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Posted: 4/19/2010 2:17:07 PM EDT
http://news.yahoo.com/video/health-15749655/extreme-parenting-radical-unschooling-19218933

Yup, those kids are gonna do great when they hit the workforce....
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:20:37 PM EDT
My aunt and uncle are planning to do this with my cousin (she's 4). They're very well-meaning parents, but I'm extremely skeptical about this. I guess we'll see what happens.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:23:37 PM EDT
The dumbing down of America continues.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:26:03 PM EDT
The parents are going to regret their stupidity when they're 80 and still taking care of their worthless kids.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:26:59 PM EDT
Pure laziness on the parents' part.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:28:34 PM EDT
I guess they don't get it. Schooling is not about learning algebra. It is about learning to do stuff you don't enjoy so that once you are an adult you can do what it takes to keep a job...
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:29:45 PM EDT
Former homeschooled student here. K-12. Did extremely well in college, all my employers have loved me. I can say from experience though that roughly 60% of the homeschoolers I've seen have done a crap job with their kids. Unschooling, homeschooling, don't do it unless you're going to try and raise your kids to be successful in TODAY'S world.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:30:32 PM EDT
Remember when illiteracy and ignorance was something to be ashamed of?
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:36:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By BR870:
http://news.yahoo.com/video/health-15749655/extreme-parenting-radical-unschooling-19218933

Yup, those kids are gonna do great when they hit the workforce....


We do this, but not to the extent shown here. We unschool but direct them to school themselves in the subjects they are interested in. For example, when they start getting old enough to learn to manage their own allowlance, they become interested in money, math, budgeting, planning, etc.


Keep in mind that the goals are different. Rather than turning kids into Pavlov's dogs, the idea is to teach kids to be resposible for their own education, goals, lives and furtures. It doesn't fit well with the communist/socialist/public school movement. They will be fine when they hit the workforce, if they want to. Like the rest of us....
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:38:51 PM EDT
I couldnt make it thru the whole video.

Mom and dad should be beaten.

Fuckin assholes.

Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:38:53 PM EDT
it's going to boil down to the parents. stupid parents will raise stupid kids. i guess "social life" will be obsolete in the future. Isn't that a part of school? meeting ur life long friends? i still have friends from the 4th grade... and i'm 25 now. idk... seems ridiculous to me. almost like an easy way out for the parents. sure they'll be doing the teaching... but now they dont have to worry about lil Mary coming home asking what a penis is or wonder why lil Bobby gets picked on in Gym class.

good luck with that.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:46:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SCW:
Originally Posted By BR870:
http://news.yahoo.com/video/health-15749655/extreme-parenting-radical-unschooling-19218933

Yup, those kids are gonna do great when they hit the workforce....


We do this, but not to the extent shown here. We unschool but direct them to school themselves in the subjects they are interested in. For example, when they start getting old enough to learn to manage their own allowlance, they become interested in money, math, budgeting, planning, etc.


Keep in mind that the goals are different. Rather than turning kids into Pavlov's dogs, the idea is to teach kids to be resposible for their own education, goals, lives and furtures. It doesn't fit well with the communist/socialist/public school movement. They will be fine when they hit the workforce, if they want to. Like the rest of us....


What if they don't want to be fine when they hit the work force. Are you going to support them?
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:49:59 PM EDT
It not for me and mine, but if thats what they want let them go for it.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:50:42 PM EDT
This is, without doubt, the stupidest fucking thing I have seen in years. Parenting means GUIDING YOUR CHILDREN TO ADULTHOOD USING LOVE, RULES, EXAMPLE AND SETTING AGE-APPROPRIATE LIMITS!!!!!! Those people aren't parents. They're running a bed and breakfast for kids they just happened to create. Unbelievable. I view this as child abuse/neglect.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 2:50:42 PM EDT
The 13 year old they interviewed had the confidence and communication skills of a 1st grader, also the last time he was in school.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 3:01:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/19/2010 3:03:57 PM EDT by The_Macallan]

"No discipline." >>> Hey man, I'll hire you right now. You sound like a winner!

"We don't need rules." >>> Oh yeah, you'll do well in society.

