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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 11/21/2003 1:36:36 PM EDT
The recent petition of John Hinkley for unsupervised visitation rights brings to mind the weapon he used to drop 2 men with one shot each when he attacked President Reagen. He used a 6 shot revolver loaded with 22 LR. I news reel shot we see all the time in Virginia is where he shot a young secret service agent in the abdomen - he dropped like a rock...no struggle..no stagger...and didn't get up. Fortunately he lived. Mr. Brady was shot in the head (note the round didn't bounce off) and dropped unfortunately crippled for life. True is was up close but then that's where it usually happens. I suggest that larger calibers aren't the only effective weapons for self defense.

Also.....the most commonly used caliber to kill people in the US is the 22 LR.

I know all you macho guys with your .45s wont like this but it's food for thought.

Link Posted: 11/21/2003 1:41:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2003 1:46:42 PM EDT by lvgunner777]

Originally Posted By Nightstalker2016:
The recent petition of John Hinkley for unsupervised visitation rights brings to mind the weapon he used to drop 2 men with one shot each when he attacked President Reagen. He used a 6 shot revolver loaded with 22 LR. I news reel shot we see all the time in Virginia is where he shot a young secret service agent in the abdomen - he dropped like a rock...no struggle..no stagger...and didn't get up. Fortunately he lived. Mr. Brady was shot in the head (note the round didn't bounce off) and dropped unfortunately crippled for life. True is was up close but then that's where it usually happens. I suggest that larger calibers aren't the only effective weapons for self defense.

Also.....the most commonly used caliber to kill people in the US is the 22 LR.

I know all you macho guys with your .45s wont like this but it's food for thought.




Do you feel the odds of a stop with a .45 are greater than a .22??

Food for thought.


Edited to add:
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 1:44:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Nightstalker2016:
...Also.....the most commonly used caliber to kill people in the US is the 22 LR...



Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that just because .22 is the most common caliber (i.e., more of them out there, more of them used in crimes, etc.) and doesn't speak at all to the subject of per-incident-effectiveness?
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 1:45:08 PM EDT
Shot placement is 90%. A shot in the foot is a shot in the foot regardless of caliber. However, I do feel that you can increase your margin of error (in terms of perfect shot placement) as the caliber of your cartridge goes up (generatlly).
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 1:45:14 PM EDT
Sure, but I've seen plenty of people shot with a .22 that did not drop, or even cry for that matter. I'll take my chances with a .45
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 1:51:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2003 1:51:49 PM EDT by wiggy762]
Shot placement COULD be more important than caliber. The key would be the ability to place your 22lr into a killing area. To do this, you will need to have the training to always hit what you are aiming at....every-damn-time. And in order for your perfect shot placement to be able to pass through clothing and still deliver that killing blow, your 22lr has to be pretty close to the killee to deliver that energy.

I do not love the .45 round because it is something incredible on its own, I choose it because it allows the best mix of small size of round and weapon (vs. a rifle) while being powerful enough to allow me some 'operator error' and still have the BG go bye-bye.
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 2:49:25 PM EDT
Hell, ya hit someone in the hand with a .45, he's goin' down.
AB
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 2:52:24 PM EDT
Might I ask your source for the data that the .22 LR kills more people in the US than any other round ????
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 2:54:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2003 2:55:18 PM EDT by Old_Painless]
I'm kind of like the old Texas cowboy that was asked, "Why do you carry a .45?"

He replied, "Because, sir, Mr. Colt doesn't make a .46."
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 2:57:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Paul:
Might I ask your source for the data that the .22 LR kills more people in the US than any other round ????


I can not source it, but it is true I read it somewhere once.
But it is misleading, 22 LR are just so common, they involved in more accidents, are used in more suicides, well you get the idea.
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 3:01:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By cyanide:

Originally Posted By Paul:
Might I ask your source for the data that the .22 LR kills more people in the US than any other round ????


I can not source it, but it is true I read it somewhere once.
But it is misleading, 22 LR are just so common, they involved in more accidents, are used in more suicides, well you get the idea.



Can't find anything on the FBI's web site. If you're commiting suicide with a .22 LR you're working way too hard.

I want to see the figures ...
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 3:32:00 PM EDT
Ok, I will need some help, who is that gun mag writer that does the ballistics info thing on rounds and the lethality rating ?? He is the one that purports that most deathas are by 32 auto's , from Detroit I think ???
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 3:39:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By cyanide:
Ok, I will need some help, who is that gun mag writer that does the ballistics info thing on rounds and the lethality rating ?? He is the one that purports that most deathas are by 32 auto's , from Detroit I think ???



If you're talking about Marshall and Sanow and their "One Shot Stops", then it should be said that their data has been thoroughly debunked.

They used horrible methodology in making their claims, ignored many statistics...and well...basically reported only what they wanted to report. In a nutshell, they are/were frauds.

It's too bad they still have a following, somewhat.
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 4:09:10 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 4:09:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/21/2003 4:10:39 PM EDT by cyanide]

Originally Posted By BigD:

Originally Posted By cyanide:
Ok, I will need some help, who is that gun mag writer that does the ballistics info thing on rounds and the lethality rating ?? He is the one that purports that most deathas are by 32 auto's , from Detroit I think ???



If you're talking about Marshall and Sanow and their "One Shot Stops", then it should be said that their data has been thoroughly debunked.

They used horrible methodology in making their claims, ignored many statistics...and well...basically reported only what they wanted to report. In a nutshell, they are/were frauds.

It's too bad they still have a following, somewhat.


I would have to agree with you . However they had access to stats that showed the 22 rimfire was involved in more deaths than any other cal. and it was substantiated by the NRA at one time. just can not find the material on the web.

They were not saying to use it for self defense, they just said it was involved in more deaths than any other cal.
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 4:10:11 PM EDT
"A .22 into a tear duct still beats a 9mm in the breastbone." - Col. Jeff Cooper
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