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Posted: 8/24/2005 2:13:55 PM EDT
here is a link to a website that has various bites and takes a look into what happens after one of these creatures venom infects your system.


RATTLESNAKE
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 2:14:51 PM EDT
Cool.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 2:16:07 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 2:19:08 PM EDT
I have an urge to eat some fried
chicken now...


Link Posted: 8/24/2005 2:20:40 PM EDT
damn. That looked brutal. There was something similar that I saw with a brown recluse spider over a 10 day span that was about that graphic.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 2:23:43 PM EDT
Father in Law was bit in the late fourties by a copperhead. His ankle never quite healed. he had grafts and an open wound till he died in 1991.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 2:33:35 PM EDT
wow that is pretty cool.
It would suck to be the one that got bit.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 2:37:18 PM EDT
looks like that rattler dumped a full load into him. usually they don't.

how unfortunate for such a young kid.

from reading his story though, he doesn't seem to be stigmatized. I’m surprised he isn’t more self-conscious, especially at his age.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 2:38:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2005 2:40:15 PM EDT by mmx1]
Brutal. Strong kid to be taking it as well as he is.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 2:41:37 PM EDT

My hand now has fully mobility and is about 80% as strong as it was before, thanks to my Dad and I resuming our rock climbing after a 1 year break due to the lack of strength in my left hand. I use it for about 90% of the things I used to do with my left hand (I am right handed). 13 surgeries, $700,000 worth of helicopter flights, surgeries, and hospital stays (paid by my insurance of course), and 20 months later, I am very happy with the outcome of this experience and my good fortune of getting through all this without any significant loss.


As medicine becomes more socialized and eventually completely run (into the ground) by the gov't, it will become too expensive to allow this kind of medical treatment. The same situation will call for amputation above the elbow.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:09:43 PM EDT
Nercrosis is bad Mmmmkay
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:15:52 PM EDT
If you think thats bad, you should see the damage caused by a Russells Viper or Saw-Scaled Viper.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:19:28 PM EDT
Thats the good thing about western N.Y. I never see those or black widow spiders. Down south I bet they are all over.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:19:55 PM EDT
Maybe the rattlesnake was trying to play tag or something? Kill them all.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:21:42 PM EDT
Is it myth or fact that high voltage electric shock will neutralize the venom?

Like from a car spark plug wire or a stun gun ?
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:26:08 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:29:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By skid2964:
Is it myth or fact that high voltage electric shock will neutralize the venom?

Like from a car spark plug wire or a stun gun ?



Myth.

Fact is that most adults will not dump any venom if they bite you, they can't eat you and they know it so why waste the venom. Juvies OTOH will dump all they have most of the time.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:29:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By skid2964:
Is it myth or fact that high voltage electric shock will neutralize the venom?

Like from a car spark plug wire or a stun gun ?



Unlikely to be beneficial. Some people swear by it but in actual, clinical tests, it shows no benefit. The people who claim it works didn't get a full dose of venom. Or likely very little.

Most venoms are very temperature sensitive. Extreme heat, enough to cause severe 2nd degree burns in the immediate area, actually work well.

In this boy's case, he got a full dose and it tooks some time to get him to a specialist, furthering the tissue damage.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:30:55 PM EDT
Did he make a belt outta that fucker at least?
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:35:09 PM EDT
Wowzers! That's nuts
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:36:31 PM EDT


And I thought it was bad when I got bit. I only got a very swollen leg and got really sick.

Damn....Just Damn
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:37:18 PM EDT
Damn!


Is that arm cut called a fasciotomy?



When my dad had a heart attack the docs had to do fasciotomy (ies?) on all four of his limbs.

They only described it as making cuts deep through the muscle all the way from arpit to wrist and groin to ankle. The reason was to release pressure from swelling so that the tissue in the limbs wouldn't die. I saw the packed wounds in his arms afterwords, but didn't really register what that would look like when open. Holy shit.





Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:39:14 PM EDT
and people have the audacity to give me a hard time for shooting one? Patty
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:41:41 PM EDT
Damn!
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:43:35 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pattymcn:
and people have the audacity to give me a hard time for shooting one? Patty



Around here they are an importent part of our Sunday morning worshiping.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:49:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pattymcn:
and people have the audacity to give me a hard time for shooting one? Patty



I dunno who, with any sense, would give you a hard time for shootin a rattler.

I kill rattlers, moccassins, and copperheads on sight.

Link Posted: 8/24/2005 3:54:13 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 4:10:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Shoot-N-Scoot:

Originally Posted By pattymcn:
and people have the audacity to give me a hard time for shooting one? Patty



Around here they are an importent part of our Sunday morning worshiping.



Damn. That was funny!
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 4:18:33 PM EDT
Glad to see they guy seemed to have good spirits after all of that and was sounding rather optimistic. I'm not a snake lover and am now even less of one.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 8:31:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Red_Beard:
Damn!


Is that arm cut called a fasciotomy?



When my dad had a heart attack the docs had to do fasciotomy (ies?) on all four of his limbs.

They only described it as making cuts deep through the muscle all the way from arpit to wrist and groin to ankle. The reason was to release pressure from swelling so that the tissue in the limbs wouldn't die. I saw the packed wounds in his arms afterwords, but didn't really register what that would look like when open. Holy shit.





Yes, that is what they did. But in the case of the snakebite, there was a lot of skin that had become necrotic due to the hemotoxic properties of the venom. This skin would become gangrenouus if left in place so when they did the fasciotomy, they also removed non-viable tissue, requiring the skin grafts. Snakebite treatment is a battle between local and systemic toxicity. If a constricting band been applied immediately after the bite and anti-inflammatory treatments been applied, the resultant edema would have been delayed, forcing more of the toxin into the lymphatic and blood systems, causing systemic toxicity. This is REALLY BAD in large venom bites as it requires large transfusions and greater antivenom.

Back in the old days, such a bite would have resulted in amputation.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 10:58:11 PM EDT
I shoot every damn rattler I see.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 11:14:10 PM EDT
If enough antivenin had been administered quickly and aggressively, the need for fasciotomies and resultant tissue loss/reconstruction would have been much less likely.

By and large, treatment for Croatalid envenomations is a MEDICAL issue, not surgical. Of course, if enough time passes before medical treatment can be started, then surgery becomes more probable.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 3:00:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By astro:
If enough antivenin had been administered quickly and aggressively, the need for fasciotomies and resultant tissue loss/reconstruction would have been much less likely.

By and large, treatment for Croatalid envenomations is a MEDICAL issue, not surgical. Of course, if enough time passes before medical treatment can be started, then surgery becomes more probable.



As I recall from reading that site about a year ago, the doctors at the first hospital weren't sure what to do, so they sent him elsewhere, delaying the critical treatment with antivenom. It's easier to fly anti-venom around than a rattlesnake victim.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 3:10:28 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Shoot-N-Scoot:

Originally Posted By pattymcn:
and people have the audacity to give me a hard time for shooting one? Patty



Around here they are an importent part of our Sunday morning worshiping.



I knew somebody from Tn or KY would be chiming in with that.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 3:29:58 AM EDT
F@#K me that was horrible.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 3:46:02 AM EDT
Wow! That sucks. I didn't realize how much damage a bit can cause. He was 13 when it happend. I pray to God nothing like that ever happens to my son.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 3:59:24 AM EDT

Originally Posted By pattymcn:
and people have the audacity to give me a hard time for shooting one? Patty



No poisonous snake gets within 10 feet of me or my property.

The enviro-weenies may cry, but the bottom line is that my life is worth more than some snake's life. Period.

Link Posted: 8/25/2005 4:00:34 AM EDT
I've had several close encounters with rattlers in NJ. They're protected in NJ so all you can do is move them.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 4:01:35 AM EDT

Originally Posted By skid2964:
Is it myth or fact that high voltage electric shock will neutralize the venom?

Like from a car spark plug wire or a stun gun ?




I read various Field and Stream articles from back in the 80's that talked about how electrical shock neutralized the toxins and neurotoxins and made them ineffective.

I have mentioned this to a friend who is an M.D. and he says no way.

