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9/19/2017 7:27:10 PM
Posted: 6/13/2002 2:32:31 PM EDT
Let's see if I can pull this off. A simple AR-15.com poll. Should the US support Israel, Yes or no. 1 vote per person, this isn't about the amount support means from moral support to $$$$$, non-support means NO support at all.
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 2:35:59 PM EDT
NO: Not till, and if, they become our 51st State. We have enough to deal with here at home.
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 2:45:48 PM EDT
i dont think there is an easy answer. i see israel as slightly more ethically and culturally in synch with the US than their arab neighbors. i am [b]NOT[/b] a zionist, and do not recognize a divine right to the "holy land". i do believe they have a right to exist somewhere, and believe it is in the US' interests to help them do so. like many other places, offenses have been committed over the years by both sides. who is ultimately in the right? i have no idea. probably neither.
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 2:46:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Hannah_Reitsch: NO: Not till, and if, they become our 51st State. We have enough to deal with here at home.
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So we should oppose their war on terrorism, while fighting our own? Keep in mind their terrorists are NEXT DOOR.... Scott
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 2:49:01 PM EDT
This poll has regularly been given, and right now I can tell you what the results will be. 70% favor support Israel 30% divided among these answers, 15% don't support Israel, 15% leave me out. But you need to give it at least two days before you determine a winner! Eric The(SoICanCallTheIsraeliEmbassy!)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 2:53:32 PM EDT
This poll should be: How many of you are of Jewish persuation that happen to live in America. You know there were 13 million that died in the WW II Camps but "we" have been paying for those 6 million long enough.(Oh wait.. isn't that what Germany should be saying... Oh wait... they're not giving Israel money... Oh wait... we paid for the rebuild of Germany too) (Marshal Plan) I guess we need to find the groups that comprise those other 7 million and give them a homeland in the Middle East and pay them for 50 years. It's only fair.
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 2:55:33 PM EDT
Please define "support" a little tighter. There's a raft of difference between: "They oughta kick the ass of those bastards who kill little girls on purpose." And: "I want my tax dollars, and I'm willing to take your tax dollars to, buy them the guns/tanks/bombs/planes to kick their asses."
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 2:57:04 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Jarhead_22: Please define "support" a little tighter. There's a raft of difference between: "They oughta kick the ass of those bastards who kill little girls on purpose." And: "I want my tax dollars, and I'm willing to take your tax dollars to, buy them the guns/tanks/bombs/planes to kick their asses."
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he defiend "support" as "any level of support". So either one of your examples would qualify as "support", under the definition he set... [beer] Scott
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 2:57:48 PM EDT
I'm not Jewish and I support Israel.
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 7:09:40 PM EDT
C'mon vote on this I'd like to have as many responses as possible, still 1 vote per person, this isn't Chicago.
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 7:39:59 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 7:49:58 PM EDT
Many, if not most, of the Arab world is our sworn enemy. Israel is our best friend in the middle east. I can't support this, but I do believe that Israeli military and intelligence has averted more attacks (directed at us) from Arab terrorists than we will ever know about. And forget about Schumer and Feinstein. Jews are some of the most ardent 2nd Amendment supporters that I have ever seen.
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 7:51:32 PM EDT
I'm a Muslim, currently studying demolitions and hanging out at Radio Shack to learn how to wire my body for a most effective fragmentation field, and I LOVE THE JEWISH PEOPLE! [:D]
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 8:09:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/13/2002 8:29:30 PM EDT by kc0hak]
Do I support Israel? Absolutely not. My parents come from Taiwan, another country in a similar situation. A small area, with a large force looming close. Having been born in this country, I am an American, but I feel a connection to my parent's country. It bothers me that a country in such a similar situation would sell technology developed with US dollars to a country like China, which represents a threat to Taiwanese and American interests. Specifically, I am referring to the Phalcon airborne early warning radar system, the sale of which was halted only because of US objections. Details here: [URL]http://www.armscontrol.org/act/2000_09/israelsept00.asp[/URL]. (Yes, it is from some place with "Arms control" in its name, but it's opposed to the big stuff.) I have also seen on Taiwanese satellite television that Israel has sold China Galils and Uzis by the shipload, advanced body armour, and smaller state-of-the-art avionics equipment. It just doesn't make sense to me that the US should continue to send aid to a country that ships the products of that aid right off to the enemy. Israel isn't the the business of protecting American interests. They're interested in protecting their own interests as cheaply as possible, and that means using US aid to acheive their goals.
