of things. Like how most of the reviewers use Wolf ammo for 'reliability testing'. 'It ran 200 rounds of Wolf without issue!' is a big selling point. 
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Posted: 6/14/2009 12:17:07 AM EDT
[#10]
Quoted: Someone forgot to tell Wolf about the great conspiracy  2005 I was buying wolf 7.62 X 39 for $74.99 / 1000 rds What is it now? Hell, it's even high at Cheaper than Dirt.. 
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Posted: 6/14/2009 12:24:50 AM EDT
[#11]
The OP will be proven correct.
Everyone is "amazed" Obongo [I know...Congress] hasn't introduced an AWB. Why would he/they need to with .223 at nearly .50 cents a pop [at Wal-Mart prices] and .22 a rare commodity? Reload without primers? Like making bricks without straw. I know I'm shooting A LOT [it is TWO words ARFcom] less. When I hear bang, I don't think what I paid, I think what I'll have to pay to replace it. There are either scum in the ammo industry or American money isn't worth shit anymore. Likely both. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 12:26:15 AM EDT
[#12]
There is no way to get rid of guns. Guns are here to stay, welcome to the year 1700. Get yours.
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Posted: 6/14/2009 1:20:50 AM EDT
[#13]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Someone forgot to tell Wolf about the great conspiracy You mean, the wolf that has gone up 3x in price from what it was 2.5 years ago? Yeah, but it's still like $.20 a round |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 1:51:57 AM EDT
[#14]
The jump in ammo prices is NOT the industry's fault... And SO FAR (and that's a big qualifier), it's not the fault of any DIRECT action by the administration.
It's simple economics. An overwhelming demand for ammo took place virtually overnight due to the fear that Obama would push through restrictive regulations. The first round of demand cleared the shelves and when people who waited a few days went to buy, they found none. This caused even more fear, so even more people began to buy even more ammo (to stock up), if and when they could find it. The cycle perpetuated itself. Naturally, the price shot up due to high demand. IF nothing else changes, the market will adjust and we'll be back to normal. We'll first see the supply to begin to come back. Many of us are already seeing this take place. Then, once the supply reaches some semblance of equilibrium, the prices will adjust accordingly. Of course all bets are off is something does change (talk of new regulations, etc.). Then it'll start all over again. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 2:01:57 AM EDT
[#15]
The conspiracy is working so well that shop shelves are just filled with guns that can't be sold at any price because of the high cost of ammunition.
Oh those clever (Jews? who's behind this, I was under the impression it was usually "internationalists," which is sort of a euphemism for "The International Jew" isn't it?) |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 2:04:54 AM EDT
[#16]
Quoted: I just read a description of a defensive handgun course in Virginia (sorry...can't remember where it was) that said you had to have 1200 rounds of ammo. Two things popped into my head: 1. Unless you already have it on hand, where ya gonna find the ammo these days? 2. At the current jacked-up prices, who can afford it even if you could find it? I haven't gone shooting in months because I refuse to dip below my current level of ammo. +1 Though I am about to just bite the bullet and order a couple cases so I can actually do some shooting. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 2:06:28 AM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
How do we get rid of guns? Simple, raise the price of ammunition to a level that new shooters to the sport can’t or won’t justify spending 50 cents a bullet (and that’s cheap now days) to go practice. As a matter of fact it has already started and is working extremely well. Many if not most of the younger people that I have introduced into the shooting sport over the past twenty five years have told me no longer go target practicing or are participating in any sanctioned competitions because the high cost of the ammo. I don’t know if anything can ever be done to return from the current 4 to 500 dollars per thousand and bring ammo prices to eight year ago levels of 1000 rounds of 223 for $98 bucks. I believe the industry will end up doing to it’s self what the Democratic Congress couldn’t. Rats Shockingly, shooting continues in countries which ammo costs (and has for some time) double what Americans are currently paying for it. Much like gas prices, this is more American drama over nothing. Shoot more .22, start reloading and quit bump firing. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 2:23:01 AM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Someone forgot to tell Wolf about the great conspiracy You mean, the wolf that has gone up 3x in price from what it was 2.5 years ago? Yeah, but it's still like $.20 a round Show me 1000 rounds for $200 shipped and I will buy you a pallet. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 2:23:06 AM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:
There is no way to get rid of guns. Guns are here to stay, welcome to the year 1700. Get yours. Yeah, that $10,000 registered lower will make a NICE addition to your hittin' club. No matter how nice your rifle/pistol/MG/arquebus is, it is just a metal stick without ammo. No Ban Needed. 
