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Posted: 8/7/2014 8:33:31 PM EDT
Why don't they exist? Given how old piezoelectricity is, I'm surprised it hasn't been attempted.

ETA

Not for potato guns, cartridge guns.
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 8:35:56 PM EDT
[#1]
You don't remember that electronically fired Remington 700?
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 8:35:56 PM EDT
[#2]
Remington did it back in the 90s.
Great triggers.
Stupid expensive to reload.
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 8:36:41 PM EDT
[#3]
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 8:38:49 PM EDT
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Remington Etronx.

I had one in 220 swift  at one point.
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No shit? I thought they were battery powered.
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 8:40:26 PM EDT
[#5]
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 8:43:04 PM EDT
[#6]
CVA made an electrically fired muzzleloader called the Electra. They don't make it anymore.


Link Posted: 8/7/2014 8:44:25 PM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

  Yeah they were, but close enough.... It used electrically fired primers.


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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Remington Etronx.

I had one in 220 swift  at one point.


No shit? I thought they were battery powered.

  Yeah they were, but close enough.... It used electrically fired primers.




Just did some more reading and apparently the RPG-7 uses a piezoelectric system...it's a little outside the scope of what I'm talking about though. I'm just surprised we don't have some 18th century PE rifles, even prototypes or failed attempts.
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 8:47:10 PM EDT
[#8]
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Quoted:
CVA made an electrically fired muzzleloader called the Electra. They don't make it anymore.


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Still used a battery (good find though).

I'm picturing a mechanical PE igniter; either self contained in the cartridge using the firing pin force ( in a conventional gun), or part of the firearm itself.
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 8:49:51 PM EDT
[#9]
Mechanically striking a piezo crystal to generate electricity for igniting the primer in a cartridge...

...really isn't any simpler or more reliable than directly striking the primer itself.

Also, the use of an electric spark to ignite the primer implies relatively high voltages - which don't tolerate wet environments.
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 8:53:46 PM EDT
[#10]
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 8:54:34 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Mechanically striking a piezo crystal to generate electricity for igniting the primer in a cartridge...

...really isn't any simpler or more reliable than directly striking the primer itself.

Also, the use of an electric spark to ignite the primer implies relatively high voltages - which don't tolerate wet environments.
View Quote



Yea, I realize it probably isn't that practical, just surprised there's not some wacky example somewhere in history.

Part of the reason I'm so intrigued is thinking about reloadable rimfire sans priming compound.
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 9:11:31 PM EDT
[#12]
Also, if you're igniting a primer with high voltage, how do you keep static electricity from also igniting it?
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 9:31:00 PM EDT
[#13]
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Quoted:

how do you keep static electricity from also igniting it?
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Link Posted: 8/7/2014 9:34:13 PM EDT
[#14]
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Quoted:



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Quoted:
Quoted:

how do you keep static electricity from also igniting it?





OK, how does that short out the "bad" high voltage, without also shorting out the "good" high voltage?
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 9:34:26 PM EDT
[#15]
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Quoted:
Also, if you're igniting a primer with high voltage, how do you keep static electricity from also igniting it?
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Rubber mags?
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 9:42:08 PM EDT
[#16]
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Quoted:
Remington did it back in the 90s.
Great triggers.
Stupid expensive to reload.
View Quote


Do they still not make them?

Chambered for 220 Swift, 22-250 Remington, and 243 Win, the Model 700 EtronX is available in limited quantities. Have your local dealer contact Zanders Sporting Goods for ordering details.
Key Features:

MODEL 700™ ETRONX™
Caliber Mag. Cap. Barrel Length Rate of Twist Overall Length Avg. Wt. (lbs.) Order No. MSRP
220 Swift 4 26" 14" 45 7/8" 8 7/8 26400 $1,999
22-250 Remington 4 26" 14" 45 7/8" 8 7/8 26402 $1,999
243 Win 4 26" 9 1/8" 45 7/8" 8 7/8 26404 $1,999

LOP: 13 3/8"; Drop at Comb: 1 5/8"; Drop at Heel: 1 1/4"

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/831855/remington-etronx-electronic-primers-box-of-1000-10-trays-of-100
Link Posted: 8/7/2014 9:46:28 PM EDT
[#17]
Link Posted: 8/8/2014 12:05:18 PM EDT
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History



That's the kinda stuff I'm looking for.
Link Posted: 8/8/2014 12:14:06 PM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Just did some more reading and apparently the RPG-7 uses a piezoelectric system...

it's a little outside the scope of what I'm talking about though. I'm just surprised we don't have some 18th century PE rifles, even prototypes or failed attempts.
View Quote



You are a long way OFF on the RPG.