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 8:16:43 PM EDT
Yes
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 8:33:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/13/2002 8:33:55 PM EDT by Atencio]
As much as I hate to say it I think some day we will sell out Tawain to China. China is too big of a player. Israel's enemies on the other hand don't present us with such a problem.
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 8:40:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: This poll has regularly been given, and right now I can tell you what the results will be. 70% favor support Israel 30% divided among these answers, 15% don't support Israel, 15% leave me out. But you need to give it at least two days before you determine a winner! Eric The(SoICanCallTheIsraeliEmbassy!)Hun[>]:)]
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Hmm, it's now at 65% pro Israel, with the other two options running roughly even, and this is at 55 total votes. Pro-Israel will wind up being 70% by tomorrow! Eric The(WannaBet?)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 8:54:27 PM EDT
Support Israel
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 9:29:33 PM EDT
Provide support. Not to be confused with 'to support'.
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 9:33:07 PM EDT
I think we should support Isreal 100%. I thought it was pretty dumb of Bush to try and tell the Isreali army to pull out when they surrounded Arafat in his compund. Let Isreal fight it out. They have shown more restraint than anything I have seen. Think of it this way. If some people here in the U.S. started blowing them selves up, driving truck bombs and shooting up schools and we a know the city where all these people come from. How long would it the for the Military to move in and take control of the City. Let Isreal fight thier war on terror and let them finish it. Hey they are taking out enemys of our country.
Link Posted: 6/13/2002 11:50:37 PM EDT
I support peace, love, and freedom for all people. [:o)]
Link Posted: 6/14/2002 12:46:34 AM EDT
Originally Posted By kc0hak: It just doesn't make sense to me that the US should continue to send aid to a country that ships the products of that aid right off to the enemy. Israel isn't the the business of protecting American interests. They're interested in protecting their own interests as cheaply as possible, and that means using US aid to acheive their goals.
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Get a clue will you? They are God's People and know what they are doing because of divine influence. Taiwan is a nothing but a country of troublemakers just like the Palestine and needs to be taught a lesson.
Link Posted: 6/14/2002 4:20:53 AM EDT
110% Israel...They are our friends and allies. Where in that part of the world do you see Democracy, Liberty and Freedom flourish?......Only one ....Israel.
Link Posted: 6/14/2002 4:49:12 AM EDT
Well, we're at [b]70% support[/b] in favor of Israel! This is where the numbers always end up. But I [u]told[/u] you that already, right? [:D] I know my People.... Eric The(MyA15.comCrewThatIs!)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 6/14/2002 5:22:31 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/14/2002 5:35:40 AM EDT
Originally Posted By s0ulzer0: I'm a Muslim, currently studying demolitions and hanging out at Radio Shack to learn how to wire my body for a most effective fragmentation field, and I LOVE THE JEWISH PEOPLE! [:D]
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[:K] [;D] the_reject
Link Posted: 6/14/2002 5:44:11 AM EDT
I Support Israel. The Choosen folk !!!
Link Posted: 6/14/2002 5:55:24 AM EDT
What kc0hk said. If they want our support. They should follow our policy. Earn it. Yeah, their our friends and allies, we pay them to be. In answer to the question, "yes", I support Israel. I just get a little tired of their arrogance.
Link Posted: 6/14/2002 8:59:40 PM EDT
C'mon don't be shy vote, I'd like 250 or so votes before it is locked.
Link Posted: 6/14/2002 9:43:32 PM EDT
Bad poll, you forgot the important question that most will answer with: "Yes I support Israel, but not with 5 billion dollars of my tax money a year." Most people in the US support Israel but have you actually asked them whether or not they support giving 5 billion dollars to them in peacetime?
Link Posted: 6/15/2002 2:02:47 AM EDT
No, the poll is valid. I may do a poll later about support LEVELS. But the genesis of this poll was some members here complaining that the US supports Israel, at any level. I see that an an issue of the government doing what the people want. I was thinking that more people would want the US to support Israel than people wouldn't want Israel to be supported. Before I asked about level of support I want to see if my theory on support of Israel was correct.