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Posted: 6/14/2009 2:40:34 AM EDT
[#20]
For those of you in your 40's and 50's or older, you won't see guns go away in this country in your lifetime. Sadly, it is MY generation (20's) that will give them up.
Honestly, when you go to a shooting match, or the range, or the fun shop, what is the largest age group of folks that are truly enthusiasts? Not as many new shooters coming in these days, and that's the sad truth. There are some to be sure, but it's slowly becoming an old mans game. It's sad. 
I can't even talk to people my age, they're so out of touch... |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 2:42:55 AM EDT
[#21]
haven't even shot my Noveske that I got a couple months back... I'll start reloading before I start shooting again.
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Posted: 6/14/2009 3:15:23 AM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
Just wait it out. Eventually there will be a downswing as the coffers get full. It's already happening with rifles. Its like gas prices. They may go down a little, but never all the way back down..... |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 3:35:53 AM EDT
[#23]
Quoted:
The OP will be proven correct. Everyone is "amazed" Obongo [I know...Congress] hasn't introduced an AWB. Why would he/they need to with .223 at nearly .50 cents a pop [at Wal-Mart prices] and .22 a rare commodity? Reload without primers? Like making bricks without straw. I know I'm shooting A LOT [it is TWO words ARFcom] less. When I hear bang, I don't think what I paid, I think what I'll have to pay to replace it. There are either scum in the ammo industry or American money isn't worth shit anymore. Likely both. And there are people that just don't understand economics. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 4:47:36 AM EDT
[#24]
The government will not take guns away. The American people will gradually just give them up.
We have slowly given up our freedoms, self-reliance, liberty and pride......why not our firearms?
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Posted: 6/14/2009 4:54:05 AM EDT
[#25]
When ammo costs are high, then you need to take up casting and reloading.
http://leeprecision.com/ LEE makes affordable casting and reloading equipment. I know that some Dillon users will sneer, but I have produced ammunition every bit as good as theirs. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 5:00:11 AM EDT
[#26]
A giant orbital magnet.
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Posted: 6/14/2009 5:13:03 AM EDT
[#27]
Simply the next generation. If we do not educate the next generation, it will be lost.
I volunteer with 4H shooting sports. It is utterly ridiculous that a county in the center of Texas with a population of under 20,000 has more youth involved than towns with populations in the millions. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 5:13:32 AM EDT
[#28]
The problem with "just get into reloading" is you can't find primers at all around here, and powder is rather rare. When you do find them, they're 10x the cost they were since nobody can find them. Oh well, I'll keep looking for .223 and .45 at a cheap price (for these days) because it's still out there. I'm just too cheap to pay $500 a case for .223, or pay $40+ per 100 rounds of .45 FMJ.
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Posted: 6/14/2009 5:15:02 AM EDT
[#29]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Someone forgot to tell Wolf about the great conspiracy You mean, the wolf that has gone up 3x in price from what it was 2.5 years ago? Yeah, but it's still like $.20 a round Show me 1000 rounds for $200 shipped and I will buy you a pallet. Wont that offer cut into your speeding ticket money? 
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Posted: 6/14/2009 5:18:18 AM EDT
[#30]
its NOT POSSIABLE....
even if you raise the prices of ammo or outright ban certin kinds,there is ALWAYS the black market,drugs stream across the southern border,why not AMMO.... |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 7:58:39 AM EDT
[#31]
Reloading is great for the single shot guys but I have been into automatics sence 1979. I tried it but it was just to labor intensive. My M16 can easly go through 1000 rounds in two hours of plinking. It's like everything else.....if you want to play you have to pay. Everything just keeps going up. Just to show how much things have gone up I was looking at the sales reciept for my first M16 that I purchased in late 79 in a gun shop here in Tucson. I payed $436.00 dollars for it. Then another $200 for the tax stamp. This place had a wall of machineguns for sale. Most for around $300 to $400.....NOT ANY MORE.
