Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Site Notices
Posted: 10/17/2004 6:44:28 AM EST
My son is an 88M (truck driver) in an Army Reserve unit that has been activated for deployment to the Sandbox. I've been to a couple of Family Support Group meetings and the question was on the tip of my tongue but I didn't ask it. As D-day gets closer, I'm getting more concerned. So here's the question to the ARFcom community. Any FIRST-HAND info regarding personal weapons? Any recommendations? There have been some articles regarding gear and accessories in SOF. I'd like to hear from some people that have BTDT.

I'd really like to see him go with a little more than pocket lint. A 9mm or 45 pistol in a drop-leg GI holster would be a nice insurance policy. What about spare parts, springs, etc. for the M16? He's going to make inquiries when he goes for his annual training at the end of this month. Deployment is scheduled for around 1 Dec.. Any help in this matter would be greatly appreciated.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 6:49:44 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 6:50:06 AM EST
We had guys bring them over for DS/DS. Easy to take over, hard as hell to bring back.
Take one if he must, just have him plan on not bringing it back. He can sell it to someone else that deploys there.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 7:11:44 AM EST
The Vietnam days of parents sending their kids shotguns are over. It's practicaclly written in stone: no personal weapons. Special forces/similar units might be able to get away with it I guess, but most soldiers can forget it. If he manages to bring one over, he probably isn't bringing it back with him. Body armor would probably be a better investment anyway.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 7:13:56 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/17/2004 7:16:11 AM EST by Garand_Shooter]
He could probably get it over there, but not get it back. But if he does get caught any step of the way he also will be likely to face an Article 15 depending on the attitude of his command regarding such.

I wouldn't suggest it.

Now a quality knife on the other hand I would consider.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 7:15:32 AM EST

Originally Posted By Steve_T_M:
The Vietnam days of parents sending their kids shotguns are over. It's practicaclly written in stone: no personal weapons. Special forces/similar units might be able to get away with it I guess, but most soldiers can forget it. If he manages to bring one over, he probably isn't bringing it back with him. Body armor would probably be a better investment anyway.



All units rotating into OEF and OIF will have interceptor body armor now.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 7:18:41 AM EST

Originally Posted By diesel1:
I'd really like to see him go with a little more than pocket lint. A 9mm or 45 pistol in a drop-leg GI holster would be a nice insurance policy. What about spare parts, springs, etc. for the M16?.





I will also be deployed shortly, you are not allowed to take any personal weapons over there with you.

It does not mean you CAN'T, a lot of people have, but I would not do it.



What I AM taking though is a spare hi-cap FACTORY or Mec-Gar beretta 92 mag, the army ones suck.
If he is carrying the M9, if not, just give it to someone who is, why not?

Also take some dry lube, and a toothbrush.
Mabye a spare part or two, but his armorer will have all that shit already, for free.

Most importantly is to clean your weapon every day, sometimes twice, if he is your son, he more than likely knows that stuff already. Make sure HE makes sure his fellow soldiers do also, that might make a big difference one day.

Don't make a big deal out of it, the hardest part of leaving for me is the stress it puts on my parents, I'm GLAD to be going, but that is always in the back of my head, making me feel guilty.

Good luck to him

P.S.: I would not ask that question of anyone there.

Link Posted: 10/17/2004 7:45:28 AM EST
I know of a Colt Mk IV in .380 that will never see american soil again....


It is said that if this weapon can't come home, then it is to be given to another that will need it, or be taken down and made into little bits of metal...



They say you CANT take one with you, but one of the big phrases in the military is " there is no such thing as CANT" be smart, be quiet, and be willing to never see it again.


I would never tell a soldier what he should or should not be allowed to bring for a little extra personal security. My best friend is here because his dad had a little .25 cal pistol, there are also 2 other happy families that got to start, and 3 less names on the VN Mem Wall.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 7:54:12 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/17/2004 7:55:51 AM EST by HeavyMetal]
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 8:00:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By Garand_Shooter:
He could probably get it over there, but not get it back. But if he does get caught any step of the way he also will be likely to face an Article 15 depending on the attitude of his command regarding such.

I wouldn't suggest it.

Now a quality knife on the other hand I would consider.



