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Originally Posted By OregonShooter: The original price was $27,500. The US federal government is no longer giving $7,500 tax credits for purchasing an EV. I drive a EV and made too much to qualify for the fed credit. It is my 2nd EV and I paid w/out getting the credit. A good EV is a good vehicle. I also own ICE vehicles. |
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Originally Posted By _DR: Well, we know this. I generally don't like EVs over ICE. But IF the EV vehicle was cheap enough I would consider one as a utilitarian vehicle. Obviously the Slate isn't cheap enough to be worth a look. But it had been discussed in another thread, that's why I brought it up in the context of this thread's topic. Understood. Not intended as a slight toward you at all. Just expressing my feelings about EVs.  ETA: A little "Kei" truck would definitely pique my interest. I think they are cool, despite not really having a use for one. |
Don't confuse where I live with where I'm from.
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Originally Posted By Deerhurst:  It's a 4000lb mini truck with a 4 banger. It's not going to handle 25,000lbs for your rascal. I drive a 4000lb mini truck. It tows ~5k. Originally Posted By Deerhurst: Originally Posted By tep0583: You know, I wouldn't be completely adverse to a basic bitch truck to to truck stuff with and this thing hits a good price point. This towing capacity, though, not going to cut it. My boat would make that it IT'S basic bitch. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/304/reo_jpg-3781767.JPG I kinda figured that was going to be a problem with the I4 engine. It's a 4000lb mini truck with a 4 banger. It's not going to handle 25,000lbs for your rascal. I drive a 4000lb mini truck. It tows ~5k. 5k to 5500 will be just fine. I don't own a rascal.  But this is supposed to be GD's dream because Bitch truck. I submit this isn't it. You may as well get a Maverick, where you'll at least have a nearby dealer for the 47 recalls. Oh well, I guess the real game now is waiting to see if this thing ever hits the streets. |
"All planes close up tight . . .we'll have to ditch unless landfall . . .when the first plane drops below 10 gallons, we all go down together."
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Originally Posted By Emoto: Understood. Not intended as a slight toward you at all. Just expressing my feelings about EVs. ETA: A little "Kei" truck would definitely pique my interest. I think they are cool, despite not really having a use for one. Originally Posted By Emoto: Originally Posted By _DR: Well, we know this. I generally don't like EVs over ICE. But IF the EV vehicle was cheap enough I would consider one as a utilitarian vehicle. Obviously the Slate isn't cheap enough to be worth a look. But it had been discussed in another thread, that's why I brought it up in the context of this thread's topic. Understood. Not intended as a slight toward you at all. Just expressing my feelings about EVs. ETA: A little "Kei" truck would definitely pique my interest. I think they are cool, despite not really having a use for one. Yeah, something you can abuse and never change the oil or transmission fluid on. |
"According to Argonne National Laboratory, it takes 100 pounds of battery in an EV to go a distance achieved by only one pound of gasoline in an ICE vehicle"
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Originally Posted By OregonShooter: In 87,000 miles of EV ownership Maintenance has included software updates, one set of tires, two sets of wiper blades and 3 cabin air filters... Attached File |
Don't confuse where I live with where I'm from.
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Originally Posted By _DR: Sure. But a gov rebate shouldn't be figured into the MSRP of a product, at least in my opinion. Those things should and usually are rebated after the MSRP is stated by the manufacturer. Otherwise it's shady (in my opinion). Originally Posted By _DR: Originally Posted By OregonShooter: Originally Posted By _DR: Looks like the Slate MSRP is now $25000. Doesn't look bad but probably going to be at least $30000 all said and done. For $30K+ I'd rather have a base Maverick, Frontier or Colorado I think. I Rode in Slate’s $24,950 Electric Truck. https://i.postimg.cc/d37j0Jtd/IMG-7371-e1782391606968.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/MX2VKRFV/IMG-7384.jpg The original price was $27,500. The US federal government is no longer giving $7,500 tax credits for purchasing an EV. Sure. But a gov rebate shouldn't be figured into the MSRP of a product, at least in my opinion. Those things should and usually are rebated after the MSRP is stated by the manufacturer. Otherwise it's shady (in my opinion). It's a risky game they play. I never liked how Tesla displayed the default prices included with projected fuel savings and I think they did the credit as well. It's one thing during checkout but as a default on the website to make your stuff look cheaper always seemed shady to me. I don't have much hope that REO will pull this off but I really wish someone was able to do it. $20,000 is something that a large amount of people are able to come up with. I think that if you could pull it off and hold it for a few years you might get a nice little community. With forums and facebook it's amazing the amount of time and work people will put into stuff and share. |
BikerNut:
Normal people like motorcycles. Real people like motorcycles.
People who don't like motorcycles are just... weird.
Normal people like motorcycles. Real people like motorcycles.
People who don't like motorcycles are just... weird.
