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Posted: 7/23/2013 5:37:55 PM EST
Sad to see how far we have declined.

Over 40 years ago we put men on the fucking moon with slide rules and willpower. Just think about that statement for a moment and let it sink in.

We don't even have any meaningful space program to speak of these days; and how can we with our current budget priorities? 40 years ago, the government paid its citizens to go to the moon. Today it pays nearly half of its citizens to sit at home and do nothing.

I am not surprised that many people these days doubt the authenticity of the Apollo missions. With our culture in general, the culture of mediocrity, apathy and breaking everyone down to the lowest common denominator, nobody is allowed to excel because it would hurt the feelings of those who can't. At one point, my son commented that the astronauts must have been incredibly brave to do what they did. Well, they were. Today, nobody is allowed to be a hero, so we are all stuck with the cowards. Today we can't let the astronauts have the spotlight, because it would hurt the feelings of the guy who mops the bathrooms at mission control.

Link Posted: 7/23/2013 5:56:50 PM EST
It's very sad.
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:03:07 PM EST
Well when you run multiple wars in multiple countries for decades, I am surprised there is enough money left to turn the lights on. Also, it looks like China is ramping up their space program and we would not want to compete with them, now would we?
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:06:24 PM EST
And in the end, the Russians won the Space Race
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:07:23 PM EST
No worries, we can always beg a ride from our enemies and finance it with our other enemies.

btw, when does the kardashians show come on.......
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:12:14 PM EST
I think you are over doing the "culture of mediocrity" thing. It sounds like it's your personal pet peeve and you just had to fit it in somewhere.

We had Affirmative Action and "Inclusiveness" with the space shuttle. They sent females, blacks people and even a Teacher. You better believe they would have sent a janitor if there was good PR to be had.


You are spot on about the economics side of it. How can you hope to accomplish great things as a Nation when half your budget is spent paying debt service, and half your Citizens are on welfare?
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:15:46 PM EST
In before those who think that any money spent on space exploration is wasted.
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:17:03 PM EST
Gingrich 2016
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:18:59 PM EST
That money is going to the war on drugs now.
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:23:12 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/23/2013 6:23:46 PM EST by Danner130]
Look at the bright side. Obama is going to send arms to the Syrian rebels.

'Death to America'

Durga, derka.
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:26:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/23/2013 6:27:15 PM EST by StevesZZ5]
My great uncle Richard Koos was involved with the Apollo project all the way through. He was one of the engineers that would simulate faults while they were building up to the actual missions. He's a pretty cool guy, when I'd met him when I was about 26, I was in awe as if I'd met a superstar. Actually, him an the others all were. From the janitors to the astronauts.

He's mentioned several times in this book.
Apollo: The Race to the Moon
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:27:46 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By CarbineDad:
And in the end, the Russians won the Space Race
View Quote


Really?

On 19 July a space probe exploring Mercury and a space probe exploring Saturn each sent back to us a picture of our planet and our moon. We didn't "lose" the space race, we chose to do our best with the money we could spend on the program. No, they are not manned, but we have robotic probes exploring the surface of Mars, probes studying the Sun and other planets, we (us civilians) can pinpoint our position anywhere on earth to within feet. All the while when the Russians are flying craft with designs that are decades old. And they're bankrupt, depending on us to pay for the ride.

No, not glamorous or flashy, but we have hardly lost the space race.
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:28:06 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:42:14 PM EST


I don't understand.


Didn't the aliens bitch-slap us last time we went to the moon and told us not to come back, ever?


Link Posted: 7/23/2013 6:43:44 PM EST
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Originally Posted By helmutlent:
It's very sad.
View Quote

Link Posted: 7/23/2013 7:28:11 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/23/2013 7:31:21 PM EST by SteelonSteel]
Originally Posted By Svetgar:
Sad to see how far we have declined.

Over 40 years ago we put men on the fucking moon with slide rules and willpower. Just think about that statement for a moment and let it sink in.

We don't even have any meaningful space program to speak of these days; and how can we with our current budget priorities? 40 years ago, the government paid its citizens to go to the moon. Today it pays nearly half of its citizens to sit at home and do nothing.

