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10/20/2017 1:01:18 AM
9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/31/2005 11:04:02 PM EDT
By Claus Christian Malzahn

Hurricane Katrina has cost the lives of hundreds and devastated the US Gulf Coast. But instead of aid donations and sympathy, the Americans have heard little more than a haughty "I told you so" from Germany. It's another low point for trans-Atlantic relations -- and set off by a German minister. How pathetic.

For the record: German Chancellor Gerhard Schröder offered his condolences to US President George W. Bush for the Hurricane Katrina disaster that has hit the Gulf Coast. Both he and his fellow Germans, Schröder wrote, feel "great sympathy for the fate of those people affected by the hurricane."

Nice words to be sure, but that was it. No pledges of aid money, no announcements of immediate help -- although finally, two days later, the German interior minister did manage to come out with a hesitant offer of assistance. And let's be honest, the crisis region this time around isn't in the Third World, but is in the United States of America. There really isn't much of a need for German helpers -- experienced as they may be from aid missions from Kosovo to Afghanistan -- because the American authorities are already doing as much as can be done.

Nevertheless, German aid money delivered to American aid agencies would surely be welcome on the other side of the Atlantic. But apparently, people over here believe that the Americans over there don't really need help. Strange. The same people who normally spend their time pointing their holier-than-thou fingers at the ghettos and slums in the US, the same ones who describe America as an out-of-control capitalist monster, are now, when the Americans could really use a bit of help, oddly quiet.

Cold and malicious

Apparently the Americans had it coming: "The American president has closed his eyes to the economic and human damage that natural catastrophes such as Katrina -- in other words, disasters caused by a lack of climate protection measures -- can visit on his country." Who wrote this? None other than Jürgen Trittin, Germany's minister of the environment.

At a moment when the dead on the Gulf Coast are still being counted, the German minister of the environment could think of nothing better to do than -- in an essay published Tuesday in the center-left daily Frankfurter Rundschau -- to blame the US itself for the catastrophe. The piece is 493 words long, and not a single one of them is wasted to express any sort of sympathy for the victims of the storm. The worst of it is that Trittin isn't alone with his cold, malicious tenor. The coverage from much of the German media tends in the same direction: If Bush had only listened to Uncle Trittin and signed the Kyoto Protocol, then this never would have happened.

Bullshit. Trittin's article is a slap in the face to all the victims. Let's just assume that the environment minister is right, that there is a direct relationship between greenhouse gases and Hurricane Katrina. Even still this would hardly be the time for yet another round of America bashing and finger pointing. Three years ago, just before the US election, former Minister of Justice Hertha Däubler Gmelin compared US President George W. Bush to Adolf Hitler. This time, with German elections looming, the environment minister is using a natural catastrophe as an excuse to once again campaign with subtle anti-Americanism and to unabashedly pat himself on the back. A "Kyoto Two" is "desperately needed" screamed the headline over his insensitive attack.

There are scientists and Nobel Prize winners who see the problem of global warming totally different than Trittin. Many consider the fight against AIDS, hunger and malaria as higher priorities than a reduction of carbon dioxide output. Last year, some of these experts jointly published the "Copenhagen Consensus," in which they outlined the greatest problems facing the world. Global warming figured low on the list. And believe it or not, the scientists are not on the payroll of the Texas oil industry. But that's hardly the point at the moment. Right now, the situation calls for empathy with the people in the American south who are suffering the after effects of the massive storm.

It's not the American people's fault that the storm hit and they couldn't have stopped it. The Germans, on the other hand, could have done a lot to prevent World War II. And yet, care packages still rained down from US troops. Trittin's know-it-all stance is therefore not only tasteless, it is also historically blind.

Source

Fucking Krauts.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:05:35 PM EDT
You're just a damn Kraut Hating 88.

Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:09:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
You're just a damn Kraut Hating 88.




That has to be an oxymoron.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:17:09 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mattja:

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
You're just a damn Kraut Hating 88.




That has to be an oxymoron.



I was just pointing out one of your "Fucking Krauts" wrote that article.

Claus Christian Malzahn is a writer for Spiegel. And just as Bill Clinton was NOT representative of the views of all Americans, Schröder doesn't represent the views of all Germans.

Personally I think it is chickenshit. We are there for them and they "used" to be there for us. But the last time they were really on board was when they sent troops to Afghanistan to assist us after 9-11.

