[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Please delete.... (Page 1 of 5)
Posted: 3/26/2010 4:21:55 AM EDT
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Idea for topic taken from this thread...For Agnostics and Atheists: What will you say if you run into God when you die? It seems lots of people just see God and the afterlife a joke...Is hell a fun place in your eyes? Please delete this thread. |
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Idea for topic taken from this thread...For Agnostics and Atheists: What will you say if you run into God when you die? It seems lots of people just see God and the afterlife a joke...Is hell a fun place in your eyes? 
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Quoted: Quoted: Idea for topic taken from this thread...For Agnostics and Atheists: What will you say if you run into God when you die? It seems lots of people just see God and the afterlife a joke...Is hell a fun place in your eyes? Nope, honest question. It really bothers me that so many people think they will be having fun in hell. I don't know why it bothers me, but it just does. It really saddens me that people see it as a joke. I do believe however, we are allowed to accept or reject what we want and it is our choice. ETA: It really bothers me less if people just say they don't believe than to just think it will be some kind of wonderful amusement park or whatever they believe. |
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Idea for topic taken from this thread...For Agnostics and Atheists: What will you say if you run into God when you die? It seems lots of people just see God and the afterlife a joke...Is hell a fun place in your eyes? Nope, honest question. It really bothers me that so many people think they will be having fun in hell. I don't know why it bothers me, but it just does. It really saddens me that people see it as a joke. I do believe however, we are allowed to accept or reject what we want and it is our choice. ETA: It really bothers me less if people just say they don't believe than to just think it will be some kind of wonderful amusement park or whatever they believe. it really bothers a LOT of others to assume they believe what you do......JMHO |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Idea for topic taken from this thread...For Agnostics and Atheists: What will you say if you run into God when you die? It seems lots of people just see God and the afterlife a joke...Is hell a fun place in your eyes? Nope, honest question. It really bothers me that so many people think they will be having fun in hell. I don't know why it bothers me, but it just does. It really saddens me that people see it as a joke. I do believe however, we are allowed to accept or reject what we want and it is our choice. ETA: It really bothers me less if people just say they don't believe than to just think it will be some kind of wonderful amusement park or whatever they believe. it really bothers a LOT of others to assume they believe what you do......JMHO Again, that is entirely fine. Like I said we all have the right to believe what we want to. |
 One of the folks who voted "no." Slam my beliefs if you want, you're not changing my mind.
I guess the folks that think it'd be fun, or that it doesn't exist, haven't even thought out the implications of Pascal's Wager, if nothing else. 
That being said, I'm not going to "get all preachy" on y'all. ETA: IBTL. |
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One of the folks who voted "no." Slam my beliefs if you want, you're not changing my mind.
I guess the folks that think it'd be fun, or that it doesn't exist, haven't even thought out the implications of Pascal's Wager, if nothing else. Which god does Pascal's wager apply to? Why pick that one over the others? |
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Being that we disagree on the factual presence of a "god" your line of thinking is flawed. Since it is a BELIEF system, either way.......and we both think that we are correct, we are not going to come to a resolution that you desire.
Stop trying to convert me. Fuck, is it that fucking hard to just let the dog lie? |
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Let me put it this way. I have seen a non-believer dying and a believer dying and the difference between the peace at the time of death was entirely different. The believe had his hands raised towards the ceiling smiling up until his last breath. The non-believer screamed in torment with a look of fear on his face. This has been accounted by many people as happening this way. |
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Quoted: Being that we disagree on the factual presence of a "god" your line of thinking is flawed. Since it is a BELIEF system, either way.......and we both think that we are correct, we are not going to come to a resolution that you desire. Stop trying to convert me. Fuck, is it that fucking hard to just let the dog lie? Stating opinions and beliefs is not trying to convert someone. You clicked on the thread knowing what it was about. It is your choice what you want to believe. I am not trying to convert anyone. You have made your choice. Is it that hard to not click on a thread where you know someone might be talking about God? You aren't getting personal emails trying to convert you with the Word of God or even telling you the message of salvation. Where do you get someone is trying to convert you every time they post a belief? Are you trying to convert me to a non-believer?  |
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Quoted: Hell won't be so bad. Most of my friends will be there. This... if I believed in it's existence. Blame it on my upbringing, my parents, my social circle, TV, violent video games and movies... blame it on a piano that gave me grief - I just don't know why. I'm not wired that way, and there really isn't so much I can do about it. I simply can not, and do not believe. If I make a joke, it isn't to disparage those that do believe, just understand from my perspective it's as unlikely as me waking up to a Unicorn vomiting rainbows and handheld gaming systems just for me. I just can't make myself do it against my ingrained feelings on the matter. That, or I'm just sick.
