Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login

Site Notices
Posted: 5/10/2004 10:54:30 AM EST
Okay, you guys probably know a lot more about this than I do since until yesterday I haven't given any of this stuff much thought. The question is at the bottom.

Background:
-I decided that I should have a second computer, but before buying one I decided to start setting up for a wireless network.
-I am a dialup user, not cable or DLS. I plan on setting up for cable or DSL very soon.
-I'm using a laptop right now.
-I live in an apartment complex.

So I go to Sam's Club and buy that U.S. Robotics Wirelss Networking kit (802.11g) with the Wireless Turbo Router and PC Card.

I installed PC Card and haven't yet done anything with the router. Seems to work great. Now as a recent college graduate I do only what seems natural: Look for some type of signal to grab onto just out of an investigative instinct.

And onto the questions:
-What does it mean if I am Networked via a Linksys 11.0 Mbps?
-Am I a leach?
-within what radius is the base probably located?
-Will the person who owns it know that I am using their router thingy?
-What can be done to keep someone from doing what I am doing?
-Does this person have access to anything other than shared files on my computer?

I'm quite new to this and have no idea what the hell is going on. Please educate me.

Thanks all!
Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:01:04 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/10/2004 11:05:39 AM EST by fight4yourrights]
My motto - If they leave their network open, feel free to use it

I secure mine.

Get the free ZoneAlarm firewall to keep folks out of your computer.

You set up your own router with security and encryption to keep others out
Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:07:21 AM EST

Originally Posted By CAR-10:
Okay, you guys probably know a lot more about this than I do since until yesterday I haven't given any of this stuff much thought. The question is at the bottom.

Background:
-I decided that I should have a second computer, but before buying one I decided to start setting up for a wireless network.
-I am a dialup user, not cable or DLS. I plan on setting up for cable or DSL very soon.
-I'm using a laptop right now.
-I live in an apartment complex.

So I go to Sam's Club and buy that U.S. Robotics Wirelss Networking kit (802.11g) with the Wireless Turbo Router and PC Card.

I installed PC Card and haven't yet done anything with the router. Seems to work great. Now as a recent college graduate I do only what seems natural: Look for some type of signal to grab onto just out of an investigative instinct.

And onto the questions:
-What does it mean if I am Networked via a Linksys 11.0 Mbps?

Someone in your complex has a $60 linksys WAP (Wireless Access Point)

-Am I a leach?
Are you surfing the web using their connection? If you are then you have to answer that question yourself. Although they may practice "unsafe computing", so do most folks with wireless and they are prob paying 40-50 a month for their broadband access.

-within what radius is the base probably located?
Depends. Wireless signals do some wierd things inside buildings. Has a lot to do with building materials, ducting, things like that. I'd guess if you're getting a full (for 802.11b) 11mbs then they are your immediate neighbors on either side or up/downstairs.

-Will the person who owns it know that I am using their router thingy?
Doubtful, unless they are running some sort of Intrusion Detection or bother to look at he connection record of the Linksys.

-What can be done to keep someone from doing what I am doing?
Wireless Security is an oxymoron. IF you enable WEP, you at least put a speedbump in the path of an intruder. Remember WEP stands for Wired Equivelant Privacy. It is NOT equivelant, however. Make sure you have all your file/print sharing turned off and the NetBios protocol uninstalled

-Does this person have access to anything other than shared files on my computer?
Maybe. If they are like me they have a full suite of wireless locator, sniffer and WEP cracking software at their disposal. If they are unethical, they could have their way with your unit.

I'm quite new to this and have no idea what the hell is going on. Please educate me.
I'll follow up with some links for you

Thanks all!

Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:10:13 AM EST
You never mention your location.

Home, apartment, condo, teepee?

Someone close to you has an unsecured wifi connection.
Your PC card did what it's supposed to do, it found a signal and connected to it.

You are a leach. As long as you do nothing wrong except for stealing someone elses signal....
The radius depends on the broadcast signal and your cards antenna.
What does your instructions say?
I doubt that the person with the unsecured and open base knows jack-shit about anything.
If they had half a clue they would bve able to see network activity on the actual network base station by looking at the network LED (if it has one).
Other than that they would need to look at their connection "program" activity monitor to see you leaching their signal.

You can keep others from leaching your signal, just follow your wifi instructions.

Head on over to this webpage to learn everything you want to know:
www.netstumbler.com

Head on over to this forum for the same:
www.netstumbler.org/
Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:13:28 AM EST
You guys rock.

My investigations continue...
Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:18:43 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/10/2004 11:20:00 AM EST by NewbHunter]
I don't like wireless internet connections for the simple fact that it makes it too easy for people to hack into your machine. You might want to take a look into War Driving. Seems a little scary if you ask me. I've actually found maps of my city online that show all the wireless connections and if they have any kind of security on them or not. These were all mapped out by war drivers.

Then again, I'm definitely not an expert about wireless connections. All I'm saying is look into it and be very careful if you do it.
Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:20:43 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/10/2004 11:21:25 AM EST by PrivateJoker]


Originally Posted By CAR-10:
-Am I a leach?



No doubt.

However I think its great that your neighbors provide a free service to the rest of the immediate community. They are truly generous souls. I wouldn't have any lost sleep over using their connection since they are giving it out so freely.

