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Posted: 8/6/2006 2:53:39 PM EDT
I am losing my battle with the PD over the amount of rifle ammunition being issued to the patrol guys. We are issued Hornady 60gr TAP but only 60 rounds. To me that just seems like two mags just isn't enough but can't seem to get the admin to release the purse strings for more. I am thinking I will probably buy more ammo myself and have at least three more mags. Just curious as to how much, if any, ammo the rest of you are issued. What are your thoughts on issuing only 60 rounds?
Link Posted: 8/6/2006 3:25:10 PM EDT
I carry 3 20's. I have access to as much as I want, but don't feel the need for more.
Link Posted: 8/6/2006 3:28:42 PM EDT
I'm of hte opinion that if you get in a gunfight with a rifle, there's a fair to midland chance your adversary may be equally armed. I'd carry at least the basic .mil standard load - 7 magazines - 1 in the weapon, 6 in a bandolier.
Link Posted: 8/6/2006 3:40:14 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 1:39:51 AM EDT
(7) 30 round mags and a 75rnd drum.
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 2:27:28 AM EDT
Sorry, but do you mean issued and available in the cruiser or carrying on your person once you deploy?

I can't say I can see a problem with having plenty of rounds in the car but I can't really say I've been on a "lets get the rifle out" call when I, or the guy who I was showing up to help had the time to start stuffing magazines in every possible location or to start gearing up with stuff to permit me to carry a couple hundred rounds. I can't foresee any of us saying "I've got 30 rds of 5.56, 45 rds of handgun ammo, but you're gonna have to hold on till I get the other 250 rounds packed up."

We're pretty rural here and folks don't mind to shoot at us I keep a 20 rd mag. seated and a 30 rd mag in my weakside back pocket goes in my pocket if the rifle gets out. I really feel, with good reason, that in my environment the sooner you unass the car and the farther away from the scene you are when you do the better off you'll be. Nothing like getting dressed near a big ol' crown vic to attract all the wrong attention.

I'm sure there are many good arguments opposite mine, those are just my reasons.
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 2:44:00 AM EDT
330 rounds. Some are issued, most are purchased by me.



Link Posted: 8/7/2006 6:09:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By AZ-K9:
330 rounds. Some are issued, most are purchased by me.

img.photobucket.com/albums/v77/jsinz/traunkshot2.jpg

img.photobucket.com/albums/v77/jsinz/ammocan2.jpg


I want that box!! What kind is it????

Right now I transport my RRA in a Blackhawk soft case. The pouches let me hold 5 30rnd mags and my radio so its perfect for now.

Now this month I join the K-9 patrol so I'll have an assigned vehicle so the box would be even better!
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 6:21:16 AM EDT
196 rounds(seven 28 round mags)
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 6:25:48 AM EDT
You should carry enough ammo to have yourself classified as a third world country.
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 6:47:59 AM EDT
170 rounds of 55gr TAP. 5 30 rounders loaded to 28.

1 in the rifle and 4 in my level III body armor. If the rifle comes out the plates go on whenever possible.

I also keep a 20 rounder filled with SS109 in the drivers door. They are against policy but better to have and not need than to need and not have
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 9:19:01 AM EDT
We're not issued any ammo, it's all self-purchased. I carry a mag-cinched pair of 30-rounders in the rifle so I have 56 if I just grab and go; but I have a Weesatch with 6 more 30(28)-rounders in it and 2 20-rounders in the soft case.
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 9:28:37 AM EDT
I carry three thirty rounders on duty. If I need more than 90rds of 5.56, 63rds of .380, 87rds of .357 Sig and 37rds of 12g 00/slugs I am fucked.
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 10:09:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Goback:

Originally Posted By AZ-K9:
330 rounds. Some are issued, most are purchased by me.

img.photobucket.com/albums/v77/jsinz/traunkshot2.jpg

img.photobucket.com/albums/v77/jsinz/ammocan2.jpg


I want that box!! What kind is it????

Right now I transport my RRA in a Blackhawk soft case. The pouches let me hold 5 30rnd mags and my radio so its perfect for now.

Now this month I join the K-9 patrol so I'll have an assigned vehicle so the box would be even better!

I think it's the pelican 1200. Posted a thread on it a while back, can be found here.
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 10:17:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2006 6:40:43 PM EDT by txgp17]
I'm not a LEO, but it seems pretty dumb to drop nearly a grand on a rifle (excluding optics, and costs of training) and then issue less than $50 in ammo.

Is your Sheriff's name Andrew Jackson Taylor?
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 10:22:44 AM EDT
TAP isn't cheap.

What you need to do is find a way to get more out of them.