I am not surprised that many people these days doubt the authenticity of the Apollo missions. With our culture in general, the culture of mediocrity, apathy and breaking everyone down to the lowest common denominator, nobody is allowed to excel because it would hurt the feelings of those who can't. At one point, my son commented that the astronauts must have been incredibly brave to do what they did. Well, they were. Today, nobody is allowed to be a hero, so we are all stuck with the cowards. Today we can't let the astronauts have the spotlight, because it would hurt the feelings of the guy who mops the bathrooms at mission control.

View Quote



yep, don't even think of sending your kid to school with a PBand J sammich. That shit is outlawed because 1 in 100 kids say they don't like PB so mom get's a Dr's note that Jessica is allergic. Oh and spelling isn't important, just spell it how you think it should be spelled. History lessons, naw, nothing before the civil rights era. Oh, fuck don't even bother, we'll just see little jonny get socially passed as long as he knows it's ok to have two mommies on a bicycle. Oh and when Janey wants to go to college with a record of 1 B and 4 A's in her senior year, nope she ain't getting a scholarship, her skin isn't the right color, that scholarship will go to someone with 1 B and 4 C's of the right color. Oh well they all might have done better if half the class time wasn't spent on the drooling window licker causing a disturbance who can't quite remember what yesterday was all about.


ETA- how did I forget Nasa's current mission is to make the arabs feel better about their stone aged selves.

yep it's cruel but we're not doing so hot anymore. you figure out why?has b
get over this media driven guilt bullshit

sorry the wild turkey has been opened .
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 8:27:02 PM EST
Did you teach your son about Stanley Kubrick filmed the moon landing and it was fake?
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 8:38:33 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By WindKnot1-1:


Really?

On 19 July a space probe exploring Mercury and a space probe exploring Saturn each sent back to us a picture of our planet and our moon. We didn't "lose" the space race, we chose to do our best with the money we could spend on the program. No, they are not manned, but we have robotic probes exploring the surface of Mars, probes studying the Sun and other planets, we (us civilians) can pinpoint our position anywhere on earth to within feet. All the while when the Russians are flying craft with designs that are decades old. And they're bankrupt, depending on us to pay for the ride.

No, not glamorous or flashy, but we have hardly lost the space race.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Originally Posted By WindKnot1-1:
Originally Posted By CarbineDad:
And in the end, the Russians won the Space Race


Really?

On 19 July a space probe exploring Mercury and a space probe exploring Saturn each sent back to us a picture of our planet and our moon. We didn't "lose" the space race, we chose to do our best with the money we could spend on the program. No, they are not manned, but we have robotic probes exploring the surface of Mars, probes studying the Sun and other planets, we (us civilians) can pinpoint our position anywhere on earth to within feet. All the while when the Russians are flying craft with designs that are decades old. And they're bankrupt, depending on us to pay for the ride.

No, not glamorous or flashy, but we have hardly lost the space race.


This and then some.

CarbineDad, how exactly did their victories exceed ours?
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 8:45:11 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/23/2013 8:48:41 PM EST by steve2071]
Government-funded spaceflight may be dead in the water, but I am still highly optimistic about the future of space exploration. I believe most of the major innovations in space travel will come from the private sector, but that doesn't make it any worse, in fact, they will probably be able to do it better, and without trying negotiate the bureaucracy of the US Government.

If it is more profitable to make a manned Mars mission a reality show, then so be it. At the end of the day, a human will still have set foot on Mars.
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 8:47:36 PM EST
Government has no business ....

End regulation on ....

Private markets respond, if needed ....

Profit for all.
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 8:50:12 PM EST
I've posted this pic before, it's the Apollo launch team. My dad is the big man in the back row.



His signature is on this countdown procedure for Apollo 14.



Nothing would piss him off faster than some idiot spouting off that the moon landings were a hoax.
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 8:55:47 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By CarbineDad:
And in the end, the Russians won the Space Race
View Quote


Exactly when did a Russian set foot on another world?
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 9:04:09 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Warhawk:


Exactly when did a Russian set foot on another world?
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Warhawk:
Originally Posted By CarbineDad:
And in the end, the Russians won the Space Race


Exactly when did a Russian set foot on another world?


When is the Russian (or Soviet) satellite going to leave the solar system?
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 9:06:56 PM EST
Originally Posted By Svetgar:
Sad to see how far we have declined.

