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Posted: 11/1/2009 3:32:31 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2009 3:33:17 PM EST by hapjack]
Just curious to see what people think......
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:33:38 PM EST
A lot of the engineers I know spend their days playing WoW and watching baseball games at work, so I'm going to say doctors.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:34:53 PM EST
I know quite a few doctors. All I can say is I'm sure every profession has their fair share of idiots.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:35:25 PM EST
Engineers. AFAIK they don't have an equivalent organization to Physicians for Social Responsibility.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:35:40 PM EST
GENERALLY speaking, engineers, based on my limited personal experiences with both.

But really, the answer has a lot to do with how you define intelligence.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:39:30 PM EST
Depends on what kind of doctors
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:39:36 PM EST
As Ian Malcolm would say, "thintelligence".
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:40:29 PM EST
There's book smart, that would be doctors and then there is knowing how stuff works and being able to solve problems, that would be engineers.

A good doctor would be a doc w/ a ChemE as an undergrad degree.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:40:43 PM EST
I am a doctor who went to an engineering school. Engineers as a whole are probably smarter in terms of problem solving and calculations. Medical students have to be good at rote memorization and to be able to recall massive amounts of information, but problem solving is not tested as critically.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:41:08 PM EST
How do we count PhD's?
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:41:34 PM EST
In terms of solving problems, them engine folks are perty good!
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:43:18 PM EST
Originally Posted By ClayP:
I am a doctor who went to an engineering school. Engineers as a whole are probably smarter in terms of problem solving and calculations. Medical students have to be good at rote memorization and to be able to recall massive amounts of information, but problem solving is not tested as critically.


That's a scary thought. How do you weed out the ones who can't problem solve, if you don't mind my asking?
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:43:59 PM EST
Most doctors have a more "well rounded" intelligence, if you will.

Engineers seem to be very book smart, but are often lacking in other areas.

Many, but not all doctors are very book smart, but also have very good people skills
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:44:02 PM EST
I have known some of each who were very smart.
I have also known some of each who have done incredibly stupid things.

I have also know some of each who thought they were god and their shit didn't stink.

In the case of the surgeon who cut me open , stopped my heart and played patti -cake with , patched it up , and then got my heart restarted , I find it hard to make the case that he isn't god.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:44:22 PM EST
Two different kinds of smart.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:45:22 PM EST

Originally Posted By joshki:
Originally Posted By ClayP:
I am a doctor who went to an engineering school. Engineers as a whole are probably smarter in terms of problem solving and calculations. Medical students have to be good at rote memorization and to be able to recall massive amounts of information, but problem solving is not tested as critically.


That's a scary thought. How do you weed out the ones who can't problem solve, if you don't mind my asking?
you don't.

Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:45:29 PM EST
Engineer here, I voted Docs.

Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:47:49 PM EST
Originally Posted By HarryDunne:
Most doctors have a more "well rounded" intelligence, if you will.

Engineers seem to be very book smart, but are often lacking in other areas.

Many, but not all doctors are very book smart, but also have very good people skills


Originally Posted By BustinCaps:
Two different kinds of smart.




These.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:48:53 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2009 3:49:16 PM EST by MFP_4073]
I have worked extensively around MDs for over 10 years and I admire them quite a bit.

However- many of them fall victim to a basic personal flaw which is the following:

"Because I am a extremely well-educated, board certified, etc and know a ton about neurosurgery - I therefore am an expert in ________ ."

I have seen it over and over. They think their intelligence spills over into sports, aviation, politics, military affairs, business, whatever. Some of it undoubtedly stems from being in a position where it is seldom good / respected to say "I don't know..."

I honestly have see it time and time again and they often pay a heavy price for it.

So therefore I feel the answer is Engineers: experts in their fields- but smart enough to know when they are out of their league.

4073
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:49:21 PM EST
Doctors become doctors b/c they can't do calculus.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:49:22 PM EST
Originally Posted By ClayP:

Originally Posted By joshki:
Originally Posted By ClayP:
I am a doctor who went to an engineering school. Engineers as a whole are probably smarter in terms of problem solving and calculations. Medical students have to be good at rote memorization and to be able to recall massive amounts of information, but problem solving is not tested as critically.


That's a scary thought. How do you weed out the ones who can't problem solve, if you don't mind my asking?
you don't.



yikes.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:50:43 PM EST
Originally Posted By BustinCaps:
Two different kinds of smart.

Take them out of their element and they are both equally ignorant. Just because you are a master of one thing does not make you a master of all. Lots of doctors and engineers could be put in situations were they would be ignorant enough to die from easily avoidable mistakes.