*IF* I ever get a bite from a snake or spider--hit me with the electricity to that spot--if it keeps my body from looking like that, I WANT IT!!
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 4:19:11 AM EDT

Originally Posted By metroplex:
I've had several close encounters with rattlers in NJ. They're protected in NJ so all you can do is move them.



Or kill them when no one is looking.

Worked for me!
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 4:21:57 AM EDT

Originally Posted By JHill:

Originally Posted By skid2964:
Is it myth or fact that high voltage electric shock will neutralize the venom?

Like from a car spark plug wire or a stun gun ?




I read various Field and Stream articles from back in the 80's that talked about how electrical shock neutralized the toxins and neurotoxins and made them ineffective.



There are as many different types of venom as there are snakes who have venom. Some might indeed be deactivated by electrical shock. Others may not be. Venoms are not all the same, as they all tend to have their own peculiar effects.



I have mentioned this to a friend who is an M.D. and he says no way.



Doctors are smart folks (usually) but even good doctors don't know everything that is discovered in research labs across the globe. It is impossible for any one person to keep up with all that is discovered.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 4:34:29 AM EDT
Snake bites are very serious injuries. As seen in the pics, it's common for tissue damage to be severe. The fact that snake bites are rarely fatal creates a false impression that these injuries are somehow not that threatening. The truth is that rehabing from even a small bite can take six months to a year and as one poster has already stated, recovery might NEVER be complete.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 5:29:58 AM EDT
An Eastern Diamondback Rattlesnake bit me back in 1985 (15 years old) on my right foot. I spent 13 days in the hospital and a total of 9 days in ICU. The damn think bit me while I was riding a 3 wheeler and got caught in my boot, so he kept pumping venom. I came within hours of losing my leg due to amputation. Quite an ordeal.

I was an outdoors guy, but it took me a year or so to even think about getting back into the woods. Even now, I am very careful about where I step while hunting. The odd thing is they told me I would have a large spot where my tissue would rot do to the digestive enzymes that is in the venom, but I barely have a scar. I was also bit on the face (lower cheek) by a Brown Recluse Spider, and it also only left a small scar and not a large damaged tissue area.

Guess I am lucky and do not rot!!!!!

I say kill all poisonous snakes on site……I sure do!!!!
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 5:48:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By John_Wayne777:

Originally Posted By metroplex:
I've had several close encounters with rattlers in NJ. They're protected in NJ so all you can do is move them.



Or kill them when no one is looking.

Worked for me!


SSS! And no I didn't mean what does a snake say.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 6:03:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/25/2005 6:04:05 AM EDT by kindstranger]
Advice from my wife who is a clinical pharmacist at a small hospital.

If you ever get bit, go directly to the closest hospital, but phone ahead. If the pharmacy doesn't have Crofab, they can have it on the way while you are in transit.

This is a big deal as alot of bites happen in rural areas where drive time is important.

In one instance my wife was involved with, a copperhead bite victim drove thirty miles to the closest hospital yet called first. She then ordered a rush of crofab from a medical center another 30 miles away. They met at the small hospital emergency room damn near at the same time. When they got inside, the doc on call JUST arrived.


Lesson: Call ahead!
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 6:13:57 AM EDT
That looks extremely painful.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 1:22:35 PM EDT

Originally Posted By vanilla_gorilla:

Originally Posted By Shoot-N-Scoot:

Originally Posted By pattymcn:
and people have the audacity to give me a hard time for shooting one? Patty



Around here they are an importent part of our Sunday morning worshiping.



I knew somebody from Tn or KY would be chiming in with that.



Just pointing out how benificial they can be.
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 1:44:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/25/2005 1:44:57 PM EDT by stormwalker]
note to self, DO NOT get bit by a rattle snake
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 2:01:30 PM EDT
*Silesius walks over to check under bed*
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 2:11:38 PM EDT
I just sent this to a friend of mine who works for a company and all he does is work with rattlesnakes. I am waiting for a reply.

Batch114
Link Posted: 8/25/2005 2:37:46 PM EDT
wow, its amazing what modern surgery can do...Im amazed that he made a (near) full recovery after all of that.
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