Rats |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 8:13:12 AM EDT
[#32]
Hoarding fueled by fears of new laws + increased materials prices=gouging. I'm thinking as the economy worsens the prices may ease some as long as we don't see the anticipated laws or hyper inflation.
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Posted: 6/14/2009 8:19:39 AM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
The problem with "just get into reloading" is you can't find primers at all around here, and powder is rather rare. When you do find them, they're 10x the cost they were since nobody can find them. Oh well, I'll keep looking for .223 and .45 at a cheap price (for these days) because it's still out there. I'm just too cheap to pay $500 a case for .223, or pay $40+ per 100 rounds of .45 FMJ. This. I spent a lot of money on reloading equipment but I can't get primers for .45 |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 8:23:06 AM EDT
[#34]
Quoted:
The OP will be proven correct. Everyone is "amazed" Obongo [I know...Congress] hasn't introduced an AWB. Why would he/they need to with .223 at nearly .50 cents a pop [at Wal-Mart prices] and .22 a rare commodity? Reload without primers? Like making bricks without straw. I know I'm shooting A LOT [it is TWO words ARFcom] less. When I hear bang, I don't think what I paid, I think what I'll have to pay to replace it. There are either scum in the ammo industry or American money isn't worth shit anymore. Likely both. I'm not sure what planet you're on, but I feel sorry for you there. Here in there here/now, ammo is starting to return. I just bought 500 rounds of .223 at Walmart for $39.97/100 (not .50 a pop), and they had .22 bulk paks stacked pretty deep. Riley's (a local gunstore here) had 12 cases of XM193 sitting on the floor when I was in there last week at just under $400/1k. Is it 2005 cheap? Nope. Is it three-months-ago expensive and vanishing as soon as you see it? Nope. It will come down as production reaches full steam and the pipeline fills. There will be a glut, and prices will follow accordingly. Who would have thought six months ago that AR lowers would be readily available at $100 (or less) before summer? Economics: It's not just for bored college freshman. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 8:25:37 AM EDT
[#35]
Except the ammo prices are caused by scarcity since the commodities market took a dump. Scarcity which was caused by panic and fear. Fear that only your idiotic Obama derangement minds is responsible for. Because him nor any dems have said anything about ammo recently. You had to dig up some old obscure policy and believe it was still relevant, there is no way Obama made you do that.
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Posted: 6/14/2009 8:29:19 AM EDT
[#36]
I'm shifting away from semi-automatics in my purchases, largely because a revolver or a bolt-action slows me down, and I learn to shoot more deliberately... like driving a stick instead of an automatic. I bought an Ishy Enfield because shooting my FAL is too expensive.
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Posted: 6/14/2009 8:29:33 AM EDT
[#37]
Quoted:
For those of you in your 40's and 50's or older, you won't see guns go away in this country in your lifetime. Sadly, it is MY generation (20's) that will give them up. Honestly, when you go to a shooting match, or the range, or the fun shop, what is the largest age group of folks that are truly enthusiasts? Not as many new shooters coming in these days, and that's the sad truth. There are some to be sure, but it's slowly becoming an old mans game. It's sad.