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Originally Posted By Ligore: Imagine how it would go if in one of the threads complaining about beef prices there was those that posted the sales numbers for cheap beef are not there. Buy expensive beef past its experation date. Well of course cheap beef sales are down. Try finding any.  I'm not telling you to buy used meat (I know I'm being intentionally funny  maybe  . . . and a bit pointed to cut through here)Let's keep the meat analogy tho it needs to shift context and be a bit more specific to be apt. Your local butcher, Carlos, he tells you he no longer has Picanha steak. My guy calls it tapa de aguayon but nobody knows that is. "Carlos, Why!!?" You ask. "I love it!" "See, I know why. Americans don't like the fat cap so I don't cut it that way anymore. But I have this Sirloin cap -it's almost the same thing but it's 5.5% more"  Should You Buy a 2026 Hyundai Venue? The Cheapest New Car in 2026 ^^ Sirloin Cap ^^ It's much closer to that - and that's the pricing difference in 2025 when both were available. I've no idea why Hyundai brings it in at the volume they maintain, from Korea. Tarriffs make that unlikely much longer but that's another issue. Trax tho has been killing it, but a bit more. So you can get near price in a somewhat differing segment. That said I don't believe you're better off in any way buying a new Mirage or Versa, even if they were still available. But buy a Venue it's not a bad choice - tho you'd be better buying some past date New York Strip (Camry) than any of those. If buyers bought Carlos' Picanha it'd still be around. I for one am not telling you to like it - only why it happens. But you're going to need to accept it. With tarriffs, it will get worse - and I very much doubt least cost offerings will ever get cheaper. |
Tertium non datur
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Originally Posted By Alacrity: https://media3.giphy.com/media/Feh1PlCfIDc8DQ2neJ/200.webp?cid=8dc8958cr0b1hiahvsupzp2oxt78ntvxe3n7n6oienetd0ft&ep=v1_gifs_search&rid=200.webp&ct=g I'm not telling you to buy used meat (I know I'm being intentionally funny maybe . . . and a bit pointed to cut through here)Let's keep the meat analogy tho it needs to shift context and be a bit more specific to be apt. Your local butcher, Carlos, he tells you he no longer has Picanha steak. My guy calls it tapa de aguayon but nobody knows that is. "Carlos, Why!!?" You ask. "I love it!" "See, I know why. Americans don't like the fat cap so I don't cut it that way anymore. But I have this Sirloin cap -it's almost the same thing but it's 5.5% more"  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjZGJ9U_LVo^^ Sirloin Cap ^^ It's much closer to that - and that's the pricing difference in 2025 when both were available. I've no idea why Hyundai brings it in at the volume they maintain, from Korea. Tarriffs make that unlikely much longer but that's another issue. Trax tho has been killing it, but a bit more. So you can get near price in a somewhat differing segment. That said I don't believe you're better off in any way buying a new Mirage or Versa, even if they were still available. But buy a Venue it's not a bad choice - tho you'd be better buying some past date New York Strip (Camry) than any of those. If buyers bought Carlos' Picanha it'd still be around. I for one am not telling you to like it - only why it happens. But you're going to need to accept it. With tarriffs, it will get worse - and I very much doubt least cost offerings will ever get cheaper. That's not an analogy. It's a meataphor. 
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Don't confuse where I live with where I'm from.
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Originally Posted By Alacrity: https://media3.giphy.com/media/Feh1PlCfIDc8DQ2neJ/200.webp?cid=8dc8958cr0b1hiahvsupzp2oxt78ntvxe3n7n6oienetd0ft&ep=v1_gifs_search&rid=200.webp&ct=g I'm not telling you to buy used meat (I know I'm being intentionally funny maybe . . . and a bit pointed to cut through here)Let's keep the meat analogy tho it needs to shift context and be a bit more specific to be apt. Your local butcher, Carlos, he tells you he no longer has Picanha steak. My guy calls it tapa de aguayon but nobody knows that is. "Carlos, Why!!?" You ask. "I love it!" "See, I know why. Americans don't like the fat cap so I don't cut it that way anymore. But I have this Sirloin cap -it's almost the same thing but it's 5.5% more" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjZGJ9U_LVo^^ Sirloin Cap ^^ It's much closer to that - and that's the pricing difference in 2025 when both were available. I've no idea why Hyundai brings it in at the volume they maintain, from Korea. Tarriffs make that unlikely much longer but that's another issue. Trax tho has been killing it, but a bit more. So you can get near price in a somewhat differing segment. That said I don't believe you're better off in any way buying a new Mirage or Versa, even if they were still available. But buy a Venue it's not a bad choice - tho you'd be better buying some past date New York Strip (Camry) than any of those. The Trax is a much better looking vehicle. Looks does matter, all other things being equal. |
"According to Argonne National Laboratory, it takes 100 pounds of battery in an EV to go a distance achieved by only one pound of gasoline in an ICE vehicle"
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Originally Posted By Emoto: That's not an analogy. It's a meataphor. Originally Posted By Emoto: Originally Posted By Alacrity: https://media3.giphy.com/media/Feh1PlCfIDc8DQ2neJ/200.webp?cid=8dc8958cr0b1hiahvsupzp2oxt78ntvxe3n7n6oienetd0ft&ep=v1_gifs_search&rid=200.webp&ct=g I'm not telling you to buy used meat (I know I'm being intentionally funny maybe . . . and a bit pointed to cut through here)Let's keep the meat analogy tho it needs to shift context and be a bit more specific to be apt. Your local butcher, Carlos, he tells you he no longer has Picanha steak. My guy calls it tapa de aguayon but nobody knows that is. "Carlos, Why!!?" You ask. "I love it!" "See, I know why. Americans don't like the fat cap so I don't cut it that way anymore. But I have this Sirloin cap -it's almost the same thing but it's 5.5% more" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjZGJ9U_LVo^^ Sirloin Cap ^^ It's much closer to that - and that's the pricing difference in 2025 when both were available. I've no idea why Hyundai brings it in at the volume they maintain, from Korea. Tarriffs make that unlikely much longer but that's another issue. Trax tho has been killing it, but a bit more. So you can get near price in a somewhat differing segment. That said I don't believe you're better off in any way buying a new Mirage or Versa, even if they were still available. But buy a Venue it's not a bad choice - tho you'd be better buying some past date New York Strip (Camry) than any of those. If buyers bought Carlos' Picanha it'd still be around. I for one am not telling you to like it - only why it happens. But you're going to need to accept it. With tarriffs, it will get worse - and I very much doubt least cost offerings will ever get cheaper. That's not an analogy. It's a meataphor. |
Tertium non datur
The Desert is My Church... and Hunting is My god
Joined:
Apr 2004
Posts:
6451
EE: 100% (6)
ID, USA
Joined:
Jan 2025
Posts:
1614
EE: 100% (1)
FL, USA
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Originally Posted By Emoto: https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-PSfjN2J/0/Kt4QKxkFJgRkRQPwQCGVnZ7zwjcGwDVdBNmWwvdZ7/S/i-PSfjN2J-S.jpg Originally Posted By Emoto: Originally Posted By Alacrity: Likely - I was too busy flailing through Heat Transfer to get much outta English classes https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-PSfjN2J/0/Kt4QKxkFJgRkRQPwQCGVnZ7zwjcGwDVdBNmWwvdZ7/S/i-PSfjN2J-S.jpg Thats not today |
Tertium non datur
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Originally Posted By boltryyder: won't consider a EV till I get 1k miles on a charge, charge takes 5 minutes or less, no loss of battery in heat and cold and the battery survives 100k plus recharges and no loss of efficiency on when charged during cycle. until then, easy no I'm not a proponent of EVs, but what production ICE car can go 1000 statute miles on a single tank of gas? BYD has 5 minute charging stations and EVs, which can go 400 miles on a charge now. |
"According to Argonne National Laboratory, it takes 100 pounds of battery in an EV to go a distance achieved by only one pound of gasoline in an ICE vehicle"
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Originally Posted By _DR: I'm not a proponent of EVs, but what production ICE car can go 1000 statute miles on a single tank of gas? BYD has 5 minute charging stations and EVs, which can go 400 miles on a charge now. Originally Posted By _DR: Originally Posted By boltryyder: won't consider a EV till I get 1k miles on a charge, charge takes 5 minutes or less, no loss of battery in heat and cold and the battery survives 100k plus recharges and no loss of efficiency on when charged during cycle. until then, easy no I'm not a proponent of EVs, but what production ICE car can go 1000 statute miles on a single tank of gas? BYD has 5 minute charging stations and EVs, which can go 400 miles on a charge now. Pretty much none of them. I’ve always been annoyed at the small tanks that come in almost everything. One of the reasons I bought my Excursion was the 44 gallon tank. My work commute is just shy of 500 miles a week and none of the cars I wanted to commute in would make the week. I think the Outback was close. I really like my CX5 but I definitely with it had a 20+ gallon tank. |
BikerNut:
Normal people like motorcycles. Real people like motorcycles.
