User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 5:42:43 PM EDT
You're eventually going to fall to your death. No two ways about it. For those who have, I can't imagine what went through their mind at that moment they lost their grip; instantly realizing their mistake and knowing that they're about to have their brain and organs splattered on the rocks below. Why do they do it?
Old but relevant: http://abcnews.go.com/Travel/story?id=8061175&page=1 Hanging by his fingertips from a 100-foot ledge was a relatively common occurrence for rock climber John Bachar. What made him extraordinary was that he did so without a safety net. In rock climbing, that meant he had no harness or ropes to hold him if something went wrong. After spending 30 years climbing without ropes, the 52-year old Bachar fell to his death on July 5 while climbing a rock formation near his home in Mammoth Lakes, Calif. It was a route he had taken dozens, if not hundreds, of times. His death shocked and saddened the tight-knit climbing community. Tributes and testimonials have poured in to online forums. But there is also much debate about whether his style of free-solo rock climbing was worth the risk. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 5:43:44 PM EDT
[#1]
I'd take some basic safety precautions because I value my life, but to each his own
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:04:05 PM EDT
[#2]
There may also be something to be said for taking on a sport or hobby that is just dangerous enough that it will kill you before you start to lose your edge.
I'd personally rather die while still in great overall shape than waste away of cancer or alzheimer's or ALS or some other slow torture. But to engage in such an activity without safety equipment? No, I can't see doing that. That's just stupid. CJ |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:06:33 PM EDT
[#3]
"Without the threat of death, there is no reason to live."-MM
I am sure they would rather go out in a pink jelloy mist than die slowly over a few months in a hospital bed. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:07:55 PM EDT
[#4]
I have done it - and stopped. I had a very, very close call.
That said - I understand the attraction, the cult-like following and the Zen that goes with it. Each of us makes decisions for our own lives. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:11:05 PM EDT
[#5]
I used to climb a lot about 10 years ago.
Havent really done any major-scary free-solos, but I've absolutely been in the 'danger zone' without protection. I dont recommend it...and I wont do it these days....but having tasted the adrenaline that comes from knowing your life it literally in your hands...I do understand why some people do it. Its addictive....like a drug. Until you've been on a wall...over 20 feet up...with nothing but your chalk and your wits...its hard to understand. All that said...I prefer life...so these days I use a rope and a harness. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:13:10 PM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
You're eventually going to fall to your death. No two ways about it. For those who have, I can't imagine what went through their mind at that moment they lost their grip; instantly realizing their mistake and knowing that they're about to have their brain and organs splattered on the rocks below. Why do they do it? It's a rush most people couldn't even imagine. You go into risky things knowing there's a good chance you'll die or get seriously fucked up. It's a risk some people are willing to take. I'd rather go out doing something I love, than die in a nursing home. I bet he got laid constantly too. You won't catch my ass climbing without ropes or a chute though. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:14:56 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted: Quoted: You're eventually going to fall to your death. No two ways about it. For those who have, I can't imagine what went through their mind at that moment they lost their grip; instantly realizing their mistake and knowing that they're about to have their brain and organs splattered on the rocks below. Why do they do it? It's a rush most people couldn't even imagine. You go into risky things knowing there's a good chance you'll die or get seriously fucked up. It's a risk some people are willing to take. I'd rather go out doing something I love, than die in a nursing home. I bet he got laid constantly too. You won't catch my ass climbing without ropes or a chute though. I have a running script for Epi-Pens, I can get this rush watching sesame street. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:16:59 PM EDT
[#8]
There are a lot of ways to die. He did ok
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:21:25 PM EDT
[#9]
I got vertigo just looking at that picture.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:21:31 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted:
I have done it - and stopped. I had a very, very close call. Care to share? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:32:32 PM EDT
[#11]
There are worse things than losing your grip and falling. Imagine you are high on a rock face and lack the energy to finish or make your way back to the bottom...
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:47:31 PM EDT
[#12]
It's the simplest form of climbing. No ropes in which to get tangled; no gear with which to fumble; no belayer at whom to yell.
Climbing is mostly mental. Free soloing, doubly so. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:54:29 PM EDT
[#13]
Quoted:
There are worse things than losing your grip and falling. Imagine you are high on a rock face and lack the energy to finish or make your way back to the bottom... The human psyche doesn't like uncertainty. It will more often chose the certainty of letting go over the uncertainty of making one last exhausted lunge at some greasy, sloped hold. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 6:56:27 PM EDT
[#14]
Old picture he has on EB shoes? Talked to him before he was a good guy.
 Gary
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 7:00:59 PM EDT
[#15]
If it's what you enjoy go for it. Like I posted in the other free-soloing thread, these are men who live every day as though they were already dead. Tsunenomo said, "the person without previous resolution to inevitable death makes certain that his death will be in bad form. But if one is resolved to death beforehand, in what way can he be despicable?"
