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1/25/2018 7:38:29 AM
Posted: 8/2/2002 11:30:55 AM EST
I am in the middle of a restoration project on my Farmall H, 1943. The tractor has always been reliable, but it needed some cosmetic work and the starter and generator needed to be restored. The starter was converted to 12 volts. The generator and voltage regulator were restored and converted to 12 volts. The wiring has all been replaced, lights, switches and all guages are now functioning. (oil, temp, electrical) The headlights are now able to shine bright for the first time in 40+ years. The muffler is new and shiny. New paint and decals. I even purchased a new carburetor to replace the 60+ year old original. Now for the problem.... It will no longer generate ANY spark. The tractor's magneto system has always been sensitive to moisture. When preparing to paint the tractor I washed all the grease off the Ol' Girl at the car wash. After its bath, it would not spark. Not a problem, I just removed the magneto cover, let it air out for a few minutes, and then the spark was working again. However, after several days of drying the magneto, replacing parts, etc. I am no longer getting ANY spark. Here is what I have done to try and restore the spark: Removed the magneto to check for moisture/rust. Cleaned the light rust found. Used a hair dryer to remove any remaining moisture. I have replaced the condenser, cleaned and reset the points, replaced the coil with a new one, and it still will not generate a spark. Anybody got any ideas? I am now looking at a beautifully resored 1943 paperweight. I will be helping a friend haul hay this evening and he claims he has a spare magneto for the Farmall H series buried somewhere in his barn. If we can locate it, I will try using his as a spare. Until then ... HELP! TheRedGoat
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 11:45:09 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/2/2002 11:47:08 AM EST by WhiskeyBravo]
I think I know what the problem is. It's not an Allice Chalmers. Seriously it sounds like you've looked at everything. Wish I could help. Edited: Did you use an ohm meter and test the current starting from the battery on up?
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 11:45:16 AM EST
I would check the condenser and coil agian.Getting a new one that is bad is not unheard of.You might take the point out and lightly scuff the back where they sit in the mag to get a ggod ground.Did you twist any wires on a conneection when you replaced them?They may look solid but are corroded and wont carry a current.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 11:50:22 AM EST
You have a short or open loop somewhere. That is the only thing it can be. Break out the ohm meter or continuity tester and check the mag.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 11:53:47 AM EST
My best guess is that the moisture is shorting the mag to ground. Bare wire. Ben
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 1:01:10 PM EST
You have a magneto, AND a coil and condensor?
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 1:36:32 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/2/2002 1:40:05 PM EST by colt]
Goat If you still can't get your ? answered here, try these links, I was researching on buying an "H" and these sites were VERY helpful. colt [url]http://www.ytmag.com[/url] [url]www.farmall-h.com[/url] [url]www.atis.net[/url]
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 6:06:22 PM EST
Thanks for the responses. Whiskey Bravo: The ignition system on the H, with a magneto, is completely seperate from the electrical systems used for batteries, lights, etc. As for the Allis Chalmers, I threatened to trade my Farmall for a John Deere, but it still would not spark. Armalite Fan: As for the coil or condenser replacement being defective, the thought had crossed my mind. I did break one connector when troubleshooting the original coil. The wire was an original, cloth covered, wire from the coil to the condenser. I replaced the defective connector. No other wires damaged. I also cleaned all the contacts. Benjamin: I am leaning in your direction. Something, somewhere, is shorting. I am not sure 'what or where' there is a short, but that is my next angle for attack. Repete: Yes, coil, condenser, points, and a magneto. A nice, neat little package that makes a battery unnecessary. The spinning magnet, inside of a 'loop' od wire creates its own electricity. A mini-powerplant. Colt: Thank you for the links. Beleive it or not, the ATIS site is where I found a tractor salavage yard in my area (25 miles east of here.) The internet is amazing.
Link Posted: 8/3/2002 3:36:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/3/2002 4:07:52 AM EST by Repete]
Sorry for my confusion Goat, where do you hide the condensor? I can't find one anywhere on my mag fired toys. Red is my favorite color, next to black(rifle)
Link Posted: 8/3/2002 4:31:20 AM EST
Ahhhh mags! Ohm meter is a necessity. Radioshack $15 cheapy will do although I suggest EVERYONE own a decent one as they are VERY useful! We will assume the rotor has adequate magnetism left as the thing worked recently. (They CAN be recharged, believe it or not!) Just check for dirt and chips. Blow out well. Check for play in bearings. Coil has a wire to the pole piece, the hi-tension contact and wire to the points. Remove wire from points. With coil installed, check between mag case and points wire. Several ohms. Should be same as points wire to polepiece ground wire. From points wire to hi-tension contact should be 100 times or more ohms but still readable on a decent meter. An open indicates bad coil, even if new. Coil wires are magnet wire which is an enamel over copper. That coating is tough. When replacing a terminal it must be scraped away. I use an exacto knife. Crimp on new terminal then solder with radio/electronic solder. Points, condenser and GROUNDING or KILL terminal are most likely source of trouble. Remove coil wire to points. Remove condenser wire. Ohm meter from case to kill terminal. Slowly rotate drive. Ohm meter shouild show zero ohms when points closed, infinite high when open. Kill terminal has macarta insulators that often crumble with age allowing it to become grounded - kill all the time! Points can be grounded due to poor insulator or improper installation of the spring. All of these will cause ohms to remain at zero. Points that never make, always infinite hi ohms can be wired wrong, contaminated contacts etc. Use a fresh piece of paper and draw through contacts a few times with points closed and try again. When you get points operating OK, move to the condenser. Ohm meter to condenser wire, other meter lead to case. After a few seconds must read infinite high ohms. If not, condenser is leaky - bad. On highest ohm scale, reverse leads. Meter should jump. If not, MAY be open. Also possible poor technique or lousy meter! A capacitor checker is a conclusive test. Thing is around .2 mfd (microfarad) at about 500 Volt rating. REAL FUN IS TESTING! When repaired and testing is needed, place finger on coil contact then spin rapidly!!!! If none of this solves your problem, let me know and we will go deeper. If all else fails, send it to me and I will fix it!