"If I wanted to go to college, I would pick up a textbook and I would learn." >>> Too late bitch. You're already a whole lifetime behind.



What a bunch of fucking whackjobs. The two parents are CLASSIC Leftists.... dickless father and bitchy mother spawning uberly-ignorant, aimless, vacuous and hyper-narcissistic soon-to-be-moonbat kids. PERFECT Obama-voters.



Link Posted: 4/19/2010 3:06:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/19/2010 3:08:05 PM EDT by outofbattery]
There's not a hell of a lot of difference between this and the local charter school,to be blunt.


It's not a bad concept,if the parents are decent examples and productive people but these folks are just fast tracking their kids towards idiocracy.Maybe they have some fear of them ever leaving home?
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 3:39:42 PM EDT
Can't see a video or article at the link.

What's all this hogwash about?
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 3:41:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Horseman:
Can't see a video or article at the link.

What's all this hogwash about?

Parents allowing their children to have no school, no rules, and no discipline...
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 3:50:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/19/2010 3:51:33 PM EDT by glock27bill]
Originally Posted By Horseman:
Can't see a video or article at the link.

What's all this hogwash about?


And they say "There's no hierarchy in our house. No judgment. No punishment."

"If the need Algebra in their lives, they'll go find it."

Donuts for breakfast.

"Hygiene was the last parenting thing we let go of."

Reporter: "You would be, what, a Junior in high school."
Unschooled: "I really don't now."
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 3:50:14 PM EDT
Simply Unbelievable.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 3:51:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SCW:
Originally Posted By BR870:
http://news.yahoo.com/video/health-15749655/extreme-parenting-radical-unschooling-19218933

Yup, those kids are gonna do great when they hit the workforce....


We do this, but not to the extent shown here. We unschool but direct them to school themselves in the subjects they are interested in. For example, when they start getting old enough to learn to manage their own allowlance, they become interested in money, math, budgeting, planning, etc.


Keep in mind that the goals are different. Rather than turning kids into Pavlov's dogs, the idea is to teach kids to be resposible for their own education, goals, lives and furtures. It doesn't fit well with the communist/socialist/public school movement. They will be fine when they hit the workforce, if they want to. Like the rest of us....


Well that's cool cuz McDonalds is always hiring and I hear there is a ditch digger shortage as well.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 3:52:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/19/2010 3:52:32 PM EDT by TheMessiah]
Well, the world needs ditch diggers, too.

ETA: DAMMIT 20 SECONDS! AND RIGHT ABOVE ME TOO
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 3:53:35 PM EDT
Originally Posted By TheMessiah:
Well, the world needs ditch diggers, too.


Thought that's what Mexico was for.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 3:59:08 PM EDT
Ok, now I get it. Now I understand how Obama was elected.


Seriously, I can't believe how absolutely stupid these people are.


"Uh, like...if I wanted to like, know things and stuff then I'd like, uh, you know, like try to learn it"



Gee, I wonder why your kids are pretty much qualified to be Wal-Mart door greeters and that's about it.



How much dope do you think they smoke in that house? Hygiene?.....You made hygiene an option?
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 4:03:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/19/2010 4:04:09 PM EDT by Spearweasel]
Originally Posted By glock27bill:
Originally Posted By Horseman:
Can't see a video or article at the link.

What's all this hogwash about?


And they say "There's no hierarchy in our house. No judgment. No punishment."

"If the need Algebra in their lives, they'll go find it."

Donuts for breakfast.

"Hygiene was the last parenting thing we let go of."

Reporter: "You would be, what, a Junior in high school."
Unschooled: "I really don't now."


Kids don't make adult decisions.

Apparently, neither do adults nowadays.

We should have stuck to Old School. Reading, writing, math, history of the big stuff. Teach the kids how to suck it up and do things they don't want to do. Kids need structure and discipline more than any of that, and if they don't have it, they won't learn anything else.

Say, isn't that last part supposed to be the parent's job?
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 4:14:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Spearweasel:
Originally Posted By glock27bill:
Originally Posted By Horseman:
Can't see a video or article at the link.

What's all this hogwash about?


