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Posted: 5/7/2003 12:04:24 PM EDT
Just seen on FNC. The NAACP is suing over 40 gun companies for the high crime rate/deaths of blacks/minoritys in poor/ghetto areas. The jurry will be in tomorrow. Does anyone have a link. The numbers reported by FNC is that a young black male in 16 times more likely to kill someone with a weapon than a young white male. Young=16-24. What a way to lay blame, sue the gun companies, ha. Im sure the punks in the ghetto get a factory discount. Does anyone have a link to this bs, with statistics? Jason
Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:07:18 PM EDT
Do a search on FoxNews.com, looks like the case has been in the works since 1999.
Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:09:32 PM EDT
I saw it as well.  It sounds like [i]'they'[/i] are suggesting the solution would be to NOT sell guns to minorities.  I'm no lawyer but I'm pretty sure [i]that[/i] would be discrimination.  Hopefully this falls flat on it's face.

Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:17:05 PM EDT
I would like to know the percentage of weapons used in these crimes were legally purchased and licensed. Probably not very high.
Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:19:59 PM EDT
...so the NAACP says blacks are not responsible enough to own firearms? IS that correct?!

WOW, cuz if that is they are saying- Ive been saying that for years!
[btw that was a joke for the idiots who dont have a sence of humor]
Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:24:15 PM EDT
NO they are saying blacks are 16x more prone to commit homocide.
Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:25:42 PM EDT
Just anoter angle/cut in the thousands of cuts the anti's are trying to use to kill off the gun industry. I go back and forth on the race issue, but the NAACP is flat out as racist as the KKK. The only people that buy into that shit are too ignorant to think for themselves.

Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:28:05 PM EDT
I don't know about you guys, but I'm going to stop calling my guns 'black rifles.'  

That way they won't be 16x more likely to encourage me to kill anyone...
Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:28:46 PM EDT
Why not knife companies?

Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:33:21 PM EDT
Me and CavVet mixed it up over this. I hope they win the suit. Seems to me the statistics demonstrate they are irresponsible gun owners. [:D]
Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:33:34 PM EDT
I believe in Ft Wayne Indiana 10+yrs ago the NAACP was broke up for mishandling $$$. The city was even run by Dems. No one wants them around or Jesse Jackson.
Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:40:49 PM EDT
Very typical, Blame someone else for your problems.....This is as bad as the "ebonics" discussion that hit the fan a few years ago.

By saying this kind of thing, the NAACP, is actually hurting the "everyone is equal" thing. It comes across as "we can't handle it" so take it away or change teh laws for us.....And that Ain't equal!

It's just foolish!
Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:44:59 PM EDT
...so the NAACP says blacks are not responsible enough to own firearms? IS that correct?!

View Quote

All joking aside, that is exactly what the NAACP is saying...I don't know what else to say....
Link Posted: 5/7/2003 12:45:41 PM EDT
Here's some links


View Quote


NAACP lawsuit targets gun makers
Crime data available to manufacturers demonstrate that industry could keep track of shady dealers and cut them off, lawyers for Baltimore-based civil rights group argue
By Vanessa O'Connell and Paul M. Barrett
The Wall Street Journal
Originally published March 13, 2003

NEW YORK -- Lawsuits that seek to hold gun makers responsible for firearm violence haven't had much success in court so far. Gun-control advocates say that is about to change.

In a novel suit headed for trial on March 24 in federal court in New York's Brooklyn borough, the Baltimore-based National Association for the Advancement of Colored People is arguing that handgun violence disproportionately harms poor, urban blacks, and that gun companies have failed to take steps to lessen the harm.


People like Frances Davis hope the NAACP wins its suit. During the past 16 years, each of her three sons died after being shot in separate street confrontations in the predominantly black Bedford-Stuyvesant section of Brooklyn. Residents "constantly live in fear, and that fear is destroying the neighborhood, communities, families," said Davis, 52 years old. "Guns destroyed my life."

The NAACP alleges that gun makers and wholesalers could take more aggressive steps to determine which gun dealers repeatedly sell weapons that end up in criminal hands -- and then crack down on those retailers. To date, that argument hasn't worked so well in a series of suits that cities and counties nationwide have brought against the industry.

Earlier this month, a California state-court judge in San Diego dismissed a group of gun-maker defendants from a suit filed by municipalities in that state.

But in the NAACP's suit, gun-control lawyers have some powerful new legal ammunition and a sympathetic trial judge as they go after gun wholesalers and manufacturers. The suit names more than 80 defendants including Smith & Wesson Holding Corp., Sturm, Ruger & Co. and Glock GmbH.