People who don't like motorcycles are just... weird.
Normal people like motorcycles. Real people like motorcycles.
People who don't like motorcycles are just... weird.
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Originally Posted By _DR: I'm not a proponent of EVs, but what production ICE car can go 1000 statute miles on a single tank of gas? BYD has 5 minute charging stations and EVs, which can go 400 miles on a charge now. Originally Posted By _DR: Originally Posted By boltryyder: won't consider a EV till I get 1k miles on a charge, charge takes 5 minutes or less, no loss of battery in heat and cold and the battery survives 100k plus recharges and no loss of efficiency on when charged during cycle. until then, easy no I'm not a proponent of EVs, but what production ICE car can go 1000 statute miles on a single tank of gas? BYD has 5 minute charging stations and EVs, which can go 400 miles on a charge now. With home charging - meaning you are leaving everyday 80% full (to give best longevity) - most people will have more range than they need for a week. If you're filling up your fuel tank every day or two, yes it's an issue. Otherwise it's an outlier event peeps cling to as a barrier. If you don't have home charging - which isn't the technical issue peeps make out either - it's more complex. Much that's not a daily practical issue gets magnified into a disqualifying characteristic. We did this here. Still people find narrow exclusions. https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/What-EV-range-wins-over-GD-1000km-620-miles-enough-932-miles-/5-2651974/? Toyota and a few others are on the cusp, with Toyota giving much evidence they are on schedule. Attached File As with early Hybrids, they're SSBs won't be volume and won't be cheap. But unlike the Prius they will be upscale brands and models. Like Hybrids, they will continue to expand to mainstream expectations. Much of which is overcoming ingrained disbelief. All the bullshit Hybrids were tagged with has been disproven by time and experience. I can see an entirely similar path for BEVs and REEVs. |
Tertium non datur
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Originally Posted By Alacrity: To be fair there's more than a bit of best case trumpeting there. Take Chinese claims with a grain of salt. But no doubt fast charging is greatly, with 400v and 800v regularly, not optimal case, going 10-80% in 15-20 mins on large capacity battery packs. Everyday, real world use. With home charging - meaning you are leaving everyday 80% full (to give best longevity) - most people will have more range than they need for a week. If you're filling up your fuel tank every day or two, yes it's an issue. Otherwise it's an outlier event peeps cling to as a barrier. If you don't have home charging - which isn't the technical issue peeps make out either - it's more complex. Much that's not a daily practical issue gets magnified into a disqualifying characteristic. We did this here. Still people find narrow exclusions. https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/What-EV-range-wins-over-GD-1000km-620-miles-enough-932-miles-/5-2651974/? Toyota and a few others are on the cusp, with Toyota giving much evidence they are on schedule. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_1332_jpeg-3786943.JPG As with early Hybrids, they're SSBs won't be volume and won't be cheap. But unlike the Prius they will be upscale brands and models. Like Hybrids, they will continue to expand to mainstream expectations. Much of which is overcoming ingrained disbelief. All the bullshit Hybrids were tagged with has been disproven by time and experience. I can see an entirely similar path for BEVs and REEVs. Originally Posted By Alacrity: To be fair there's more than a bit of best case trumpeting there. Take Chinese claims with a grain of salt. But no doubt fast charging is greatly, with 400v and 800v regularly, not optimal case, going 10-80% in 15-20 mins on large capacity battery packs. Everyday, real world use. With home charging - meaning you are leaving everyday 80% full (to give best longevity) - most people will have more range than they need for a week. If you're filling up your fuel tank every day or two, yes it's an issue. Otherwise it's an outlier event peeps cling to as a barrier. If you don't have home charging - which isn't the technical issue peeps make out either - it's more complex. Much that's not a daily practical issue gets magnified into a disqualifying characteristic. We did this here. Still people find narrow exclusions. https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/What-EV-range-wins-over-GD-1000km-620-miles-enough-932-miles-/5-2651974/? Toyota and a few others are on the cusp, with Toyota giving much evidence they are on schedule. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_1332_jpeg-3786943.JPG As with early Hybrids, they're SSBs won't be volume and won't be cheap. But unlike the Prius they will be upscale brands and models. Like Hybrids, they will continue to expand to mainstream expectations. Much of which is overcoming ingrained disbelief. All the bullshit Hybrids were tagged with has been disproven by time and experience. I can see an entirely similar path for BEVs and REEVs. I have a 400V EV the 230 miles of manufacturer stated range is highly variable and in the real world rarely achievable. To achieve the manufacturer rated range would require charging to 100% then driving at 55 mph or less in an ideal Temperature range from about 50-75 degrees. It would also need to be dry as rain reduces range. On top of that I would need to drive the vehicle to dead empty stranding myself somewhere that is nearly guaranteed not to have an EV charger. The actual reliable useful range is roughly 60% of the manufacturers rated range. This range is achievable in the vast majority of conditions outside of towing obviously. Charging above 80% slows the the point that 80-90% takes 20 minutes while 20-80% takes ~30 minutes. To add to that public L3 charging speeds are HIGHLY variable with Tesla being the most consistent yet even they have variabilities between sites. You also have variability due to outdoor temperature, current battery temperature and current state of charge of the battery when you plug it in. If you don't have home charging - which isn't the technical issue peeps make out either - it's more complex. No, this is very much a real issue. Because without it you take away two primary advantages of EV ownership which are ownership costs and convenience . Public charging costs as much or more than gasoline and takes much longer. As far as purely technical a good friend of mine installed my EV charger and he owns a residential/commercial electrical company that services an area with high EV adoption rates. He personally sees numerous people annually that contact him for EV charger installs that require expensive work arounds to make work. These include main panel upgrades and circuit sharing with AC units or dryers because the electrical utility will not allow a service upgrade because there isn't enough capacity at the subdivision level. Essentially these older subdivisions that were built out prior to AC and heat pumps being common in new homes the panels have already been maxed out at every location because of 40+ years of HVAC upgrades. He always finds a way to make it work but customers are not always happy about the cost nor the charge rate because at times 48A 240V isn't possible. Some are forced to live with 24-32A 240V. this works fine with a Tesla sedan but upsets customers with the GM EV Silverado equipped with a 205 KWh battery. Everyone wants to be able to charge during their utilities lowest cost time of use rate window. The smart customers call an electrician prior to buying an EV for a site visit and estimate to see what's required prior to proceeding with the EV purchase. |