I can understand why they may not have helped us in Iraq, despite it being in their best interests, but I can't fathom a reason why they wouldn't offer now. We would surely help them.

But we sadly have LOTS of allies who don't actually contribute much. Israel didn't send troops to Afghanistan after 9-11 and I don't know if they will offer any kind of assistance to New Orleans.

But I doubt we will see a "Fucking Israel" post if they don't offer anything.

And if they do, then they will be a better ally than Germany has been lately.

I'm not holding my breath for anything from either.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:25:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
I was just pointing out one of your "Fucking Krauts" wrote that article.



I realize that.



And just as Bill Clinton was NOT representative of the views of all Americans, Schröder doesn't represent the views of all Germans.



Why not? Was he not elected? They seem to think Bush and Rummy are representative of the American people. Why should Schröder and his cronies get a pass?



Personally I think it is chickenshit. We are there for them and they "used" to be there for us. But the last time they were really on board was when they sent troops to Afghanistan to assist us after 9-11.

I can understand why they may not have helped us in Iraq, despite it being in their best interests, but I can't fathom a reason why they wouldn't offer now. We would surely help them.



As the article stated, German politicians have gotten a lot of mileage out of bashing America, especially Bush. That is exactly what they are doing now.



But we sadly have LOTS of allies who don't actually contribute much. Israel didn't send troops to Afghanistan after 9-11 and I don't know if they will offer any kind of assistance to New Orleans.

But I doubt we will see a "Fucking Israel" post if they don't offer anything.



Let me be more clear: My problem is not with the aid, it's with the attitude. Everything with them is "blame Bush first."

If the same kind of sentiment came out of Israel, I would say fuck them too.



And if they do, then they will be a better ally than Germany has been lately.

I'm not holding my breath for anything from either.



Nor am I. But in this case, Germany spat in our eye.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:30:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mattja:


Why not? Was he not elected? They seem to think Bush and Rummy are representative of the American people. Why should Schröder and his cronies get a pass?



I guess what I'm saying is feel free to blame the government but realize the government doesn't always represent the views of the people just as Bill Clinton was hardly representative of the views of every member of this forum and millions of other Americans.


Originally Posted By mattja:

As the article stated, German politicians have gotten a lot of mileage out of bashing America, especially Bush. That is exactly what they are doing now.



Yeah, they seem to be trying hard to be the new France.


Originally Posted By mattja:

Let me be more clear: My problem is not with the aid, it's with the attitude. Everything with them is "blame Bush first."



And it ain't just Germany, sadly.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:36:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/31/2005 11:36:55 PM EDT by mk1iii]

Originally Posted By mattja:
By Claus Christian Malzahn


Nice words to be sure, but that was it. No pledges of aid money, no announcements of immediate help -- although finally, two days later, the German interior minister did manage to come out with a hesitant offer of assistance. And let's be honest, the crisis region this time around isn't in the Third World, but is in the United States of America. There really isn't much of a need for German helpers -- experienced as they may be from aid missions from Kosovo to Afghanistan -- because the American authorities are already doing as much as can be done.




I think he's right. We took a beating and we'll bounce back from it. I don't think we need anybody's help. We help others thats what we do. If somebody offers than fine, but don't ask for it.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:39:43 PM EDT


<Klaus> I'm German. It's vaht ve do. </Klaus>
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:51:32 PM EDT
Pledges for aid should not be expected. You sound like some of the welfare recipient Super dome refugees.
Link Posted: 8/31/2005 11:53:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By cheeks:
Pledges for aid should not be expected. You sound like some of the welfare recipient Super dome refugees.



You must have missed the part where I said I am not interested in their aid.

My gripe is with their "blame Bush first" attitude.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 12:00:19 AM EDT
We can, and SHOULD, take care of our own. Any German money sent for disaster relief SHOULD be sent back immediately since we can take care of ourselves. We can, right? I think we can.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 4:09:07 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:

But I doubt we will see a "Fucking Israel" post if they don't offer anything.




FWIW, I heard on Hannity last night on the way home that Israel was the first country to offer aid. Actually, he said the only country.

Link Posted: 9/1/2005 4:26:46 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Peak_Oil:
We can, and SHOULD, take care of our own. Any German money sent for disaster relief SHOULD be sent back immediately since we can take care of ourselves. We can, right? I think we can.



That is ciompletely wrong.