Over 40 years ago we put men on the fucking moon with slide rules and willpower. Just think about that statement for a moment and let it sink in.

We don't even have any meaningful space program to speak of these days; and how can we with our current budget priorities? 40 years ago, the government paid its citizens to go to the moon. Today it pays nearly half of its citizens to sit at home and do nothing.

I am not surprised that many people these days doubt the authenticity of the Apollo missions. With our culture in general, the culture of mediocrity, apathy and breaking everyone down to the lowest common denominator, nobody is allowed to excel because it would hurt the feelings of those who can't. At one point, my son commented that the astronauts must have been incredibly brave to do what they did. Well, they were. Today, nobody is allowed to be a hero, so we are all stuck with the cowards. Today we can't let the astronauts have the spotlight, because it would hurt the feelings of the guy who mops the bathrooms at mission control.

View Quote


If you want to make him really sad and angry, take him to the Houston Space Center. They have the Saturn V that was supposed to send Apollo 18 to the moon. The men were trained, the ground support staff was ready, the rocket was built, the landing site was picked out--and then Nixon cancelled the whole thing, supposedly to save money.

The rocket impressed the hell out of me. The decision not to fly it, not so much.

Link Posted: 7/23/2013 9:11:19 PM EST
Rat bit my sister Nell and whitey on the Moon.
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 9:14:25 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/23/2013 9:21:30 PM EST by jDrexler]
Originally Posted By Svetgar:
Sad to see how far we have declined.

We don't even have any meaningful space program to speak of these days;
View Quote


That's entirely not true, our robotic missions are doing awesome things, they just don't have the appeal of putting boots on the ground.

Kepler has CONFIRMED the existence of 134 planets outside of our solar system, with over 3,000 more potential candidates.

This is a radar image of the surface of titan



and don't forget about curiosity

Link Posted: 7/23/2013 9:24:05 PM EST
Funny you should mention 17, the family was watching old home movies last night and at the young age of 2(Oct 1972) I did get to see that stack on the launch pad.

Would have really liked to see a Saturn V launch, never liked the shuttle program so much so even at space camp many years ago I spent all the free time climbing in and around in the Apollo capsule they had.

Must have been fun going to the moon in something the size of a standard cab ford f150 with two other guys.

Link Posted: 7/23/2013 9:26:56 PM EST
I agree that I would rather have a good space program than have money go to the FSA or the other BS that it does. That said, a good space program is a luxury, luxuries are the first thing to go when you're hugely in debt and can barely pay your bills.
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 9:50:39 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jDrexler:


That's entirely not true, our robotic missions are doing awesome things, they just don't have the appeal of putting boots on the ground.

Kepler has CONFIRMED the existence of 134 planets outside of our solar system, with over 3,000 more potential candidates.

This is a radar image of the surface of titan

http://blogs.airspacemag.com/daily-planet/files/2009/09/titan_north_polar-1024x501.jpg

and don't forget about curiosity

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Slideshows/_production/_archive/TechScience/_Mars/ss-120809-mars-rover/ss-121109-mars-curiosity-tease.photoblog900.jpg
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Originally Posted By jDrexler:
Originally Posted By Svetgar:
Sad to see how far we have declined.

We don't even have any meaningful space program to speak of these days;


That's entirely not true, our robotic missions are doing awesome things, they just don't have the appeal of putting boots on the ground.

Kepler has CONFIRMED the existence of 134 planets outside of our solar system, with over 3,000 more potential candidates.

This is a radar image of the surface of titan

http://blogs.airspacemag.com/daily-planet/files/2009/09/titan_north_polar-1024x501.jpg

and don't forget about curiosity

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Slideshows/_production/_archive/TechScience/_Mars/ss-120809-mars-rover/ss-121109-mars-curiosity-tease.photoblog900.jpg


Yep - we are doing more exploration with less funding. We have a probe going to Pluto as well. They are looking for signs of life on Europa and Titan. The number of known extra solar planets continues to grow.
Link Posted: 7/23/2013 9:57:03 PM EST
In a few hundred years' time I honestly think that the first moon landing will be seen as the moment western civilization peaked. The rot had already set in by then to be sure, but that moment truly captured western man's ingenuity, spirit, vision, and collective capacity.