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Originally Posted By Alacrity: https://media3.giphy.com/media/Feh1PlCfIDc8DQ2neJ/200.webp?cid=8dc8958cr0b1hiahvsupzp2oxt78ntvxe3n7n6oienetd0ft&ep=v1_gifs_search&rid=200.webp&ct=g I'm not telling you to buy used meat (I know I'm being intentionally funny maybe . . . and a bit pointed to cut through here)Let's keep the meat analogy tho it needs to shift context and be a bit more specific to be apt. Your local butcher, Carlos, he tells you he no longer has Picanha steak. My guy calls it tapa de aguayon but nobody knows that is. "Carlos, Why!!?" You ask. "I love it!" "See, I know why. Americans don't like the fat cap so I don't cut it that way anymore. But I have this Sirloin cap -it's almost the same thing but it's 5.5% more" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjZGJ9U_LVo^^ Sirloin Cap ^^ It's much closer to that - and that's the pricing difference in 2025 when both were available. I've no idea why Hyundai brings it in at the volume they maintain, from Korea. Tarriffs make that unlikely much longer but that's another issue. Trax tho has been killing it, but a bit more. So you can get near price in a somewhat differing segment. That said I don't believe you're better off in any way buying a new Mirage or Versa, even if they were still available. But buy a Venue it's not a bad choice - tho you'd be better buying some past date New York Strip (Camry) than any of those. If buyers bought Carlos' Picanha it'd still be around. I for one am not telling you to like it - only why it happens. But you're going to need to accept it. With tarriffs, it will get worse - and I very much doubt least cost offerings will ever get cheaper. Originally Posted By Alacrity: Originally Posted By Ligore: Imagine how it would go if in one of the threads complaining about beef prices there was those that posted the sales numbers for cheap beef are not there. Buy expensive beef past its experation date. Well of course cheap beef sales are down. Try finding any. I'm not telling you to buy used meat (I know I'm being intentionally funny maybe . . . and a bit pointed to cut through here)Let's keep the meat analogy tho it needs to shift context and be a bit more specific to be apt. Your local butcher, Carlos, he tells you he no longer has Picanha steak. My guy calls it tapa de aguayon but nobody knows that is. "Carlos, Why!!?" You ask. "I love it!" "See, I know why. Americans don't like the fat cap so I don't cut it that way anymore. But I have this Sirloin cap -it's almost the same thing but it's 5.5% more" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjZGJ9U_LVo^^ Sirloin Cap ^^ It's much closer to that - and that's the pricing difference in 2025 when both were available. I've no idea why Hyundai brings it in at the volume they maintain, from Korea. Tarriffs make that unlikely much longer but that's another issue. Trax tho has been killing it, but a bit more. So you can get near price in a somewhat differing segment. That said I don't believe you're better off in any way buying a new Mirage or Versa, even if they were still available. But buy a Venue it's not a bad choice - tho you'd be better buying some past date New York Strip (Camry) than any of those. If buyers bought Carlos' Picanha it'd still be around. I for one am not telling you to like it - only why it happens. But you're going to need to accept it. With tarriffs, it will get worse - and I very much doubt least cost offerings will ever get cheaper. CVT AND FWD only. Unacceptable. |
China delenda est
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Originally Posted By mooreshawnm: CVT AND FWD only. Unacceptable. Originally Posted By mooreshawnm: Originally Posted By Alacrity: Originally Posted By Ligore: Imagine how it would go if in one of the threads complaining about beef prices there was those that posted the sales numbers for cheap beef are not there. Buy expensive beef past its experation date. Well of course cheap beef sales are down. Try finding any. I'm not telling you to buy used meat (I know I'm being intentionally funny maybe . . . and a bit pointed to cut through here)Let's keep the meat analogy tho it needs to shift context and be a bit more specific to be apt. Your local butcher, Carlos, he tells you he no longer has Picanha steak. My guy calls it tapa de aguayon but nobody knows that is. "Carlos, Why!!?" You ask. "I love it!" "See, I know why. Americans don't like the fat cap so I don't cut it that way anymore. But I have this Sirloin cap -it's almost the same thing but it's 5.5% more" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjZGJ9U_LVo^^ Sirloin Cap ^^ It's much closer to that - and that's the pricing difference in 2025 when both were available. I've no idea why Hyundai brings it in at the volume they maintain, from Korea. Tarriffs make that unlikely much longer but that's another issue. Trax tho has been killing it, but a bit more. So you can get near price in a somewhat differing segment. That said I don't believe you're better off in any way buying a new Mirage or Versa, even if they were still available. But buy a Venue it's not a bad choice - tho you'd be better buying some past date New York Strip (Camry) than any of those. If buyers bought Carlos' Picanha it'd still be around. I for one am not telling you to like it - only why it happens. But you're going to need to accept it. With tarriffs, it will get worse - and I very much doubt least cost offerings will ever get cheaper. CVT AND FWD only. Unacceptable. |
Tertium non datur