Link Posted: 6/15/2002 2:35:57 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Jarhead_22: Please define "support" a little tighter. "
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That was my immediate reaction as well. I support Israels right of self-dfense WITHOUT US interference. I support Israels right to complete autonomy from UN and international interference. I support Israels right to compete for a national existence in teh same way EVERY OTHER nation does. In any pleace on earth they choose. I support Israels right to seek to enter commercial arrangements with ANY US corporation of their choosing. So, yeah, I support Israel. What I DO NOT support is [size=6] US [/size=6] interference in Israeli affairs. Including the ILLEGAL AND UNCONSTITUTIONAL socialist re-distribution of wealth via the THEFT if US taxpayers money which is sent over to Israel at the rate of $4+ billion a year. What I do not support are the "foregin entanglemnts" George Washington warned against, where in favoring one nation, and disparaging another, we would FOREVER be creating a society of people that HATE US for our playing favorites. So while a poll is nice, it is inadequate to intelligently discuss this issue. Weren't you guys the ones saying "polls are irreelvant" when teh poll was claiming Clinton was doing a good job???? [:D]
Link Posted: 6/15/2002 2:44:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/15/2002 2:48:08 AM EDT by garandman]
Originally Posted By kc0hak: Do I support Israel? Absolutely not. My parents come from Taiwan, another country in a similar situation. A small area, with a large force looming close. Having been born in this country, I am an American, but I feel a connection to my parent's country. It bothers me that a country in such a similar situation would sell technology developed with US dollars to a country like China, which represents a threat to Taiwanese and American interests. Specifically, I am referring to the Phalcon airborne early warning radar system, the sale of which was halted only because of US objections.
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Bingo. EXACTLY what G. Washington was referring to when he wqarned against foreign entaglments.(see my earlier thread on Washingtons' Farewell Address, 1796, in a thread entitled "Isolationism") In supporting Israel, we've made enemies in two ways: 1. Obviously, we've estranged the Arab peoples, who prior to 1940 had NO beef with us on any national scale. 2. OTHER nations that need our help and DO NOT receive it legitimately ask WHY we favor Israel, and NOT them, when their situation is SOO close to Israels in terms of the clear and present dangers they face. EXCELLENT point, kc. Unfortunately, many of the pro-Israel crown are SO pro-Israel, your legitimate concerns have NEVER EVEN crossed their minds. BTW, you pro-Israel groupies - The SAME foreign entanglements that you favor that sends money to Israel, has been stealing US tax dollars from Jewish taxpayers, which have then been sent by the SAME thieves that steal my tax dollars FOR Israel, to Arab nations, who use the money to fund those who kill Jews. SO their Jewish blood is on your heads. "Oh, what a tangled web we weave...."
Link Posted: 6/15/2002 2:50:28 AM EDT
Yes, Support Israel
Link Posted: 6/15/2002 4:19:32 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Kroagnon: Most people in the US support Israel but have you actually asked them whether or not they support giving 5 billion dollars to them in peacetime?
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Israel must remain in a perpetual state of war in order to continue receiving $5.3 Billion. The U.S. taxpayer is going to be billed by Israel another $200,000,000 this year to pay for their 'incursions'. I support Israel's right to be recognized by the nations of the world and Israel's right to live in relative peace. I support the Palestinians right to a country of their own and to live in relative peace and not under the jack-boot of the Israeli occupation. I do not support the U.S. policy of Israel First. Israel is of absolutely no strategic value to the U.S. in that region. Only Arabia and Turkey are strategic to our interest in that region. Israel is a parasite and its' host is the U.S. taxpayer.
Link Posted: 6/15/2002 4:27:44 AM EDT
There are some few 'Israel Firsters' here that will take comfort from seeing that 69% (at this time) support Israel. I submit to you few that on this board and in our nation the support for Israel is broad but without depth. Should the media decide to actually report the facts U.S. attitudes will rapidly change. The Palestinians are fighting a vicious occupying force. If my country was occupied and I had no F-16's, helicopters or tanks then I too would fight back with the limited weapons available to me.