RPG tube is a precussion system to fire the grenade.

The warhead uses

Link Posted: 8/8/2014 12:17:20 PM EDT
[#20]
If for anything else, I don't want electronics in my guns?  Mechanical crap can't be hacked, can't be "backdoored," etc

Mechanical stuff either works, or it doesn't.  That's a quality that I desire in a firearm.
Link Posted: 8/8/2014 2:45:55 PM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
If for anything else, I don't want electronics in my guns?  Mechanical crap can't be hacked, can't be "backdoored," etc

Mechanical stuff either works, or it doesn't.  That's a quality that I desire in a firearm.
View Quote



Piezoelectric stuff is more or less mechanical. Pretty much just smacking a crystal or ceramic to generate a charge.
Link Posted: 8/8/2014 3:22:27 PM EDT
[#22]
I managed to resist buying the Etronix.
I just couldn't see it happening at that point; cost promised to outweigh advantage.
Link Posted: 8/8/2014 3:53:04 PM EDT
[#23]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
You are a long way OFF on the RPG.



RPG tube is a precussion system to fire the grenade.



The warhead uses



http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn206/Giaosuech/m72impactsensor-doan-s1.jpg

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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:



Quoted:



Just did some more reading and apparently the RPG-7 uses a piezoelectric system...



it's a little outside the scope of what I'm talking about though. I'm just surprised we don't have some 18th century PE rifles, even prototypes or failed attempts.






You are a long way OFF on the RPG.



RPG tube is a precussion system to fire the grenade.



The warhead uses



http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn206/Giaosuech/m72impactsensor-doan-s1.jpg

He said RPG-7 not an M72 LAW. Oh, and as a result you are wrong. The -7 is a piezoelectric fuze for the warhead.



 
Link Posted: 8/8/2014 4:58:19 PM EDT
[#24]
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Quoted:

He said RPG-7 not an M72 LAW. Oh, and as a result you are wrong. The -7 is a piezoelectric fuze for the warhead.
 
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Delbaeth.

you got me. oh SNAP.

I used a LAW rocket cut away because that was easy to pull up.





PG7.



And you are wrong.
RPG7scan fire differnt types of warheads




Stay in your lane A&M Tech1

Link Posted: 8/8/2014 5:56:44 PM EDT
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:






Just did some more reading and apparently the RPG-7 uses a piezoelectric system...it's a little outside the scope of what I'm talking about though. I'm just surprised we don't have some 18th century PE rifles, even prototypes or failed attempts.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Remington Etronx.

I had one in 220 swift  at one point.


No shit? I thought they were battery powered.

  Yeah they were, but close enough.... It used electrically fired primers.








Just did some more reading and apparently the RPG-7 uses a piezoelectric system...it's a little outside the scope of what I'm talking about though. I'm just surprised we don't have some 18th century PE rifles, even prototypes or failed attempts.



That fires the warhead, not the propulsion. It sits at the forward end of the standoff cone, to set the correct distance for the shaped charge. It needs to hit something hard (like armor) to go high order.  

A pyro designer I worked with believed that hitting something soft, like a car or a house, wouldn't set one off. Any experience here on ARF?
Link Posted: 8/8/2014 6:34:19 PM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:  That fires the warhead, not the propulsion. It sits at the forward end of the standoff cone, to set the correct distance for the shaped charge. It needs to hit something hard (like armor) to go high order.  

A pyro designer I worked with believed that hitting something soft, like a car or a house, wouldn't set one off. Any experience here on ARF?
View Quote


Wasn't there a Marine hit with one that didn't explode?  Don't know that he survived the embedded warhead, but I seem to remember he made it to the evac clinic.
Link Posted: 8/8/2014 6:43:47 PM EDT
[#27]
I saw one hit a car and explode in Mosul. I can't promise it didn't hit something structural, though. Shit was wrecked.
Link Posted: 8/10/2014 10:17:04 AM EDT
[#28]
You need a more complex primer, making less reliable.  Sure, larger ammunition like 20mm and above sometimes have it.
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