Qual with other ammo and then get the TAP to replace it

I carry 10 30 rounders. It was a pain, but after time I had enough ammo for all the mags.
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 11:28:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/7/2006 11:38:37 AM EDT by RumbleTruck]
SWAT:

2-30 rds clamped (loaded to 28) in gun, 2-30's on vest (4spare G22 mags in vest)

Patrol:

2-30's clamped, and

Eagle Industries Patrol Bandolier (PB-M4/4-M9/2-LE)

containing 4-30's and 2 G22 mags

Link Posted: 8/7/2006 12:15:38 PM EDT
My unit has no budget so to speak in regards to ammo. We have our own independent arsenal and purchase and stock our own ammo separate from the departments main supply room. We have pallets of ammo and cases of spare mags, so it is up to each individual operator. We have no need to purchase our own gear / ammo however some guys have certain specialty items not department paid for so they wish to purchase them on their own. Our division is pretty flexible as to what type of gear / loadout that we carry and most guys customize their set-up. Weapons however are pretty much defined. Colt M4's, HK33's, MP5SD, Benelli M1's, Rem700 based .308's, 7 Barrett M82A1's and SIG 226 .40's.

On my person when I deploy with the M4, I have 2 30's on my left thigh pouch and 2 30's on my load bearing. I load my M4 with a mag from the carry bag so a total of 5 30's with 28/mag. I also carry 3 more mags held within the M4 soft case for a total of 7. If I deploy with my M1 shotty, I have 14 spare rounds. If I deploy with my MP5SD I have a total of 5 mags. My Sig226 .40 I have a total of 5 mags on my person. Besides our command truck, we also have a weapons and equipment truck that deploys with us carrying quite a bit of weapons / ammo.

Hawaii has some interesting mountainous / jungle terrain so when we deploy into that type of enviornment my loadout is very different from an urban setting.
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 2:54:52 PM EDT
Get the opportunity to attend John Giduck's seminar on the Beslan incident and you will surely carry as much ammunition as you possibly can.

One of the "Rules of Engagement"...Anything worth shooting is worth shooting twice. Ammo is cheap. Life is not.
Link Posted: 8/7/2006 8:29:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FALSNARS:
Sorry, but do you mean issued and available in the cruiser or carrying on your person once you deploy? Both actually.

I can't say I can see a problem with having plenty of rounds in the car but I can't really say I've been on a "lets get the rifle out" call when I, or the guy who I was showing up to help had the time to start stuffing magazines in every possible location or to start gearing up with stuff to permit me to carry a couple hundred rounds. I can't foresee any of us saying "I've got 30 rds of 5.56, 45 rds of handgun ammo, but you're gonna have to hold on till I get the other 250 rounds packed up." Couldn't agree more. Gotta have it ready to grab and go or else you don't have it at all.

We're pretty rural here and folks don't mind to shoot at us I keep a 20 rd mag. seated and a 30 rd mag in my weakside back pocket goes in my pocket if the rifle gets out. I really feel, with good reason, that in my environment the sooner you unass the car and the farther away from the scene you are when you do the better off you'll be. Nothing like getting dressed near a big ol' crown vic to attract all the wrong attention.Amen!! I can't tell you how many older cops around this county and the small town I am in are talking on th eradio AFTER they have the car stopped or AFTER they are on scene

I'm sure there are many good arguments opposite mine, those are just my reasons.


I am actually thinking along the lines of like rumble truck posted with the shoulder bag. I could have it in the front seat or even hanging next to the AR in the rack so that when the weapon comes out so do the extra mags. Currently I have two mags coupled together 28/mag.

Thanks for the help guys and stay safe out there!!
Link Posted: 8/8/2006 2:48:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/8/2006 2:49:48 PM EDT by 556fmj]
I carry about 200 rounds of rifle ammo all ready to go in 30 round mags and a few 20 round mags.
Link Posted: 8/8/2006 4:27:47 PM EDT
I think there is a great movie quote from an OK corral movie. A subject comments on the amount of ammo a partner is loading up. The reply...."I don't want to get killed for lack of shooting back" That said 10 20 round mags split between gun(2), thigh rig(3) and plate carrier(5). 600 on strippers in a can and 1200 boxed up lining the bottom of a tupperware conatiner.

Link Posted: 8/8/2006 7:23:29 PM EDT
I carry two mags for my Berretta 92---------Not allowed anything else PERIOD
Link Posted: 8/8/2006 9:39:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AZ-K9:
I think it's the pelican 1200. Posted a thread on it a while back, can be found here.




I saw a similar case recently and it was stenciled on top: "Emergency Tool". Inside was a .50 cal revolver
Link Posted: 8/9/2006 4:07:48 AM EDT

Originally Posted By NorCal_LEO:
To me, buying extra ammo myself for SHTF is a no brainer. I carry enough to repel the Naional Guard paid for gladly by yours truly.


hey hey hey, lets not be rash here, a good scowl is probably enough to repel the national guard
Link Posted: 8/16/2006 7:01:05 PM EDT
4 30-rounders.

I'm not .mil. I don't get to fire indescriminantly. My rifle is not full-auto.

So assuming that I critically hit someone with 1 out of 3 shots, I've just tagged 40 people before I run empty.

If the time comes that I need to kill 40 people on the street before I get a resupply, I'm certain that there with be plenty of my own dead and wounded on the street that won't need their mags.

I think you guys have been watching "Heat" too much.

Link Posted: 8/16/2006 7:07:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Chuckles5492:
I think you guys have been watching "Heat" too much.