Any money offered should be taken with humility and put to good use. Never refuse aid freely given, even if you are simply going to end up offering back in kind at a later date. But apparently only Israel knows the meaning of gratitude.

Link Posted: 9/1/2005 4:36:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By cheeks:
Pledges for aid should not be expected. You sound like some of the welfare recipient Super dome refugees.



Don't get hung up on money. It's the thought that is important. We haven't received (at least publically) many expressions of condolences. Even the Tsunami ridden Governments could put that forward.

Bomber
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 6:35:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Jame_Retief:

Originally Posted By Peak_Oil:
We can, and SHOULD, take care of our own. Any German money sent for disaster relief SHOULD be sent back immediately since we can take care of ourselves. We can, right? I think we can.



That is ciompletely wrong.

Any money offered should be taken with humility and put to good use. Never refuse aid freely given, even if you are simply going to end up offering back in kind at a later date. But apparently only Israel knows the meaning of gratitude.


Give me a freaking break, they just took it out of the hand out we gave them.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 6:58:53 AM EDT
Like you, when someone says "humanitarian" I immediately associate that with the word "Germany".

Germany is, after all, the nation that has produced the greatest humanitarian minds in the world. They are beloved all over the world for their selfless acts. A German can barely walk anywhere without being besieged by throngs of grateful people. They have done so much to further mankind!

Who is first when a natural disaster occurs? Germany.

Who is first on the scene when there is some great injustice in the world? Germany.

Who spends the most? Germany.

You should all be ashamed.

Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:00:38 AM EDT
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:01:34 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Bubbatheredneck:

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:

But I doubt we will see a "Fucking Israel" post if they don't offer anything.




FWIW, I heard on Hannity last night on the way home that Israel was the first country to offer aid. Actually, he said the only country.





And if they do, then they will be a better ally than Germany has been lately.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:03:58 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Cheesebeast:
Like you, when someone says "humanitarian" I immediately associate that with the word "Germany".

Germany is, after all, the nation that has produced the greatest humanitarian minds in the world. They are beloved all over the world for their selfless acts. A German can barely walk anywhere without being besieged by throngs of grateful people. They have done so much to further mankind!

Who is first when a natural disaster occurs? Germany.

Who is first on the scene when there is some great injustice in the world? Germany.

Who spends the most? Germany.

You should all be ashamed.





It's true!

I once saw a BMW almost swerve to avoid mowing down an orphan, only nicking the tot and hurling it to the roadside, neatly avoiding any damage to the finely finished teutonic masterpiece.



Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:05:23 AM EDT
You find out who your real friends are when you need help ...
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:11:24 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
But we sadly have LOTS of allies who don't actually contribute much. Israel didn't send troops to Afghanistan after 9-11 and I don't know if they will offer any kind of assistance to New Orleans.




Are you serious with this? You seem to be a guy who thinks he knows everything about everything. So do you really think it would have been a good idea to send Isreali troops over to ANY conflict involving practitioners of the Islamic faith? Talk about throwing gas on the fire...
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:21:05 AM EDT
If it wasn't fot the US they would've all been speaking Russian
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:27:12 AM EDT
I e-mailed them in their feedback section...

"Thanks so much for your incredible insight on global warming. When a nuclear device goes off in Berlin we'll be able to say the same about Al Quaeda.

Until then, have a nice day
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:31:56 AM EDT
The hell with the Germans. We have enough issues internally. Look at the DU posts now blaming Bush for BLOWING UP the levees to create the flooding since the expected storm swell never hit. Look at the sheeple in NO running lawless in the streets. Look at the lack of ability of BIG government to thus far help most of the affected people.

We have some serious issues in our own house to clean up first. I could care less what the Germans think. I am proud to live in a country who aids the rest of the world in similar times of human loss and suffering. But I am even prouder to live in a country who does not look, expect, or need the aid of other countries when the same happens here.

Let's clean up our own problems and then no one can criticize us. We really shouldn't care anyway.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:33:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/1/2005 7:34:24 AM EDT by NoHarmNoFAL-01]

Originally Posted By mattja:

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
You're just a damn Kraut Hating 88.




That has to be an oxymoron.



Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:47:35 AM EDT
Fourth stanza of the German anthem:

Germany, Germany above all,
and during disaster more than ever,
only in disaster can love
show whether it's strong and true;
And so shall the song continue
from generation to generation
|: Germany, Germany above all,
and during disaster more than ever.:|

...interesting...
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:48:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Turnkey:
If it wasn't fot the US they would've all been speaking Russian



They spoke Russian in East Germany?
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:58:08 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Red_Label:

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
But we sadly have LOTS of allies who don't actually contribute much. Israel didn't send troops to Afghanistan after 9-11 and I don't know if they will offer any kind of assistance to New Orleans.




Are you serious with this? You seem to be a guy who thinks he knows everything about everything. So do you really think it would have been a good idea to send Isreali troops over to ANY conflict involving practitioners of the Islamic faith? Talk about throwing gas on the fire...


I was thinking the same thing. That had to be the most assinine comment I've seen yet.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 8:04:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By dport:

Originally Posted By Red_Label:

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:
But we sadly have LOTS of allies who don't actually contribute much. Israel didn't send troops to Afghanistan after 9-11 and I don't know if they will offer any kind of assistance to New Orleans.




Are you serious with this? You seem to be a guy who thinks he knows everything about everything. So do you really think it would have been a good idea to send Isreali troops over to ANY conflict involving practitioners of the Islamic faith? Talk about throwing gas on the fire...


I was thinking the same thing. That had to be the most assinine comment I've seen yet.



+1....Israel sending troops to Afghanistan...that has to be about the dumbest thing I have heard on here...
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 9:02:34 AM EDT

What do you expect from the country that gave the world National Socialism, the SS, the Death Camp, and the Stasi?

GunLvr
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 2:59:43 PM EDT
This is what that asshole said.

I got this translation from a German on another board.



From the op-ed piece by the German minister:

"Bei einem Anteil an der Weltbevölkerung von vier Prozent sind sie für etwa
ein Viertel der globalen Emissionen von Treibhausgasen verantwortlich."

It singles out the USA, with the cliché that 4% of the world population is
responsible for 25% of greenhouse gasses. (Another way of saying that the
USA manufactures 25% of the world output.)

"Der durchschnittliche Amerikaner erzeugt - bei vergleichbarem
Lebensstandard - mehr als doppelt so viel CO2 wie der durchschnittliche
Europäer. Die Regierung Bush lehnt dennoch internationale Klimaschutzziele
mit der Begründung ab, sie schadeten der amerikanischen Volkswirtschaft."

It does point the finger to the Americans and their outrageous lifestyle.
(I have never seen French cars during my stays in the USA, that is true.
But I have observed whole fleets of German steel on the roads there.)

However:

"Dabei könnte gerade die deutsche Industrie stolz darauf sein, bewiesen zu
haben, dass keine Volkswirtschaft dazu verdammt ist, sich dem Energieträger
Öl auszuliefern. Die deutsche Energiewende gilt international als Beispiel
dafür, dass die Förderung erneuerbarer Energien, energieeffizienter
Techniken und eine konsequente Nutzung der Potentiale des Energiesparens
volkswirtschaftlichen, sozialen und umweltpolitischen Erfolg verbindet."

The minister does not lament the fact that Americans like their Beemers,
Volkswagens, Audis and Mercedeses. Rather, it boasts about Germany leading
the way in energy production.

"Der amerikanische Präsident verschließt die Augen vor den wirtschaftlichen
und menschlichen Schäden, die seinem Land und der Weltwirtschaft durch
Naturkatastrophen wie "Katrina", also durch unterlassenen Klimaschutz,
zugefügt werden."

It does link Katrina to not signing Kyoto. You did not sign Kyoto, you
chose to close your eyes instead - now bear the consequences.



The German minister of the environment is a complete asshat.

I hear he will be gone with the next election.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 6:38:50 PM EDT
I think some of you folks need to re-read the article, the writer was actually condemning the bush bashing and that stupid environmental minister.

one of my Best buddies from Germany messaged me and showed me this article, and expressed his disgust that Trittin and Schroeder have soiled Germany wit htheir policies and that he was happy that they would all loose their jobs later this month.

The German government and Media is controlled by the HARD left, many of the HARD left in the US have also said things very similar to what the German environmental minister said. the LEFT is the LEFT, be they Deutsch oder Amerikanisch. And one thing we all know about the left, they will shamelessly plug a disaster or other tragic occurrence to pimp their careers, they are all full of $hit.

Rest assured, the majority of Germany does not feel that way.