I have nothing but admiration for them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 7:04:31 PM EDT
[#16]
<–– Scared of heights so fuck that!!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 7:16:00 PM EDT
[#17]
Quoted: Quoted: I have done it - and stopped. I had a very, very close call. Care to share? I was free climbing on a flat face next to an area I had climbed on for a year. I had never been up it - and hadn't see people on it. I started the climb with one woman around - but not directly at the face. I had no equipment on me. I got up around 30-35 feet and made a fateful transition left and up that was really tricky..... a hard combo move with very narrow edges for my feet and very limited handholds. Once I made the hard move up and left I started looking for my next features to support another move... and it quickly sunk in that there really weren't any. I was on really narrow edges and I knew I couldn't stay on them. So I looked down and laterally for a retreat. The more I looked and felt for it - the more I realized that they either didn't exist - or the risk of the limited features was way to high to even consider. I knew then that I was in a bad position with no good options. I tried to retreat back where I came from - but the move I had made to go up was pretty edgy - and I couldn't pick up the limited features from above. I knew I was in a jam and I yelled for the woman who was there - thinking she could secure a rope above (accessible) that I could body rappel on. No reply and she was nowhere to be seen. I kept feeling for some kind of possibility while 3-4 more minutes passed. I did a limited hand-jam and leaned back to find anything - nada. My leg muscles started to tire and I got "sewing machine leg" - where your muscles repetitively spasm. There was no arm jam feature that I could hang from to rest my legs. At that point I knew I had about 2 minutes max to get off the face before I lost muscle control. So I yelled for help again. Nada. So I calmly figured that I could come off the wall against my will - or plan a jump to the flat 80% rock below. So I planned a jump. I knew it would be a bad deal - but better to bail with a little control and avoid going head-first. I was probably about 30-45 seconds from jumping - mulling the best way to leave the face in control, when the woman's head appeared above and she asked "Whats up?". Thanks God. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 7:29:32 PM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I have done it - and stopped. I had a very, very close call. Care to share? I was free climbing on a flat face next to an area I had climbed on for a year. I had never been up it - and hadn't see people on it. I started the climb with one woman around - but not directly at the face. I had no equipment on me. I got up around 30-35 feet and made a fateful transition left and up that was really tricky..... a hard combo move with very narrow edges for my feet and very limited handholds. Once I made the hard move up and left I started looking for my next features to support another move... and it quickly sunk in that there really weren't any. I was on really narrow edges and I knew I couldn't stay on them. So I looked down and laterally for a retreat. The more I looked and felt for it - the more I realized that they either didn't exist - or the risk of the limited features was way to high to even consider. I knew then that I was in a bad position with no good options. I tried to retreat back where I came from - but the move I had made to go up was pretty edgy - and I couldn't pick up the limited features from above. I knew I was in a jam and I yelled for the woman who was there - thinking she could secure a rope above (accessible) that I could body rappel on. No reply and she was nowhere to be seen. I kept feeling for some kind of possibility while 3-4 more minutes passed. I did a limited hand-jam and leaned back to find anything - nada. My leg muscles started to tire and I got "sewing machine leg" - where your muscles repetitively spasm. There was no arm jam feature that I could hang from to rest my legs. At that point I knew I had about 2 minutes max to get off the face before I lost muscle control. So I yelled for help again. Nada. So I calmly figured that I could come off the wall against my will - or plan a jump to the flat 80% rock below. So I planned a jump. I knew it would be a bad deal - but better to bail with a little control and avoid going head-first. I was probably about 30-45 seconds from jumping - mulling the best way to leave the face in control, when the woman's head appeared above and she asked "Whats up?". Thanks God. That had me sweating. Fuck all that. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 7:38:13 PM EDT
[#19]
Damn, I've meet John on several occasions. Even bouldered with him at Camp 4 a couple of times. Damn.
Several of my climbing friends have died over the years. One thing about climbing. If you push the limits enough times you will die. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 7:41:16 PM EDT
[#20]
It is very addictive. I started out on routes that I knew, and the first time I climbed a wall I hadn't even seen before and didn't know if it was even possible, that's when I knew it was time to stop. Man, I miss it. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 7:51:23 PM EDT
[#21]
I don't know if this picture will link, but I'll give it a try.
I soloed a climb near the shaded buttress on the right. I traversed in starting where the sun is shining, and after about a 1km traverse, finished up the side of the buttress. Pulling over the very top, I can still remember the crunching sound of the snail shells that filled the small limestone pockets. If you look at the shaded buttress in the foreground, you'll notice some bushes a little above mid-height. That ledge wraps all the way around the cliff to a v-notch in the sunshine. There's a very prominent boulder protruding from the profile of the buttress; if I recall correctly, the exit climb started on top of that protrusion and climbed to the the side of the buttress that's not visible in the picture. So, you know, if something went wrong, there's uh plenty of water to aim for... 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 7:54:56 PM EDT
[#22]
As the saying goes...
