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Posted: 10/5/2017 10:26:12 AM EDT
[#1]
Their business, their rules
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Posted: 10/5/2017 11:58:23 AM EDT
[#2]
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The Crowne Plaza in Phoenix had a gunbuster on all the doors. I was going to be on federal property so I didn't bring my P07 with me anyway Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Private property, so it is within their rights to do so. A lot of places in AZ do it because a) we always had open carry, then b) permit CCW and now c) no-permit CCW. The Department of Liquor Licenses and Control (DLLC) will provide laminated signs for licensees to post at their liquor-licensed business which can be picked up by visiting our offices. Please see http://www.azliquor.gov/hours.html for office hours and location.
Signs distributed by DLLC will have the director’s signature and a DLLC watermark in the lower, right-hand corner. Printable version of the “NO FIREARMS ALLOWED” signs can be found on the DLLC website homepage at http://www.azliquor.gov/ . To comply with A.R.S. §4-229(C), posted signs must be on white, laminated, 110 pound index paper. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:04:23 PM EDT
[#3]
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Their business, their rules 
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:10:23 PM EDT
[#4]
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Their business, their rules http://fatwts.umbc.edu/files/2016/09/segregation2.jpg 
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:10:56 PM EDT
[#5]
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Maybe your room is your home, no different than an apartment. Can a landlord ban guns in their apartments? |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:11:46 PM EDT
[#6]
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Cased long guns? Use discreet, locking cases. Put some Bass Pro fishing decals on the outside. "Well, let's get these fishing poles up to the room now." The first rule of OPSEC when dealing with hotel employees is, we don't discuss jack and shit with them. 
(I have no idea what fishing there might be around Las Vegas - maybe none - but you get the point I hope. I used to have an inconspicuous looking locking rifle case and I put decals on the outside of it that said "Fragile, Handle With Care, Surveying Equipment"). Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Local friend owns a firearms training business. They go to the Shot Show every year. They were checking in to a Vegas hotel this year, and brought several long guns up to the room so as not to leave them in the vehicle. Hotel staff asked them not to, discussion ensued, staff didn't press it. Shortly thereafter hotel security showed up, demanding the guns be removed from the hotel or secured by security. This was obviously before the latest incident. Use discreet, locking cases. Put some Bass Pro fishing decals on the outside. "Well, let's get these fishing poles up to the room now." The first rule of OPSEC when dealing with hotel employees is, we don't discuss jack and shit with them.
(I have no idea what fishing there might be around Las Vegas - maybe none - but you get the point I hope. I used to have an inconspicuous looking locking rifle case and I put decals on the outside of it that said "Fragile, Handle With Care, Surveying Equipment"). |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:16:02 PM EDT
[#7]
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Illegal provisions are unenforceable. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Maybe your room is your home, no different than an apartment. Can a landlord ban guns in their apartments? Even though the lease says no dogs? Yes, I'm sure that would work out. 
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:24:50 PM EDT
[#8]
It's always interesting reading people stating "the law" from their own state and not understanding that "the law" in other states is different. Many even working in LE can't understand this simple fact.
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:27:12 PM EDT
[#9]
News flash, it was legal before Heller. You did know you could buy, own, and keep firearms before then right? Heller is a lame decision anyway.
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:27:38 PM EDT
[#10]
Their property, their rules.
This is why I make a point of never reading signs. 
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:33:40 PM EDT
[#11]
I carry anywhere there isn't a metal detector. I don't care what their policy may be.
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:33:48 PM EDT
[#12]
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What's in the lease both parties sign? |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:35:56 PM EDT
[#13]
I stayed at a hotel in Oregon that had a big sign behind the front desk that said "No firearms allowed" I said nothing about the ones that were in my bag at the time.