Duce out.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:20:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Duce Apocalypse:
I think some of you folks need to re-read the article, the writer was actually condemning the bush bashing and that stupid environmental minister.

one of my Best buddies from Germany messaged me and showed me this article, and expressed his disgust that Trittin and Schroeder have soiled Germany wit htheir policies and that he was happy that they would all loose their jobs later this month.

The German government and Media is controlled by the HARD left, many of the HARD left in the US have also said things very similar to what the German environmental minister said. the LEFT is the LEFT, be they Deutsch oder Amerikanisch. And one thing we all know about the left, they will shamelessly plug a disaster or other tragic occurrence to pimp their careers, they are all full of $hit.

Rest assured, the majority of Germany does not feel that way.


Duce out.



While I agree that the LEFT controls the media, don't be so sure that the people don't have the same attitude. I used to think the same about the Canadian media until I talked to friends and acquaintances from back home. If you listen to a lie long enough you start to believe it. They bash Bush like you wouldn't believe. They know nothing about him but are adept at parotting anything they hear from the news outlets.
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 7:30:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/1/2005 7:31:23 PM EDT by Zardoz]

Originally Posted By squeezecockerp7m8:
Fourth stanza of the German anthem:

Germany, Germany above all,
and during disaster round-the-clock bombing more than ever,
only in disaster round-the-clock bombing can love
show whether it's strong and true;
And so shall the song continue
from generation to generation
|: Germany, Germany above all,
and during disaster round-the-clock bombing more than ever.:|

...interesting...



Fixed, and free of charge!
Link Posted: 9/1/2005 11:43:59 PM EDT
Well looks like this thread is indeed bullshit.

Countries sending aid to the US after Katrina

……"Offers have been received from Russia, Japan, Canada, France, Honduras, Germany, Venezuela, Jamaica, Australia, the United Kingdom, the Netherlands, Switzerland, Greece, Hungary, Colombia, the Dominican Republic, El Salvador, Mexico, China, South Korea, Israel, the United Arab Emirates, NATO and the Organization of American States, the spokesman said."……

Here's what the Fucking Krauts had to say...

Germany, which was rebuilt after World War II largely by the U.S. Marshall Plan, offered its help in a telephone call to Rice.

"The German Government is prepared to do all that is humanly possible," the German embassy said. In his call, German Foreign Minister Joschka Fischer assured Rice of Germany's solidarity with its American friends in a difficult time, the embassy said.
Link Posted: 9/2/2005 12:09:25 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/2/2005 12:09:50 AM EDT by NH_AR_Shooter]

Originally Posted By squeezecockerp7m8:

Originally Posted By Turnkey:
If it wasn't for the US they would've all been speaking Russian



They spoke Russian in East Germany?



I think we should keep in mind that most of the people in power in Germany today were anti US/Pro Communist during the cold war. Our true allies lost power when "reunification" tilted the country to the left.

If some of these people sound like our enemies, its because they were and still are.
Link Posted: 9/2/2005 12:11:59 AM EDT

Originally Posted By NH_AR_Shooter:

Originally Posted By squeezecockerp7m8:

Originally Posted By Turnkey:
If it wasn't for the US they would've all been speaking Russian



They spoke Russian in East Germany?



I think we should keep in mind that most of the people in power in Germany today were anti US/Pro Communist during the cold war. Our true allies lost power when "reunification" tilted the country to the left.

If some of these people sound like our enemies, its because they were and still are.



Our true allies are sending aid. Look one post up.
Link Posted: 9/2/2005 12:22:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/2/2005 12:23:08 AM EDT by NH_AR_Shooter]

Originally Posted By SteyrAUG:

Originally Posted By NH_AR_Shooter:

Originally Posted By squeezecockerp7m8:

Originally Posted By Turnkey:
If it wasn't for the US they would've all been speaking Russian



They spoke Russian in East Germany?



I think we should keep in mind that most of the people in power in Germany today were anti US/Pro Communist during the cold war. Our true allies lost power when "reunification" tilted the country to the left.

If some of these people sound like our enemies, its because they were and still are.



Our true allies are sending aid. Look one post up.



I knew they offered aid. I'm referring to the various anti US BS you hear from certain German politicians. These folks think the wrong side won the cold war and never have anything good to say about the US. My point is he only speaks for himself and the other leftist.

The offer of Aid is good, those BS comments by the German minister are a seperate issue.
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