How far we've fallen...and this is only the beginning...
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 4:27:59 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Warhawk:
http://i.imgur.com/5EE7O.jpg
View Quote

I've seen my share of those CDDT & launch manuals.

There was a lot accomplished with the manned missions, but there was also the "let's get there before the Rooskies" factor which led to a lot of wasted effort. Now manned flight is of very limited value and missions can be accomplished without it. Unfortunately, we've diverted resources to less productive ventures that result in more and more people dependent on government handouts and fewer and fewer technological advances.
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 5:52:06 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By dillweed:
In a few hundred years' time I honestly think that the first moon landing will be seen as the moment western civilization peaked. The rot had already set in by then to be sure, but that moment truly captured western man's ingenuity, spirit, vision, and collective capacity.

How far we've fallen...and this is only the beginning...
View Quote



An interesting observation. That, the Vietnam War, and the rise of the Welfare State, morphing into tomorrows totalitarian police state.
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 5:55:22 AM EST
Space Expolration was always tied to the cold war and the arms race with the USSR. Now that the race is over, we have no need to explore space. The ISS is a joke and is only in 'space' by technical definition.

Let China say they are going to put a military base on Mars and we will be walking on the surface of the planet in a year.
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 5:55:30 AM EST
while it sucks that we are no longer putting guys on the moon, we are still doing kick ass things. Look at all the probes we have sent to various bodies, some amazing work being done.

I agree that it is sad to see the decline, but don't shit all over the work that is being done, it all matters
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 8:42:29 AM EST
you guys should watch this, not really for scientific value, it's just freaking cool

Vimeo - Around Saturn
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 8:44:59 AM EST
It's 2013. Where is my flying car, God Damn it!!!!
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 8:51:38 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By WindKnot1-1:


Really?

On 19 July a space probe exploring Mercury and a space probe exploring Saturn each sent back to us a picture of our planet and our moon. We didn't "lose" the space race, we chose to do our best with the money we could spend on the program. No, they are not manned, but we have robotic probes exploring the surface of Mars, probes studying the Sun and other planets, we (us civilians) can pinpoint our position anywhere on earth to within feet. All the while when the Russians are flying craft with designs that are decades old. And they're bankrupt, depending on us to pay for the ride.

No, not glamorous or flashy, but we have hardly lost the space race.
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Originally Posted By WindKnot1-1:
Originally Posted By CarbineDad:
And in the end, the Russians won the Space Race


Really?

On 19 July a space probe exploring Mercury and a space probe exploring Saturn each sent back to us a picture of our planet and our moon. We didn't "lose" the space race, we chose to do our best with the money we could spend on the program. No, they are not manned, but we have robotic probes exploring the surface of Mars, probes studying the Sun and other planets, we (us civilians) can pinpoint our position anywhere on earth to within feet. All the while when the Russians are flying craft with designs that are decades old. And they're bankrupt, depending on us to pay for the ride.

No, not glamorous or flashy, but we have hardly lost the space race.


we do not possess the means to put a Man in orbit, the russians do..they win
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 9:33:01 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/24/2013 9:37:03 AM EST by Ameshawki]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AJK07734:


we do not possess the means to put a Man in orbit, the russians do..they win
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AJK07734:
Originally Posted By WindKnot1-1:
Originally Posted By CarbineDad:
And in the end, the Russians won the Space Race


Really?

On 19 July a space probe exploring Mercury and a space probe exploring Saturn each sent back to us a picture of our planet and our moon. We didn't "lose" the space race, we chose to do our best with the money we could spend on the program. No, they are not manned, but we have robotic probes exploring the surface of Mars, probes studying the Sun and other planets, we (us civilians) can pinpoint our position anywhere on earth to within feet. All the while when the Russians are flying craft with designs that are decades old. And they're bankrupt, depending on us to pay for the ride.