And they say "There's no hierarchy in our house. No judgment. No punishment."

"If the need Algebra in their lives, they'll go find it."

Donuts for breakfast.

"Hygiene was the last parenting thing we let go of."

Reporter: "You would be, what, a Junior in high school."
Unschooled: "I really don't now."


Kids don't make adult decisions.

Apparently, neither do adults nowadays.

We should have stuck to Old School. Reading, writing, math, history of the big stuff. Teach the kids how to suck it up and do things they don't want to do. Kids need structure and discipline more than any of that, and if they don't have it, they won't learn anything else.

Say, isn't that last part supposed to be the parent's job?
Ultimately this is what school is really about. The 3Rs are just the route through which they instill that...

Link Posted: 4/19/2010 4:23:57 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Fender57:
Originally Posted By SCW:
Originally Posted By BR870:
http://news.yahoo.com/video/health-15749655/extreme-parenting-radical-unschooling-19218933

Yup, those kids are gonna do great when they hit the workforce....


We do this, but not to the extent shown here. We unschool but direct them to school themselves in the subjects they are interested in. For example, when they start getting old enough to learn to manage their own allowlance, they become interested in money, math, budgeting, planning, etc.


Keep in mind that the goals are different. Rather than turning kids into Pavlov's dogs, the idea is to teach kids to be resposible for their own education, goals, lives and furtures. It doesn't fit well with the communist/socialist/public school movement. They will be fine when they hit the workforce, if they want to. Like the rest of us....


Well that's cool cuz McDonalds is always hiring and I hear there is a ditch digger shortage as well.


I guess I kind of unschooled myself....since I made bad grades in subjects I didnt like....But, I'm glad I had to take those subjects now, whether I aced them or not. If not, I'd be just another 40 yr. old slacker living with mom, wearing pink floyd shirts, smoking weed thinking the rest of the world was a bunch of suckers and sell outs.....keeping it real and all.




Link Posted: 4/19/2010 4:31:17 PM EDT
Sheesh, we're homeschooling precisely because we want our child to have the "three R's", along with rules and discipline.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 4:42:47 PM EDT
I was talking to some of my students who make passable grades even though they don't work at it. I told them that they are making a terrible mistake by not developing good work habits. A sharp mind, a good memory, and good speaking skills will carry you only so far. At some point you will need to work to improve your skills and do a job. If at 18 you've never worked at anything, you are really screwed.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 5:03:00 PM EDT
This is just a feel good cop-out for lazy ass parents.
And those kids won't be digging ditches or working at McDonalds, they'll be living off our tax $$.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 5:07:24 PM EDT
Come to think of it, this is the approach that most self-professed Christian parents have about teaching their children about their faith. They tell everyone else that their kids have to find their own way and then bitch when their kids never go to church and have no interest in matters spiritual.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 5:16:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By glock27bill:
Originally Posted By Horseman:
Can't see a video or article at the link.

What's all this hogwash about?


And they say "There's no hierarchy in our house. No judgment. No punishment."

"If the need Algebra in their lives, they'll go find it."

Donuts for breakfast.

"Hygiene was the last parenting thing we let go of."

Reporter: "You would be, what, a Junior in high school."
Unschooled: "I really don't now."

So here it is ok for the state to come in, declare the parents unfit, and remove the children from the lefty utopia? This sounds like the left's argument when they they will remove kids from home school and force them to go to public school because the kid is getting religious\right-wing hardcore militia stuff (you know––Christian stuff, the Constitution and BOR crap), but here some lefty wants to raise their little precious as they see fit, and we all moan about how horrible and irresponsible they are for how they want to raise their kids? That sword cuts both ways, be careful when you skin it.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 5:18:47 PM EDT
There's a whole lot of in that video.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 5:23:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By JaredGrey:
I can say from experience though that roughly 60% of the homeschoolers I've seen have done a crap job with their kids.


So... still better than government schools then?
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 5:29:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Insider:
Come to think of it, this is the approach that most self-professed Christian parents have about teaching their children about their faith. They tell everyone else that their kids have to find their own way and then bitch when their kids never go to church and have no interest in matters spiritual.