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:45:48 PM EDT
[#14]
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so I can have a dog in the apartment, Even though the lease says no dogs? Yes, I'm sure that would work out. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Maybe your room is your home, no different than an apartment. Can a landlord ban guns in their apartments? Even though the lease says no dogs? Yes, I'm sure that would work out. As was already pointed out, there was a court case where it was determined a land lord cannot tell an apartment tenant they cannot own guns. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:46:30 PM EDT
[#15]
I've always been told a hotel room is a temporary residence. So just like renting a house or apartment you should be able to have guns in your room. You have the same rights in your hotel room as your very own home. Now I'm sure they could probably ban guns from being open or concealed carried in the lobby or common areas. But I doubt they can ban you from having guns in your luggage and room.
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:48:24 PM EDT
[#16]
All the casinos in 'Vegas post no firearms in the casino but finding my way into my hotel room without passing thru the casino floor was something I never figured out ... so I walked thru with two full-sized rifle cases under how many hundreds of cameras up to my room.
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:52:54 PM EDT
[#17]
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I don't care what their policy is. I check in and I do what I want. Wynn hotel adds metal detectors. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 12:55:16 PM EDT
[#18]
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I love it when GD is all about "Muh property rights" until it's someone else's property. I don't think government should be able to tell property owners what they can and cannot allow on their property. I think hotels are well within their rights to ban guns on the property. And I'm not a fan of government making laws that interfere with that right. But from a pragmatic standpoint, my carrying a gun into the hotel doesn't hurt them and they'll never know I did it unless the worst case scenario occurs and I need it for self defense. If caught (highly unlikely) I'll leave without rancor. They can have their rules and I won't try to say otherwise. But I'm not going to follow those rules if they're too inconvenient, don't make sense, and I can get away with it. Following other people's rules merely because they exist is not a virtue. I view this along the lines of people who wait 5 minutes at a deserted intersection at 3 in the morning for the red light to turn green. Doing that isn't virtuous. It's just stupid. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:02:37 PM EDT
[#19]
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That's a bad comparison. A better one would be if your landlord put that you don't have a right to free speech or religion in the lease. How would that go over? |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:02:44 PM EDT
[#20]
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Hotel's can ban firearms and are not bound by the second amendment. Furthermore hotel employees can make entry into a room without it violating a subject's constitutional rights as well. <<snip snip>> At that point hotel staff can make entry into the room but before hand LE does a 'safety sweep'. With all the murders and over-doses that happen in hotel rooms you can't just leave a body rotting in there for days when you suspect fowl play. Or worse yet someone can be lying on the floor dying... You just have to be able to articulate a justification of entering someone's room. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:04:05 PM EDT
[#21]
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Most states have laws covering what a private business can allow on their property, we have had a couple of court cases about this very subject here in Montana and the courts have always sided with the business that says no guns on our property, now that hunting season is upon us, we will start seeing signs to the effect of you are welcome, but please leave your weapons outside of our establishment. Now we also can't have guns in places that serve alcohol and many of our smaller convenience stores have casinos attached to them that serve alcohol, so you are not to suppose to carry guns in those places either. So it is pretty much up to the owners of the establishment on whether they allow guns or not. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:07:22 PM EDT
[#22]
Fuck private property rights
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:11:47 PM EDT
[#23]
I will still do what I normally do when I see a no gun sign. Keep it concealed and walk right in.
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:17:58 PM EDT
[#24]
Hotels can not ban them.
Why? Because they would need to search your bags and your room to find them.... which is illegal and they have no right to search your bag or property. If anyone asks me to take a look inside my bag I would tell them that they can go get pleasantly fucked.... |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:19:35 PM EDT
[#25]
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Their business, their rules http://fatwts.umbc.edu/files/2016/09/segregation2.jpg |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:19:58 PM EDT
[#26]
A couple of buddies were out in Vegas many years ago for a big machinegun shoot. They arrived at the hotel and loaded their guns onto a couple of luggage carts, we are talking beltfeds etc in large gun cases. They proceeded into the elevator and pressed the button for their floor. Well the elevator changed directions and took them down into the basement. Obviously hotel security took notice of the gun cases and decided to get them into the basement and away from the public areas. They both knew what was happening and raised their hands up to show security via the camera that they were not bad guys. Armed security was waiting for them as the doors opened. After some back and forth about the legality of not giving over possession of NFA items to the hotel for safe keeping, the hotel gave them access to a secure area and a cage to store their guns.