No, not glamorous or flashy, but we have hardly lost the space race.


we do not possess the means to put a Man in orbit, the russians do..they win



There's a little more to than that. The Russians have big cheap rockets. We have a rover on Mars. We absolutely won the space race and continue to do things no other country can even dream of.
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 9:43:14 AM EST
Let me make you sadder....just google the current Chinese space plans for a space station & "trips to other worlds"
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 9:44:28 AM EST
Let me make you sadder....just google the current Chinese space plans for a space station & "trips to other worlds"
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 9:56:57 AM EST
We'll be back in space in a decade or two.
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 10:03:58 AM EST
We got bigger things to worry about these days. Like changing the climate. 4 seasons per year is way too many. No more floods or droughts. Equal distribution of precipitation for everyone and just the right amount of wind and sun to power the green energy crap.
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 10:26:41 AM EST
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Originally Posted By AJK07734:


we do not possess the means to put a Man in orbit, the russians do..they win
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Originally Posted By AJK07734:
Originally Posted By WindKnot1-1:
Originally Posted By CarbineDad:
And in the end, the Russians won the Space Race


Really?

On 19 July a space probe exploring Mercury and a space probe exploring Saturn each sent back to us a picture of our planet and our moon. We didn't "lose" the space race, we chose to do our best with the money we could spend on the program. No, they are not manned, but we have robotic probes exploring the surface of Mars, probes studying the Sun and other planets, we (us civilians) can pinpoint our position anywhere on earth to within feet. All the while when the Russians are flying craft with designs that are decades old. And they're bankrupt, depending on us to pay for the ride.

No, not glamorous or flashy, but we have hardly lost the space race.


we do not possess the means to put a Man in orbit, the russians do..they win


a 45 year old spacecraft does not make them a winner, and it's sad that you think putting humans in space is the defining element of a space program.
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 10:32:59 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Caboose314:
We'll be back in space in a decade or two Within 18 months of it proving commercially viable (i.e. profitable and de-regulated).
View Quote


FIFY
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 10:35:45 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Warhawk:


Exactly when did a Russian set foot on another world?
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Originally Posted By Warhawk:
Originally Posted By CarbineDad:
And in the end, the Russians won the Space Race


Exactly when did a Russian set foot on another world?



They didnt, but they still have a space program. NASA's new mission is muslim outreach...
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 10:42:03 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/24/2013 10:45:02 AM EST by thirsty]
I don't know if you guys realize, but NASA is forging ahead with the next generation launch vehicle. A friend of mine is on the team currently designing and testing the next generation J-2, and another team is re-engineering a better F-1 main.

The SLS heavy lifter is very much alive and the goal is, according to everyone at NASA, they're going to use it to shoot for the moon.

Obama and his administration will be out by the time testing of the Orion assembly begins, he represents nothing more than a speed bump to NASA.

ETA: Constellation was cancelled by Obama, now it's called SLS. Obama's Muslim outreach program got dick slapped in congress and NASA's new SLS program was born in 2010 shortly thereafter. But you didn't hear about that because, well, it would make Obama look bad and the media can't have that.
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 10:52:01 AM EST
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Originally Posted By FZ1Steve:
Well when you run multiple wars in multiple countries for decades, I am surprised there is enough money left to turn the lights on. Also, it looks like China is ramping up their space program and we would not want to compete with them, now would we?
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And they're not signatories to the partial nuclear test ban treaty so... nuclear pulse propulsion?
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 10:58:12 AM EST
I know people that still think it was staged. These are not tin foil hat people either just normal everyday people with kids & jobs that think the tech to put a man on the moon was just imposable to do at that time & the political cold war statement of 1st to put a man on the moon had to be done any way it could.
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 11:03:13 AM EST
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Originally Posted By fuzzy03cls:
I know people that still think it was staged. These are not tin foil hat people either just normal everyday people with kids & jobs that think the tech to put a man on the moon was just imposable to do at that time & the political cold war statement of 1st to put a man on the moon had to be done any way it could.
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And I'm sure the Russians would have called us out on it if it was faked.
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 11:08:07 AM EST
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Originally Posted By X_805:


And I'm sure the Russians would have called us out on it if it was faked.
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Originally Posted By X_805:
Originally Posted By fuzzy03cls:
I know people that still think it was staged. These are not tin foil hat people either just normal everyday people with kids & jobs that think the tech to put a man on the moon was just imposable to do at that time & the political cold war statement of 1st to put a man on the moon had to be done any way it could.


And I'm sure the Russians would have called us out on it if it was faked.

Agreed.

John Young was has always been one of my heroes-both for Apollo 16 and flying the first shuttle
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