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| I dont believe in Hell, but if I did I would probably rather go there than Heaven. That old saying "Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven", comes to mind. I'll be damned if I am going to bow to some narcissistic god that has never done anything for me, I would rather be in Hell where you would be free to do as you wish. I am not trying to piss on anyone's beliefs, that is just my .02. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Idea for topic taken from this thread...For Agnostics and Atheists: What will you say if you run into God when you die? It seems lots of people just see God and the afterlife a joke...Is hell a fun place in your eyes? Nope, honest question. It really bothers me that so many people think they will be having fun in hell. I don't know why it bothers me, but it just does. It really saddens me that people see it as a joke. I do believe however, we are allowed to accept or reject what we want and it is our choice. ETA: It really bothers me less if people just say they don't believe than to just think it will be some kind of wonderful amusement park or whatever they believe. I don't believe in it but I also joke about it sometimes. |
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I used to be religious, but I couldn't get around the fact that the central argument is mere tautology. God exists because a book says he exists, and it's right because he wrote it or made sure it was written. I don't think this argument is going to gain any traction here. Most people don't know what tautology means. |
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Quoted: That's why I posted that comic, I figured it would help explain the term.I used to be religious, but I couldn't get around the fact that the central argument is mere tautology. God exists because a book says he exists, and it's right because he wrote it or made sure it was written. I don't think this argument is going to gain any traction here. Most people don't know what tautology means. |
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Quoted: Let me put it this way. I have seen a non-believer dying and a believer dying and the difference between the peace at the time of death was entirely different. The believe had his hands raised towards the ceiling smiling up until his last breath. The non-believer screamed in torment with a look of fear on his face. This has been accounted by many people as happening this way.  |
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Quoted: http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/honor_societies.png I used to be religious, but I couldn't get around the fact that the central argument is mere tautology. God exists because a book says he exists, and it's right because he wrote it or made sure it was written. God doesn't exist to me just because the Bible says so. I have seen Him work in peoples lives including my own. I have felt His presence. Did you ever experience that when you were "religious". I do not consider myself religious. I consider myself a believer. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Let me put it this way. I have seen a non-believer dying and a believer dying and the difference between the peace at the time of death was entirely different. The believe had his hands raised towards the ceiling smiling up until his last breath. The non-believer screamed in torment with a look of fear on his face. This has been accounted by many people as happening this way. Absolutely true story. Happened at a nursing home I worked at. Many people could attest to it, believers and non-believers. I wish I could find the post, but I posted about the guy that had his hands raised up when it happened and also told about it in a couple of other threads. |
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Hell won't be so bad. Most of my friends will be there. This... if I believed in it's existence. Blame it on my upbringing, my parents, my social circle, TV, violent video games and movies... blame it on a piano that gave me grief - I just don't know why. I'm not wired that way, and there really isn't so much I can do about it. I simply can not, and do not believe. If I make a joke, it isn't to disparage those that do believe, just understand from my perspective it's as unlikely as me waking up to a Unicorn vomiting rainbows and handheld gaming systems just for me. I just can't make myself do it against my ingrained feelings on the matter. That, or I'm just sick. Well said. The funny thing about hell is this: I'm by default an non-believer (see above). I've lived a clean life. I've been a productive father, husband, and employee. I've never purposefully hurt anyone. According to the OP, I'm going to burn in a sulfurous pit after death. But that black dude who raped his toddler then wrapped her in the rug and left her die from exposure; If he repents on his death bed, I mean whole-heartedly repents with the conviction of a true believer, that dude gets a free pass? C'mon now. That's asinine. |
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Let me put it this way. I have seen a non-believer dying and a believer dying and the difference between the peace at the time of death was entirely different. The believe had his hands raised towards the ceiling smiling up until his last breath. The non-believer screamed in torment with a look of fear on his face. This has been accounted by many people as happening this way.