Yea, this is pretty much on point. You see, the Army often looks the other way when it comes to SF units. For regular units returning, he will have to go through a customs check, not to mention a check by his command. If he has a weapon, it will be discovered. Any punishment he would receive would depend on who caught him, where he was caught, and the person's attitude toward POWs (personally owned weapons). Believe it or not, some officers are pro gun and would look the other way, but others are very politically correct and anti gun, and would make an example out of him. This whole scenario assumes no one would question him (make an issue) about it when he tried to carry it on a mission.

Personally, I am 100% against the Army's policy of no POWs (I'm also against the policy of no war trophies--but that is another issue).
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 8:06:57 AM EST
What the previous posters have said is true. Centcom Order 1A prohibits personal firearms. That said there are plenty of people that brought personal weapons with them. Whether or not they can carry them is dependent on how lenient their chain of command is. Everybody that I dealt with over there that brought personal weapons over did not get hassled.

There are other considerations that need mentioning. If the personal weapon is not 5.56, 9mm, 7.62, or 12ga you're going to have problems getting ammunition for it. Even with a .45 pistol you'll have problems getting ammo unless you're able to scam some from the spec ops community.

Magazines are a different story. If your son will be carrying a Beretta, be sure he brings after market magazines as the mil issue ones are complete crap....Trust me on this one!

Getting a personal weapon out is another issue. In short, it will be near impossible to bring a personal weapon home. Every service person is thoroughly searched prior to leaving the AOR. His best bet would be to either give it to another service person or dismantle it. That's the short of it. Let me know if there are any other questions about the sandbox and I'll be glad to help....
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 10:05:50 AM EST
I would think that all the gear going back and forth would make an excellet place to hid a weapon... Or is it that only a little bit of gear moves and your unit only brings your immediat gear.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 10:29:12 AM EST


So the rules against personal weapons do not apply to parts like magazines? What about scopes or other parts? My brother may be going back, and he has an M16/ M203 with only iron sights. I was thinking an ACOG might be helpful.

Diesel1, the SOF recommendations seem to be pretty much what my brother needed his first deployment in Iraq. The leatherman tool was really useful.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 10:43:52 AM EST
Scopes and such are OK. In fact, a nice Trijicon Reflex or Aimpoint would be a good purchase for a 88M who may be taking snap shots out of a moving vehicle.

If he is issued a M-16A2 or A4, a collapsable stock and the wrench to install it prob wouldn't hurt if his command doesn't mind.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 10:53:16 AM EST

Originally Posted By Zapp:

So the rules against personal weapons do not apply to parts like magazines? What about scopes or other parts? My brother may be going back, and he has an M16/ M203 with only iron sights. I was thinking an ACOG might be helpful.

Diesel1, the SOF recommendations seem to be pretty much what my brother needed his first deployment in Iraq. The leatherman tool was really useful.



Mags are fine. I just bought a bunch of new M16 mags at a gun show because the mags I was issued are complete crap... and I was only issued 3 of them

Also picked up a Molle II FLC because I was issued the old shitty LCE. I guess I showed up when my unit and CIF didn't have shit in supply

Optics should be ok too. If I'm ever issued an M4 with an aimpoint my personal EOtech is going on the thing..heh.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 10:54:50 AM EST
Buy him a used compact glock. They go for pretty cheap and are easy to hide.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 5:29:18 PM EST
Be careful about sending him with a personal weapon. I know an Army Lt. that is being threatened with an Article 15 right now becuase he brought a personal weapon.
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 1:04:42 AM EST
Zapp said "Leatherman!!"
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 1:57:25 AM EST
This no personal weapon policy is so freaking stupid. I say the military should allow them to carry a personally owned weapon if they wish. I know if I was going over I'd wanna bring along a handgun. Heck, I could understand if they required training on the weapon, ammo commonality, a quality weapon, etc. But such zero tolerance BS should not be tolerated.

I'm sure if enough people complained to their congress critters, something might be made of this issue. But it would take large numbers.
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 3:03:13 AM EST
October 18, 2004

460 reservists get call: They’ll inspect war gear

By Christopher Munsey
Times staff writer

The Naval Reserve will mobilize 460 drilling reservists this fall to handle a new mission in Iraq and Kuwait — inspecting all returning military equipment for disease-bearing dirt and smuggled contraband.

