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Posted: 1/20/2024 11:10:33 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustyKnifeUSMC: This. My ATACR 1-8 is too big and heavy. I’m tempted to put it on EE. Replace it with a Trijicon VUDU! This is for a SCAR17. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustyKnifeUSMC: Originally Posted By RustedAce: I own both. The ridiculous size/weight of the ATACR isn’t worth it’s benefits. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/47980/IMG_3613-3091821.jpg This. My ATACR 1-8 is too big and heavy. I’m tempted to put it on EE. Replace it with a Trijicon VUDU! This is for a SCAR17. I would replace the SCAR and keep the ATACR 1-8. |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 11:13:54 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fatguy7814: Serious question, not being a dick…. What does this reticle do better than a simple reticle, while shooting quickly and under stress even at distance? I’m not up to speed on everything these busy reticles really offer, I look at them and see a bunch of crap that I have never needed… but feel free to educate me (honestly). I've been shooting competitively over 6 years now (3gun, tactical games, run-n-gun) and this has been my experience as well. Simpler reticles are easier to process when you're shooting quickly and under timed stress. But if your application isn't timed and you need ranging capabilities and more wind holds, you'll want a more full-featured reticle with a bunch of MIL lines everywhere. |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 12:25:16 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PacNW5: I've been shooting competitively over 6 years now (3gun, tactical games, run-n-gun) and this has been my experience as well. Simpler reticles are easier to process when you're shooting quickly and under timed stress. But if your application isn't timed and you need ranging capabilities and more wind holds, you'll want a more full-featured reticle with a bunch of MIL lines everywhere. Using a Christmas tree reticle on the clock isn’t a big deal and it’s very common. |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 12:44:21 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fatguy7814: Serious question, not being a dick…. What does this reticle do better than a simple reticle, while shooting quickly and under stress even at distance? I’m not up to speed on everything these busy reticles really offer, I look at them and see a bunch of crap that I have never needed… but feel free to educate me (honestly). Literally everything. I'm not even sure where to start. |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 2:54:52 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustedAce: A place I worked at had a scope with MOA turrets and MOA adjustments. People kept ripping off the MOA dope and adding MIL dope, bout drove me insane. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustedAce: Originally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: MOA is for F class, bench rest, and hunting Dinosaurs. A place I worked at had a scope with MOA turrets and MOA adjustments. People kept ripping off the MOA dope and adding MIL dope, bout drove me insane. I don't know of I understand. You mean mil reticle with moa turrets? And you mean people were pulling the moa dope card off and putting a mil card on? |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 2:56:42 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By deadmau5er: Besides superior eye relief, having 1x, superior field of view, actual support from Armament Tech? IMO, the glass and reticle is superior too. As a general purpose/combat optic, the Elcan is superior and more versatile. Weight and shitty mounts are very real and acceptable criticisms of them though and the ACOG is still one of the best optics. It's just not better than the Elcan. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By deadmau5er: Originally Posted By mstennes: I couldn’t find anything it did better. Besides superior eye relief, having 1x, superior field of view, actual support from Armament Tech? IMO, the glass and reticle is superior too. As a general purpose/combat optic, the Elcan is superior and more versatile. Weight and shitty mounts are very real and acceptable criticisms of them though and the ACOG is still one of the best optics. It's just not better than the Elcan. I never wore an ACOG out. I'm sure it happens, I've just never seen it. I used to have to replace an Elcan usually before the barrel was toast, and I wore a barrel out almost annually. |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 3:00:48 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 30calTBLkid: I never wore an ACOG out. I'm sure it happens, I've just never seen it. I used to have to replace an Elcan usually before the barrel was toast, and I wore a barrel out almost annually. |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 3:09:15 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 30calTBLkid: I never wore an ACOG out. I'm sure it happens, I've just never seen it. I used to have to replace an Elcan usually before the barrel was toast, and I wore a barrel out almost annually. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 30calTBLkid: Originally Posted By deadmau5er: Originally Posted By mstennes: I couldn’t find anything it did better. Besides superior eye relief, having 1x, superior field of view, actual support from Armament Tech? IMO, the glass and reticle is superior too. As a general purpose/combat optic, the Elcan is superior and more versatile. Weight and shitty mounts are very real and acceptable criticisms of them though and the ACOG is still one of the best optics. It's just not better than the Elcan. I never wore an ACOG out. I'm sure it happens, I've just never seen it. I used to have to replace an Elcan usually before the barrel was toast, and I wore a barrel out almost annually.  That's a lot of shooting, I am jealous. Also can I be on your team when our civilization finishes crumbling and goes all Lord of the flies? |