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You'll all think it's funny till you find out your seat in hell is right in between Nanci Pelosi and Dianne Feinstein and you're all nekkid.
 Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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I'm not going to participate in this thread much further. You're exhibiting the same mode of discourse on the subject that is just off-putting to those who aren't evangelical Christians. Anecdotal evidence of peaceful deaths and feelings of God aren't very effective in making someone reconsider the existence of God. It's cool that it's working out for you, but it's not other people's fault that they're not responding to your arguments. |
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Quoted: I'm not going to participate in this thread much further. You're exhibiting the same mode of discourse on the subject that is just off-putting to those who aren't evangelical Christians. Anecdotal evidence of peaceful deaths and feelings of God aren't very effective in making someone reconsider the existence of God. It's cool that it's working out for you, but it's not other people's fault that they're not responding to your arguments. I am not arguing with anyone, just telling a true story about what happened. Like I said it is your choice to believe what you want to believe. I am not trying to change your mind. ETA: I also believe that not everyone who claims to be a Christian is going to heaven. Not everyone who has the title is a true Christian. |
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Quoted: http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/honor_societies.png I used to be religious, but I couldn't get around the fact that the central argument is mere tautology. God exists because a book says he exists, and it's right because he wrote it or made sure it was written. +1  |
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Let me put it this way. I have seen a non-believer dying and a believer dying and the difference between the peace at the time of death was entirely different. The believe had his hands raised towards the ceiling smiling up until his last breath. The non-believer screamed in torment with a look of fear on his face. This has been accounted by many people as happening this way.
Absolutely true story. Happened at a nursing home I worked at. Many people could attest to it, believers and non-believers. I wish I could find the post, but I posted about the guy that had his hands raised up when it happened and also told about it in a couple of other threads. Are you saying that religion makes people more comfortable with the idea of dieing? I think this is absolutely true. It doesn't imply that God and hell are real, though. As someone with a medical background, you're probably aware of a large number of different coping mechanisms that people have. Either way, this is not even close to evidence of the existence of an afterlife. |
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Quoted: One of the folks who voted "no." Slam my beliefs if you want, you're not changing my mind.I guess the folks that think it'd be fun, or that it doesn't exist, haven't even thought out the implications of Pascal's Wager, if nothing else. That being said, I'm not going to "get all preachy" on y'all. ETA: IBTL. Oh we have. Pascal's wager assumes that one can determine what one religion to choose. So tell me...what religion should I follow? Christianity? Islam? Judaism? Hinduism? The Aborigine religion? The religion of the ancient Greeks? The aztec religion? Scientology? The religion of the Vikings? Native American religions? Really, they all seem equally plausible/implausible to me. Also Pascal's wager is a strawman. It is the exact same as: "Why not believe in santa just in case he is real and will bring you presents some day?" If you think santa is made up then you can never force yourself to believe otherwise. For the sake of argument lets assume santa is real and does bring people who believe in him presents. Me saying "well, I don't think santa is real, but incase he is I'll pretend that I believe in him so maybe he'll bring me a present" will not work. It just won't. Since I can't trick myself into believing in something, and I can't trick a supreme being into thinking that I believe in them when I really don't, pascal's wager is completely useless. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Let me put it this way. I have seen a non-believer dying and a believer dying and the difference between the peace at the time of death was entirely different. The believe had his hands raised towards the ceiling smiling up until his last breath. The non-believer screamed in torment with a look of fear on his face. This has been accounted by many people as happening this way. Absolutely true story. Happened at a nursing home I worked at. Many people could attest to it, believers and non-believers. I wish I could find the post, but I posted about the guy that had his hands raised up when it happened and also told about it in a couple of other threads. Are you saying that religion makes people more comfortable with the idea of dieing? I think this is absolutely true. It doesn't imply that God and hell are real, though. As someone with a medical background, you're probably aware of a large number of different coping mechanisms that people have. Either way, this is not even close to evidence of the existence of an afterlife. No but it could point towards the afterlife. My story is not the only one like that. When I saw the one man die the expression on his face was unexplainable. It was like he saw an angel, God, a loved one, or something. Whatever it was, there was a distinct difference between the 2 deaths. |
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Let me put it this way. I have seen a non-believer dying and a believer dying and the difference between the peace at the time of death was entirely different. The believe had his hands raised towards the ceiling smiling up until his last breath. The non-believer screamed in torment with a look of fear on his face. This has been accounted by many people as happening this way.