The customs inspection mission is a new one for the Reserve, and every reservist slated for mobilization will have to be trained first in the job, officials said.

Reservists working out of 31 Reserve centers nationwide will be called up, said Cmdr. Thomas Gresback, a spokesman for the Naval Expeditionary Logistics Support Force.

Once mobilized, the reservists will get six weeks of training at the Cheatham Annex in Williamsburg, Va., before being sent overseas, Gresback said.

“Instead of taking the reservists to U.S. Customs, we’re going to bring the trainers to the reservists,” he said.

Besides customs training, reservists will focus on force protection skills, such as combat lifesaving and qualifying on M16 rifles, during those six weeks.

The mobilized sailors will take over the job from Air Force personnel who’ve performed the mission for the past year.

The job is necessary because every piece of equipment leaving with units rotating out of Iraq and Kuwait — everything from Abrams tanks to tow trucks — is washed with high-pressure water hoses on wash racks at different staging areas.

The goal is making sure that mud, dust and dirt-bearing foreign pests and bacteria are washed clear before the equipment is moved out of theater at ports such as Ash Shuaybah in Kuwait.

Cleaning the equipment keeps pests from being introduced into the United States and possibly harming agriculture.

Inspectors also check the washed vehicles for contraband, looking for things such as weapons and souvenirs stashed by military personnel.

Given that it’s not a role they specifically trained for, learning the customs inspection job and deploying to Kuwait and Iraq will require some flexibility by the reservists, Gresback said.

“Based on our experience with reservists so far, we feel very confident that they’ll not only meet the mission, but exceed it,” he said.

Since many of the reservists have not worked together, building unit cohesion is also a concern, Gresback said.

“That’s what we’re hoping to do in Williamsburg,” he said.

Earlier this summer, Navy leadership tasked NAVELSF with overseeing the training and deployment of the customs inspectors because of its performance in Kuwait and Iraq this year, Gresback said.

Currently, about 485 reservists from NAVELSF Forward Group Bravo are deployed in the two countries.

Reservists drawn from three Naval Cargo Handling Battalions and a Supply Support Battalion help load and unload ships at Ash Shuaybah, run post offices, operate fuel depots and track air cargo.

The first group of 500 reservists, NAVELSF Forward Group Alpha, returned in early September.

Reservists are scheduled to report to their Reserve centers on or about Nov. 30. They’ll be mobilized for at least a year, and deployed for up to eight months. A second group will follow in late 2005.

http://www.navytimes.com/story.php?f=0-NAVYPAPER-381012.php
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 4:02:30 AM EST
As far as personal weapons it's a crap shoot. I brought an HK-91, 20 magazines and a spares kit to GW-1 and managed to get it back again (how this was done will remain a secret to protect the innocent) you can see the pics at

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/Anti_Tank_Company_of_Marines_in_Op_Desert_Storm

If your son is a low profile type with added invisible man qualities and some luck he might be able to pull it off otherwise it's not such a hot idea. On the other hand I for one would be more than happy to contribute to any care package drive.

Please tell your son that everyone I know has the utmost respect for him, his unit and their mission. We sish them good luck and god speed.

Semper Fi
Clint
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 10:59:30 AM EST
i took a police trade-in beretta, spent $300 on it, used white out to give it a faux "butt number". wore it in a 6004 like a lot of other guys. no one asked. i gave it to someone in need before i left. customs inbound is a bitch, dont risk it.
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 11:07:57 AM EST

Originally Posted By diesel1:
My son is an 88M (truck driver) in an Army Reserve unit that has been activated for deployment to the Sandbox. I've been to a couple of Family Support Group meetings and the question was on the tip of my tongue but I didn't ask it. As D-day gets closer, I'm getting more concerned. So here's the question to the ARFcom community. Any FIRST-HAND info regarding personal weapons? Any recommendations? There have been some articles regarding gear and accessories in SOF. I'd like to hear from some people that have BTDT.

SOF? Is this a joke? Or just lack of knowledge?
Flat out against the regs for rank and file. No personal firearms. Only those issued by the unit.