No man is an island.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:50:47 PM EST
of the engineers I've dealt with, the new crop coming out of college is scary. no practical knowledge - just what they read in a book. doctors are a little more hands on.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:55:54 PM EST
I think it's all subjective...

I knew an Engineer who had 2 doctorates, one in mathematics and one in aerospace engineering. I have no doubt in my mind, that he was the smartest man I'd ever met. He worked on the International Space station, and in his spare time, he researched architecture and structural engineering, and then he built a house. And this was over a period of several weeks.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:56:08 PM EST

Originally Posted By BustinCaps:
Two different kinds of smart.


Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:56:39 PM EST
Originally Posted By BustinCaps:
Two different kinds of smart.


This...it's math vs science...

Whats the better tasting fruit...apples or oranges

Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:56:40 PM EST
I may be biased since I'm an engineer but here's my take-

Doctors are definitely smart, but most of their schooling is sheer hard-work and determination. They do a lot of mass memorization because the human body hasn't changed much over the last several centuries. (I am excluding the few that do cutting edge research - thought they are more engineering-like.) Some doctors are incredibly skilled, but skill in performing a technique is quite different than solving open-ended problems.

Engineers, on the other hand, learn basic concepts and have to apply them to different problems in order to achieve success. An engineer may not see the same problem more than a handful of times in his career. Now, of course, some engineers (by degree) cannot do this - I call them technicians.

All professions have their share of idiots - including this one.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:57:25 PM EST
I'm a doc, and I voted for the engineers.

Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:58:15 PM EST
Originally Posted By Dan_shoe:
of the engineers I've dealt with, the new crop coming out of college is scary. no practical knowledge - just what they read in a book. doctors are a little more hands on.


Yah, but the new engineer will most likely not be soon making life-and-death decisions without the problem-solving skills to deal with it.

Engineers, by far.

My father, all my friends from UofL and the guys I worked with in the consulting business all have been the most intelligent people. Dr's have been good at repeating what they were told, but don't do well with problem solving.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:59:17 PM EST
Well, I'm going to be an MD in 6 months, but...

...my wife has her BS in Chemical Engineering, and is also going to be an MD in 6 months, so...

...I guess I don't actually have an answer, being the dumb one with a liberal artsy-fartsy BA...

Link Posted: 11/1/2009 3:59:54 PM EST
Originally Posted By GarandM1:
Engineers. AFAIK they don't have an equivalent organization to Physicians for Social Responsibility.


Those guys can all go DIAF.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:00:52 PM EST
Originally Posted By TheGrayMan:
I'm a doc, and I voted for the engineers.



That's interesting, why do you feel that way? (if you don't mind to answer)

Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:01:38 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2009 4:04:30 PM EST by fatalerror113]
Engineers, because they know the plane will take off.

Doctors....not so much.



In reality I'd stay its a tossup.

I know plenty of engineers that are smart as hell.

I know others who I wonder how they got their PE.

There are doctors that seem to know their shit.

There are others who don't know their ass from a hole in the ground.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:03:05 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/1/2009 4:03:26 PM EST by raven]
My dad's an engineer, but he is also a liberal.

Smart in some ways, definitely. But others? Uh......
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:04:54 PM EST
Originally Posted By MFP_4073:
They think their intelligence spills over into sports, aviation, politics, military affairs, business, whatever.

You think that's bad, try arguing with them about bookkeeping and taxes. I make a pretty good living now cleaning-up their messes.

As to the poll, I think in raw intelligence doctors are much smarter, but in practical terms engineers are a smarter bunch because they're willing to ask questions and to learn.z
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:04:56 PM EST

I will say a couple comments about MDs in their defense:

They have to deal with the 'x-factor' human element. They do not solve problems in a 1, 2, 3 / x, y, z mathematical void.

They are dealing with a human being- someone's mom, dad, kid etc. No solution is ever the same- there are always the human elements that have to be addressed.

They also have to have (or SHOLUD have) - in most specialties- some degree of personal touch. That is not required of engineers.

So while I still say Engineers for overall intelligence- there is a ton more required of MDs to be effective than just intelligence.

4073
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:05:02 PM EST
Originally Posted By hapjack:
Originally Posted By TheGrayMan:
I'm a doc, and I voted for the engineers.



That's interesting, why do you feel that way? (if you don't mind to answer)



Because they're much more the prototypical egg-head, book-smart geeks we typically associate with high intelligence. I know lots of engineers... and they're a smart crew. Physicians aren't generally dumb bunnies either, but that's belied by the fact that we're too stupid to quit the soul-crushing grind that drives so many of us into an early grave.