There are old mountaineers, and there are bold mountaineers. But there are not old, bold mountaineers. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 7:55:26 PM EDT
[#23]
Why tip-toe through life just to arrive safely at death?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/10/2011 8:06:01 PM EDT
[#24]
Quoted: I can get vertigo from a really good 1st person shooter/vid game.<–– Scared of heights so fuck that!! Climbing around on some of the ruins in STALKER can do it to me. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 5:09:01 PM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:
There are worse things than losing your grip and falling. Imagine you are high on a rock face and lack the energy to finish or make your way back to the bottom... All sounds the same to me. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 5:39:22 PM EDT
[#26]
You know this seems awful close to Russian Roulette to me.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 5:40:17 PM EDT
[#27]
I'll never understand freestyle rock climbers.
Visit a nursing home sometime. It will all start to make some sense. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 5:45:58 PM EDT
[#28]
Adrenalin is a hell of a rush.
That is why sports like this will be around for a very long time. Come to think of it I am sure drag racers, motorcycle racers sky divers etc all know what it feels like. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 5:47:09 PM EDT
[#29]
I've done it once when I was 19 or 20 - the adrenalin and the high is indescribable. Looking back, I get dizzy and queazy and can't believe how stupid I was. It was nothing that technical, but definitely a massive penalty for fucking up.
The guy did it for 30 years - I'd say he loved a life as full as he was going to. Those hardcore adrenalin guys - they rarely have families, close friends - they live for their sport. He died the best way he could - the ay he would have wanted to, most likely. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 5:48:09 PM EDT
[#30]
No one here gets out alive
Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 5:50:51 PM EDT
[#31]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I have done it - and stopped. I had a very, very close call. Care to share? I was free climbing on a flat face next to an area I had climbed on for a year. I had never been up it - and hadn't see people on it. I started the climb with one woman around - but not directly at the face. I had no equipment on me. I got up around 30-35 feet and made a fateful transition left and up that was really tricky..... a hard combo move with very narrow edges for my feet and very limited handholds. Once I made the hard move up and left I started looking for my next features to support another move... and it quickly sunk in that there really weren't any. I was on really narrow edges and I knew I couldn't stay on them. So I looked down and laterally for a retreat. The more I looked and felt for it - the more I realized that they either didn't exist - or the risk of the limited features was way to high to even consider. I knew then that I was in a bad position with no good options. I tried to retreat back where I came from - but the move I had made to go up was pretty edgy - and I couldn't pick up the limited features from above. I knew I was in a jam and I yelled for the woman who was there - thinking she could secure a rope above (accessible) that I could body rappel on. No reply and she was nowhere to be seen. I kept feeling for some kind of possibility while 3-4 more minutes passed. I did a limited hand-jam and leaned back to find anything - nada. My leg muscles started to tire and I got "sewing machine leg" - where your muscles repetitively spasm. There was no arm jam feature that I could hang from to rest my legs. At that point I knew I had about 2 minutes max to get off the face before I lost muscle control. So I yelled for help again. Nada. So I calmly figured that I could come off the wall against my will - or plan a jump to the flat 80% rock below. So I planned a jump. I knew it would be a bad deal - but better to bail with a little control and avoid going head-first. I was probably about 30-45 seconds from jumping - mulling the best way to leave the face in control, when the woman's head appeared above and she asked "Whats up?". Thanks God. OK, I guess I lied. I had said the adrenaline was indescribable. However, I would have to say you described it quite well. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 5:52:18 PM EDT
[#32]
Gravity always wins!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 5:53:24 PM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
I'll never understand freestyle rock climbers.
Visit a nursing home sometime. It will all start to make some sense. So I should take up freestyle climbing if I have to go to a nursing home? 
No thanks, my future grandkids might need me to take care of them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 5:54:55 PM EDT
[#34]
This guy is always at the bottom to greet you.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 6:00:46 PM EDT
[#35]
everybody dies, nursing home, blah blah fucking blah
and probably from the same people that would say suicide is a cowards way out and how selfish it is i have a reason for taking reasonable measures not to fucking die...living they can climb the same shit with a line, i consider them insane |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 8:51:20 PM EDT
[#36]
Quoted:
There may also be something to be said for taking on a sport or hobby that is just dangerous enough that it will kill you before you start to lose your edge. I'd personally rather die while still in great overall shape than waste away of cancer or alzheimer's or ALS or some other slow torture. Not me. I'd rather hang around for at least another half a century after the young fools have killed themselves, drinking beer and watching porn in my underwear. To each his own... 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 10:23:27 PM EDT
[#37]
it is the thrill I wold guess.