Definately invest in some firewall software. I personally use Norton's Internet Security. Seems to work well. However you can use the Freebie Zone Alarm.

Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:32:36 AM EST

Originally Posted By PrivateJoker:


Originally Posted By CAR-10:
-Am I a leach?



No doubt.

However I think its great that your neighbors provide a free service to the rest of the immediate community. They are truly generous souls. I wouldn't have any lost sleep over using their connection since they are giving it out so freely.

Definately invest in some firewall software. I personally use Norton's Internet Security. Seems to work well. However you can use the Freebie Zone Alarm.




I can't find a refernce, but yesterday there was a guy on here saying that firewall hardware is the way to go. I say software is better than a lack of any ware.

So this wireless router is like the neighborhood slut. Sounds like the kind of thing that requires some amount of protection to play with.
Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:36:00 AM EST
A PROPERLY CONFIGURED hardware router/firewall along with a PROPERLY CONFIGURED software firewall will give you your best security.


Originally Posted By CAR-10:
I can't find a refernce, but yesterday there was a guy on here saying that firewall hardware is the way to go. I say software is better than a lack of any ware.

So this wireless router is like the neighborhood slut. Sounds like the kind of thing that requires some amount of protection to play with.

Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:37:51 AM EST

Originally Posted By KA3B:
A PROPERLY CONFIGURED hardware router/firewall along with a PROPERLY CONFIGURED software firewall will give you your best security.


Originally Posted By CAR-10:
I can't find a refernce, but yesterday there was a guy on here saying that firewall hardware is the way to go. I say software is better than a lack of any ware.

So this wireless router is like the neighborhood slut. Sounds like the kind of thing that requires some amount of protection to play with.




Ah, that makes more sense now.
Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:41:18 AM EST

Originally Posted By NewbHunter:
I don't like wireless internet connections for the simple fact that it makes it too easy for people to hack into your machine. You might want to take a look into War Driving. Seems a little scary if you ask me. I've actually found maps of my city online that show all the wireless connections and if they have any kind of security on them or not. These were all mapped out by war drivers.

Then again, I'm definitely not an expert about wireless connections. All I'm saying is look into it and be very careful if you do it.



This article securityfocus.com/columnists/237 was linked to wardriving and discusses how it could be a felony, in some cases, to use a neighbor's open signal. At the worst it is like stealing cable, which is a crime.

I think I'll be setting up with DSL and securing my own router so others don't intrude. I suppose I should even add firewall hardware and software.

Thanks for the education guys!
Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:46:48 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/10/2004 11:47:39 AM EST by BayEagle]

Originally Posted By KA3B:
A PROPERLY CONFIGURED hardware router/firewall along with a PROPERLY CONFIGURED software firewall will give you your best security.




Bingo. This is what anyone using a persistant internet connection (cable or dsl) should be doing at home.

Just keep in mind that when you add Wireless traffic to this setup, that unless you are using a VPN (sort of an encrypted tunnel) over wireless, then your traffic (between PC, router and Laptop) can be captured and exploited. You are basically letting someone access all the protected traffic behind your firewalls and routers.

I do a presentation on WLAN sec where I capture usernames and passwords in the hour before I give the preso (typically on a tradeshow floor) and then put a screen capture of the info on a slide like this:



w00t w00t

Link Posted: 5/10/2004 11:54:35 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/10/2004 11:56:09 AM EST by PrivateJoker]

Originally Posted By CAR-10:

Originally Posted By NewbHunter:
I don't like wireless internet connections for the simple fact that it makes it too easy for people to hack into your machine. You might want to take a look into War Driving. Seems a little scary if you ask me. I've actually found maps of my city online that show all the wireless connections and if they have any kind of security on them or not. These were all mapped out by war drivers.

Then again, I'm definitely not an expert about wireless connections. All I'm saying is look into it and be very careful if you do it.



This article securityfocus.com/columnists/237 was linked to wardriving and discusses how it could be a felony, in some cases, to use a neighbor's open signal. At the worst it is like stealing cable, which is a crime.

I think I'll be setting up with DSL and securing my own router so others don't intrude. I suppose I should even add firewall hardware and software.

Thanks for the education guys!



"So if the government wanted to throw you in jail, it could argue that, by getting free Internet, you were accessing the provider's computer without authorization (and that you knew or should have known it was without authorization or in excess of authorization) and you thereby obtained some information from the computer. .......Even putting up an unencrypted, unprotected wireless access point might conceivably get you in trouble...So you plug your Linksys 802.11(g) access point into your cable modem, and sit outside. You're busted! You see, when you "broadcast" the cable connection, you are opening it up for anyone to potentially use it. So other people can potentially get Internet access from Comcast without paying for it."

This article seems pretty damn erroneous to me... 1st it says the "Leach" is the criminal, then the person providing the unsecure connection is the criminal.... then it goes on to say:

"In fact, the companion New York State computer crime law, NY Penal Code Section 156 (6), requires that, before you can be prosecuted for using a computer service without authorization, the government has to prove that the owner has given actual notice to potential hackers or trespassers, either in writing or orally. In the absence of such notice in New York, the hacker can presume that he or she has authorization to proceed, under state law. "

WTF??? Seems the use of the term "Hacker" is as loose as the use of the term "Assault Weapon."

Top Top