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Originally Posted By OregonShooter: I have a 400V EV the 230 miles of manufacturer stated range is highly variable and in the real world rarely achievable. To achieve the manufacturer rated range would require charging to 100% then driving at 55 mph or less in an ideal Temperature range from about 50-75 degrees. It would also need to be dry as rain reduces range. On top of that I would need to drive the vehicle to dead empty stranding myself somewhere that is nearly guaranteed not to have an EV charger. The actual reliable useful range is roughly 60% of the manufacturers rated range. This range is achievable in the vast majority of conditions outside of towing obviously. Charging above 80% slows the the point that 80-90% takes 20 minutes while 20-80% takes ~30 minutes. To add to that public L3 charging speeds are HIGHLY variable with Tesla being the most consistent yet even they have variabilities between sites. You also have variability due to outdoor temperature, current battery temperature and current state of charge of the battery when you plug it in. No, this is very much a real issue. Because without it you take away two primary advantages of EV ownership which are ownership costs and convenience . Public charging costs as much or more than gasoline and takes much longer. As far as purely technical a good friend of mine installed my EV charger and he owns a residential/commercial electrical company that services an area with high EV adoption rates. He personally sees numerous people annually that contact him for EV charger installs that require expensive work arounds to make work. These include main panel upgrades and circuit sharing with AC units or dryers because the electrical utility will not allow a service upgrade because there isn't enough capacity at the subdivision level. Essentially these older subdivisions that were built out prior to AC and heat pumps being common in new homes the panels have already been maxed out at every location because of 40+ years of HVAC upgrades. He always finds a way to make it work but customers are not always happy about the cost nor the charge rate because at times 48A 240V isn't possible. Some are forced to live with 24-32A 240V. this works fine with a Tesla sedan but upsets customers with the GM EV Silverado equipped with a 205 KWh battery. Everyone wants to be able to charge during their utilities lowest cost time of use rate window. The smart customers call an electrician prior to buying an EV for a site visit and estimate to see what's required prior to proceeding with the EV purchase. Originally Posted By OregonShooter: Originally Posted By Alacrity: To be fair there's more than a bit of best case trumpeting there. Take Chinese claims with a grain of salt. But no doubt fast charging is greatly, with 400v and 800v regularly, not optimal case, going 10-80% in 15-20 mins on large capacity battery packs. Everyday, real world use. With home charging - meaning you are leaving everyday 80% full (to give best longevity) - most people will have more range than they need for a week. If you're filling up your fuel tank every day or two, yes it's an issue. Otherwise it's an outlier event peeps cling to as a barrier. If you don't have home charging - which isn't the technical issue peeps make out either - it's more complex. Much that's not a daily practical issue gets magnified into a disqualifying characteristic. We did this here. Still people find narrow exclusions. https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/What-EV-range-wins-over-GD-1000km-620-miles-enough-932-miles-/5-2651974/? Toyota and a few others are on the cusp, with Toyota giving much evidence they are on schedule. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_1332_jpeg-3786943.JPG As with early Hybrids, they're SSBs won't be volume and won't be cheap. But unlike the Prius they will be upscale brands and models. Like Hybrids, they will continue to expand to mainstream expectations. Much of which is overcoming ingrained disbelief. All the bullshit Hybrids were tagged with has been disproven by time and experience. I can see an entirely similar path for BEVs and REEVs. I have a 400V EV the 230 miles of manufacturer stated range is highly variable and in the real world rarely achievable. To achieve the manufacturer rated range would require charging to 100% then driving at 55 mph or less in an ideal Temperature range from about 50-75 degrees. It would also need to be dry as rain reduces range. On top of that I would need to drive the vehicle to dead empty stranding myself somewhere that is nearly guaranteed not to have an EV charger. The actual reliable useful range is roughly 60% of the manufacturers rated range. This range is achievable in the vast majority of conditions outside of towing obviously. Charging above 80% slows the the point that 80-90% takes 20 minutes while 20-80% takes ~30 minutes. To add to that public L3 charging speeds are HIGHLY variable with Tesla being the most consistent yet even they have variabilities between sites. You also have variability due to outdoor temperature, current battery temperature and current state of charge of the battery when you plug it in. If you don't have home charging - which isn't the technical issue peeps make out either - it's more complex. No, this is very much a real issue. Because without it you take away two primary advantages of EV ownership which are ownership costs and convenience . Public charging costs as much or more than gasoline and takes much longer. As far as purely technical a good friend of mine installed my EV charger and he owns a residential/commercial electrical company that services an area with high EV adoption rates. He personally sees numerous people annually that contact him for EV charger installs that require expensive work arounds to make work. These include main panel upgrades and circuit sharing with AC units or dryers because the electrical utility will not allow a service upgrade because there isn't enough capacity at the subdivision level. Essentially these older subdivisions that were built out prior to AC and heat pumps being common in new homes the panels have already been maxed out at every location because of 40+ years of HVAC upgrades. He always finds a way to make it work but customers are not always happy about the cost nor the charge rate because at times 48A 240V isn't possible. Some are forced to live with 24-32A 240V. this works fine with a Tesla sedan but upsets customers with the GM EV Silverado equipped with a 205 KWh battery. Everyone wants to be able to charge during their utilities lowest cost time of use rate window. The smart customers call an electrician prior to buying an EV for a site visit and estimate to see what's required prior to proceeding with the EV purchase. But trucks - due to size, mass, frontal area, uses like towing/hauling ore som-:move the efficiency outside the useful curve. Lightnings are kinda notorious (as low as 2mi/kWh w winter use) for a lot of reasons . Smaller, lower mass, more aerodynamic and sophisticated vehicles do better. Truck BEVs aren't even worth discussing with what's offered. Current Teslas get triple that+. Some over 7 mi/KWh. Mentioned that variability in charging times. Larger capacity necessary for trucks exacerbates everything - capacity/mass, so more charging time, so then slower equals more pain. Your Ford std or ext? I think ext is 130ish kWh - Teslas about half that. So reduces much. 60% of EPA rating is prolly a good rule of thumb for keeping an 80% cap. Going above 80% slows but also increases battery wear. Battery life is much more impacted by heat and holding charge toward extreme limits. 