Link Posted: 8/3/2002 5:45:10 AM EST
Repete: No prblem on your confusion. The condenser is located under/beside the coil on top of the magneto. A very tight package. MickeyMouse: You are my hero! That is the kind of info I was looking for. My friend is due here any minute with his replacement magneto assembly. The easy solution is to replace my unit. If that does not work, then a trip to Radio Shack is next on the list. TO YOU ALL: Thank you ALL, very very very much, for the detailed responses. That took alot of your time, and I am always amazed at how knowledgeable and generous the folks here at AR15.com can be.
Link Posted: 8/4/2002 9:46:43 AM EST
Link Posted: 8/5/2002 1:45:44 PM EST
The tractor is now sparking again. My friend brought over his 'spare' magneto but it was in terrible/poor condition. We worked on his magneto for over an hour but it still had problems. Prior to his arrival, I had again disassembled my magneto system and checked for shorts. I re-cleaned the points and reassembled my magneto system. After giving up on his magneto, we installed mine once again. The tractor would not turn over! GRRRR!!! The 'rebuilt' carburetor had allowed gas to overflow into the third and fourth cylinders overnight. After draining the oil, draining the cylinders and replacing the oil, we tried again to start the tractor with my magneto. Believe it or not, the tractor fired on the first revolution! HOORAY!! It was not even out of time after all the disassembly. I returned the defective carb to Tractor Supply company, but they refused to refund the 18.50 shipping charges. "We will have to pay to ship this back, sir." So what?! You sold me a defective carburetor, why am I paying for your suppliers' mistake? I filed a written complaint, and I am still fuming at their reaction, but at least.... The TRACTOR IS RUNNING AGAIN.. HOORAY! Thank you all for your help!
Link Posted: 8/5/2002 2:02:45 PM EST
Now go out and plow something. [:D]
Link Posted: 8/5/2002 2:05:14 PM EST
Arock, Bar ditch and pasture mowing are the tractor's primary tasks....no rain = no grass growing. However, since the tractor now has fresh paint and working headlights, it will begin to see service in local parades and hay rides...
Link Posted: 8/5/2002 3:37:08 PM EST
Hang onto that "junk" mag as it contains some parts that are difficult to find! Glad all is well with the spark box. Looks like turning off the fuel when done may become part of your routine. Sucks they want you to pay freight on THEIR defective part!!
Link Posted: 8/5/2002 4:43:40 PM EST
MickeyMouse, I am slowly collecting 'spare' parts for my antiques. Spare distributor cap, rotor, plugs, coil, etc. There are still some tractor scrap yards around, but I figure one day parts will become scarce, even for a 'common' tractor like the Farmall H. As for turning off the fuel, that should NOT be required. The needle and seat is supposed to cut off when the reservoir inside the carb is full. The friend of mine that helped work on the Farmall is about 65 years young. He worked on them extensively as a youth/young man. He is confident that a functioning carb should not allow excess fuel to spill/over run. I am going to track down a kit for my current/original carb with a new needle and seat. The previous kit only included a couple of gaskets.
Link Posted: 8/5/2002 5:14:08 PM EST
am aware they are not SUPPOSED to leak!! However, some do!! Including my Cub Lowboy for YEARS. Did rebuild this spring and so far so good. Still turn it off for long periods of non use. Good luck with your toy. Feel free to let me know if I can be of any assistance.
Link Posted: 8/5/2002 5:14:24 PM EST
i own a restored/rebuilt 1958 allis-chalmers d-17...53 h.p. my father-in-law owns every farmall from the old f-14's up to the m. glad to here you got it running. up here in ohio, there are several old codgers that work on mags for very low bucks...rebuilding that thing might run a $100 max., but more than likely, $50 would cover it. i love those old h's. they're too light, just like my allis, but boy do they work hard. btw, i have a shitload of j.d. garden tractors and i'm looking for a little 1010, 1020 or 1030 to restore next. post some pics of that red beauty!
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