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Posted: 2/19/2016 11:56:44 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2016 11:57:21 AM EST by longhorn77]
Was listening to the radio on my way into work, and they aired a quote from Bernie where he was basically stating why he thinks Congress needs to change. What I found interesting was he didn't mention that congress was run by the GOP, or that it was too conservative; rather, he stated it was too influenced by Wall Street and other, outside big money lobbyists. Basically, he was indicting both parties, and how capitalism has influenced our politics.

On the right, in the last several months and years, I've enjoyed the recent groundswell in support for true conservatism and constitutionalism over the standard GPO platform.

Are we also witnessing a fundamental shit on the left? With the rise in popularity of socialism, it would seem the left may also be entering a renaissance of ideas.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 11:58:12 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2016 11:59:01 AM EST by JmPnTX]
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 11:59:05 AM EST
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Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:00:31 PM EST
It's not Bernie, it's Bunny. Bunny Sanduhs.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:02:27 PM EST
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Originally Posted By mizzarley:
It's not Bernie, it's Bunny. Bunny Sanduhs.
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It's not Bernie. It's Adolf. Adolf Hitler.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:03:54 PM EST
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Originally Posted By efpeter:



It's not Bernie. It's Adolf. Adolf Hitler.
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Originally Posted By efpeter:
Originally Posted By mizzarley:
It's not Bernie, it's Bunny. Bunny Sanduhs.



It's not Bernie. It's Adolf. Adolf Hitler.
Vlad Lenin.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:05:52 PM EST
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To be clear, I am specially referring to the fact people in this country are openly considering socialism as a reasonable form of government, outside of an academic setting. Just look at the number of supporters the Bernie campaign has.

10-20 years ago, it would have been the death of a political campaign to be labeled a socialist. Bernie wears the label with pride, and he's garnered wide support amongst the millennials and many from demographics you wouldn't have expected.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:06:11 PM EST
He's kinda right. We don't have a Wall Street problem though, we have a corrupt politician problem. We need trials and long prison sentences for these policy makers.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:07:09 PM EST
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Originally Posted By efpeter:
It's not Bernie. It's Adolf. Adolf Hitler.
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That's a slur. Hitler had a coherent plan and a vision. He also had real jobs and was a combat vet.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:11:02 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2016 12:19:31 PM EST by longhorn77]
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Originally Posted By hotbiggun42:
He's kinda right. We don't have a Wall Street problem though, we have a corrupt politician problem. We need trials and long prison sentences for these policy makers.
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I disagree though. If you support free market principles, people should be able to spend their own money to influence whomever they are able to. The check for this sort of behavior should be our elections. If we, the people, don't like our Reps and Senators kowtowing to the Chamber of Commerce, we should vote them out. I would posit most politicians enjoy their position, and would rather keep them, than not.

So why is our system not working? Because we only have two parties to choose from, and we base our votes on hope, rather than on concrete and specific examples and promises. Then, when things don't go our way, we hope it will the next time, and we continue to keep the same people in power.

ETA - I misread your post originally. I agree we have a lot of corruption in the sense we send middle class folks to DC, and they retire as multimillionaires for doing nothing more than "representing" us in Congress. Ex. Reid, Harry.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:13:31 PM EST
Nope same old leftist 1960's hippie bullshit they've been peddling for over 40 years now, it's just that they have a young naive audience that hasn't seen the failures of socialist policies or fully grasped the consequences of surrendering their liberties to a bunch of dangerous beaurocrats.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:24:21 PM EST
These young communists make me miss the USSR.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:26:08 PM EST
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Originally Posted By pavlovwolf:
These young communists make me miss the USSR.
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Don't fret, it'll come again.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:27:34 PM EST
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Originally Posted By efpeter:



It's not Bernie. It's Adolf. Adolf Hitler.
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Originally Posted By efpeter:
Originally Posted By mizzarley:
It's not Bernie, it's Bunny. Bunny Sanduhs.



It's not Bernie. It's Adolf. Adolf Hitler.


No it's not it's Leon Trotsky
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:29:26 PM EST
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Originally Posted By hotbiggun42:
He's kinda right. We don't have a Wall Street problem though, we have a corrupt politician problem. We need trials and long prison sentences for these policy makers.
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FNI
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:40:09 PM EST
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Originally Posted By longhorn77:


I disagree though. If you support free market principles, people should be able to spend their own money to influence whomever they are able to. The check for this sort of behavior should be our elections. If we, the people, don't like our Reps and Senators kowtowing to the Chamber of Commerce, we should vote them out. I would posit most politicians enjoy their position, and would rather keep them, than not.

So why is our system not working? Because we only have two parties to choose from, and we base our votes on hope, rather than on concrete and specific examples and promises. Then, when things don't go our way, we hope it will the next time, and we continue to keep the same people in power.

ETA - I misread your post originally. I agree we have a lot of corruption in the sense we send middle class folks to DC, and they retire as multimillionaires for doing nothing more than "representing" us in Congress. Ex. Reid, Harry.
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Originally Posted By longhorn77:
Originally Posted By hotbiggun42:
He's kinda right. We don't have a Wall Street problem though, we have a corrupt politician problem. We need trials and long prison sentences for these policy makers.


I disagree though. If you support free market principles, people should be able to spend their own money to influence whomever they are able to. The check for this sort of behavior should be our elections. If we, the people, don't like our Reps and Senators kowtowing to the Chamber of Commerce, we should vote them out. I would posit most politicians enjoy their position, and would rather keep them, than not.