Yes, except that children really do need to learn facts and skills. They can come to or avoid myth and storytelling when they grow up and have sense to tell the difference.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 7:50:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Remember when illiteracy and ignorance was something to be ashamed of?


i'm actually old enough to remember that..........
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 8:03:01 PM EDT
I really wish more parents would do this, gives my child(ren) a competitive edge.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 8:06:27 PM EDT
Hippy Homeschooling.

"Unschooling" was started by the Flower Children of the '70s, who didn't want their kids learning the lessons of an oppressive patriarchal society. That, and they were too lazy to bother.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 8:07:15 PM EDT
I am now convinced that one day I will see a resume from someone who claims they got their engineering degree from World of Warcraft.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 8:08:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Remember when illiteracy and ignorance was something to be ashamed of?


WTF happend to those days?
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 8:26:48 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Remember when illiteracy and ignorance was something to be ashamed of?


Yep. Holy shit.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 8:34:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Vaux:
This is, without doubt, the stupidest fucking thing I have seen in years. Parenting means GUIDING YOUR CHILDREN TO ADULTHOOD USING LOVE, RULES, EXAMPLE AND SETTING AGE-APPROPRIATE LIMITS!!!!!! Those people aren't parents. They're running a bed and breakfast for kids they just happened to create. Unbelievable. I view this as child abuse/neglect.

This.

Kids who aren't taught such things as how to follow rules, how to work in an environment where they are NOT the center of attention, and who are allowed to grow up in a 'do what you want to do' environment WILL fail as adults.

First off, they have NO chance of getting through college.

Second, they have NO chance of suceeding in the workforce - no boss is going to let an employee just 'work on the things they feel interested in'...

There's nothing wrong with homeschooling done right...

But 'unschooling' kids is a recipe for disaster. There's more to school than just learning math & how to read.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 8:38:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By STX:

Originally Posted By glock27bill:
Originally Posted By Horseman:
Can't see a video or article at the link.

What's all this hogwash about?


And they say "There's no hierarchy in our house. No judgment. No punishment."

"If the need Algebra in their lives, they'll go find it."

Donuts for breakfast.

"Hygiene was the last parenting thing we let go of."

Reporter: "You would be, what, a Junior in high school."
Unschooled: "I really don't now."

So here it is ok for the state to come in, declare the parents unfit, and remove the children from the lefty utopia?

Most definately. These parents are doing perminant harm to these kids - no different than if they were beating the shit out of them every hour on the hour...


This sounds like the left's argument when they they will remove kids from home school and force them to go to public school because the kid is getting religious\right-wing hardcore militia stuff (you know––Christian stuff, the Constitution and BOR crap), but here some lefty wants to raise their little precious as they see fit, and we all moan about how horrible and irresponsible they are for how they want to raise their kids? That sword cuts both ways, be careful when you skin it.

Neither extreme can be permitted (oddly enough, almost every case of 'extremes' leads to left-wing parents as the kooks, btw).

Home school is fine, with responsible parents... However, when what the parents start doing irreparable harm to the kids. Then it's abuse. Period.

Same goes for 'I won't let my kid who has cancer get chemo, we'll use homeopathic bullshit & sweat lodges' - pull the kids, ASAP.



Link Posted: 4/19/2010 8:41:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/19/2010 8:42:54 PM EDT by Tony-Ri]
With good kids who want to learn, unschooling can work. Of course it can also be an utter failure. All the unschooled students I've known worked better than most of y'all believe.

Link Posted: 4/19/2010 8:45:46 PM EDT
It's like Montessori homeschool. From Hell.

At best those kids will get an extremely lopsided education. It seems more likely to me that they won't have much of an education at all if they can watch TV or play video games all day.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 8:49:01 PM EDT
Cool, at least we know who will be at the bottom of the food chain. Productive citizen? NOT. Future Socalists? YEP.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 8:50:35 PM EDT
And people tell me Rousseau is an OK dude...
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 9:38:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By kongman74:
It's like Montessori homeschool. From Hell.

At best those kids will get an extremely lopsided education. It seems more likely to me that they won't have much of an education at all if they can watch TV or play video games all day.