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:21:27 PM EDT
[#27]
Don't ask
Don't Tell |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:22:35 PM EDT
[#28]
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I used to work security in a hotel. One of the things we were told is that hotel employees were not allowed to search rooms while a guest was checked in as it violated the guests constitutional rights since the room was essentially their home. After the Heller decision does the 2nd not extend to the temporary home that is your hotel room? I know I advised a general manager of that reasoning when the hotel chain wanted to enforce a no firearms policy and got him to agree with me. In Florida they can create a "Policy" to ban guns on their property. However it would not be unlawful for someone to have one at the hotel. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:31:03 PM EDT
[#29]
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Fuck private property rights |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:34:10 PM EDT
[#30]
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The private property I've rented? |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:39:31 PM EDT
[#31]
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Rented by agreed upon terms and conditions. If the hotel has a "no guns" policy as one of those conditions, and you agree to it, well, it's not exactly violating your rights to enforce a stipulation you agreed to. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The private property I've rented? |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:44:32 PM EDT
[#32]
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Hotels can not ban them. Why? Because they would need to search your bags and your room to find them.... which is illegal and they have no right to search your bag or property. If anyone asks me to take a look inside my bag I would tell them that they can go get pleasantly fucked.... |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:44:37 PM EDT
[#33]
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so I can have a dog in the apartment, Even though the lease says no dogs? Yes, I'm sure that would work out. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Maybe your room is your home, no different than an apartment. Can a landlord ban guns in their apartments? Even though the lease says no dogs? Yes, I'm sure that would work out. Banning certain types of pets certainly isn't illegal, and is therefore, an enforceable provision of a lease. Illegal provisions or clauses present in a lease are unenforceable however; even when the lease is signed by both parties. Thanks for your worthless comment. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:51:53 PM EDT
[#34]
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There shouldn't be anything wrong with having that sign from a legal standpoint. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Their business, their rules http://fatwts.umbc.edu/files/2016/09/segregation2.jpg In Florida, "No Firearms Allowed" signage has no legal bearing in locations where the possession of guns is otherwise legally permitted, so those signs can be ignored without legal repercussion unless the guns are somehow discovered and you're asked to leave and then you must leave or you're trespassing. Rightly or wrongly according to one's personal opinion; but that's the legality of the situation here and in other states as well. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:53:50 PM EDT
[#35]
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After you tell them they can go get pleasantly fucked, what would be your response when they instruct you to leave the property? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Hotels can not ban them. Why? Because they would need to search your bags and your room to find them.... which is illegal and they have no right to search your bag or property. If anyone asks me to take a look inside my bag I would tell them that they can go get pleasantly fucked.... |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:56:47 PM EDT
[#36]
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Unless it's a rule that they have posted or otherwise directly informed you then their actions may well be illegal themselves. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Hotels can not ban them. Why? Because they would need to search your bags and your room to find them.... which is illegal and they have no right to search your bag or property. If anyone asks me to take a look inside my bag I would tell them that they can go get pleasantly fucked.... You contract with a hotel to occupy a room for the night. After the transaction, they ask you to leave the premises. (Ignore guns - they ask you to leave for any reason.) Are you saying they are not allowed to request you leave their property? |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:58:19 PM EDT
[#37]
Quoted:
I used to work security in a hotel. One of the things we were told is that hotel employees were not allowed to search rooms while a guest was checked in as it violated the guests constitutional rights since the room was essentially their home. After the Heller decision does the 2nd not extend to the temporary home that is your hotel room? I know I advised a general manager of that reasoning when the hotel chain wanted to enforce a no firearms policy and got him to agree with me. I say it is thier biz they can refuse service to whom they wish. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 1:59:39 PM EDT
[#38]
Quoted:
I used to work security in a hotel. One of the things we were told is that hotel employees were not allowed to search rooms while a guest was checked in as it violated the guests constitutional rights since the room was essentially their home. After the Heller decision does the 2nd not extend to the temporary home that is your hotel room? I know I advised a general manager of that reasoning when the hotel chain wanted to enforce a no firearms policy and got him to agree with me. BOR is protections from government infringements. When you agree to stay in a private hotel you are not guaranteed any protections. Their hotel, their rules. If it is in their contract that they do not allow guns and they will allow their employees to go through your stuff in your room then you can choose to go somewhere else. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 2:03:22 PM EDT
[#39]
A few years ago on a trip I came upon a chain motel whose name escapes me unfortunately that had a no firearms policy plastered all over the front door.
