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 Heavy dipped in cornbread Joined Mar 2002 Posts 7094 EE 100% (7) KY, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:12:38 PM EDT [Last Edit: 8/15/2005 11:14:57 PM EDT by Charging_Handle] Just because it is warmer than average in Alaska this year doesn't necessarily mean it's caused by "Global Warming". It was one of the coolest Summers on record here in KY last year. Most of August and September were awesome, with low humidity and temps in the 70's and low 80's. So if Global Warming really exists (and I'm not convinced it does), it's going to take more than 1 or 2 years of fluctuations to prove it. And explain why the temp increase over 50 years is + a few degrees in AK while in other areas it is - a few degrees. It's meaningless data. One year is not a trend. One year is irrelevent. You need to establish a trend, which to be of any scientific value would be about a 1000 year period, at least. This is why I find much of the reporting of Global Warming to be bunk. These people are trying to take 20 or 30 years worth of data (some of which is conflicting to start with) and pass it off as it it held the same value as 1000 years of data. This space is currently for rent. Gimme $20 and I'll put anything here you want, up to the 255 character limit.  Stay classy ARFCOM! Joined Dec 2002 Posts 6790 EE 100% (7) VA, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:16:06 PM EDT No different than so-called 'scientists' claiming that eggs are bad for you one day and then the next saying that they're actually good for you.It seems that most reside on a Jump To Conclusions mat these days. Offering unwanted advice to the world since 1996  Joined Mar 2001 Posts 72 EE 0% (0) TX, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:17:58 PM EDT Yes its a myth. Let consider we only have about 500 years of recorded temptaures. The earth is 100s of millions of years old. With that little data how could we conclude that we currently have global warming?  Quid custodit ipsos custodes? Joined Dec 2001 Posts 2601 EE 0% (0) AZ, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:19:54 PM EDT So, out of the 5 billion years this sun and planet have been around Alaska has a warm summer. It must be global warming! Forget about the fact that we only have recorded temp info for probably a little over 100 years. We frankly don't know enough about weather patterns and temperature to know if its global warming.  Joined Apr 2005 Posts 244 EE 100% (1) AK, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:22:22 PM EDT Yes, it has been hot up here (Fairbanks) the past couple years. However there has also been extremely bad wildfires the past couple years resulting in choking smoke. I wonder if they are taking into consideration the convection caused by the smoke. Weatherman says that its suppose to subside tomorrow...yeah right-Derek  Stay classy ARFCOM! Joined Dec 2002 Posts 6793 EE 100% (7) VA, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:24:06 PM EDT You know, I was thinking about that yesterday. Most, if not all, of those that subscribe to the theory of global warming also believe that the earth is millions and millions of years old. So how can they reconcile the lack of climatological data for any period past say 200-300 years ago with such a theory?For all they know, these things are cyclical. Yet they still blame man for global warming.Don't you just hate it when you have all that stuff in your head, but can't get it out in a lyrical manner? I know I do. Offering unwanted advice to the world since 1996  Held hostage in Kalifornia. Joined Apr 2003 Posts 6600 EE 100% (8) CA, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:24:17 PM EDT leave me alone im pondering my gay pole POLL HAHA YOU MADE A HILARIOUS SPELLING ERRORAnd you wonder why you stay out of chat?  Heavy dipped in cornbread Joined Mar 2002 Posts 7095 EE 100% (7) KY, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:24:21 PM EDT What I find so shocking about all this Global Warming horseshit is all the stuff the "scientists" leave out, as well as the implications of their findings.We know there have been temperature changes on earth since the beginnings of time. They occurred naturally, long before any humans were here. It's not a shocking thing. It's been going on for millions of years.Yet the scientific implications are that WE are responsible for global warming, POLLUTION is the cause and STOPPING pollution is the way to treat it. Did human pollution cause all the other climate changes in earth's history, nearly all of which occurred before there were ever any humans on earth? Was it automobile gases? Was it aerosol cans? CFC's? Global warming is sheer lunacy. Earth is constaly evolving and changing. That includes climate as well. We have had warming and cooling periods before, none of our doing. So the arrogance of these global warming scientists in blaming humans for this and the double arrogance of thinking we mortal humans are somehow capable of changing earth's climate really pisses me off. This is just fear mongering from people who fear progress. Plain and simple. This space is currently for rent. Gimme$20 and I'll put anything here you want, up to the 255 character limit.
Posted: 8/15/2005 11:26:29 PM EDT
 Originally Posted By Charging_Handle:Did human pollution cause all the other climate changes in earth's history, nearly all of which occurred before there were ever any humans on earth? Was it automobile gases? Was it aerosol cans? CFC's?