A great many agencies in this country are in very rural areas. That means back up can take a considerable amount of time to get there. Sometimes more than a half-hour when you figure folks have to be called at home and awoke at 0-dark:30 to respond.

Nope, better to be caught with, than without. That is for sure!
Link Posted: 8/16/2006 7:21:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Chuckles5492:
4 30-rounders.

I'm not .mil. I don't get to fire indescriminantly. My rifle is not full-auto.

So assuming that I critically hit someone with 1 out of 3 shots, I've just tagged 40 people before I run empty.

If the time comes that I need to kill 40 people on the street before I get a resupply, I'm certain that there with be plenty of my own dead and wounded on the street that won't need their mags.

I think you guys have been watching "Heat" too much.



I completely understand your point and to be honest that concern has crossed my mind more than a few times. However, like someone said earlier in the thread isn't it better to have the ammo and not need than to need it and not have it?
Link Posted: 8/16/2006 7:55:13 PM EDT
Must be nice to carry a rifle on patrol. I'm ready though with my 870 and 00 buckshot. We aren't allowed to carry slugs.
Link Posted: 8/16/2006 8:01:35 PM EDT
120 rnds in 30s and 50 Barrowed from Quals
Link Posted: 8/17/2006 11:45:03 AM EDT
My dept. gives us 36 rds. Enough for two 20 rd. magazines. I feel that isn't enough. So, I have an additional two 30 rd magazines that I carry on a leg pouch when that SHTF call comes out.
Link Posted: 8/17/2006 1:51:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By luckyRT:
My dept. gives us 36 rds. Enough for two 20 rd. magazines. I feel that isn't enough. So, I have an additional two 30 rd magazines that I carry on a leg pouch when that SHTF call comes out.


Yup, our range guys are the same way. They will only give out enough ammo for two 20 rd mags. It's like pulling teeth to get extra ammo from them. My other beat partners also have gotten extra mags on their own dime for when it hits the fan type call.
Link Posted: 8/17/2006 5:13:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 556fmj:

Originally Posted By luckyRT:
My dept. gives us 36 rds. Enough for two 20 rd. magazines. I feel that isn't enough. So, I have an additional two 30 rd magazines that I carry on a leg pouch when that SHTF call comes out.


Yup, our range guys are the same way. They will only give out enough ammo for two 20 rd mags. It's like pulling teeth to get extra ammo from them. My other beat partners also have gotten extra mags on their own dime for when it hits the fan type call.


Kinda seems universal to most departments that the dollar outwieghs everything else. Not that I blame them as jobs too depend on money but it's to bad that we have to skimp in important areas.
Link Posted: 8/22/2006 6:51:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/22/2006 6:53:24 AM EDT by MartinR]
I work part-time in a mostly rural county and we are allowed to carry our own rifle if we qualify with it (we must provide our own ammo). I carry (2) magazines with 20 rds total when I carry the rifle. IMHO 60 rounds sounds like plenty of ammo.

While I think it's good to have a rifle as an option, IMHO firing even one shot with any firearm is going to be rare and with a rifle even moreso. (I seem to remember that most self defense shootings in law enforcement is similar to civilians - less than 21' - pistol range). Firing even ONE shot with a rifle is probably going to be an EXTREMELY rare situation. While I think it can be a helpful tool to have, I think a rifle is not nearly as important as the handgun, shotgun, Tazer, or pepper spray in most law enforcement encounters.

More important in my opinion is to get proper training and to practice with whatever tools you have. (I was APPALLED at the poor shooting at last years rifle qualification - IMHO too many officers bought fancy guns and ninja gadgets and didn't spend much time practicing).
Link Posted: 8/22/2006 7:01:28 AM EDT
We are issued the same, two magazines only. I bought a eagle chest rig and carry an additional 6 - 30 round mags along with some other items.
Link Posted: 8/23/2006 8:10:35 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/23/2006 8:12:31 AM EDT by smicha6551]
How about something like this:

www.eagleindustries.com/ProdDisp.asp?PartNoID=867

I'd think with five rifle magazines (with one in the gun) and five magazines for your pistol (two on the bag, two on your belt, and one in the gun) you should be more than ready.
Link Posted: 8/23/2006 9:13:53 AM EDT

Originally Posted By smicha6551:
How about something like this:

www.eagleindustries.com/ProdDisp.asp?PartNoID=867

I'd think with five rifle magazines (with one in the gun) and five magazines for your pistol (two on the bag, two on your belt, and one in the gun) you should be more than ready.


that looks like a really useful/handy piece of field gear!
Link Posted: 8/25/2006 6:43:27 AM EDT
My dept only issues us 50rds of rifle ammo, 46rds of .40cal, & 4rds of '00'. I aquired more .40cal & '00' during quals. Haven't been able to get any extra rifle ammo yet so I just have regular Winchester brand ammo in my extra AR mags.

I bought the Eagle "Patrol Bandoleer" & keep 2 extra G22 mags & 4 30rd AR mags in it. It's a nice piece of gear & hangs off the back of my seat so I can grab & go as I get out. SKD Tactical has them for $35 & shipping was cheap. My dad has one for his patrol car also.
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