Posted: 8/7/2011 4:57:40 PM EDT
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I don't have a problem with MSG myself, but for the sake of health, try to make the most of what you can from scratch in order to eat healthy. While your worried about MSG I'm worried about sodium and other nasties.
This is why I avoid all canned goods other than the occasional can of tuna. Boxed meals and frozen dinners are also a no go. |
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lol. I have MSG in my spice drawer. There was a study done a few years ago on a couple hundred people who all claimed they had bad reactions to MSG. They were fed food with and without MSG without knowing which was which. Only two of them reported problems when they ate the MSG but not when they didn't. Take it for what it's worth. |
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lol. I have MSG in my spice drawer. There was a study done a few years ago on a couple hundred people who all claimed they had bad reactions to MSG. They were fed food with and without MSG without knowing which was which. Only two of them reported problems when they ate the MSG but not when they didn't. Take it for what it's worth. The question is HOW MUCH MSG was there? Some meals have a LOT of MSG in it. Especially Chinese food. There is no one standing over the cook to stop him when he dumps in a truckload of the stuff. I can tell within a couple of minutes whether there is MSG in the food. At first I had no idea what was going on, I would almost have a panic attack after eating at this one chinese place. After this happening at a different chinese place I started to put two and two together. I asked the cook, and sure enough there was a shitload of that stuff in there. Now I ask before I order, and request that there not be any MSG in my dish. Food tastes better without it, more natural. The MSG overpowers the subtle flavors of the dish such that it all tastes the same. It might as well be corn mush. |
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So, what's the issue with MSG? In brief, from the link I posted: Everyone knows that some people get reactions after eating the food ingredient monosodium glutamate ––reactions that include migraine headaches, upset stomach, fuzzy thinking, diarrhea, heart irregularities, asthma, and/or mood swings. I see. It's not an issue with MSG itself, but that some people don't handle it well. I too have MSG in my spice cabinet and I use it sparingly with no issues. I thought you were saying MSG itself was evil. |
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So, what's the issue with MSG? In brief, from the link I posted: Everyone knows that some people get reactions after eating the food ingredient monosodium glutamate ––reactions that include migraine headaches, upset stomach, fuzzy thinking, diarrhea, heart irregularities, asthma, and/or mood swings. I see. It's not an issue with MSG itself, but that some people don't handle it well. I too have MSG in my spice cabinet and I use it sparingly with no issues. I thought you were saying MSG itself was evil. No, its that some people don't THINK they handle it well. |
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Subsequent research found that, while large doses of MSG given without food may elicit more symptoms than a placebo in individuals who believe that they react adversely to MSG, the frequency of the responses was low and the responses reported were inconsistent, not reproducible, and not observed when MSG was given with food. No statistical association has been demonstrated under controlled conditions, even in studies with people convinced that they are sensitive to it http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monosodium_glutamate#Health_concerns "Review of alleged reaction to monosodium glutamate and outcome of a multicenter double-blind placebo-controlled study" SUMMARY The weight of the evidence supports the designation of MSG as a generally safe food flavoring agent. Neither epidemiologic surveys nor challenge studies provide evidence that ingestion of MSG is associated with adverse reactions in the population at large. In subjects who report adverse reactions to MSG, rigorous DBPC challenge studies indicate that large doses of MSG given without food may elicit more symptoms than a placebo in individuals who believe that they react adversely to MSG. However, neither persistent nor serious effects from MSG ingestion were observed, and the frequency of the responses was low. More importantly, the responses reported were inconsistent and were not reproducible. The responses were not observed when MSG was given with food. |
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Subsequent research found that, while large doses of MSG given without food may elicit more symptoms than a placebo in individuals who believe that they react adversely to MSG, the frequency of the responses was low and the responses reported were inconsistent, not reproducible, and not observed when MSG was given with food. No statistical association has been demonstrated under controlled conditions, even in studies with people convinced that they are sensitive to it
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monosodium_glutamate#Health_concerns "Review of alleged reaction to monosodium glutamate and outcome of a multicenter double-blind placebo-controlled study" SUMMARY
The weight of the evidence supports the designation of MSG as a generally safe food flavoring agent. Neither epidemiologic surveys nor challenge studies provide evidence that ingestion of MSG is associated with adverse reactions in the population at large. In subjects who report adverse reactions to MSG, rigorous DBPC challenge studies indicate that large doses of MSG given without food may elicit more symptoms than a placebo in individuals who believe that they react adversely to MSG. However, neither persistent nor serious effects from MSG ingestion were observed, and the frequency of the responses was low. More importantly, the responses reported were inconsistent and were not reproducible. The responses were not observed when MSG was given with food. Based on the weight of the SCIENTIFIC evidence, I'm contemplating locking this thread. Even a moderator  can understand that 'scientific evidence' can point to damn near anything you want it to, i.e, global warming, guns are bad, etc.