I can't even talk to people my age, they're so out of touch... I'm 26. I got my DAD into shooting (he was never anti-gun, just didn't own anything but a HD handgun). I'm helping a 23 yr old build his first AR. I'm working on another co-worker. What have you done? ETA: actually 2 or 3 co-workers, I'm just closer to a purchase with the one. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 8:30:06 AM EDT
[#38]
Elect Obama
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Posted: 6/14/2009 8:33:01 AM EDT
[#39]
Quoted:
When ammo costs are high, then you need to take up casting and reloading. http://leeprecision.com/ LEE makes affordable casting and reloading equipment. I know that some Dillon users will sneer, but I have produced ammunition every bit as good as theirs. Next steps. 1) ban import of AKs, mags and FMJ mil cal ammo. 2) ban lead in bullets. It's for the environment. 3) Close CMP and funding for public ranges. As the supply of shooters decreases it's much easier to control. Note: this is only a prediction, not saying they will occur. WJ |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 8:34:02 AM EDT
[#40]
Ammo prices will drop. Eventually, those who are stockpiling will reach the limits of their storage spaces. And, ammo that's being sold now was made
from metals that were at peak prices when it was bought. With metals prices being a lot lower now, ammo will be getting cheaper to produce, while at the same time, demand from stockpilers will start to slack off. Prices will drop to more normal levels. Right now, if you had your ammo manufacturer's license, you could be profitable very quickly with an investment of just a few thousand dollars, starting with a complete Corbin bullet swage system for making the bullets for less than you can buy them. A huge money maker would be 230 gr. FMJ .45 bullets. Their markup is very high so it'd be easy to compete. CJ |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 9:26:55 AM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
The OP will be proven correct. Everyone is "amazed" Obongo [I know...Congress] hasn't introduced an AWB. Why would he/they need to with .223 at nearly .50 cents a pop [at Wal-Mart prices] and .22 a rare commodity? Reload without primers? Like making bricks without straw. I know I'm shooting A LOT [it is TWO words ARFcom] less. When I hear bang, I don't think what I paid, I think what I'll have to pay to replace it. There are either scum in the ammo industry or American money isn't worth shit anymore. Likely both. So basically you're trying to make the case that the ammunition industry is intentionally driving itself out of business because they've been infiltrated by anti-gunners who are actually conspiring to take away our ability to shoot through the price fixing of ammunition. Am I following? |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 10:37:28 AM EDT
[#42]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Someone forgot to tell Wolf about the great conspiracy You mean, the wolf that has gone up 3x in price from what it was 2.5 years ago? Yeah, but it's still like $.20 a round Show me 1000 rounds for $200 shipped and I will buy you a pallet. Wont that offer cut into your speeding ticket money?
It would indeed, were I not so confident that it cannot be done. Besides, I said a pallet, not a pallet of ammo
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Posted: 6/14/2009 12:50:55 PM EDT
[#43]
Quoted:
Quoted:
The OP will be proven correct. And there are people that just don't understand economics. Yup, that would be Sherrick13, who sold AT THE BOTTOM and the guy that continued to argue there was no recession MONTHS after it had already started. And this from his Epic Fail "all is well" thread on the economy. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
And I am not, and have not said things are just fine. I have said over and over we are in a slowdown but not a recession... Wrong. Totally wrong. EPIC FAIL. This thread is a mass grave of how completely wrong you have been. Context is everything and you know it. In fact you are really kind of an ass [  ] for posting that out of context.  I was the first to admit we were in a recession when the numbers showed it. But I'm not a depression groupie hoping to get to use my "toys" like you.
When that was written we were NOT in a recession . From what I remember I suspected we would go into one, but pointed out we weren't in one yet. Out of context? It was posted on page 1 of this thread. You posted it on 9/29/08, MORE THAN 9 MONTHS AFTER the recession had started: It's official: Recession since Dec. '07 The National Bureau of Economic Research declares what most Americans already knew: the downturn has been going on for some time. By Chris Isidore, CNNMoney.com senior writer Last Updated: December 1, 2008: 5:40 PM ET NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) –– The National Bureau of Economic Research said Monday that the U.S. has been in a recession since December 2007, making official what most Americans [Those Sherrick refers to as Doom and Gloomer's, asses, SHTF fantasizers, etc.] have already believed about the state of the economy. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 12:57:13 PM EDT
[#44]
isnt that what's going on now?
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Posted: 6/14/2009 1:04:12 PM EDT
[#45]
Eliminate the ready availability of primers.
