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Posted: 5/13/2004 3:23:22 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/13/2004 3:24:20 PM EST by TomJefferson]
BTK had his school band concert this week and I set by one of his buddies parents which I have known for a few years. He's a Phd at Oakridge National Labs. He points out his grandkid who has the longest hair in the band.

Out of the blue he leans over and says I'm a die hard liberal. OK, I say. Then out of the blue he says "How do you feel on abortion?". I think a amoment and decide on my political approach would be the best answer and say "I don't think it's any of the governments business one way or the other and should be left up to the family."

He immediately takes the offensive, "Damn fathers shouldn't have a damn thing to say about it for they are all scum of the Earth." "I for one am a bit proud of my parenting." I calmly reply.

Wow, I"m taken back abit but then realize he is raising his two grandchildren since the mom and dad ran off in different directions both had heavy drug habits.

I just sat there thinking "Well bud did it ever cross your mind that if you weren't so damn liberal it might not have happened that way and you wouldn't feel the way you do?"

God I had to bite my lip but was dieing to blurt it out. Then before we leave he hits me up for $100 for mensa. I hope he isn't holding his breath waiting on the money.

Thought you would find this entertaining.

Tj
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 3:27:37 PM EST
The fact that he came right out and asked you something like that out of the blue leads me to think he was picking a debate. He had to know you're conservative. Maybe heard it from his kid or something. Make sense to you TJ?
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 3:34:11 PM EST
You should have said "If I thought I could abort all the future liberals, I'd be more than happy to help"
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 3:41:52 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/13/2004 3:42:44 PM EST by TomJefferson]

Originally Posted By DOW:
The fact that he came right out and asked you something like that out of the blue leads me to think he was picking a debate. He had to know you're conservative. Maybe heard it from his kid or something. Make sense to you TJ?



I'm afraid my conservative views are quite well known and sure I was being baited but I think he actually thought he could influence me. I think my answer took him back since he probably expected a stronger answer to the right.

Most libs run from me on debating this stuff except here on the net. For some reason they always seem to get emotional and try to fight their point whatever it is from emotion only and no logic. Their answer to calm debate is run like hell.

Tj
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 3:45:01 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/13/2004 3:47:00 PM EST by Aimless]
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 3:45:58 PM EST

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:
So this week I set by a confessed liberal.......



What did he confess to and was he found guilty ?
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 3:46:53 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 3:48:48 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/13/2004 3:51:53 PM EST by TomJefferson]
Have no idea. Like Aimless says, no one has ever just sat down and out of the blue approached such a topic with me. It typically just comes up in general confersation but not hey you.

I've known this guy about 8 years but only from school events, dropping each others kids off, etc.

Tj

BTW, they just had a fire at K25 maybe he has a third eye. On the cool side, Oarkridge now has these camera operated remote control 5.56mm guns guarding the place. They were on the news and way cool like a video game. Use the joystick put the X on the target and squeeze off a burst.
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 3:53:10 PM EST

Originally Posted By tc6969:
You should have said I'm a father too and then brought out my pic of Billy with guns hanging all over him.



LOL, he brought up guns too. Said he had one single shot 20 guage! All I said was I like guns. lOL

Tj
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 3:55:20 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 7:47:45 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:00:42 PM EST
I am constantly amazed by the number of flaming liberals that work at national labs. I guess it must come from sucking on the teet of .gov for too long. It saddens me to see otherwise rational, intelligent people completely ignore logic in deference to base emotion.
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:16:33 PM EST

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:

Originally Posted By tc6969:
You should have said I'm a father too and then brought out my pic of Billy with guns hanging all over him.



LOL, he brought up guns too. Said he had one single shot 20 guage! All I said was I like guns. lOL

Tj




Tell him you like pie too?
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:23:00 PM EST

Er, uh...

Thomas Jefferson was a liberal and the father of the Democratic Party...

???

If you want a conservative founding father go for Madison or Hamilton.

Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:24:18 PM EST

Originally Posted By Damocles:
Er, uh...

Thomas Jefferson was a liberal and the father of the Democratic Party...

???

If you want a conservative founding father go for Madison or Hamilton.




Thomas Jefferson was not a liberal by todays standards. He believed in small government and was an ardent believer in states rights. He was a Liberatarian.
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:34:57 PM EST

Originally Posted By redwolf8784:

Originally Posted By Damocles:
Er, uh...