There is a reason that Chinese restaurants advertise 'No Msg' to attract those that simply cannot tolerate it. The fact exists that it bothers MANY people, myself included, some study be damned. It's not some imagined thing just to get attention. |
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Quoted: Even a moderator can understand that 'scientific evidence' can point to damn near anything you want it to, i.e, global warming, guns are bad, etc. There is a reason that Chinese restaurants advertise 'No Msg' to attract those that simply cannot tolerate it. The fact exists that it bothers MANY people, myself included, some study be damned. It's not some imagined thing just to get attention. No. When you KNOW or even suspect that MSG is present, you can develop symptoms. That's why people do double-blind studies. Neither the researcher nor the subject knows if something does or doesn't contain MSG. Valid scientific research most definitely does NOT point to anything you want it to and claiming otherwise is just plain wrong. If MSG were indeed a problem for people, the study would have shown that. |
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8282275Monosodium L-glutamate: a double-blind study and review.SourceDepartment of Chemistry, Faculty of Business & Technology, University of Western Sydney, Campbelltown, NSW, Australia. Abstract71 healthy subjects were treated with placebos and monosodium L-glutamate (MSG) doses of 1.5, 3.0 and 3.15 g/person, which represented a body mass-adjusted dose range of 0.015-0.07 g/kg body weight before a standardized breakfast over 5 days. The study used a rigorous randomized double-blind crossover design that controlled for subjects who had MSG after-tastes. Capsules and specially formulated drinks were used as vehicles for placebo and MSG treatments. Subjects mostly had no responses to placebo (86%) and MSG (85%) treatments. Sensations, previously attributed to MSG, did not occur at a significantly higher rate than did those elicited by placebo treatment. A significant (P < 0.05) negative correlation between MSG dose and after-effects was found. The profound effect of food in negating the effects of large MSG doses was demonstrated. The common practice of extrapolating food-free experimental results to 'in use' situations was called into question. An exhaustive review of previous methodologies identified the strong taste of MSG as the factor invalidating most 'blind' and 'double-blind' claims by previous researchers. The present study led to the conclusion that 'Chinese Restaurant Syndrome' is an anecdote applied to a variety of postprandial illnesses; rigorous and realistic scientific evidence linking the syndrome to MSG could not be found. |
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16999713Reconsidering the effects of monosodium glutamate: a literature review.AbstractPURPOSE:This article reviews the literature from the past 40 years of research related to monosodium glutamate (MSG) and its ability to trigger a migraine headache, induce an asthma exacerbation, or evoke a constellation of symptoms described as the "Chinese restaurant syndrome." DATA SOURCES:Literature retrieved by a search using PubMed, Medline, Lexis-Nexus, and Infotrac to review articles from the past 40 years. CONCLUSIONS:MSG has a widespread reputation for eliciting a variety of symptoms, ranging from headache to dry mouth to flushing. Since the first report of the so-called Chinese restaurant syndrome 40 years ago, clinical trials have failed to identify a consistent relationship between the consumption of MSG and the constellation of symptoms that comprise the syndrome. Furthermore, MSG has been described as a trigger for asthma and migraine headache exacerbations, but there are no consistent data to support this relationship. Although there have been reports of an MSG-sensitive subset of the population, this has not been demonstrated in placebo-controlled trials. IMPLICATIONS FOR PRACTICE:Despite a widespread belief that MSG can elicit a headache, among other symptoms, there are no consistent clinical data to support this claim. Findings from the literature indicate that there is no consistent evidence to suggest that individuals may be uniquely sensitive to MSG. Nurse practitioners should therefore concentrate their efforts on advising patients of the nutritional pitfalls of some Chinese restaurant meals and to seek more consistently documented etiologies for symptoms such as headache, xerostomia, or flushing. |
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What we have here is a case of certain individuals who claim to be sensitive to MSG, just as the subjects in the tests of the research I quoted. Ask yourself what is MORE LIKELY: 1) The scientific evidence from the world-class researchers is wrong and I'm unique, OR 2) The reason for my "sensitivity" to MSG is triggered by the fact that I know or suspect there's MSG in the food. I enjoy reading the pamphlets that come with medications, and I always look at the adverse reaction reports during clinical trials. One thing that never fails to amuse me is when the test subjects claim "I got nausea/headache/fever/whatever" as a result of taking this medicine... ... and then the same number of people complain of the exact same symptoms after being given a placebo. That clearly shows that people can talk themselves into believing they are "allergic" to just about anything. |
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Quoted: Subsequent research found that, while large doses of MSG given without food may elicit more symptoms than a placebo in individuals who believe that they react adversely to MSG, the frequency of the responses was low and the responses reported were inconsistent, not reproducible, and not observed when MSG was given with food. No statistical association has been demonstrated under controlled conditions, even in studies with people convinced that they are sensitive to it http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monosodium_glutamate#Health_concerns "Review of alleged reaction to monosodium glutamate and outcome of a multicenter double-blind placebo-controlled study" SUMMARY The weight of the evidence supports the designation of MSG as a generally safe food flavoring agent. Neither epidemiologic surveys nor challenge studies provide evidence that ingestion of MSG is associated with adverse reactions in the population at large. In subjects who report adverse reactions to MSG, rigorous DBPC challenge studies indicate that large doses of MSG given without food may elicit more symptoms than a placebo in individuals who believe that they react adversely to MSG. However, neither persistent nor serious effects from MSG ingestion were observed, and the frequency of the responses was low. More importantly, the responses reported were inconsistent and were not reproducible. The responses were not observed when MSG was given with food. Zhukov, doctors have been telling people with migraines to avoid msg for years. You can find studies which agree with and disagree with, literally everything. |