If you're that worried, make sure he knows how to CLEAN his issued arms and KEEP THEM OPERATIONAL. No more sad tales of remfs getting their asses shot off because their unit command failed to enforce proper weapons maintenance procedures, provide materials for same, and if necessary conduct mandatory weapons-cleaning sessions.

Knives, on the other hand - get them some nice cutlery, sky's the limit.
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 11:11:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By Zapp:
The leatherman tool was really useful.

Must have missed the news story about the Leatherman cEO coming out in favor of John F'in Kerry.
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 11:13:46 AM EST

Originally Posted By Charging_Handle:
This no personal weapon policy is so freaking stupid. I say the military should allow them to carry a personally owned weapon if they wish. I know if I was going over I'd wanna bring along a handgun. Heck, I could understand if they required training on the weapon, ammo commonality, a quality weapon, etc. But such zero tolerance BS should not be tolerated.

I'm sure if enough people complained to their congress critters, something might be made of this issue. But it would take large numbers.

It'sa nonsense issue. This isn't some post-apocalypse fantasy. This is organized warfare with a standardized equipment inventory, armorers trained for specific models of firearms, and serious political issues regarding Geneva Conventions and "allowable" types of anti-personnel ammunition.
Spend your time where it will do some good, not on this Individualist crapola.
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 11:14:31 AM EST

Originally Posted By rayra:

Originally Posted By diesel1:
My son is an 88M (truck driver) in an Army Reserve unit that has been activated for deployment to the Sandbox. I've been to a couple of Family Support Group meetings and the question was on the tip of my tongue but I didn't ask it. As D-day gets closer, I'm getting more concerned. So here's the question to the ARFcom community. Any FIRST-HAND info regarding personal weapons? Any recommendations? There have been some articles regarding gear and accessories in SOF. I'd like to hear from some people that have BTDT.

SOF? Is this a joke? Or just lack of knowledge?
Flat out against the regs for rank and file. No personal firearms. Only those issued by the unit.

If you're that worried, make sure he knows how to CLEAN his issued arms and KEEP THEM OPERATIONAL. No more sad tales of remfs getting their asses shot off because their unit command failed to enforce proper weapons maintenance procedures, provide materials for same, and if necessary conduct mandatory weapons-cleaning sessions.

Knives, on the other hand - get them some nice cutlery, sky's the limit.



Not knowing how to take care of your weapon is not the issue here. Shit happens in combat and a backup weapon could save lives.
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 11:39:34 AM EST

Originally Posted By DvlDog:
i took a police trade-in beretta, spent $300 on it, used white out to give it a faux "butt number". wore it in a 6004 like a lot of other guys. no one asked. i gave it to someone in need before i left. customs inbound is a bitch, dont risk it.



This sounds like a good idea... Agree with 'don't try to get it back.' (Unless he can make friends with a contracter who could get it back.)
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 11:52:25 AM EST
How about uppers?
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 2:22:31 PM EST
its just not worth it to bring it back. my dad went over jockeying big-wigs in a C-12, i built him an 870 to keep in the airplane. he got his back because when he came back he flew himself back. told the customs at dover that it belonged ot the unit...nuff said. as for me, i was flying back on DoD transport. had my shit dumped and all. i considered $300 cheap insurance and was more than happy to pass it on. "pay it forward"
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 5:01:48 PM EST

Originally Posted By KA3B:
October 18, 2004

460 reservists get call: They’ll inspect war gear

By Christopher Munsey
Times staff writer

The Naval Reserve will mobilize 460 drilling reservists this fall to handle a new mission in Iraq and Kuwait — inspecting all returning military equipment for disease-bearing dirt and smuggled contraband.

http://www.navytimes.com/story.php?f=0-NAVYPAPER-381012.php



Good old navy
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 5:32:23 PM EST
It's possible I'll go, I've been waiting on a wiaver from a medical discharge from the navy to be signed so God willing I can re enlist into the national guard, an infantry unit, but so far, I haven't heard anything, it's been months. I think it will depend on who's elected, if bush then in my opinion we'll be over their awhile and I'll eventually go.
Anyhow, I thought it was real certain back in august and was planning on personal weapons, and investing in body armor, personal weapon was gonna be a benelli 12 guage, and yes also some knives. I guess it would be worth the risk of not being able to bring something back though.
Top Top