Absolutely true story. Happened at a nursing home I worked at. Many people could attest to it, believers and non-believers. I wish I could find the post, but I posted about the guy that had his hands raised up when it happened and also told about it in a couple of other threads. Are you saying that religion makes people more comfortable with the idea of dieing? I think this is absolutely true. It doesn't imply that God and hell are real, though. As someone with a medical background, you're probably aware of a large number of different coping mechanisms that people have. Either way, this is not even close to evidence of the existence of an afterlife. No but it could point towards the afterlife. My story is not the only one like that. When I saw the one man die the expression on his face was unexplainable. It was like he saw an angel, God, a loved one, or something. Whatever it was, there was a distinct difference between the 2 deaths. It's called "morphine". I feel sorry for the other agonized bastard who didn't get enough. |
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All religons say basically two things....
How to treat your fellow man... And what happens when you die... If your GOD condems me to eternal damnation.... for my actions ...for the blink of an eye that I'm on this planet.... I really don't want much to do with that..... God is supposening merciful.....
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Let me put it this way. I have seen a non-believer dying and a believer dying and the difference between the peace at the time of death was entirely different. The believe had his hands raised towards the ceiling smiling up until his last breath. The non-believer screamed in torment with a look of fear on his face. This has been accounted by many people as happening this way.
Absolutely true story. Happened at a nursing home I worked at. Many people could attest to it, believers and non-believers. I wish I could find the post, but I posted about the guy that had his hands raised up when it happened and also told about it in a couple of other threads. Are you saying that religion makes people more comfortable with the idea of dieing? I think this is absolutely true. It doesn't imply that God and hell are real, though. As someone with a medical background, you're probably aware of a large number of different coping mechanisms that people have. Either way, this is not even close to evidence of the existence of an afterlife. No but it could point towards the afterlife. My story is not the only one like that. When I saw the one man die the expression on his face was unexplainable. It was like he saw an angel, God, a loved one, or something. Whatever it was, there was a distinct difference between the 2 deaths. Two deaths won't tell you a thing. There could have been different disease processes in the two people. They probably lived completely different lives and have brains that are wired in completely different ways. As the brain dies and different pathways are interrupted, people probably experience some crazy things that are in no way related to the supernatural. If you're using religion to ease your fear about death and the unknown, it's cool; do what makes you happy. Insisting that your opinions are factual and that we're idiots for not coming to the same conclusions as you after a couple anecdotal observations is absurd. ETA: Also, as Khemist points out, this is a nursing home. These guys were probably on all sorts of heavy meds. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Let me put it this way. I have seen a non-believer dying and a believer dying and the difference between the peace at the time of death was entirely different. The believe had his hands raised towards the ceiling smiling up until his last breath. The non-believer screamed in torment with a look of fear on his face. This has been accounted by many people as happening this way. Absolutely true story. Happened at a nursing home I worked at. Many people could attest to it, believers and non-believers. I wish I could find the post, but I posted about the guy that had his hands raised up when it happened and also told about it in a couple of other threads. Are you saying that religion makes people more comfortable with the idea of dieing? I think this is absolutely true. It doesn't imply that God and hell are real, though. As someone with a medical background, you're probably aware of a large number of different coping mechanisms that people have. Either way, this is not even close to evidence of the existence of an afterlife. No but it could point towards the afterlife. My story is not the only one like that. When I saw the one man die the expression on his face was unexplainable. It was like he saw an angel, God, a loved one, or something. Whatever it was, there was a distinct difference between the 2 deaths. There are many ways to die. Some much more excruciating than others. A few times as a kid I dried to swim across an Olympic sized pool longways. I could make it about 3/4 of the way across before my brain was severely starved of oxygen. Thinking slows down, vision goes to tunnels, other senses are muted...your brain is telling you that you need to breath desperately...but somehow, you almost don't care much. It was the most peaceful experience I've ever had in my life. More than once the thought of "if I died right now, I don't think I'd care" ran through my mind. Eventually I came up for air. |