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USA
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Posted: 1/20/2024 3:09:33 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fatguy7814: Red dot in SFP is the same in FFP… FFP in LPVO is dumb… 1x= usable reticle then 8x FFP = super sized horse pussy. Red dot with a couple of drop indicators is best reticle in LPVO…. If you use a Christmas tree reticle, then you probably use a cart to bring your rifle and ammo to your nice little shooting bench. reticle on the nx NX8 is gr8, m8  
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Posted: 1/20/2024 4:55:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RustedAce]
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: I don't know of I understand. You mean mil reticle with moa turrets? And you mean people were pulling the moa dope card off and putting a mil card on? It was MOA turrets, and MOA hold. They kept putting mil card on it. |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 5:16:44 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By binthere: It’s not as good as Schmidt & Bender which is not as good as Zeiss Hensoldt but Nightforce glass isn’t terrible either. I have three ATACR scopes. all FFP. Great scopes. Better tracking than S&B PMII’s. Granted the glass is of slightly lesser quality. But they are better mechanically. I still stand by the claim that for war use, a SFP LPVO is better than a FFP LPVO. Reasoning is that on 1x, you can still see a reticle and do not have to rely on a red dot which may or may a not be bright enough in sunlight. Secondly, if you aren’t using an LPVO on 1x, when are you really not going to go to the full 6x or 8x? That’s not a huge difference in magnification. So a sfp reticle isn’t a real deal breaker as in an actual sniper scope. If you can’t see what you are shooting at on 1x, you go to full 6x or 8x. Then your reticle is true to mil or bdc anyway. You can’t use a FFP reticle on 1x. You need the red dot. With a sfp you don’t need the red dot. Out to one to three hundred meters you don’t need magnification to hit a man sized tgt anyway. So at a full magnification of 6-8x why do you really need the scope reticle to disappear for all intents and purposes at very low magnification. It’s not helping you at all. These aren’t sniper scopes and clip on night vision works just fine at 6x or 8x. So a sfp LPVO isn’t a hindrance there either. Thanks for this. I’m reading thru this thread and was about to PM you. You answered most of my questions here. |
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SC, USA
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Posted: 1/20/2024 5:22:14 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustedAce: It was MOA turrets, and MOA hold. They kept putting mil card on it. Wait wtf?? How could you even be close to target??? Like the gun woulnt even point close. |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 5:25:21 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustedAce: It was MOA turrets, and MOA hold. They kept putting mil card on it. That would be a funny prank the first time. After the first time I would be pretty irritated. |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 5:29:30 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By organdoner: Wait wtf?? How could you even be close to target??? Like the gun woulnt even point close. There's scopes with hashmarks that indicate 4 moa where you would normally have mils. You would still be pretty close out to about 400 yards but that difference in the subtensions would stack and you would start missing higher and higher |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 6:35:31 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mstennes: I would replace the SCAR and keep the ATACR 1-8. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mstennes: Originally Posted By RustyKnifeUSMC: Originally Posted By RustedAce: I own both. The ridiculous size/weight of the ATACR isn't worth it's benefits. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/47980/IMG_3613-3091821.jpg This. My ATACR 1-8 is too big and heavy. I'm tempted to put it on EE. Replace it with a Trijicon VUDU! This is for a SCAR17. I would replace the SCAR and keep the ATACR 1-8. Haha! |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 6:37:33 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RTUtah: Haha! He’s right. |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 6:55:45 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustedAce: Am I the only GIRTHcog owner here? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustedAce: Originally Posted By WhiskersTheCat: How do you like memecog? Am I the only GIRTHcog owner here? I think so. I kinda want one of each but I don't know what to put them on |
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Posted: 1/20/2024 6:56:47 PM EDT
[#18]
SR25 + memecog would be pretty cool I bet
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Posted: 1/20/2024 7:04:10 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustedAce: He's right. I require zero convincing, hombre. I'm an SR25 man. And a NF man. 
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SC, USA
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Posted: 1/20/2024 7:05:42 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: There's scopes with hashmarks that indicate 4 moa where you would normally have mils. You would still be pretty close out to about 400 yards but that difference in the subtensions would stack and you would start missing higher and higher I was thing automatically thinking at range, guess up close makes sense |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 1:02:27 PM EDT
[#21]
This thread got me thinking and I bought another TA33 to put on one of my SBRs.
Damn arf costing me money again 
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Posted: 1/22/2024 1:11:18 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By keeperofthedew: This thread got me thinking and I bought another TA33 to put on one of my SBRs. Damn arf costing me money again TA33 SBRs are cool. 