That's my only-partially-tongue-in-cheek answer.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:07:11 PM EST
well I'm an engineer, so I'm going to go ahead and vote engineer

now if I can only find a position somewhere that will take a recent grad...
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:08:52 PM EST
Originally Posted By Ironmaker:
There's book smart, that would be doctors and then there is knowing how stuff works and being able to solve problems, that would be engineers.

A good doctor would be a doc w/ a ChemE as an undergrad degree.


Not to sure about the knowing how thngs work part, when my son was in engineering school , he showed 2 prof's how to change the brakes on their vehicles, fixed anothers ATV, overhauled several carbs for others, showed/hepled numerous students HOW TO CHANGE THE OIL in their cars,most were astonished it only took about 20 min.

He was in HIGH demand for student projects because MOST students had NO idea how things worked.

Don't get me wrong engineers design some amazing stuff, but then some equip. I get I KNOW the guy that designed it had never operated a similar, or this machine
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:09:30 PM EST

Originally Posted By Ironmaker:
There's book smart, that would be doctors and then there is knowing how stuff works and being able to solve problems, that would be engineers.

A good doctor would be a doc w/ a ChemE as an undergrad degree.

engineers I've dealt with had absolutely no common sense,none.they were smart as hell when it came to certain things but dumb as a stump with other relatively simple problems.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:10:09 PM EST
In order to become a doctor, you have to have a solid understanding of a complex system, be able to diagnose problems that occur, and do your best to correct the problems. The same can be said for graduates of your community college's auto repair program.

In order to become an engineer, you must have a solid understanding of complex materials, be able to predict problems that might occur, and then create a complex system from those materials.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:13:29 PM EST
Intelligence.

In my world, that means brains, education, and common sense.

Doctors for the win.

20 yrs in the mil as a bedpan commando - I've spent some time around docs.

11 yrs as an electrician, dealing with engineers.

Some engineers I've seen just don't have any common sense.

Many times in the last 2 yrs I've taken their drawing back, and showed them that what they drew just plain won't work.

Last example:

A box is 30"W x 48"W x 48"Deep.

I have 9 3" EMTs that need to go into it.

3" EMT is about 3.5" OD.

9 x 3.5" = 31.5"

He drew it up so that the EMT went into the 30" side of the box.

You can't fit 31.5" of something into 30" - and that's not even considering the space between the pipes.

The guy scares me.

Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:15:13 PM EST

Originally Posted By MFP_4073:

So therefore I feel the answer is Engineers: experts in their fields- but smart enough to know when they are out of their league.

4073

Engineers in my experience are significantly worse than any Doctor I've ever seen. They aren't typically well rounded intellectually or personality wise and end up lying and pulling so much shit out of their asses it could stop up public bathroom. When you call them on it they usually say something about how everyone pulls things out of their asses and no one really knows anything... except them because they know everything because they are an engineer. They not only try to say they know everything, but will deny that anyone else can know anything that they don't know.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:15:59 PM EST
Originally Posted By ClayP:
I am a doctor who went to an engineering school. Engineers as a whole are probably smarter in terms of problem solving and calculations. Medical students have to be good at rote memorization and to be able to recall massive amounts of information, but problem solving is not tested as critically.


Doctors don't have to be massively talented at problem solving when they have technical specialty's that
do the tests to give them the answers they use to "put the pieces of the puzzle" together.

Doctors have to be able to remember where to find the answers they need.....not important if you remember
all the answers just as long as you remember where to find them when you need them.


Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:17:39 PM EST
Lawyers
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:18:08 PM EST

Originally Posted By tyman:
Originally Posted By HarryDunne:
Most doctors have a more "well rounded" intelligence, if you will.

Engineers seem to be very book smart, but are often lacking in other areas.

Many, but not all doctors are very book smart, but also have very good people skills


Originally Posted By BustinCaps:
Two different kinds of smart.




These.

Yep
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:18:41 PM EST

Originally Posted By Rem700PSS:
Originally Posted By BustinCaps:
Two different kinds of smart.


This...it's math vs science...

Whats the better tasting fruit...apples or oranges

Ya, no science in engineering.

Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:19:07 PM EST
Originally Posted By BustinCaps:
Two different kinds of smart.


Absofuckinglutely.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:20:15 PM EST
((flame suit is now on, and active))

Intelligence is not the issue...Common Sense, is. I don't care how smart you think you are.
Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:20:41 PM EST
Being in I.T., I can say Doctors are way smarter.

To be a doctor someone has to go through years of med school, plus internship and residency. That process is designed to weed out most of the idiots.
A lot of engineers never make it through college. The developers (engineers) at my company are idiots. I am constantly surprised by how stupid they are.

Link Posted: 11/1/2009 4:20:50 PM EST
Originally Posted By DKing:
Lawyers


There are kids around. You shouldn't use that kind of language.






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