It was not Motel 6 or Super 8 but one of the more pricy chains. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 2:04:45 PM EDT
[#40]
A landlord can't prohibit you or your guests from carrying in Minnesota.
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Posted: 10/5/2017 2:05:03 PM EDT
[#41]
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Montana sounds like a great place to steal firearms out of hotel parking lots. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 2:09:10 PM EDT
[#42]
Quoted:
I used to work security in a hotel. One of the things we were told is that hotel employees were not allowed to search rooms while a guest was checked in as it violated the guests constitutional rights since the room was essentially their home. After the Heller decision does the 2nd not extend to the temporary home that is your hotel room? I know I advised a general manager of that reasoning when the hotel chain wanted to enforce a no firearms policy and got him to agree with me. Seems Steve Wynn has already begun wanding people and checking bags at his properties in Vegas before you can enter the hotel section. Makes me wonder how they plan on dealing with legal CCW folks. I can see some guy getting drawn down on by some security schmoe just trying to go to his hotel room. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 2:10:19 PM EDT
[#43]
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I love it when GD is all about "Muh property rights" until it's someone else's property. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't care what their policy is. I check in and I do what I want. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 2:14:21 PM EDT
[#44]
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Leaving a firearm in your vehicle is dangerous. Not so honest people are not dummies, they will prey on people whom they know will have a gun. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 2:15:51 PM EDT
[#45]
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I've only ever signed no pets and no smoking policies. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 4:28:46 PM EDT
[#46]
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In most states a guest has to stay 30 or more days to establish residency. Under 30 days and it ain't your 'residence'. Seems Steve Wynn has already begun wanding people and checking bags at his properties in Vegas before you can enter the hotel section. Makes me wonder how they plan on dealing with legal CCW folks. I can see some guy getting drawn down on by some security schmoe just trying to go to his hotel room. 
Also How would renting a room, differ from renting an RV?(IE mobile home) |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 4:43:54 PM EDT
[#47]
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I love it when GD is all about "Muh property rights" until it's someone else's property. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't care what their policy is. I check in and I do what I want. 
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Posted: 10/5/2017 4:50:25 PM EDT
[#48]
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Hotels can not ban them. Why? Because they would need to search your bags and your room to find them.... which is illegal and they have no right to search your bag or property. If anyone asks me to take a look inside my bag I would tell them that they can go get pleasantly fucked.... |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 4:58:34 PM EDT
[#49]
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Yep. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't care what their policy is. I check in and I do what I want. Concealed is concealed. |
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Posted: 10/5/2017 5:10:08 PM EDT
[#50]
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Someone's private property that is a business open to the public do not have the right to trump Civil Rights. Concealed is concealed. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't care what their policy is. I check in and I do what I want. Concealed is concealed. Business owners have every right to ban firearms from their establishment. When asked to leave, you will be trespassing if you refuse to comply. We're not talking about concealed weapons staying concealed. This is about if a hotel can ban firearms from their establishment. They can. |
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