Same goes for base jumping one wrong move and your are history. adrenaline sure is a hell of a drug |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 10:28:26 PM EDT
[#38]
double tap
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 10:35:08 PM EDT
[#39]
Quoted:
everybody dies, nursing home, blah blah fucking blah and probably from the same people that would say suicide is a cowards way out and how selfish it is i have a reason for taking reasonable measures not to fucking die...living they can climb the same shit with a line, i consider them insane Agreed; that nursing home, everyone dies argument sounds like some TapOut wearing crap from someone who only sees black and white. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:02:42 PM EDT
[#40]
I almost had a 35ft ladder go out from under me in training once.
That was enough discovering my own mortality for me. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:04:12 PM EDT
[#41]
Can understand the attraction.
Didn't climb rock faces, just trees. Getting 40-60 feet up in a tree and losing your grip will get your attention. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:06:56 PM EDT
[#42]
Free Climbing is stupid.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:07:06 PM EDT
[#43]
Quoted:
There are a lot of ways to die. He did ok Damn right. To each their own and to their own risk. I have a great deal of respect for those who will take the risk to do the things I will not. I have disdain for people who never take risk and call others stupid for doing so. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:11:42 PM EDT
[#44]
Quoted:
I have disdain for people who never take risk and call others stupid for doing so. I have disdain for people who take needless risks and call others stupid for not also taking needless risks. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:23:47 PM EDT
[#45]
Dying doing what he loved. Now, if he had a family I would think he is a complete asshole, that's how I felt about that fucking retard that got stuck in the cave(what, a year and a half ago?).
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:27:18 PM EDT
[#46]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I have disdain for people who never take risk and call others stupid for doing so. I have disdain for people who take needless risks and call others stupid for not also taking needless risks. I don't call people stupid for not taking needless risk, you won't see ME rock climbing! There ain't a damn thing wrong with being an old man and dying in your sleep peacefully. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:33:11 PM EDT
[#47]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I have done it - and stopped. I had a very, very close call. Care to share? I was free climbing on a flat face next to an area I had climbed on for a year. I had never been up it - and hadn't see people on it. I started the climb with one woman around - but not directly at the face. I had no equipment on me. I got up around 30-35 feet and made a fateful transition left and up that was really tricky..... a hard combo move with very narrow edges for my feet and very limited handholds. Once I made the hard move up and left I started looking for my next features to support another move... and it quickly sunk in that there really weren't any. I was on really narrow edges and I knew I couldn't stay on them. So I looked down and laterally for a retreat. The more I looked and felt for it - the more I realized that they either didn't exist - or the risk of the limited features was way to high to even consider. I knew then that I was in a bad position with no good options. I tried to retreat back where I came from - but the move I had made to go up was pretty edgy - and I couldn't pick up the limited features from above. I knew I was in a jam and I yelled for the woman who was there - thinking she could secure a rope above (accessible) that I could body rappel on. No reply and she was nowhere to be seen. I kept feeling for some kind of possibility while 3-4 more minutes passed. I did a limited hand-jam and leaned back to find anything - nada. My leg muscles started to tire and I got "sewing machine leg" - where your muscles repetitively spasm. There was no arm jam feature that I could hang from to rest my legs. At that point I knew I had about 2 minutes max to get off the face before I lost muscle control. So I yelled for help again. Nada. So I calmly figured that I could come off the wall against my will - or plan a jump to the flat 80% rock below. So I planned a jump. I knew it would be a bad deal - but better to bail with a little control and avoid going head-first. I was probably about 30-45 seconds from jumping - mulling the best way to leave the face in control, when the woman's head appeared above and she asked "Whats up?". Thanks God. That story was really awesome. Good thing that lady came back 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:46:38 PM EDT
[#48]
OP, adrenaline is a damn good high. free climbing is an amazing experience, but i am not stupid enough to go alone.
Quoted:
everybody dies, nursing home, blah blah fucking blah and probably from the same people that would say suicide is a cowards way out and how selfish it is i have a reason for taking reasonable measures not to fucking die...living they can climb the same shit with a line, i consider them insane you could climb the same shit with a line, but it wouldn't be as fun, just like indoor rockclimbing as not as fun as REAL rockclimbing. and YES, i am a little insane, after all i did run into burning buildings for 3 years. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:53:02 PM EDT
[#49]
I did it a few times when I was younger (17-20), nothing like what the hardcore folks do, but certainly high enough that the results from screwing up would have been permanent (75'-100' walls)
As others have said the adrenaline rush is incredible. I would rather live life to the fullest and go out doing something I enjoy than live to 100 and rot away in a nursing home for the last decade. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2011 11:55:20 PM EDT
[#50]
I enjoy climbing for the physical challenge but have 0 plans to free solo. I have enough fun/thrills with ropes/pads.
|
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