0% or 100%. So I'd only charge above 80% if I had a specific reason. Even when I was driving 30-35k per year I'd very rarely do more than 150 on a daily basis. 80% is fine - which would be 200 miles minimum for the most popular models. Likely better much of the time, especially shoulder seasons/more consistent mild climates. Still leaving home every day with 200 miles solid is statistically more than all but a few percent of peeps that super commute. We've done lots of threads, no need to rehash the fact that many will claim it doesn't fit them. Cool. BEVs don't fit me either. Doesn't change facts. New DC Fast for some of both 400v and 800v systems are seeing the times I posted. Some aren't.mSmaller batts, better systems, charging times - and ranges - diverge positively from your Ford tho there's variables on the charging system you point out and I touched on previously. But if you charge at home, meh. Ive installed about a 100 level 2 capable outlets. Half those in 90s townhome units tho NatGas heat, water and dual dryer hookups. Tho I have kiosks in places, people want in unit if there's garages. Zero issues. Tho it's only practical for me where there's attached garages which means sufficient service. Peeps surveyed indicate sufficient charging. Had no doubt 60A would. Talking to friends and neighbors seems 20-40 mile equivalent charge happens each hour. But even if you're only getting 10 per you'd see 120-150 a night. But yes peeps should check. As when they might want to put a welding outlet in their garage. Or a number of other items. As before, trucks aren't a good candidate for many reasons. Doesn't make other less so. Tho I wouldn't expect anywhere near 50% on road within 30 years, tho Europe might be close to that in market share sooner. I'm like VVinci and others where the top out will be a third. We'll see how tech improvement changes. 30 years ago BEVs were utter shit. What I meant by complex. If I didn't have a home charging option I'd want a 1000 mile cushion as well. So public charging trip was less often. A number of business's offer employee charging kiosks. I've never seen a Level 1 as tenant improvement so I assume all I see are useful Level 2. There's a good number I see tho it varies by region. But work charging is still an exception. But I don't se much utilization across non in unit installations in any event. All change is challenge. But I do like the America where we figure out how to get shit done than the one where we wallow in why can't. If SSBs hold much of their promise @boltryyder might get his wish. I'd probably be more in favor of smaller batteries that weigh less - roughly half and keep ranges similar to current. This will only advance. But the killer app to me seems to be lighter weight REEV hybrids that blend BEV efficiency with smaller in board ICE powered generators to extend range. Cheap Chinese REEV see 600-750 miles in CLTC, Premium and Super-REEVs like XPeng X9 ($40-$50k) get boltryyder approved legs real world. |
Tertium non datur
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Originally Posted By Alacrity: After a couple weeks of pretty decent coverage in most of the 1st and 2nd tier online outlets, some with MSN uptakes, REO Industries has about 10k followers on Insta and 13k on X. Says somthing tho I'm still pondering what. I am honestly torn on whether I think this is a deliberate scam, or an accidental scam - in the sense that this could be a well-intentioned but clueless guy who genuinely believes he can design, prototype, set up a production line, and manufacture a brand new road-legal 4WD vehicle (complying with all government regulations) by late 2028. Looking at past attempts to launch a new car may be informative:One example of a start-up from scratch is obviously DeLorean. The company was started and staffed by people with lots of experience in the automotive industry. The concept dates back to 1973, and it took until 1981 for production to start and deliveries to begin. That's EIGHT YEARS from concept to deliveries, and that involving people who actually knew what they were doing, and had lots of experience designing and building cars ... and was in an era when government regulation was far less onerous. Also, side note: the car totally sucked, and the company went bankrupt within a year of starting deliveries, because they couldn't sell their underpowered and overpriced car. Additional fun fact: the starting price in 1981 was $25K, even though the planned price when the project started was $12K. As a more recent comparison, It took Tesla from 2007 to 2012 to go from concept to deliveries with the Model S - and that was a company that had ALREADY manufactured a working car (the Roadster), so they already had automotive expertise, manufacturing experience, etc. - and it still took them FIVE YEARS from concept to deliveries to get their second car into mass production. Sure, the Model S is a more complicated car than this truck, thought it could also be argued that being an EV it's also simpler in some ways. For a guy with ZERO automotive experience to claim he can go from concept to deliveries in two and a half years - when it took far more experienced people in the auto industry between five and eight years to do the same thing - is completely delusional, IMO. I would be amazed if these trucks are ever built, and if they are, I would be shocked if mass production happened before 2031. I think this Step 1. Lots of promises and buzz Step 2. Some people will put down deposits Step 3. No updates for a long time Step 4. New promises (with flashy CGI and AI renders and videos) - but also statements that investors/loans are needed to actually start to set up production, and moving of goalposts (both in terms of delivery dates and price). Steps 3 and 4 will repeat for a while. . . . Step X. Some people might eventually get their deposits back. |
“A real man does not think of victory or defeat. He plunges recklessly towards an irrational death. By doing this, you will awaken from your dreams.” -- Tsunetomo Yamamoto
Actual tweet from REO:
 
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"Sometimes, the grass is greener because it's on a septic system."
"Sporterizing: The art of spending $700 on a $300 gun to make it worth $200." -GTwannabe
"Sporterizing: The art of spending $700 on a $300 gun to make it worth $200." -GTwannabe
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Started getting these videos suggested. Dude bought a building and wants to build an open source KEI truck that will be delivered as a kit primarily and possibly a low volume of completed vehicles sold under the LSV category. So an actual American Kei  Our New American Kei Truck, Explained |
BikerNut:
Normal people like motorcycles. Real people like motorcycles.
People who don't like motorcycles are just... weird.
Normal people like motorcycles. Real people like motorcycles.
People who don't like motorcycles are just... weird.