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Quoted: But some people really ARE sensitive to it. I get sick when I've eaten it. That's how I find out it's present. I've stopped eating Chinese food because even if they don't add it in their kitchens (on request) many of their ingredients, canned and vacuum packed, already have it in there. It's nearly impossible to avoid it in Chinese restaurants. Uxb's doctor had him stop eating MSG when he was a little boy, because it was causing unstoppable nosebleeds. No more MSG, no more nosebleeds. He was six. I don't think that was subliminal suggestion. This is a perfect example of "correlation does not equal causation". |
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Quoted: The food industry is a powerful lobby. They pay for studies which support their validity in the same way that the ag chemical industry pays for studies that say there is no proof that pesticide, antibiotic and steroid-heavy foods are any worse for the human body than organically grown produce. But most people recognize that there are two sides to every story. I was not aware that threads in cooking could not give information about how to avoid processed foods, or be bent toward natural and organically grown food choice and prep. I will refrain from posting anything in the future which other people might disagree with. I'm afraid that may limit my participation in this forum, unfortunately, since I never know who might disagree.  This is NOT about posting something others disagree with. Can you see that? Furthermore, you are making wide-sweeping accusations of corruption in several independent trials with ZERO evidence. Why are doctors telling people that get headaches to avoid MSG? Because they heard the same false rumors you're propagating. I'm not locking threads because of this - my comment was over the top and I apologize. (I've edited the posts to remove references to that statement) It's just a very sore spot with me when people dismiss scientific evidence without a shred of proof. Alar in apples. Silicone breast implants. "Mercury" in vaccines. The list goes on and on. |
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Quoted: But most people recognize that there are two sides to every story. This is a binary result. MSG either causes problems or it doesn't. Scientific evidence says no. You should have more data on your side other than a vague suspicion that the food industry is paying off the researchers without any proof to back it up. |
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So, what's the issue with MSG? Mine is it gives me a headache. This, and high BP/Heart Rate. Probably related, you think?
I can't eat it, it is like a poison to me. In light of irrefutable evidence presented by Zhukov I am obligated to change my testimony. Mine is that I imagine it gives me a headache. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: So, what's the issue with MSG? Mine is it gives me a headache. This, and high BP/Heart Rate. Probably related, you think? I can't eat it, it is like a poison to me. In light of irrefutable evidence presented by Zhukov I am obligated to change my testimony. Mine is that I imagine it gives me a headache. Funny, but you still don't get it. How do you know - without a shadow of a doubt - that it's the MSG that's giving you headaches? I'm dismayed that people use the results of scientific methods every single day and probably wouldn't take medication that hasn't been tested according to that protocol, but discard that notion when it doesn't agree with their limited observations. There are literally hundreds of other correlating factors that could be the culprit that causes headaches. How the food is prepared, knowledge ahead of time that a certain food contains MSG (psychosomatic effects are very real), other foods that are eaten along with the food that contains MSG, etc. How people can single out one ingredient among thousands of others even though medical research has shown otherwise is baffling to me. I guess I'll shut up since scientists don't know crap and I'm obviously wrong and misguided. |
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So, what's the issue with MSG? Mine is it gives me a headache. This, and high BP/Heart Rate. Probably related, you think?
I can't eat it, it is like a poison to me. In light of irrefutable evidence presented by Zhukov I am obligated to change my testimony. Mine is that I imagine it gives me a headache. Funny, but you still don't get it. How do you know - without a shadow of a doubt - that it's the MSG that's giving you headaches? I'm dismayed that people use the results of scientific methods every single day and probably wouldn't take medication that hasn't been tested according to that protocol, but discard that notion when it doesn't agree with their limited observations. There are literally hundreds of other correlating factors that could be the culprit that causes headaches. How the food is prepared, knowledge ahead of time that a certain food contains MSG (psychosomatic effects are very real), other foods that are eaten along with the food that contains MSG, etc. How people can single out one ingredient among thousands of others even though medical research has shown otherwise is baffling to me. I guess I'll shut up since scientists don't know crap and I'm obviously wrong and misguided. I am an ag scientist, trained and experienced in scientific method, and I could introduce you to a room full of doctors, all friends of mine, who know beyond the shadow of a doubt that MSG is harmful to many of their patients. However I have only a scant few minutes each day to spend on arfcom, so I will simply back away, as I come here to escape, not to argue. I will take your internet search studies as sufficient evidence to never bring this up on arfcom again. Lock requested. |