Link Posted: 6/15/2002 4:53:52 AM EDT
Post from 5subslr5 -
The Palestinians are fighting a vicious occupying force. If my country was occupied and I had no F-16's, helicopters or tanks then [u]I too would fight back with the limited weapons available to me[/u].
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[size=4]Using your own children with bombs strapped to their bodies? That doesn't seem too smart, or something anyone should be proud of![/size=4] Surely you don't mean that, [b]SubDude[/b]? Because that's what the Palestinians have chosen to do, and it's resulted in the deaths of way more Israeli innocents, women and children, than it has Israeli combatants and military age men! It is the military tactics of losers. The only reason that it works so well as it has is that: Israel is a decent, Western styled democracy, fully civilzed nation with a people who share Western ideals, who will not utterly obliterate an enemy such as the Palestinians. If this was happening in Brezhnev's Soviet Union of 1982, the Palestinians would simply no longer exist. But still it must pain you that Israel is so popular here in the United States and with the folks on this Board! Eric The(Heh-heh-heh)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 6/15/2002 10:57:59 PM EDT
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: [size=4]Using your own children with bombs strapped to their bodies? That doesn't seem too smart, or something anyone should be proud of![/size=4]
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Yes, Hun, that is terrible. But so is Israeli troops shooting dead those same kids who are only throwing rocks at them. Not to mention occupying and oppressing a populace against their will Geez, the Jews/Israelis can do no wrong in your eyes, can they?
Link Posted: 6/15/2002 11:00:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By s0ulzer0: I'm a Muslim, currently studying demolitions and hanging out at Radio Shack to learn how to wire my body for a most effective fragmentation field, and I LOVE THE JEWISH PEOPLE! [:D]
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[img]http://www.boomspeed.com/winston_wolf/Hakim.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 5:14:47 AM EDT
Post from Kroagnon -
Yes, Hun, that is terrible. But so is Israeli troops shooting dead those same kids who are only throwing rocks at them. Not to mention occupying and oppressing a populace against their will
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Against their will? The Palestinians are free to leave and go back to their homelands, you know, Egypt, Jordan, Syria, and Lebanon. And we can start with Chairless Yassir 'Bring Me A Wet Wash Cloth, Quickly!' Arafat, who was born in 1930, in Cairo, Egypt! That pretty much him makes Arafat as much of a 'Palestinian', as is Golda Meir, the late Prime Minister of Israel!
Geez, the Jews/Israelis can do no wrong in your eyes, can they?
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I've seen nothing wrong, [b]yet![/b] But who knows, the Millenium is young. And the stakes are incredibly high. Eric The(FriendOfHISFriends)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 5:37:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/16/2002 5:41:54 AM EDT by ELEFTARIA]
In the Israel vs Muslim conflict, I support Israel. My friend's enemy is my enemy.
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 5:45:52 AM EDT
I fully support Israel. 5 billion is a relatively small price to pay in view of the other huge expenditures we make. I regret that Israel has not seen fit to tell the traitor Colon Exit Powel to take a hike and move forward against our common enemy. I think they should OBLITERATE all traces of the moslems of West Bank and Gaza, making them a footnote in history. Killing number one, Arafathead.
Link Posted: 6/16/2002 9:53:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/16/2002 9:56:28 PM EDT by Kroagnon]
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: And we can start with Chairless Yassir 'Bring Me A Wet Wash Cloth, Quickly!' Arafat, who was born in 1930, in Cairo, Egypt!
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Well I'll agree with you there. Why do the Palestinians follow an idiot like Arafat? He isn't even Palestinian! Just as Fidel Castro isn't Cuban, Adolf Hitler wasn't German, Josef Stalin wasn't Russian, etc.
Geez, the Jews/Israelis can do no wrong in your eyes, can they? I've seen nothing wrong, [b]yet![/b]
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I've noted for some time now that on the subject of Israel, you never address the situations of where the Israelis are in the wrong. So I'll ask you again: are you condoning the acts of Israeli troops shooting DEAD Palestinian kids who are throwing rocks at them? This is literally throwing rocks, AKA stones against CAR-15/M16/M4 armed Israeli troops.
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