That's what I didn't get. If you want your offspring to become self-reliant young adults, unschooling is a great thing. However, if you feed them donuts and pay for their World of Warcraft subscription you're just creating larger children. Part of the freedom in unschooling is the freedom to try great and foolish things and fail miserably, but it seems that they're not really encouraging their kids to try much at anything at all. But they're their kids, and they can fuck them up any way they want. It's not my place to butt in.

For those who think young people can't handle responsibility, or need formal schooling: Benjamin Franklin (admittedly a minor figure in American history) could not remember a time at which he couldn't read, despite never having had formal schooling. David Farragut (another minor figure in the War of 1812 and the Civil War) was a midshipman in the US Navy at 9 years old, and had his first command of a ship at the tender age of...12. We expect too little out of our young people today.

I'm a huge fan of unschooling, since the whole idea of formal school was created by Bismarck to produce obedient soldiers in a fascist country.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 11:03:09 PM EDT

Originally Posted By wutzu:
Originally Posted By kongman74:
It's like Montessori homeschool. From Hell.

At best those kids will get an extremely lopsided education. It seems more likely to me that they won't have much of an education at all if they can watch TV or play video games all day.


That's what I didn't get. If you want your offspring to become self-reliant young adults, unschooling is a great thing. However, if you feed them donuts and pay for their World of Warcraft subscription you're just creating larger children. Part of the freedom in unschooling is the freedom to try great and foolish things and fail miserably, but it seems that they're not really encouraging their kids to try much at anything at all. But they're their kids, and they can fuck them up any way they want. It's not my place to butt in.

For those who think young people can't handle responsibility, or need formal schooling: Benjamin Franklin (admittedly a minor figure in American history) could not remember a time at which he couldn't read, despite never having had formal schooling. David Farragut (another minor figure in the War of 1812 and the Civil War) was a midshipman in the US Navy at 9 years old, and had his first command of a ship at the tender age of...12. We expect too little out of our young people today.

I'm a huge fan of unschooling, since the whole idea of formal school was created by Bismarck to produce obedient soldiers in a fascist country.

You distort history heavily.

Both of the men you mention went through formal training programs, where they would have learned the same skills/values taught in school today...

Being a Midshipman in an Empire-Period Navy, for example... That's a military officer commissioning program by way of apprenticeship. No room for 'unschooled' free-spirits there - they would get flogged (literally)... Very regimented - follow orders, learn to work as a team (and to lead), do things when the Captain says, how the Captain says... And so on...

And as for Franklin, the environment he grew up in also involved formal training - again, by way of an apprenticeship system... I doubt his boss would have put up with much of the 'free spirit' crap, either...

As for your Bismark/Fascist comment - Fascisim didn't exist back then, and Prussia was just another European nation - ruled the same way they all were back then...

There is a difference between 'self-reliance' and anti-social selfishness.

So-called 'unschooling' teaches selfishness, not self-reliance.
Link Posted: 4/19/2010 11:21:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By The_Macallan: "If I wanted to go to college, I would pick up a textbook and I would learn."


It is an acceptable way to learn, been done to me a few times. "Here's the book; be ready to program in a week."

Of course, there are at least two major catches..........and one of them she'll never see because she's skipped the huge step. The reason why people do that to me is because they know from my transcripts that they can. I have the infrastructure to be able to learn like that. They know I have the background to be able to pick up the text book and absorb. If I didn't have the degrees I do, they would require me to take the basic courses first.

But even with such knowledge, one is bound to make mistakes. The programming issue? I had a degree in telecommunications from an engineering college; I was not a computer science graduate. In the course of that project, I was trying to build memory structures and couldn't understand why they wouldn't work.....and really, didn't know where to look to find out. Three years later, I found out what I was trying to do was use arrays, a basic structure in CS, but I didn't know it then.

Even when you know a lot, you can still trip..................and if you don't know very much at all, we-ll................................................................
_______________________________________________________________________
("I want you to study this disk, be up on it for tomorrow morning's briefing."––Madeline to Nikita, (w,stte), La Femme Nikita "Gambit")
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