Their ammunition comes from a subpoena that a New York plaintiffs' attorney, Elisa Barnes, successfully used last fall to force the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms to turn over a trove of statistics on the movement of guns used in crime -- a far bigger cache of the data than has previously been obtained by gun-control lawyers.

The ATF has collected the information for decades but resisted sharing it, saying that might interfere with criminal investigations and encroach on the privacy of some people, such as those who had legally bought guns later picked up at a crime scene. Much of the data come from gun companies themselves.

The government gives gun makers the serial numbers of any of their guns used in a crime. Makers, in turn, tell the government which wholesalers handled the weapons, and those wholesalers can identify the dealers involved.

Expert analysis of this and other data, Barnes predicted, will demonstrate that the industry itself has the ability to keep track of shady dealers and to cut them off.

In addition, an industry insider may emerge as the star witness. Robert Ricker, a 52-year-old former National Rifle Association attorney who still quietly consults with some industry interests, says he plans to testify in the case that his former colleagues consciously decided against taking certain steps to help keep guns away from rogue dealers.

He and others tried to raise these concerns and push change from the inside but were effectively silenced, he said.

Presiding over the NAACP case is Jack Weinstein, an 81-year-old semi-retired federal trial judge famous for his sympathy for creative liability theories and using the courts to resolve tough social problems. He supervised what seemed to be an important gun-control court victory in 1999 that was later reversed by the Second U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in New York.

Barnes represented relatives of gun-crime victims in that suit. In the current case, he used his judicial authority to back Barnes's demands for ATF crime-gun records.

In an unconventional move, Judge Weinstein is putting an "advisory jury" in the box for this bench trial -- meaning he will consider the jurors' views but reserve to himself the role of ultimately determining liability and a remedy.

Gun-industry lawyers say the NAACP suit is one more illogical attempt to place enforcement of criminal gun laws on gun makers. But privately, defense lawyers say they may well lose at trial and their main focus is preparing the ground for another appeal to the Second Circuit, where they expect to be vindicated.

"We hope for the best but expect the worst," said Lawrence G. Keane, general counsel of the National Shooting Sports Foundation, a trade group.

The suit has attracted attention not only among those who debate gun policy but also in civil-rights circles.

"The NAACP has a long history of challenging the courts to think through policies that stand the courts on their head," said William Spriggs, executive director of the Institute for Equality at the National Urban League, an African-American advocacy organization. "Most of its major advances took place because it was able to use the courts to advance public policy and think about issues in a far broader way."

Industry defenders answer that gun-control advocates should take their concerns to mayors, city councils and even Congress. Gun-liability suits are a backdoor alternative to achieving limits on guns that politicians haven't been willing to legislate, the industry's Keane said.

Within the industry, Ricker, the former NRA attorney, made no secret of his view that the NRA and its allies have unnecessarily resisted identifying dubious gun dealers. In a Jan. 31 affidavit obtained by the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence, he said gun makers have known for years that some wholesalers and dealers divert weapons to lawbreakers.

Ricker said gun makers themselves could use the ATF's crime-gun data to identify the problem dealers, but have chosen not to.

"It's a very simple system," he said. "Gun makers get a report from the government when their guns are used in crimes. They can inquire down the line to find out which wholesaler or dealer was involved. It's easy for them to have the information, but they have to use it."

Industry lawyers say they will try to undercut Ricker's credibility by pointing out stark changes in his public statements on the topic. Keane, the gun-trade-group lawyer, said Ricker's "contention that this industry knowingly sells guns to criminals is: a.) insulting, b.) offensive and c.) patently false." The industry routinely cooperates with police and goes beyond that to train dealers to recognize suspect buyers, he added.

The judge in the California case had Ricker's affidavit before him but still dismissed the manufacturer defendants, allowing the suit to proceed against only a handful of wholesalers and dealers.
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Link Posted: 5/7/2003 7:20:01 PM EDT
That is the most racist thing I've heard in a long time...Damn commies...
Link Posted: 5/7/2003 7:59:01 PM EDT
...so the NAACP says blacks are not responsible enough to own firearms? IS that correct?!

View Quote

All joking aside, that is exactly what the NAACP is saying...I don't know what else to say....
View Quote

Hmmm...  'The more things change the more they stay the same.'  'Those who forget history are bound to repeat it.'

The original purpose of 'gun control laws' was to assist in 'controling' 'negroes'.  

Are they saying that we should have no other gun 'control' law other than that xxx (blacks, pick your PC term) should be outlawed from owning guns?  Would that law not acheive the same purpose?

Disclaimer:  Read carefully.  These questions are facetious and not meant to be rascist in any way.
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