Thomas Jefferson was a liberal and the father of the Democratic Party...

???

If you want a conservative founding father go for Madison or Hamilton.




Thomas Jefferson was not a liberal by todays standards. He believed in small government and was an ardent believer in states rights. He was a Liberatarian.



Whatever, by the standards of the time he lived in he was a liberal. By the dictionary definition of the word, he was a liberal.

So what?

There's nothing inherently wrong with being a liberal person.

Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:40:18 PM EST
I think my reply to his question on abortion would be, "Well, if I could travel back in time and was standing in front of your pregnant mother, I might be talked into it."
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:42:51 PM EST

Originally Posted By Damocles:

Originally Posted By redwolf8784:

Originally Posted By Damocles:
Er, uh...

Thomas Jefferson was a liberal and the father of the Democratic Party...

???

If you want a conservative founding father go for Madison or Hamilton.




Thomas Jefferson was not a liberal by todays standards. He believed in small government and was an ardent believer in states rights. He was a Liberatarian.



Whatever, by the standards of the time he lived in he was a liberal. By the dictionary definition of the word, he was a liberal.

So what?

There's nothing inherently wrong with being a liberal person.




I have to respectfully disagree with you. There were liberals like today even back then. Plato proposed a communistic government over 3000 years ago. Todays liberals are along that bent. Dont confuse being a liberal with being a liberatarian. They are completely different. A liberal is one who believes government should solve all the problems, while a liberatarian(Jefferson) believes the government should be limited in as many places as possible.

And I agree with you, there is nothing wrong with being a liberal. I was a communist about five years ago (I was a young impressionable high school kid that listened to way to much communist propaganda heavy metal and rock). But I can disagree with them and call their ideas stupid and idiotic. I can also look up to Thomas Jefferson, even though I dispise liberal thought, BECAUSE HE WAS NOT A LIBERAL!
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:48:08 PM EST

Originally Posted By wetidlerjr:

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:
So this week I set by a confessed liberal.......



What did he confess to and was he found guilty ?



Yes, we plan on hanging him as soon as he bathes....which may take awhile.


SGtar15
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:49:26 PM EST

Originally Posted By sgtar15:

Originally Posted By wetidlerjr:

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:
So this week I set by a confessed liberal.......



What did he confess to and was he found guilty ?



Yes, we plan on hanging him as soon as he bathes....which may take awhile.


SGtar15




Was he a Frenchman?
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:53:14 PM EST

Originally Posted By Damocles:
So what?

There's nothing inherently wrong with being a liberal person.




But there's something inherently tiresome about people who can't realize that yesterday's classic liberals are not today's leftists who call themselves "liberals."

Nothing wrong with being a liberal person, true. So long as you don't vote.
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:55:01 PM EST

1st definition of liberal
1a: of, relating to or based on the liberal arts
1b: of, or befitting a man of free birth
2a: generous, open minded
2b: given or provided in a generous or open minded way
...
4: not literal or strict
5: broad minded, not bound by authoritarianism, orthodoxy or traditional forms
6: a political party advocating ECONOMIC FREEDOM, greater individual participation in government and constitutional, political and administrative reforms to achieve these goals.

2nd definition of liberal
1: one who is open minded and not strict in observance of orthodox, traditional or established forms or ways.

The United States is a liberal democracy devoted to the promotion of individual liberty and economic freedom.

And I think that's wonderful.

Don't you?

Link Posted: 5/13/2004 8:57:19 PM EST

Originally Posted By the:

Originally Posted By Damocles:
So what?

There's nothing inherently wrong with being a liberal person.




But there's something inherently tiresome about people who can't realize that yesterday's classic liberals are not today's leftists who call themselves "liberals."

Nothing wrong with being a liberal person, true. So long as you don't vote.



Just because someone calls themselves a liberal doesn't mean they are.

Tiresome?

Link Posted: 5/13/2004 9:00:08 PM EST

Originally Posted By Damocles:
1st definition of liberal
1a: of, relating to or based on the liberal arts
1b: of, or befitting a man of free birth
2a: generous, open minded
2b: given or provided in a generous or open minded way
...
4: not literal or strict
5: broad minded, not bound by authoritarianism, orthodoxy or traditional forms
6: a political party advocating ECONOMIC FREEDOM, greater individual participation in government and constitutional, political and administrative reforms to achieve these goals.

2nd definition of liberal
1: one who is open minded and not strict in observance of orthodox, traditional or established forms or ways.