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Originally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: Started getting these videos suggested. Dude bought a building and wants to build an open source KEI truck that will be delivered as a kit primarily and possibly a low volume of completed vehicles sold under the LSV category. So an actual American Kei https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJJa9zBDa6A TOYOTA IMV Origin at the Japan Mobility Show 2025 You've got stuff like that from Toyota that been floated. Here's the intro at Japan Mobility last year. Attached File Ox is a flat pack and assemble on site electric. Attached File Mobius in Kenya did some very basic, low cost, local market models. Attached File Toyota had the ultra low cost Kijang, here after it was improved with things like windows and internal pin door hinges. This really goes back to Renault 2CV. We have a member that was invoked with an African "buggy" effort maybe he'll chime in. We can get down to cheap trikes but we're kinda devolving in a race to bottom cost. |
Tertium non datur
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Originally Posted By DK-Prof: I am honestly torn on whether I think this is a deliberate scam, or an accidental scam - in the sense that this could be a well-intentioned but clueless guy who genuinely believes he can design, prototype, set up a production line, and manufacture a brand new road-legal 4WD vehicle (complying with all government regulations) by late 2028. Looking at past attempts to launch a new car may be informative:One example of a start-up from scratch is obviously DeLorean. The company was started and staffed by people with lots of experience in the automotive industry. The concept dates back to 1973, and it took until 1981 for production to start and deliveries to begin. That's EIGHT YEARS from concept to deliveries, and that involving people who actually knew what they were doing, and had lots of experience designing and building cars ... and was in an era when government regulation was far less onerous. Also, side note: the car totally sucked, and the company went bankrupt within a year of starting deliveries, because they couldn't sell their underpowered and overpriced car. Additional fun fact: the starting price in 1981 was $25K, even though the planned price when the project started was $12K. As a more recent comparison, It took Tesla from 2007 to 2012 to go from concept to deliveries with the Model S - and that was a company that had ALREADY manufactured a working car (the Roadster), so they already had automotive expertise, manufacturing experience, etc. - and it still took them FIVE YEARS from concept to deliveries to get their second car into mass production. Sure, the Model S is a more complicated car than this truck, thought it could also be argued that being an EV it's also simpler in some ways. For a guy with ZERO automotive experience to claim he can go from concept to deliveries in two and a half years - when it took far more experienced people in the auto industry between five and eight years to do the same thing - is completely delusional, IMO. I would be amazed if these trucks are ever built, and if they are, I would be shocked if mass production happened before 2031. I think this Step 1. Lots of promises and buzz Step 2. Some people will put down deposits Step 3. No updates for a long time Step 4. New promises (with flashy CGI and AI renders and videos) - but also statements that investors/loans are needed to actually start to set up production, and moving of goalposts (both in terms of delivery dates and price). Steps 3 and 4 will repeat for a while. . . . Step X. Some people might eventually get their deposits back. Originally Posted By DK-Prof: Originally Posted By Alacrity: After a couple weeks of pretty decent coverage in most of the 1st and 2nd tier online outlets, some with MSN uptakes, REO Industries has about 10k followers on Insta and 13k on X. Says somthing tho I'm still pondering what. I am honestly torn on whether I think this is a deliberate scam, or an accidental scam - in the sense that this could be a well-intentioned but clueless guy who genuinely believes he can design, prototype, set up a production line, and manufacture a brand new road-legal 4WD vehicle (complying with all government regulations) by late 2028. Looking at past attempts to launch a new car may be informative:One example of a start-up from scratch is obviously DeLorean. The company was started and staffed by people with lots of experience in the automotive industry. The concept dates back to 1973, and it took until 1981 for production to start and deliveries to begin. That's EIGHT YEARS from concept to deliveries, and that involving people who actually knew what they were doing, and had lots of experience designing and building cars ... and was in an era when government regulation was far less onerous. Also, side note: the car totally sucked, and the company went bankrupt within a year of starting deliveries, because they couldn't sell their underpowered and overpriced car. Additional fun fact: the starting price in 1981 was $25K, even though the planned price when the project started was $12K. As a more recent comparison, It took Tesla from 2007 to 2012 to go from concept to deliveries with the Model S - and that was a company that had ALREADY manufactured a working car (the Roadster), so they already had automotive expertise, manufacturing experience, etc. - and it still took them FIVE YEARS from concept to deliveries to get their second car into mass production. Sure, the Model S is a more complicated car than this truck, thought it could also be argued that being an EV it's also simpler in some ways. For a guy with ZERO automotive experience to claim he can go from concept to deliveries in two and a half years - when it took far more experienced people in the auto industry between five and eight years to do the same thing - is completely delusional, IMO. I would be amazed if these trucks are ever built, and if they are, I would be shocked if mass production happened before 2031. I think this Step 1. Lots of promises and buzz Step 2. Some people will put down deposits Step 3. No updates for a long time Step 4. New promises (with flashy CGI and AI renders and videos) - but also statements that investors/loans are needed to actually start to set up production, and moving of goalposts (both in terms of delivery dates and price). Steps 3 and 4 will repeat for a while. . . . Step X. Some people might eventually get their deposits back. I went from scam, to someone stole this Dallas Brokers Identity for an ax,an identity scam, to this guys pushing test to demand over investment, to pipe dream and naivete. But shit maybe he's figured out some path that solves all the issues I can imagine. Or it's a path to market that's different than were assuming - like LSV |
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Originally Posted By GenYRevolverGuy: Actual tweet from REO:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/HMLFk07XMAAVWKS?format=jpg&name=small |
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Originally Posted By Alacrity: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fRQpPuVAmMYou've got stuff like that from Toyota that been floated. Here's the intro at Japan Mobility last year. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_2126_png-3788561.JPG Ox is a flat pack and assemble on site electric. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_2127_jpeg-3788567.JPG How big is the OX? That picture makes it look decent sized. Did it ever go anywhere? Interesting idea. |
BikerNut:
Normal people like motorcycles. Real people like motorcycles.
People who don't like motorcycles are just... weird.
Normal people like motorcycles. Real people like motorcycles.
People who don't like motorcycles are just... weird.
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Originally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: How big is the OX? That picture makes it look decent sized. Did it ever go anywhere? Interesting idea. Originally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: Originally Posted By Alacrity: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fRQpPuVAmMYou've got stuff like that from Toyota that been floated. Here's the intro at Japan Mobility last year. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_2126_png-3788561.JPG Ox is a flat pack and assemble on site electric. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_2127_jpeg-3788567.JPG How big is the OX? That picture makes it look decent sized. Did it ever go anywhere? Interesting idea. Attached File Attached File It's a "medium" truck with about the same wheelbase as the shortest Fuso FE or China stuff like Foton Aumark (which has the R2.8 Cummins-Foton engine everyone is enamored with) that dominates the market now. Much lighter build tho. It was supposed to be a step up from the Suzuki Carry class, good payload while being cheaper than traditional mediums trucks like Isuzu and Fuso. Then China. . . Attached File Torquil Norman on the left was the push behind. He funded/founded Global Vehicle Trust back in 2013 to bring affordable commerical transport to underserved areas. His money was toys, UK guys will prolly recall Bluebird - Polly Pocket and Thomas Train - and was an outstanding gentleman. The other is Gordon Murray. Yea. . . Why I know anything about this. Attached File This was the killer app. 6 stacked to a container, engines in separate, and assembled at destination by any semi skilled crew. Even me . Cheaply designed, cheap to ship and cheap to operate with a small, basic Ford Duratorq Van engine. Never went far which is sad, but needs were filled without philanthropy. Nevertheless Norman's are on whole, good people (read up on Jesse) and Casey took over GVT. Truck's been electrified and they're still trying to do good in places like Africa (Rwanda) by using as a co-op, kinda, low-cost, grass roots transport service (app based) for small holders to get farm products to market.This, Elio, Aptera, Dyson's failed efforts, Sir Jim's successful Grenadier, a host of others highlight how fucking incredibly hard it is to succeed in bringing product from ground up as a new mfg to fruition. Maybe the key is to have few resources and a back ground in Real Estate . I wish this guy well - I'd love to see if - but I'm not optimistic. |
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Originally Posted By GenYRevolverGuy: Actual tweet from REO: Mom, can we get a Hilux? No, son. We have a Hilux at home. |
q3131: I can enjoy necrobeastialexhibitionism as much as the next guy, but homonecrobestailexhibitionism is just plain sick.