So why is our system not working? Because we only have two parties to choose from, and we base our votes on hope, rather than on concrete and specific examples and promises. Then, when things don't go our way, we hope it will the next time, and we continue to keep the same people in power.

ETA - I misread your post originally. I agree we have a lot of corruption in the sense we send middle class folks to DC, and they retire as multimillionaires for doing nothing more than "representing" us in Congress. Ex. Reid, Harry.


The entire power structure is inverted. Power is concentrated in a strong (and ever increasing) Federal government. This is the opposite of what it should be. The Federal government should be very limited in what it can do. This was the Framers' intent (at least some of them). As government gets closer to the people, it can get more powerful because the local people have more direct control over it. If you want something done in your state or city, the people you should have to convince should be your neighbors and friends -- people who will live under the same rules as you. Not a bunch of idiots in Washington DC who know nothing about you or what you're trying to do, and will exempt themselves and their political allies from whatever they don't like.

If Federal offices couldn't do very much then rich powerful people would seek them less. It would at least shift the problem to the States, but we have good odds in many of them. And we as citizens could "vote with our feet" and move to a state we like better. The problem with the Federal government getting it wrong is that when they do, there's nowhere else to go...
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 12:45:19 PM EST
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Originally Posted By hotbiggun42:
He's kinda right. We don't have a Wall Street problem though, we have a corrupt politician problem. We need trials and long prison sentences for these policy makers.
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Bingo. His issue in that regard is that he never says he will go after politicians. In fact, he wants to expand gov control.

How dumb can he be, beat rampant corruption with more funds for corruption. Serious tard.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 2:22:54 PM EST
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Originally Posted By czechsix:
Don't fret, it'll come again.
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Originally Posted By czechsix:
Originally Posted By pavlovwolf:
These young communists make me miss the USSR.
Don't fret, it'll come again.



Might be us next time.

The reason I miss it is we had a very visible enemy that was so large and hard such a large military that there was no way to not perceive it as a threat. On any given day, a random situation could result in their bombers overhead and their missiles being launched.

It was dangerous, but it held us together to a greater degree since we had a common enemy. There were outliers of course, but the vast majority of Americans were anti USSR.

We don't have that now, so more of these kids are off the reservation.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 2:36:27 PM EST
No OP, the socialist message has always been the same: strong central government control of production under the guise of "for the people". The only ones to make out are those in power, their hanger-ons and the families of.

Socialism is bereft of anything that could be considered "new thought". As a matter of fact, it stamps it out.

Dont fall for their bullshit or be lulled into thinking it can evolve.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 2:42:30 PM EST
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Originally Posted By 9divdoc:


No it's not it's Leon Trotsky
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Originally Posted By 9divdoc:
Originally Posted By efpeter:
Originally Posted By mizzarley:
It's not Bernie, it's Bunny. Bunny Sanduhs.



It's not Bernie. It's Adolf. Adolf Hitler.


No it's not it's Leon Trotsky


Nope, It's Friedrich Engels.
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 2:43:08 PM EST
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Originally Posted By 9divdoc:


No it's not it's Leon Trotsky
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Originally Posted By 9divdoc:
Originally Posted By efpeter:
Originally Posted By mizzarley:
It's not Bernie, it's Bunny. Bunny Sanduhs.



It's not Bernie. It's Adolf. Adolf Hitler.


No it's not it's Leon Trotsky

More like Mao zedung
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 2:45:27 PM EST
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Originally Posted By RogerBall:


Nope, It's Friedrich Engels.
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Originally Posted By RogerBall:
Originally Posted By 9divdoc:
Originally Posted By efpeter:
Originally Posted By mizzarley:
It's not Bernie, it's Bunny. Bunny Sanduhs.



It's not Bernie. It's Adolf. Adolf Hitler.


No it's not it's Leon Trotsky


Nope, It's Friedrich Engels.



No, it's just "Asshole".
Link Posted: 2/19/2016 2:48:13 PM EST
It's not a Renaissance.

It's the Dark Ages.

Link Posted: 2/19/2016 2:51:21 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2016 2:52:02 PM EST by Derek45]
communism is not new

American acceptance of it is

for a big part of my life, they were the fucking ENEMY

...for some of us, they still are

Link Posted: 2/19/2016 3:26:56 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2016 3:28:01 PM EST by longhorn77]
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Originally Posted By spacemanvic:
No OP, the socialist message has always been the same: strong central government control of production under the guise of "for the people". The only ones to make out are those in power, their hanger-ons and the families of.

Socialism is bereft of anything that could be considered "new thought". As a matter of fact, it stamps it out.

Dont fall for their bullshit or be lulled into thinking it can evolve.
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I'm on the same page as you in that socialism is bullshit.

I wasn't saying socialism was *new*, but rather, the acceptance of an open socialist as a major Dem candidate is. Yes, I would say the fact we have a major political candidate running on a platform based on open socialism a political renaissance - at least for the left. Again, not more than 10-20 years ago, running so openly would have been a political death sentence. At the least, there would have been zero chance of a self-described socialist being the leading D candidate.

I just find it interesting that as we, on the right, are undergoing our own shift, those on the left appear to be as well. We are rebelling against the GOPe and big government on the right while at the same time, we are seeing something similar occur on the left.
Link Posted: 2/21/2016 11:44:01 PM EST
Both parties have been shifting left for a long time.

Compare JFK's platfrom to Bush's



Today's GOP are 1970's democrats

Today's democrats are prue fucking commies

What a fucking pity

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