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Posted: 1/22/2024 1:21:36 PM EDT
[#23]
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Posted: 1/22/2024 1:25:56 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGE: What sorcery is this? Gas adj built into upper? Piston gun? https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/IMG_3225-2982104_jpg-3103301.JPG WAR adjustable upper. |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 1:33:13 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustedAce: Originally Posted By TGE: What sorcery is this? Gas adj built into upper? Piston gun? https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/IMG_3225-2982104_jpg-3103301.JPG WAR adjustable upper. You recommend them? |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 1/22/2024 4:28:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Millennial]
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: MOA is for F class, bench rest, and hunting Dinosaurs. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: Originally Posted By bnc: Ah, I'm with you now. Was looking at the FC-MOA reticle previously. MOA is for F class, bench rest, and hunting Dinosaurs. Literally all my optics are MOA… LOL. The dots and holographic have MOA adjustment, the LPVOs all have MOA turrets with either BDC or MOA reticles and my higher power scopes are all MOA/MOA. It’s just easier to do quick estimates using the old 1”/100yd approximation, because most people think & see in inches and yards and 1”/100yds=1MOA is usually plenty accurate for most practical distances. And if you need more precise than that calculation/estimation, just adjust the number by 5% (still easy mental maths). |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 4:34:46 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Millennial: Literally all my optics are MOA… LOL. The dots and holographic have MOA adjustment, the LPVOs all have MOA turrets with either BDC or MOA reticles and my higher power scopes are all MOA/MOA. It’s just easier to do quick estimates using the old 1”/100yd, because most people think & see in inches and yards and 1”/100yds is usually plenty accurate for most practical distances. And if you need more precise calculation/estimation, just adjust the number by 5% (easy). They should be using a decent reticle and can use that to correct holds, judge distance etc. Time is now old man. |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 4:59:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RustedAce]
[#28]
Pew pew.
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Posted: 1/22/2024 5:23:08 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustedAce: TA33 SBRs are cool. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/47980/IMG_3225-2982104.jpg Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RustedAce: Originally Posted By keeperofthedew: This thread got me thinking and I bought another TA33 to put on one of my SBRs. Damn arf costing me money again TA33 SBRs are cool. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/47980/IMG_3225-2982104.jpg Going to go on the one on the left.  Attached File |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 1/22/2024 8:19:38 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: MOA is for F class, bench rest, and hunting Dinosaurs. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: Originally Posted By bnc: Ah, I'm with you now. Was looking at the FC-MOA reticle previously. MOA is for F class, bench rest, and hunting Dinosaurs. Literally all my optics are MOA… LOL. The dots and holographic have MOA adjustment, the LPVOs all have MOA turrets with either BDC or MOA reticles and my higher power scopes are all MOA/MOA. It’s just easier to do quick estimates using the old 1”/100yd, because most people think & see in inches and yards and 1”/100yds is usually plenty accurate for most practical distances. And if you need more precise calculation/estimation, just adjust the number by 5% (easy). |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 8:27:23 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Millennial: Literally all my optics are MOA… LOL. The dots and holographic have MOA adjustment, the LPVOs all have MOA turrets with either BDC or MOA reticles and my higher power scopes are all MOA/MOA. It’s just easier to do quick estimates using the old 1”/100yd approximation, because most people think & see in inches and yards and 1”/100yds=1MOA is usually plenty accurate for most practical distances. And if you need more precise than that calculation/estimation, just adjust the number by 5% (still easy mental maths). Cope and Sneed. |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 8:41:41 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Millennial: Literally all my optics are MOA… LOL. The dots and holographic have MOA adjustment, the LPVOs all have MOA turrets with either BDC or MOA reticles and my higher power scopes are all MOA/MOA. It’s just easier to do quick estimates using the old 1”/100yd, because most people think & see in inches and yards and 1”/100yds is usually plenty accurate for most practical distances. And if you need more precise calculation/estimation, just adjust the number by 5% (easy). Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Millennial: Originally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: Originally Posted By bnc: Ah, I'm with you now. Was looking at the FC-MOA reticle previously. MOA is for F class, bench rest, and hunting Dinosaurs. Literally all my optics are MOA… LOL. The dots and holographic have MOA adjustment, the LPVOs all have MOA turrets with either BDC or MOA reticles and my higher power scopes are all MOA/MOA. It’s just easier to do quick estimates using the old 1”/100yd, because most people think & see in inches and yards and 1”/100yds is usually plenty accurate for most practical distances. And if you need more precise calculation/estimation, just adjust the number by 5% (easy). Based customary system user. Also IMPERIAL PINTS ONLY |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 9:11:57 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WhiskersTheCat: Based customary system user. Also IMPERIAL PINTS ONLY Inches and yards doesn't have anything to do with mils vs. moa. |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 9:14:02 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: Inches and yards doesn't have anything to do with mils vs. moa. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: Originally Posted By WhiskersTheCat: Based customary system user. Also IMPERIAL PINTS ONLY Inches and yards doesn't have anything to do with mils vs. moa. What about pints? MOA user here. It's what I started with a long time ago and what I understand. I've seen no compelling reason to switch at this point. |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 9:52:55 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Redbirdxx: What about pints? MOA user here. It's what I started with a long time ago and what I understand. I've seen no compelling reason to switch at this point. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Redbirdxx: Originally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: Originally Posted By WhiskersTheCat: Based customary system user. Also IMPERIAL PINTS ONLY Inches and yards doesn't have anything to do with mils vs. moa. What about pints? MOA user here. It's what I started with a long time ago and what I understand. I've seen no compelling reason to switch at this point. Based |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 9:53:18 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: Inches and yards doesn't have anything to do with mils vs. moa. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: Originally Posted By WhiskersTheCat: Based customary system user. Also IMPERIAL PINTS ONLY Inches and yards doesn't have anything to do with mils vs. moa. It has to do with ease of relatability |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 10:02:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: brasscrossedrifles]
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WhiskersTheCat: It has to do with ease of relatability It doesn't have anything to do with anything we actually use either for. I'll give you an example, what kind of reticle is in the scope on the KAC you have set up for mid range? |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 10:13:11 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: It doesn't have anything to do with anything we actually use either for. I'll give you an example, what kind of reticle is in the scope on the KAC you have set up for mid range? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: Originally Posted By WhiskersTheCat: It has to do with ease of relatability It doesn't have anything to do with anything we actually use either for. I'll give you an example, what kind of reticle is in the scope on the KAC you have set up for mid range? Which one the Vortex or the ACOG |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 10:16:34 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WhiskersTheCat: Which one the Vortex or the ACOG Vortex |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 10:20:27 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: Vortex Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By brasscrossedrifles: Originally Posted By WhiskersTheCat: Which one the Vortex or the ACOG Vortex The EBR-9 |
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Posted: 1/22/2024 10:46:08 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By WhiskersTheCat: The EBR-9 Oh, a BDC. That's a different conversation. You aren't really using angular measurement, you're making really rough, qualitative adjustments off of someone else's use of angular measurements. You aren't even at the moa vs. mils discussion, you're still at using angular measurements vs. trying to approximate width and height at approximated distances. Which can be fine depending on what you are trying to do, but quickly becomes limiting if you want to do much more. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 1/22/2024 10:57:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: DetroitSounds]
[#42]
There is no best, or "only worth having". Once you get into the good shit, it's just personal preference.
ACOG's. Love em, but fuck that eye relief. NX8. Really hard to beat it when you take the footprint and weight into account, albeit the box is a bit tight. ATACR. Superb, but fuck that beast on a 5.56. Good fit on my SR25 though. Razor? Meh, obviously great glass and brightness but that's where it ends for me. Nowadays I prefer EXPS for CQB and VCOG's for GPR's. Big ass windows on Eotechs, and a tank tough LPVO that performs more than adequately compared to others in it's class. |
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Posted: 2/16/2024 7:29:49 PM EDT
[#43]
What's the best mount to pair with the NX8?
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Posted: 2/16/2024 7:33:27 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AbleArcher: What's the best mount to pair with the NX8? I’m wondering the same thing. Scheels has a FDE capped turret NX8 in stock that I can’t stop thinking about. |
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Posted: 2/16/2024 7:33:55 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Mars87: TA11 is the proven master race of the ACOGs. |
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Posted: 2/16/2024 7:39:09 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dissident: I’m wondering the same thing. Scheels has a FDE capped turret NX8 in stock that I can’t stop thinking about. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dissident: Originally Posted By AbleArcher: What's the best mount to pair with the NX8? I’m wondering the same thing. Scheels has a FDE capped turret NX8 in stock that I can’t stop thinking about. I was unaware of that. It may be walking out of there tonight. |
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Posted: 2/16/2024 9:06:00 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AbleArcher: What's the best mount to pair with the NX8? Personally I like the Badger Con 1, it’s available and you can get different heights for the perfect setup for you. You also won’t go wrong with the G mount but they are harder to get and are limited in height. |
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Posted: 2/16/2024 9:07:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Dissident]
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AbleArcher: I was unaware of that. It may be walking out of there tonight. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AbleArcher: Originally Posted By Dissident: Originally Posted By AbleArcher: What's the best mount to pair with the NX8? I’m wondering the same thing. Scheels has a FDE capped turret NX8 in stock that I can’t stop thinking about. I was unaware of that. It may be walking out of there tonight.  |
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Posted: 2/16/2024 10:00:08 PM EDT
[#49]
"Mom, can we get an acog with a red dot on it?"
"No, we have an acog with a red dot on it at home" The acog with a red dot on it at home:  Attached File |
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Posted: 2/16/2024 10:25:12 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By nightstalker: Agree Double Agree. |
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