Too many machinists, metallurgists, and chemists with a passion for hobby to eliminate firearms and cartridges with one exception, primers, the most difficult component to manufacture. One of the reasons electronic ignition was never really fully developed past the experimental stage. Whoops, guess I let that cat out of the bag to all those machinists, metallurgiusts, and chemists. OK, nope, you can't eliminate firearms completely here. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 1:08:44 PM EDT
[#46]
dt-
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Posted: 6/14/2009 2:06:09 PM EDT
[#47]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The OP will be proven correct. And there are people that just don't understand economics. Yup, that would be Sherrick13, who sold AT THE BOTTOM and the guy that continued to argue there was no recession MONTHS after it had already started. And this from his Epic Fail "all is well" thread on the economy. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
And I am not, and have not said things are just fine. I have said over and over we are in a slowdown but not a recession... Wrong. Totally wrong. EPIC FAIL. This thread is a mass grave of how completely wrong you have been. Context is everything and you know it. In fact you are really kind of an ass [ ] for posting that out of context. I was the first to admit we were in a recession when the numbers showed it. But I'm not a depression groupie hoping to get to use my "toys" like you.
When that was written we were NOT in a recession . From what I remember I suspected we would go into one, but pointed out we weren't in one yet. Out of context? It was posted on page 1 of this thread. You posted it on 9/29/08, MORE THAN 9 MONTHS AFTER the recession had started: It's official: Recession since Dec. '07 The National Bureau of Economic Research declares what most Americans already knew: the downturn has been going on for some time. By Chris Isidore, CNNMoney.com senior writer Last Updated: December 1, 2008: 5:40 PM ET NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) –– The National Bureau of Economic Research said Monday that the U.S. has been in a recession since December 2007, making official what most Americans [Those Sherrick refers to as Doom and Gloomer's, asses, SHTF fantasizers, etc.] have already believed about the state of the economy. Oh AR. NEBR is controlled by liberals. You want to support and believe them go ahead. But they are the only ones that follow their OWN definition of recession, which changes everytime they declare a new one, and it is NOT generally accpeted by other economists. But it doesn't surprise me that you would follow what they said. I would explain more, but it would be lost on you. However I will bring this thead up again in about a year and let you explain some more why primers and stuff are back (barring war with Iran or some shit) and let you look stupid again. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 2:10:44 PM EDT
[#48]
You're going to ruin a good thread by injecting common sense like this!
Quoted: The jump in ammo prices is NOT the industry's fault... And SO FAR (and that's a big qualifier), it's not the fault of any DIRECT action by the administration. It's simple economics. An overwhelming demand for ammo took place virtually overnight due to the fear that Obama would push through restrictive regulations. The first round of demand cleared the shelves and when people who waited a few days went to buy, they found none. This caused even more fear, so even more people began to buy even more ammo (to stock up), if and when they could find it. The cycle perpetuated itself. Naturally, the price shot up due to high demand. IF nothing else changes, the market will adjust and we'll be back to normal. We'll first see the supply to begin to come back. Many of us are already seeing this take place. Then, once the supply reaches some semblance of equilibrium, the prices will adjust accordingly. Of course all bets are off is something does change (talk of new regulations, etc.). Then it'll start all over again. |
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Posted: 6/14/2009 2:13:27 PM EDT
[#49]
The shortage got started on its own, but if the Dems are smart, they can take advantage of it. They can shut down recreational shooting without passing laws. All they have to do is yell "Boo!" and shooters will panic and keep the prices up. Some representative from Southern North Carolina introduces a bill in Congress that would reinstate the AWB. It never gets out of committee, but it keeps the prices from coming down. The next time a Wal-Mart in Waukegan has some .22 in stock, and it looks like availability and prices might normalize, the representative from Eastern West Virginia introduces a bill that would require microstamping bullets, and the panic starts again. They can keep this going indefinitely.
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Posted: 6/14/2009 2:16:00 PM EDT
[#50]
My local Wal-Mart has a good supply of ammunition every couple of days now. There are still the people here and there who come and snap it all up, but it's there.
I see things starting to settle down. |
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