Tomislav:If you truly love something, you need to shoot it, then set it on fire. (And then post pics!)
كا
Tomislav:If you truly love something, you need to shoot it, then set it on fire. (And then post pics!)
كا
Joined:
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USA
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Originally Posted By boltryyder: won't consider a EV till I get 1k miles on a charge, charge takes 5 minutes or less, no loss of battery in heat and cold and the battery survives 100k plus recharges and no loss of efficiency on when charged during cycle. until then, easy no Your threshold is asinine and fantasy land. Good luck. There are times when an EV does makes sense for some people. |
Esstac’s Retarded Social Media Influencer
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Originally Posted By PCUT: Yeah dont want to risk losing that $25! Originally Posted By PCUT: Originally Posted By CheemsK1500: I am going to need to see an actual working prototype before submitting a deposit. Yeah dont want to risk losing that $25! 25 dollars is 25 dollars! |
"According to Argonne National Laboratory, it takes 100 pounds of battery in an EV to go a distance achieved by only one pound of gasoline in an ICE vehicle"
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Originally Posted By Shadyman: For $2800 I can get a remanufactured long block GM 292i6 engine to drop in a 1976 Chevy C20 pickup. Take me a day with a friend. Just sayin’.. I suppose if you want to daily drive a 50 year old pickup with a 15 second 0-60 time have at it. In rural North Dakota I suppose that might suffice but I do wonder how it wouldn't rust in half due to salt brine in winter service. I suppose you can cut up a soup can with tin snips and rivet it over the hole in the floor to slow that cold draft a bit. |
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Originally Posted By OregonShooter: I suppose if you want to daily drive a 50 year old pickup with a 15 second 0-60 time have at it. In rural North Dakota I suppose that might suffice but I do wonder how it wouldn't rust in half due to salt brine in winter service. I suppose you can cut up a soup can with tin snips and rivet it over the hole in the floor to slow that cold draft a bit. Originally Posted By OregonShooter: Originally Posted By Shadyman: For $2800 I can get a remanufactured long block GM 292i6 engine to drop in a 1976 Chevy C20 pickup. Take me a day with a friend. Just sayin’.. I suppose if you want to daily drive a 50 year old pickup with a 15 second 0-60 time have at it. In rural North Dakota I suppose that might suffice but I do wonder how it wouldn't rust in half due to salt brine in winter service. I suppose you can cut up a soup can with tin snips and rivet it over the hole in the floor to slow that cold draft a bit. In Texas, the body will last forever if you don't wreck. And yes, I could and would daily drive a 50 year old pickup with a 15 second 0-60 time, with satisfaction. I might put a modern stereo receiver and speakers in it and call it a resto-mod too.  |
"According to Argonne National Laboratory, it takes 100 pounds of battery in an EV to go a distance achieved by only one pound of gasoline in an ICE vehicle"
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Originally Posted By _DR: In Texas, the body will last forever if you don't wreck. And yes, I could and would daily drive a 50 year old pickup with a 15 second 0-60 time, with satisfaction. I might put a modern stereo receiver and speakers in it and call it a resto-mod too. A restomod?! Sir please calm down this is a family establishment |
The hardest part about a zombie apocalypse will be pretending I'm not excited.
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Originally Posted By thezentree: A restomod?! Sir please calm down this is a family establishment Forgive me. I don't know what came over me. |
"According to Argonne National Laboratory, it takes 100 pounds of battery in an EV to go a distance achieved by only one pound of gasoline in an ICE vehicle"
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Getting this shit back on track - REO's X game is prime. I'm warming up. Got a mention from Farah/Smoking Tire. Interested in seeing what Matt flushes out. Not that he's a hard ball journ but maybe some live action interview. Attached File Some interesting claims here. Attached File MERCH!! He's learned from Diesel Bros and yeetbaby. Attached File But this . . . It's ok Zach you can come out man, we know you are here. Dude deserves some love.    |
Tertium non datur
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Originally Posted By Alacrity: Getting this shit back on track - REO's X game is prime. I'm warming up. Got a mention from Farah/Smoking Tire. Interested in seeing what Matt flushes out. Not that he's a hard ball journ but maybe some live action interview. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_2171_jpeg-3792701.JPG Some interesting claims here. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_2170_jpeg-3792703.JPG MERCH!! He's learned from Diesel Bros and yeetbaby. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_2169_jpeg-3792706.JPG But this . . . It's ok Zach you can come out man, we know you are here. Dude deserves some love. The balls vent has returned! 
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Originally Posted By Alacrity: Getting this shit back on track - REO's X game is prime. I'm warming up. Got a mention from Farah/Smoking Tire. Interested in seeing what Matt flushes out. Not that he's a hard ball journ but maybe some live action interview. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_2171_jpeg-3792701.JPG Some interesting claims here. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_2170_jpeg-3792703.JPG MERCH!! He's learned from Diesel Bros and yeetbaby. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/14291/IMG_2169_jpeg-3792706.JPG But this . . . It's ok Zach you can come out man, we know you are here. Dude deserves some love. Oh fuck the ball chiller. I might be back in. |
Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords may not be a basis for a system of government, but strange men distributing Kalashnikovs from the back of a Toyota certainly can be.