It was those Egyptians and their fucking air conditioners!
Posted: 8/15/2005 11:28:29 PM EDT
 Originally Posted By Burley:Don't you just hate it when you have all that stuff in your head, but can't get it out in a lyrical manner? I know I do.

+1! I might have the knowledge on a certain issue, but articulating it is a whole new slice of pie.
Posted: 8/15/2005 11:28:42 PM EDT
 Originally Posted By Charging_Handle:What I find so shocking about all this Global Warming horseshit is all the stuff the "scientists" leave out, as well as the implications of their findings.We know there have been temperature changes on earth since the beginnings of time. They occurred naturally, long before any humans were here. It's not a shocking thing. It's been going on for millions of years.Yet the scientific implications are that WE are responsible for global warming, POLLUTION is the cause and STOPPING pollution is the way to treat it. Did human pollution cause all the other climate changes in earth's history, nearly all of which occurred before there were ever any humans on earth? Was it automobile gases? Was it aerosol cans? CFC's? Global warming is sheer lunacy. Earth is constaly evolving and changing. That includes climate as well. We have had warming and cooling periods before, none of our doing. So the arrogance of these global warming scientists in blaming humans for this and the double arrogance of thinking we mortal humans are somehow capable of changing earth's climate really pisses me off. This is just fear mongering from people who fear progress. Plain and simple.

Couldn't agree more. Global warming is the biggest load of shit ever.
 Member Joined Sep 2002 Posts 2431 EE 100% (30) MD, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:32:10 PM EDT I believe in Global Warming..........but I don't believe that we humans had anything to do with it. There is just not enough recorded history to know what cycles the earth's climate goes through. If man was around during the Ice Age, the libs would have blamed us for that too "You know, people always ask, 'do you shoot to maim or shoot to kill?' I always say empty the chamber and let God decide." - Deputy Garcia
 Member Joined Jul 2004 Posts 5417 EE 100% (70) TX, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:33:22 PM EDT Funny how the hole in the ozone layer was discovered prior to the widespread use of CFCs.
 Member Joined Nov 2004 Posts 3375 EE 0% (0) TX, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:49:27 PM EDT I probably should have posted this in the religion forumI really doubt that anyone will ever change their mind on this topicit is unfortunate that they call it "global warming"it should be called something like "climatological destabilization" or "atmospheric fluctuation"warming at unusual levels\times is only one one of the symptomssome others are increased flooding, rainfall, droughts and freezeswe're having multiple heavy storms, and flooding in TX, that we didn'thave 20-30 years ago, I just don't believe we are in a "cycle"and, I don't believe the "cycle" of heating and cooling will allow for thereappearing of the ice cliffs, permafrost or icebergs that have beenreceding for the last ten years unless we have another ice age, not likely I do think that pollution from cars and factories has overtaxed the Earths natural cleansingabilities that would come into play for events like forest fires or volcanic eruptionshowever, I do not think the process can be reversed, so I am NOT saying that cars andfactories should be halted, just that the longer we go on like this, the harder it will be to breathe
 Member Joined Apr 2003 Posts 557 EE 100% (5) AK, USA Posted: 8/15/2005 11:50:54 PM EDT I'm loving these hot summers in SE Alaska....I leave my truck idling all night, and randomly empty aerosol cans just to make sure the temp is right for my camping trips.
Posted: 8/15/2005 11:57:44 PM EDT
 Originally Posted By Charging_Handle:What I find so shocking about all this Global Warming horseshit is all the stuff the "scientists" leave out, as well as the implications of their findings.