The United States is a liberal democracy devoted to the promotion of individual liberty and economic freedom.

And I think that's wonderful.

Don't you?




What is happening here is the definition of the word Liberal is skewing this discussion.
A Liberal in politics today generally means
-supports gun control
-supports larger government
-supports international agreements such as the UN, Kyoto Treaty, ect.
-supports entitlement programs
-generally is in favor of appeasment
-weak on border control
-too accepting of other peoples, cultures, religions ect. except when that people, religion and culture is the White Christian Heterosexual Pro-gun Male

I dont think that Jefferson generally agreed with most liberal positions as stand today.
Link Posted: 5/13/2004 9:01:56 PM EST

Originally Posted By redwolf8784:
What is happening here is the definition of the word Liberal is skewing this discussion.
A Liberal in politics today generally means
-supports gun control
-supports larger government
-supports international agreements such as the UN, Kyoto Treaty, ect.
-supports entitlement programs
-generally is in favor of appeasment
-weak on border control
-too accepting of other peoples, cultures, religions ect. except when that people, religion and culture is the White Christian Heterosexual Pro-gun Male

I dont think that Jefferson generally agreed with most liberal positions as stand today.



OK.

Link Posted: 5/13/2004 10:11:48 PM EST

Originally Posted By sgtar15:

Originally Posted By wetidlerjr:

Originally Posted By TomJefferson:
So this week I set by a confessed liberal.......



What did he confess to and was he found guilty ?



Yes, we plan on hanging him as soon as he bathes....which may take awhile.


SGtar15



That SGtar15 ! So funny and yet so clueless !
Link Posted: 5/14/2004 3:00:40 AM EST
.
"So this week I set by a confessed liberal....... "

I'm going out on a limb here...I'll bet it was'nt a english teecher you were settin' buy

.
Link Posted: 5/14/2004 3:22:16 AM EST
My girlfriend is a self-proclaimed liberal. She is neutral on the gun issue (even though she did let me teach her how to shoot) and she is anti-abortion.

Liberals have a COMPLETELY different mindset than most of us here.
My g/f has a lot of socialist ideology. "I can't believe people are so selfish that they go out and spend $50,000 on a car. That much money could feed an entire village in Africa for a month!"

My response: "I don't work hard for my money so I can send it to a bunch of people who refuse to change their country and way of life. The more we send them aid, the more reliant they become to the point that they see no reason to try to change; they will just sit around waiting for the US to bring them food while everything around them is going to shit."

I have a very in-depth look into the mind of a Liberal and I can tell you that no amount of logic will ever change the way they think. Their half-truths, their emotional shouting responses, their arguments based on nothing more than what some guy said on CNN a few months ago, their feel-good bullshit... it will never go away no matter how much you try to convince them.

The few "liberals" who change and become conservative were never true liberals to begin with.

I did change her mind about guns though. I even have her to the point that she'd like to carry a pistol. I told her she has to be able to use it when the time comes or I am not going to help her find one and get her carry permit. She has been of the mindset that she wouldn't shoot someone, even if that person was about to rob/rape/kill her. She seems to be slowly coming around on that issue, though. When I am confident she will actually use the pistol if she needs to, then I will pursue it. Until then, she will just have to rely on "screaming and running" like she has so far.

Her anti-Bush bullshit gets VERY old. Luckily she is NOT voting for Kerry. Right now she doesn't know WHO she's gonna vote for. She hates Bush even though I don't think she knows why she hates him (typical liberal).
Link Posted: 5/14/2004 3:32:08 AM EST

Originally Posted By Aimless:
I have NEVER in my life since college EVER heard a spontaneous conversation about abortion start like that. He's a weird bird and was looking for trouble from you.

Edit-Now that I think about it I couldn't honestly tell you what the opinion of most of my friends on abortion is Must be the nukleer stuff up there has gotten to him, check for a third eye next time you see him!




you mean his brown eye?
Link Posted: 5/14/2004 4:42:49 AM EST
Cypher, don't make my mistake and actually marry a liberal. It's not worth it.

My Mother in Law asked me about abortion once, I said I had been against it until I found out they could ID fag kids in the womb. I told her that changed my mind right then and there. She's never brought up the subject again.
Link Posted: 5/14/2004 4:46:35 AM EST
Sounds like you have been face-to-face with a real life troll.

You shoudl have just ignored him... that would have seriously pissed him off.
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