When people try to convince someone else of something they "sell" it by leaving out the bad part

I prefer to know the good and the bad to help me make better decisions

as far as this subject, I do not know of anything that indicates it is NOT a problem

however, the "hole in the ozone facts" are clearly not understood well enough for them to
be able to use them to make any concrete statements, they still do it though...........
 Detached Observer Joined Mar 2003 Posts 4729 EE 0% (0) TX, USA Posted: 8/16/2005 12:03:02 AM EDT We know for a fact that there were periods of cooling known as the Ice Ages. Does it not stand to reason that there would also be periods of warming. On a small scale, man can indeed cause localized climate changes (cities are known as heat islands because the buildings and pavement absorb heat, etc), but it is a stretch to think that man can effect things on a global scale. "Got a problem, need help, odds against you, Call The Equalizer" -- From The Equalizer"I bring order to chaos. Don't be Mr. Chaos"
Posted: 8/16/2005 12:05:52 AM EDT
 Originally Posted By 22bad:Scientists say this is more than just a string of freak summers. Between 1949 and 2003, the average annual air temperature in Alaska increased by 3.3 degrees Fahrenheit, with some areas in the state registering increases of almost twice that much, especially in the spring and the autumn.

in Alaska, that is still fucking cold
Posted: 8/16/2005 12:19:19 AM EDT

Did you go to troll school or take a correspondence course?
 Member Joined Nov 2004 Posts 3378 EE 0% (0) TX, USA Posted: 8/16/2005 12:20:40 AM EDT I guess you are trying to make a point of some sortwhy don't you include your old screen name with your "thoughts"?liberals fought against bush with such bs rhetoric that they lost any claimto intelligent discourse IMO, btw they still do it, they make ridiculous claimsand state them as fact.........you made some pretty impressively stupid claims yourself
 Member Joined Jul 2004 Posts 5418 EE 100% (70) TX, USA Posted: 8/16/2005 12:25:26 AM EDT If the increase in temperature were due to ever increasing amounts of man-made pollution, a graph of the worlds average temperatures would be curvilinear. Not linear.Something other than man-made pollution is causing it.
 Joined Apr 2003 Posts 2221 EE 0% (0) KS, USA Posted: 8/16/2005 12:34:59 AM EDT "Global warming" essentially works on the assumption that there are no buffers in the environment.I think, personally, as a scientist but not a climatologist, that all of the data we have collected so far is comparitively infinitesimal, and is as likely to produce false trends as it is to produce good predictions.It seems possible that there are cyclical global environmental fluctuations, some of which have something to do with solar activity, and I consider the possibility that even changing local galactic conditions may alter the Terran climatological/ecological conditions.I think we should limit our impact as much as is practical, but I do not think we can have nearly the long term impact on the planet that the alarmists think we can. Jim
Posted: 8/16/2005 12:38:46 AM EDT

Dude, put the joint down. Don't you know it can lead to hardcore drug use?
Posted: 8/16/2005 12:40:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/16/2005 12:45:36 AM EDT by 22bad]
 Originally Posted By 1Andy2:If the increase in temperature were due to ever increasing amounts of man-made pollution, a graph of the worlds average temperatures would be curvilinear. Not linear.Something other than man-made pollution is causing it.

Thats a good point
wouldn't different countries type\rate of pollution determine their idividual rate of heat
reflection\trapping. And wouldn't the "climatological destabilization" that it caused be
determined by the way prevailing wind currents\weather patterns and land\water formations guided them?
 Joined Apr 2005 Posts 245 EE 100% (1) AK, USA Posted: 8/16/2005 1:15:11 AM EDT This winter when its -40 for a month at a time and occasionally dipping down to -60 I want the author of that artical to join me at work for a day. Turning wrenches on the flightline sucks at -45...perhaps that will change his mind.
Posted: 8/16/2005 3:56:20 AM EDT

You're absolutely right!!!

We should be listening to the same "experts" who said twenty years ago that the fish in the ocean would all be dead and the polar ice caps would have melted by now if we didn't change

Or maybe we should be listening to Al Gore. Here's a guy who is preaching about global warming on one of the coldest days in recorded history in NY.

...I'll stick with my party line. It makes a helluva lot more sense
Posted: 8/16/2005 4:14:45 AM EDT
 Joined Oct 2004 Posts 460 EE 0% (0) MO, USA Posted: 8/16/2005 4:28:47 AM EDT MYTH If I recall correctly, they were predicting another ice age during the mid or late 70's. I was a kid at that time in Nebraska and I remember the winters being a real bitch. Now the winters are much more mild, but I see it as a temporary fluctuation. Our scientist have so little data when you consider just how old the planet is and are mere infants when it comes to actually interpreting much of the data.
Posted: 8/16/2005 4:33:50 AM EDT

Very, very well said!
That reminds me of our Georgraphy Teacher (in High School) telling us how Meteorology is a vague and unprecise form of Science etc
 The Pope of all Truffles Joined Aug 2004 Posts 1085 EE 100% (19) VA, USA Posted: 8/16/2005 4:55:24 AM EDT Global warming is quite plausible. We had an ice age during the middle ages and are still warming up from that period. The cause is most likely the sun, it has been especially active in the last 10 years or so. Global warming caused by pollution that will destroy the world unless we throw away all of our cars and power plants and live like hippies on communes is a total crock, obviously.
Posted: 8/16/2005 8:36:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DoubleFeed:
 Originally Posted By 22bad:I probably should have posted this in the religion forumI really doubt that anyone will ever change their mind on this topicit is unfortunate that they call it "global warming"it should be called something like "climatological destabilization" or "atmospheric fluctuation"warming at unusual levels\times is only one one of the symptomssome others are increased flooding, rainfall, droughts and freezeswe're having multiple heavy storms, and flooding in TX, that we didn'thave 20-30 years ago, I just don't believe we are in a "cycle"and, I don't believe the "cycle" of heating and cooling will allow for thereappearing of the ice cliffs, permafrost or icebergs that have beenreceding for the last ten years unless we have another ice age, not likely I do think that pollution from cars and factories has overtaxed the Earths natural cleansingabilities that would come into play for events like forest fires or volcanic eruptionshowever, I do not think the process can be reversed, so I am NOT saying that cars andfactories should be halted, just that the longer we go on like this, the harder it will be to breathe
Anybody remember that the big threat in the '70s was an impending ice age?

Could it be that they were reacting to EXTREME climate changes
like we have been having.......record breaking heat, cold and rain?
And, they just didn't understand what it was yet?
I wonder how many people would be more accepting of the concept
if it wasn't called global "warming", I think that name is very misleading
 Member Joined Nov 2004 Posts 3406 EE 0% (0) TX, USA Posted: 8/16/2005 8:41:05 PM EDT Not that it is the pass\fail test or anything, but why do so many people get struck by lightning now?more severe storms? here is another group of people hit by lightning.........Nineteen Fort Benning Soldiers Struck by LightningThe Associated Press Published: Aug 17, 2005ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGBESV82HCE.htmlFORT BENNING, Ga. (AP) - A lightning strike amid a drenching rainstorm Tuesday sent 19 Fort Benning soldiers to the hospital. Most of the soldiers were treated at Martin Army Community Hospital and released, although four remained hospitalized overnight for observation. The soldiers, who are in basic training, were on their last day of a field exercise and preparing to head back to their barracks because of the weather. The soldiers were injured even after they spread out as a precaution against lightning, Fort Benning spokeswoman Monica Manganaro said. "They had them ground their equipment so they weren't holding weapons," she said. "They did all the right things." The storm brought between 2 and 3 inches of rain to the area.
 Posting With The Protection Of Aluminum Foil Joined Oct 2004 Posts 5863 EE 100% (1) FL, USA Posted: 8/16/2005 8:41:35 PM EDT Yes Global warming is still a myth. Junk Science at its finest. "War is the remedy our enemies have chosen, and I say give them all they want." Gen. William T. Sherman
Posted: 8/16/2005 8:44:43 PM EDT

Wow a bunch of tired rhetoric. You think for yourself?
 Posting With The Protection Of Aluminum Foil Joined Oct 2004 Posts 5865 EE 100% (1) FL, USA Posted: 8/16/2005 8:45:30 PM EDT [Last Edit: 8/16/2005 8:46:30 PM EDT by WildBoar] Guys.....................Guess who it......................Probably ............... is........... "War is the remedy our enemies have chosen, and I say give them all they want." Gen. William T. Sherman
Posted: 8/16/2005 8:47:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/16/2005 8:47:32 PM EDT by WildBoar]
 Originally Posted By 22bad:I guess you are trying to make a point of some sortwhy don't you include your old screen name with your "thoughts"?

He .... Doesnt need to include........ his old screen name.......

Its painfully obvious.

Hi Cyanide.
Posted: 8/16/2005 8:51:37 PM EDT
Really? Now was that when the dinosaurs died out or when the black plauge swept Europe?

 Originally Posted By QuantumPion:We had an ice age during the middle ages and are still warming up from that period.
Posted: 8/16/2005 8:51:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WildBoar:
 Originally Posted By 22bad:I guess you are trying to make a point of some sortwhy don't you include your old screen name with your "thoughts"?

He .... Doesnt need to include........ his old screen name.......

Its painfully obvious.

Hi Cyanide.

I just saw a few of his posts, never had any "exchanges" with him........
Posted: 8/16/2005 8:53:46 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WildBoar:
 Originally Posted By 22bad:I guess you are trying to make a point of some sortwhy don't you include your old screen name with your "thoughts"?

He .... Doesnt need to include........ his old screen name.......

Its painfully obvious.

Hi Cyanide.

I just saw a few of his posts, never had any "exchanges" with him........

I am convinced its him. We need a consensus from others though.
Posted: 8/16/2005 8:54:22 PM EDT
-45, that's a warm day at the South Pole.
We had to do a double prop change on an LC-130.

Some "jackass" LCDR ordered the LT PIC to shut the engines off instead of running them for 17+ hours while waiting for the weather to clear.

 Originally Posted By sledhead907:This winter when its -40 for a month at a time and occasionally dipping down to -60 I want the author of that artical to join me at work for a day. Turning wrenches on the flightline sucks at -45...perhaps that will change his mind.
Posted: 8/16/2005 8:55:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/16/2005 8:57:00 PM EDT by Max_Mike]

Originally Posted By MatterhornMonkey:

Very, very well said!
That reminds me of our Georgraphy Teacher (in High School) telling us how Meteorology is a vague and unprecise form of Science etc

When is the last time you heard anything about acid rain or ozone depletion?

Global warming is just one in a long line of BS crisis supposedly caused by man that will end the world as we know it.

Global warming is about funding and government control of property rights…. can you say socialist. Create a crisis then scream you need funding to study the problem and insist the government needs to control all aspects of industry.

There may even be some global warming going on, but if there is humans don’t have a damn thing to do with it.
 Bass Player and Liberal Seeking Missile Joined Jun 2004 Posts 4235 EE 100% (8) NY, USA Posted: 8/16/2005 9:01:59 PM EDT The Earth has cooled down and warmed up naturally every 1000's of years or so. How else could we have had an ice age and now enjoy a more temporate climite now?I am even more amazed by how small minded these "scientists" are. They think that because they've been recording things for 100 years that anything on that timeline can be used to show trends? HA!The Earth has been around for millions of years, and they think they can take 30 or 50 years and make a federal case out of it. Retarded. "Computer games don't affect kids. I mean if Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic music."Kristian Wilson, Nintendo, Inc, 1989
Posted: 8/17/2005 3:44:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/17/2005 3:45:27 AM EDT by DoubleFeed]
 Joined Aug 2004 Posts 175 EE 100% (2) MO, USA Posted: 8/17/2005 3:59:24 AM EDT Global warming! I'm gonna get rich investing in air conditioning companies.
 Joined Jan 2001 Posts 554 EE 100% (60) MT, USA Posted: 8/17/2005 4:10:06 AM EDT Of course global warming is real(is's just not caused by man), if it weren't we would be hunting wooly mamoths on snowshoes in Neveda. The fact is that the earth's been in what we call an ice age for about two thirds of it's known history. Be damn glad we have global warming and not global cooling.
 Will snipe for food. Joined Jun 2001 Posts 480 EE 100% (4) KY, USA Posted: 8/17/2005 4:30:40 AM EDT Man, I am so frikken sick of hearing about Global Warming I could puke. That issue is pure politically correct politics pure and simple. The globalists are trying to use that issue to get power for the UN so that the UN can then lay down the law over any country in the world (read us) in the name of saving the environment. Where are these idiots during the winter times when were having record blizzards and cold during the winter time. If it was getting colder instead of warmer they would be crying about global cooling! That these arrogent asshats can run around and pretend that they in their wisdom can understand The planet Earth's millinum weather cycls is ludicrous. Some scientists are just now starting to talk about 10,000 yr weather cycles that have been happening since the planed was formed. You can run but you'll only die tired.
 Joined Jul 2005 Posts 34 EE 0% (0) UT, USA Posted: 8/17/2005 9:49:29 AM EDT [Last Edit: 8/17/2005 9:50:14 AM EDT by 37Victor] Anytime I hear this stuff I just remember "Silent Spring". Whatever happened to that, huh? As I recall it turned out to be a load of crap. Forgive me for not buying this latest poorly backed excuse for science.
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